POLL: Sean Payton in 2023 (Officially Going to Denver)

[JohnnyCakes]

You believe I post in a condescending way because I don’t post like I kiss ass. That’s really what it is.

I’m not required to answer your question because that wasn’t my point. You got your chest all out feeling good so continue to do you.

Big Hat no cattle

 

[slanidrac16]

You believe I post in a condescending way because I don’t post like I kiss ass. That’s really what it is.

I’m not required to answer your question because that wasn’t my point. You got your chest all out feeling good so continue to do you.

Like a kiss ass? Na. Just leave out the “kiss”.

 

[JohnnyCakes]

Say hello to Bill and Monti. I didn’t know you were in on the process.

Guy walks around like he's on the payroll!

 

[imaCafan]

Second rounder this year, first next year. Then make a trade with our First this year for this and next years firsts+ from someone like Raiders or Panthers.

 

[BritCard]

Many think this. But we can do without “ won’t don’t you get” comments. We are all commenting on the situation and / or possible scenarios. Nobody is right and nobody is wrong.

Dvontel is always right. It's why I had to put him on ignore. He was just too right for me, took away all debating options...

 

[slanidrac16]

Dvontel is always right. It's why I had to put him on ignore. He was just too right for me, took away all debating options...

I respect everyone’s opinion, however, there are ways to question a posters opinions without basically calling them stupid.
But when you put him on the spot and ask for his opinion you get “ I dont have to answer your question.”
Oh well.

 

[urs]

Dvontel is always right. It's why I had to put him on ignore. He was just too right for me, took away all debating options...

You ignored him because he rightfully clowned your horrific all-22 "film study" posts.

 

[ASUCHRIS]

If he would have settled for far less, I believe Payton would have already been traded.

You have zero idea what has even been discussed. I'd say hell no to firsts this year and next, but I'd consider a second this year and first next. Is that far less? Again - what does NO get for holding his rights until they expire?

You realize there’s a lot of petty people out there, right?

No doubt, but Loomis doesn't strike me as someone who will cut off his nose to spite his face. Putting an asset for sale at an outrageous price then losing that asset for nothing seems like terrible business to me.
If one thing is obvious, the market for Payton is much weaker than anticipated.

Reading your post, I’m willing to bet that you really believe Payton is still in play, huh?

If it were over, he'd have said he's going back to TV. The fact that it hasn't happened yet is definitely not a good sign to it happening moving forward, but I'm not convinced it's over. Are you?

 

[RON_IN_OC]

You ignored him because he rightfully clowned your horrific all-22 "film study" posts.

Nobody should be "clowning" another poster...Not Dvontel, Brit, etc. Disagree and comeback at them, but don't clown them. We all have opinions and interpretations of how we view things going on. If you don't agree, that's cool, just don't be an ass about it and make things personal.

 

[TRW]

If the Cardinals didn't have #3 pick and we're down in the teens or 20s, this deal is already done.

Perhaps. Perhaps not.

 

[DVontel]

You have zero idea what has even been discussed. I'd say hell no to firsts this year and next, but I'd consider a second this year and first next. Is that far less? Again - what does NO get for holding his rights until they expire?

I never claimed I did, but since Bidwill has moved onto other candidates, especially highly qualified ones like Lou Anarumo, that doesn’t seem like a good sign for the #ProPayton guys on here. And no, I don’t believe Bidwill is doing that for “leverage”. What would Loomis even lose from Bidwill doing that?

No doubt, but Loomis doesn't strike me as someone who will cut off his nose to spite his face. Putting an asset for sale at an outrageous price then losing that asset for nothing seems like terrible business to me.
If one thing is obvious, the market for Payton is much weaker than anticipated.

Loomis has gotten embarrassed badly by Howie not once, but twice in the past year. I bet Loomis feels the embarrassment, too. I doubt he wants to get made to look like a fool anymore, which is why he’s being so hard-headed with the demands.

If it were over, he'd have said he's going back to TV. The fact that it hasn't happened yet is definitely not a good sign to it happening moving forward, but I'm not convinced it's over. Are you?

Payton really doesn’t have a choice. It’s not up to him or Bidwill or George Paton. Loomis holds all the cards. I’m convinced it’s over for the Arizona Cardinals.

 

[kerouac9]

They should not give any first rounder regardless of where it’s at. lol why are you guys not getting this?

Yeah... I dunno. I'd trade a first-round pick after, like eighth overall for a young-ish, proven head coach. McVay, Shanahan, Tomlin, Harbaugh, those types.

Why? Because even if there's a 60% chance of that draft pick panning out to be an All-pro-type player (and I think that's super-generous TBH), there's a 100% chance that the guys above are going to be at the top of their game for 10+ more years with little risk of injury. That's a risk scenario that I can live with.

I don't really get why people are completely enamored with Sean Payton, though. This is a guy who was accused of being a drunk and abuser of painkillers like two years ago.

