PFF QB Annual Rosen

[Cardsfaninlouky]

@CardsSunsDbacks nailed what I meant.

Almost every QB who became good showed SOMETHING in their rookie year. Rosen didnt have a single objectively good game last year.

I expect that Murray will.

Only good games from Rosen that stick out in my mind are the one in Green Bay & the one against the 49ers on the road where he threw that bomb for a TD. Not even sure those were great games but they won & he was the QB. I've moved on, it's now KM time, he is our future & this season cannot get here fast enough.

 

[Solar7]

SK had one hell of a draft, maybe the best one ever in Arizona? I have no idea why people continue to bash him? If it's because of his DUI then that's stupid? People make mistakes, he's just in a higher profile position than most which makes his mistake look worse. As long as it never happens again he should be fine. I couldn't have been happier with our draft. Well done SK.

Not a single player in this draft class has played a snap, so it's hard to claim they're much of anything yet. Keim started out great, but has since failed to select any successful first round picks, all but one of his players selected are not on this team on a second contract, and his most high profile moves of the offseason are insane Hail Mary decisions that completely ignore history.

The DUI doesn't even factor in for me, and he probably shouldn't be part of this organization next year. But he'll need to be, because I don't see how you can dump him.

 

[HGC]

Not a single player in this draft class has played a snap, so it's hard to claim they're much of anything yet. Keim started out great, but has since failed to select any successful first round picks, all but one of his players selected are not on this team on a second contract, and his most high profile moves of the offseason are insane Hail Mary decisions that completely ignore history.

The DUI doesn't even factor in for me, and he probably shouldn't be part of this organization next year. But he'll need to be, because I don't see how you can dump him.

Bidwill’s not dumb and he knows this overhaul won’t be easy or as fast as some people here think. Kingsbury buys Keim 2 years.

 

[Delmar M Lewis]

There in lies kinda a problem the precedent was set last year with the hire and fire of Wilks it's one and done now if you don't succeed please dont get me wrong in this tho I wasnt a fan of Wilks at all just stating what the perception is IMHO

 

[LarryStalling]

If banging on Rosen makes the Murray jock sniffers feel better, so be it.

Truth is no one here has a clue how their careers will turn out, only narratives to fit their opinions. Myself included.

My prediction is Rosen will be good to great, could be Matt Ryan-like, could be Cutler-like.

Murray will be one the best broken play QBs but will struggle in the pocket. Could be Russel Wilson-like, could be Bortles-like.

I would settle for Fran Tarkington good.

 

[Krangodnzr]

Bidwill’s not dumb and he knows this overhaul won’t be easy or as fast as some people here think. Kingsbury buys Keim 2 years.

I think it depends on the how the team performs. If the team is a dumpster fire, Keim has to go. If the team shows significant progress, he buys one more year.

 

[Krangodnzr]

Not a single player in this draft class has played a snap, so it's hard to claim they're much of anything yet. Keim started out great, but has since failed to select any successful first round picks, all but one of his players selected are not on this team on a second contract, and his most high profile moves of the offseason are insane Hail Mary decisions that completely ignore history.

The DUI doesn't even factor in for me, and he probably shouldn't be part of this organization next year. But he'll need to be, because I don't see how you can dump him.

I think there is more to last offseason than what we know. As we've all speculated in the past, it seems like Bidwill had his hands in a lot last offseason. Keim never seemed to enthused by Wilks. Wilks sold a lot of BS, and I think that Bidwill gave Keim a mulligan. The team wasn't built to be a 4-3 team, and yet Wilks tried to make it one even though he said he would still mostly run 3-4 concepts. McCoy sold everyone on an offense that would fit the strengths of the players, and then he proceeded to use David Johnson like a 1990's RB.

I've maintained that I think Arians would have led last years roster to a near 8-8 finish, and that the Wilks staff was just that bad.

 

[Delmar M Lewis]

I think there is more to last offseason than what we know. As we've all speculated in the past, it seems like Bidwill had his hands in a lot last offseason. Keim never seemed to enthused by Wilks. Wilks sold a lot of BS, and I think that Bidwill gave Keim a mulligan. The team wasn't built to be a 4-3 team, and yet Wilks tried to make it one even though he said he would still mostly run 3-4 concepts. McCoy sold everyone on an offense that would fit the strengths of the players, and then he proceeded to use David Johnson like a 1990's RB.

