one game down
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jbeecham
ASFN Addict
I hate the Lakers and I didn't watch most of this game, but I find it amazing that Shaq fouled out of the game and that the Spurs had 35 free throws to the Lakers 12. Maybe the Spurs really played that well, but something smells foul to me just by looking at the stat lines.
Smells foul maybe, but these are the Lakers we're talking about. You think the NBA would give the Spurs the benefit of the calls, and not the Lakers?
I dunno...
But I thought the Spurs just played more aggressively, and played better defense. The last 3 fouls by Shaq were legitimate, that's for sure.
Mike
I dunno...
But I thought the Spurs just played more aggressively, and played better defense. The last 3 fouls by Shaq were legitimate, that's for sure.
Mike
I don't think it is part of any grand conspiracy, but if I was Brian in Mesa or LakeShowMan I would certainly be complaining about the officiating in last night's game. Bruce Bowen was absolutely mauling Kobe Bryant the entire game.
It was kind of nice to see though. I can't remember the last time I thought the Lakers got shafted by the officiating over the course of a game. It's kind of nice to see.
Joe Mama
It was kind of nice to see though. I can't remember the last time I thought the Lakers got shafted by the officiating over the course of a game. It's kind of nice to see.
Joe Mama
I thought Bowen did as good as job as anyone can do on Kobe in this league.
Maybe he fouled him a few times with no-call, but Kobe probably did as well. Bowen just made it his mission to stick to Kobe like glue, and I think he did that pretty well.
Mike
Maybe he fouled him a few times with no-call, but Kobe probably did as well. Bowen just made it his mission to stick to Kobe like glue, and I think he did that pretty well.
Mike
As much as I dislike the Lakers, I watched the game and felt that the Spurs were getting the majority of the calls. I know that the play right before Shaq got called for an offensive foul, and fouled out of the game was were Duncan clearly went over Shaq's back to get the rebound. I thought to myself that that play sure looked familiar. Shaq has never fouled out of a playoff game as well.
I still believe that the Spurs are in trouble due to how poorly the Lakers shot the ball, executed, Shaq fouling out, players injured and they still remained close in the game.
I still believe that the Spurs are in trouble due to how poorly the Lakers shot the ball, executed, Shaq fouling out, players injured and they still remained close in the game.
By the way, chew on this stat from last night.
Lakers - 24 fouls called on them.
Spurs - 20 fouls called on them.
So the free throw shooting was obviously off, but the fouls called was pretty even. The Spurs just had a lot of fouls that weren't shooting, and the Lakers fouled when the Spurs were taking shots.
Mike
Lakers - 24 fouls called on them.
Spurs - 20 fouls called on them.
So the free throw shooting was obviously off, but the fouls called was pretty even. The Spurs just had a lot of fouls that weren't shooting, and the Lakers fouled when the Spurs were taking shots.
Mike
Chaplin
Better off silent
The Lakers had 19 turnovers to the Spurs' 11. That's not officiating, that's good defense. How many fouls were called AFTER the Spurs got a steal on a break?
LakeShowMan
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Originally posted by Joe Mama
I don't think it is part of any grand conspiracy, but if I was Brian in Mesa or LakeShowMan I would certainly be complaining about the officiating in last night's game. Bruce Bowen was absolutely mauling Kobe Bryant the entire game.
It was kind of nice to see though. I can't remember the last time I thought the Lakers got shafted by the officiating over the course of a game. It's kind of nice to see.
Joe Mama
You know, last night, I was screaming awfully loud at my TV, but I will never blame a game on the refs. The Lakers didn't get a whole lot of calls last night, but if they would have shot the ball anywhere close to the way they were capable, they would have won the game.
I don't know if they can win the championship if both Devean and Rick are out, but thats why they play the game. If the Lakers can win game 2, we still get the split and take away home advantage.
LakeShowMan
Registered
That was a misstatement by the announcers. That was actually the 8th time Shaq has fouled out of a playoff game. The most famous was game 4 of the Finals against Indiana when Shaq fouled out in OT and Kobe won them the game.
I do agree though that they lost the game because they couldn't hit the broad side of a barn, plus it didn't help that Duncan had more FTs than the entire Laker team.
The numbers show from face value that both teams went to the line pretty evenly. It was not the amount of times that they went to the line that bothered me. It was the timing and the plays that the calls were made that I felt was unfair. Shaq commits an offensive foul almost everytime he goes to the basket. That is my perception of it. I would imagine that the ref's have a very hard time knowing when to call a foul or an offensive foul when it comes to shaq due to his size and strength. I brought up one example in a previous post where Duncan clearly went over shaq's back to get a rebound in the final stages of the game in which no call was made. The Spurs got 2 points from a fast break from the rebound. The very next play, Shaq goes to the hoop to score and the ref's call an offensive foul which fouls him out of the game. You could call Shaq all game long for offensive fouls. But if the calls are not made throughout the game, why call it in the final minutes of one?
I didn't see it that way concerning Shaq...he has gotten a lot better at not knocking guys out of his way all the time. I thought that last offensive foul was legit.
Usually I'm yelling at the TV because he's barreling over guys without any calls, but I didn't do that last night.
I think the ref's are starting to get him under control.
Mike
Usually I'm yelling at the TV because he's barreling over guys without any calls, but I didn't do that last night.
I think the ref's are starting to get him under control.
Mike
SirStefan32
Krycek, Alex Krycek
Does anybody really think the Spurs will beat the Lakers?
I hate the Lakers and love the Spurs, but there is no way Shaq and Kobe are going to be eliminated by the Spurs.
I hate the Lakers and love the Spurs, but there is no way Shaq and Kobe are going to be eliminated by the Spurs.
After last night, I think the Spurs can. I think it's 50/50.