I've maintained that I think Arians would have led last years roster to a near 8-8 finish, and that the Wilks staff was just that bad.

There is a old saying bad coaches try to make players fit Their system and Good Coaches change their system to fit their strenghts

 

[Krangodnzr]

There is a old saying bad coaches try to make players fit Their system and Good Coaches change their system to fit their strenghts

To a point this is true. If you are hiring a coach for a specific system, then you need to give that coach players that fit the system.

 

[HoodieBets]

There is a old saying bad coaches try to make players fit Their system and Good Coaches change their system to fit their strenghts

Bill bellichick would disagree


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[Krangodnzr]

Bill bellichick would disagree


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The Patriots have changed their defense AND offense multiple times since he took over. We've even seen the Patriots do offensive overhauls during seasons when things weren't working.

The Patriots are really in a unique situation with Belichick. He's similar to Parcells in the fact that his understanding of offensive and defensive football are unparalleled. If Belichick wanted to not be a head coach and wanted to be an offensive coordinator, I bet he'd lead one of the best offenses in football.

 

[HoodieBets]

The Patriots have changed their defense AND offense multiple times since he took over. We've even seen the Patriots do offensive overhauls during seasons when things weren't working.

The Patriots are really in a unique situation with Belichick. He's similar to Parcells in the fact that his understanding of offensive and defensive football are unparalleled. If Belichick wanted to not be a head coach and wanted to be an offensive coordinator, I bet he'd lead one of the best offenses in football.

Yes he has had different iterations but he has not changed overall for any one player . It’s always been bend but don’t break defense. He conforms more to what’s going on in the league instead of fitting schemes to match players. Like when he switched to mostly nickel that was due to how the passing attack evolving even though he was thin at DB at the time.



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[Krangodnzr]

Yes he has had different iterations but he has not changed overall for any one player . It’s always been bend but don’t break defense. He conforms more to what’s going on in the league instead of fitting schemes to match players. Like when he switched to mostly nickel that was due to how the passing attack evolving even though he was thin at DB at the time.



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But he has changed based on roster strength. When he's had a good running back and power players, he's moved to ball control schemes. When he's had a roster better suited to passing often, he's changed.

They've also been in front of shifts in the NFL before other teams on quite a few occasions. Look at how the devalue LT; their passing game features a lot of short passes, which means you don't have invest a ton of money in a top shelf LT. Or how they have devalued pass rushers in favor of coverage players.

 

[HoodieBets]

But he has changed based on roster strength. When he's had a good running back and power players, he's moved to ball control schemes. When he's had a roster better suited to passing often, he's changed.

They've also been in front of shifts in the NFL before other teams on quite a few occasions. Look at how the devalue LT; their passing game features a lot of short passes, which means you don't have invest a ton of money in a top shelf LT. Or how they have devalued pass rushers in favor of coverage players.

Devalue LT? Are you crazy they’ve only had 3 guys there since 2001 and one of those 3 was Trent Brown who they traded for. The other two were matt light and Nate Solder.


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[Krangodnzr]

Devalue LT? Are you crazy they’ve only had 3 guys there since 2001 and one of those 3 was Trent Brown who they traded for. The other two were matt light and Nate Solder.


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Right, and they never paid either like the top LT in the NFL either. Hence why Nate Solder is overpaid with the Giants.

Trent Brown was only the starter because of Isiah Wynn's injury. And how much effort did they put in to replace Brown this year even though Wynn is coming off an ACL tear?

 

[HoodieBets]

Right, and they never paid either like the top LT in the NFL either. Hence why Nate Solder is overpaid with the Giants.

Trent Brown was only the starter because of Isiah Wynn's injury. And how much effort did they put in to replace Brown this year even though Wynn is coming off an ACL tear?

They also never paid Tom Brady as the top QB. It’s all apart of the “patriot way”.


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[Krangodnzr]

They also never paid Tom Brady as the top QB. It’s all apart of the “patriot way”.


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No, they did at one point, but Brady took a pay cut and since then hasn't been seeking big deals. He has enough money and would rather win.

 

[DVontel]

No, they did at one point, but Brady took a pay cut and since then hasn't been seeking big deals. He has enough money and would rather win.

Helps that he is married to a person that is richer than him.

 

[Cardsfaninlouky]

Not a single player in this draft class has played a snap, so it's hard to claim they're much of anything yet. Keim started out great, but has since failed to select any successful first round picks, all but one of his players selected are not on this team on a second contract, and his most high profile moves of the offseason are insane Hail Mary decisions that completely ignore history.

The DUI doesn't even factor in for me, and he probably shouldn't be part of this organization next year. But he'll need to be, because I don't see how you can dump him.

Potential is all we can pin our hopes on from this draft & how the national analysts viewed it. Any draft by any team is that way, obviously you can't judge any player drafted until they actually play some games. Again, I loved our draft, the only thing I would criticize is that we didn't draft on OL'man earlier. The Cardinals FO had to choose by team needs so they spent early picks on WR's. They didn't think an OL'man was worthy of an early pick on their board. Can't draft every position of need in the early rounds that often so they had to decide which way to go. Time will tell on this class but I think our WR's are gonna be special with time in this offense.

 

[Delmar M Lewis]

Bill bellichick would disagree


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You are right again to a degree but remember New England is the exception not the rule who else could take players like Randy Moss Junior Seau and the like and consistently win games playoffs and Super Bowls then turn around and win more with players that few if any have heard of total respect but do not like New England at all

 

[Jetstream Green]

Rosen has everything needed to be a franchise QB and worth a second contract if the guy can just get a break. Murray has the 'it' factor in deuces but is just a rookie but appears to have everything to be a superstar. Both guy are pretty damn good options depending on your coaching staff. With realistic observations towards the coach and scheme can we finally stop this crap critique. I am a Cardinal fan and rooting my arse off for Murray while I hope Rosen is given a chance because I am a football fan

 

[Solar7]

Potential is all we can pin our hopes on from this draft & how the national analysts viewed it. Any draft by any team is that way, obviously you can't judge any player drafted until they actually play some games. Again, I loved our draft, the only thing I would criticize is that we didn't draft on OL'man earlier. The Cardinals FO had to choose by team needs so they spent early picks on WR's. They didn't think an OL'man was worthy of an early pick on their board. Can't draft every position of need in the early rounds that often so they had to decide which way to go. Time will tell on this class but I think our WR's are gonna be special with time in this offense.

I'm not against your thought process, it was just insight on why we might dislike Keim regardless of the DUI. I was a big fan of his, and it's fading.

 

[POISON]

If banging on Rosen makes the Murray jock sniffers feel better, so be it.

Truth is no one here has a clue how their careers will turn out, only narratives to fit their opinions. Myself included.

My prediction is Rosen will be good to great, could be Matt Ryan-like, could be Cutler-like.

Murray will be one the best broken play QBs but will struggle in the pocket. Could be Russel Wilson-like, could be Bortles-like.

My prediction is he sucks and will continue to do so.

 

[CardsSunsDbacks]

There in lies kinda a problem the precedent was set last year with the hire and fire of Wilks it's one and done now if you don't succeed please dont get me wrong in this tho I wasnt a fan of Wilks at all just stating what the perception is IMHO

The Cardinals didn't merely fail to succeed last year, but were absolutely terrible and pretty much any coach that coaches a team that is that bad is going to get canned. Really all K2 needs to do this year is be better than terrible in order for his job to be pretty safe. If the team is 5-11 and shows some promise during the season would you say that he would be getting fired or would you consider that a success?

 

[Delmar M Lewis]

The Cardinals didn't merely fail to succeed last year, but were absolutely terrible and pretty much any coach that coaches a team that is that bad is going to get canned. Really all K2 needs to do this year is be better than terrible in order for his job to be pretty safe. If the team is 5-11 and shows some promise during the season would you say that he would be getting fired or would you consider that a success?

Your right the key is how management views the progress if say its 4 and 12 or 5 and 11 but there are no lopsided losses then I would tend to think KK stays, if however there are quite a few 40 to 3 scores then it's by by birdie would you also not agree with that too