Mike
LakeShowMan
Registered
Losing Devean, after Rick Fox's injury, is really going to hurt the Lakers. Somebody from the bench is really going to have to step up. This series just got MUCH tougher for the Lakers. If they can win tomorrow, I still think they'll win the series, however I just don't know if they can beat Sac. without 2 of their 6 best players. I really hope Devean can come back an contribute, but that injury looked pretty nasty last night.
I agree that the offensive call on Shaq was a legitimate call. I also feel that Duncan goes over backs a half dozen times throughout the game with no calls. He did it throughout the Phoenix series with no calls either. I was questioning the timing of the calls. The number of calls can be equal, but that still does not say wether or not the game was officated evenly. I look for constitancy from the refs. If you are going to call it at one end, call it at the other. If you are going to let the players decide the game with minimal calls with a lot of contact, then it should be that way on both ends.
Your "Chew on this comment," which showed that both teams went to the line pretty evenly does not prove anything to me. I could show you the stat line for Bo Outlaw, which is:
MPG Reb. PPG BPG APG
22.5 4.6 4.7 .89 1.4
If you looked at this line for just the stats, you might think that this player is almost worthless to a team. If you watch the Suns then obviously Bo does tons of things for this team that do not show up on the stats.
They didn't go evenly.
Spurs were 21-35 from the line, Lakers were 9-12.
But as LSM stated, the Lakers shooting was way off.
Overall it was a pretty ugly game to watch.
I just hope Devean can get back for part of this series; losing 2 of your top 6 is hard to stomach.
How about the face/eye-slapping in that game? Man, Kobe got Duncan in a frustrated swinging of his arm after he felt he was fouled, and Horry got smacked in the head on at least 3 occassions by Robinson (no calls also), and of course Horry hit Robinson in the package near the end of the game (technical foul).
Down one, time to turn it on once again...Go Lakers!!
My stat didn't show they went to the line the same, it shows that both teams had almost the same number of fouls called on them. Some are non-shooting, and some aren't...which is why the Spurs had more foul shots.
Mike
jbeecham
ASFN Addict
Horry hit robinson in the package as he swiped for the ball and the whistle was blown and then he hit him again and that's why he got the technical. I was a little surprised Duncan didn't get a technical for shoving Horry after that happened.
LakeShowMan
Registered
I think Duncan would have to spit on one ref and kick another one in the family jewels to get a 'T'. That guy is truly loved by the NBA, and probably for good reason.
And Duncan could do all of that and still not show any emotion. Can you say Zombie?
I don't think it does much good to look at numbers when talking about officiating. I've seen games where one team went to the free-throw line much more than the other or one team got a lot more foul calls than the other, but it was a well officiated game. Some teams just foul more than others.
I picked San Antonio to win this series in six games. I'll be cheering for San Antonio the rest of the way. I would like nothing more than to see the Lakers get swept by the Spurs. I've been complaining about the officiating in Lakers games as long as I can remember, but last night I thought the Spurs clearly got the better of the officiating.
Bruce Bowen did play some very good defense on Kobe Bryant. He also should have fouled out that game by the third quarter. He had his hands all over Kobe. I couldn't believe the officials were letting him do it to a player of Kobe Bryant's stature. There were a lot of other plays also, but I don't remember all of them now. I know one that sticks out in my mind was when there was a loose ball towards the end of the game and Ginobilli pushed one of the Lakers out of the way to get it. It looked pretty obvious to me, and it was an important possession.
It's not like I feel sorry for the Lakers. They've been getting the benefit of the officiating for a long time now. If they get games like that for the rest of the playoffs I wouldn't feel sorry for them.
I'm sure it won't last.
Joe Mama
I picked San Antonio to win this series in six games. I'll be cheering for San Antonio the rest of the way. I would like nothing more than to see the Lakers get swept by the Spurs. I've been complaining about the officiating in Lakers games as long as I can remember, but last night I thought the Spurs clearly got the better of the officiating.
Bruce Bowen did play some very good defense on Kobe Bryant. He also should have fouled out that game by the third quarter. He had his hands all over Kobe. I couldn't believe the officials were letting him do it to a player of Kobe Bryant's stature. There were a lot of other plays also, but I don't remember all of them now. I know one that sticks out in my mind was when there was a loose ball towards the end of the game and Ginobilli pushed one of the Lakers out of the way to get it. It looked pretty obvious to me, and it was an important possession.
It's not like I feel sorry for the Lakers. They've been getting the benefit of the officiating for a long time now. If they get games like that for the rest of the playoffs I wouldn't feel sorry for them.
I'm sure it won't last.
Joe Mama
LakeShowMan
Registered
I have to say this, and I know some of you are going to call me a whiner, but I don't care. Kobe does not get any calls. I will say that Shaq gets the benefit of the doubt a lot. He is an almost impossible person the referee. He fouls and gets fouled everytime he touches the ball. I see it differently then most fans of other teams do, but I guess that is to be expected.
Kobe on the other gets absolutely NO love from the refs, which is weird since he easily considered one of the 2 or 3 best players (#1 IMO) in the league and he plays on the team who has won the championship the last 3 years. Hell, AI, Pierce, T-Mac, and many others get way more help from the refs than Kobe does. You would think with the kind of person he is (no off-court problems), and the kind of player he is, Kobe would get some calls his way. I just don't see it.
I know you guys think I am crazy, but this is really what I see. I don't expect him to get the calls that Michael got (which were just rediculous and unfair), or even those that Magic, Larry, and the Dr. got. With that said, if someone should get some calls in this league shouldn't it be the guy who works his ass off year after year, improves his game, wills his team to victory, and by all accounts is just a genuine guy off the court that never does anything to embarrass his team or league?
OK, you all may slam away (except you Brian, I know you got my back
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