I agree with this statement. Pretty much every head coach trade wasn't worth it in the end.

Really? The Seahawks traded a 2nd for Mike Holmgren and he coached that team for 10 years and went to the playoffs six times including a visit to the Super Bowl.

Bill Belichick resigned from the Jets and was traded to New England for a package of three picks including a first-rounder. Seems to have worked out okay for them.

Jon Gruden was moved from Oakland for two firsts and two seconds and immediately won the Super Bowl with Tampa Bay. In the seven years he coached the Bucs they went to the playoffs three times.

Of course, Bruce Arians won a Super Bowl with Tampa.

Houston has #12 & Denver has #29.

...dave

Yes, but those draft picks came to them via trade. The picks they earned are 2nd overall (HOU) and 5th overall (DEN). I don't understand what your point is.

 

[DVontel]

Yeah... I dunno. I'd trade a first-round pick after, like eighth overall for a young-ish, proven head coach. McVay, Shanahan, Tomlin, Harbaugh, those types.

For McVay & Shanahan? Probably. I have concerns about Tomlin & Harbaugh though, so nah for me.

But even with McVay & Shanahan, they would be coming to a team with little talent. For Shanny, it took 3 years for him to field a great team, now imagine doing that without multiple first rounders. Imagine how long that would take to build from the ground up.

 

[oaken1]

You have zero idea what has even been discussed. I'd say hell no to firsts this year and next, but I'd consider a second this year and first next. Is that far less? Again - what does NO get for holding his rights until they expire?

No doubt, but Loomis doesn't strike me as someone who will cut off his nose to spite his face. Putting an asset for sale at an outrageous price then losing that asset for nothing seems like terrible business to me.
If one thing is obvious, the market for Payton is much weaker than anticipated.

If it were over, he'd have said he's going back to TV. The fact that it hasn't happened yet is definitely not a good sign to it happening moving forward, but I'm not convinced it's over. Are you?

I spent 10 years in Louisiana. wanted another Bronco. Guy down the road a ways had an 85 with a blown engine... I offered him 3k,...dude said he wanted 8k,...because Broncos are rare in LA...wouldnt come down a dollar.
7 years later he still had his 8000 dollar No engine havin Bronco sitting in the yard collecting rust.

On the Payton note... dude is like a super hero in New Orleans, walks on water..all that ****... but when things got tough he bailed.... left that team high and dry with no quarterback and cap issues they still havent recovered from.
Loomis could just be like the typical Louisiana coon-ass and not be very smart..... or he could still be butt hurt about how Payton did the team and intentionally trying to screw him back, like a bitter exe that wont give you your box of important papers so you can move out of state.

 

[ajcardfan]

Could trade with Raiders or Panthers, get more draft capital for this year and next, then trade for SP. Problem is we would be trading with zero leverage. 2 firsts next year would do it, yes?

Doing a trade now is stupid. Especially since teams know we are doing it to get Payton. There is no doubt in my mind if we played this card we would get fleeced.

Personally, I don't think Payton is worth a 1st or 2nd in this draft. I can handle a conditional pick next year. But if New Orleans won't take that, then eff em.

I am glad MO is bringing in more candidates. It's leverage in negotiations with NO. And, who knows? Maybe one of these guys blows everbody away and gets the job.

 

[kerouac9]

For McVay & Shanahan? Probably. I have concerns about Tomlin & Harbaugh though, so nah for me.

But even with McVay & Shanahan, they would be coming to a team with little talent. For Shanny, it took 3 years for him to field a great team, now imagine doing that without multiple first rounders. Imagine how long that would take to build from the ground up.

Weird take on Tomlin; you can have that one.

I don't know if I'd give up two firsts for anyone. I think you bite the bullet in Year 1 and trade a prospect who is unlikely to be elite but still maybe, but it's really hard for me to take the risk that Denver made (and also Houston with Laramy Tunsil), which is that you could be bad for a while even if the guy works out.

That first #1 pick that Shanahan got was used on Solomon Thomas, sixth overall. He's started five games in the past four season (with three different teams). Let's not overvalue draft picks, either.

It took Shanahan three years because his starting quarterbacks during that time included C.J. Beathard, Brian Hoyer, Jimmy Garropollo, and Nick Mullens. A new coach walks into the building with a QB better than all four of those guys put together with nothing to do but learn the playbook.

 

[RON_IN_OC]

I spent 10 years in Louisiana. wanted another Bronco. Guy down the road a ways had an 85 with a blown engine... I offered him 3k,...dude said he wanted 8k,...because Broncos are rare in LA...wouldnt come down a dollar.
7 years later he still had his 8000 dollar No engine havin Bronco sitting in the yard collecting rust.

On the Payton note... dude is like a super hero in New Orleans, walks on water..all that ****... but when things got tough he bailed.... left that team high and dry with no quarterback and cap issues they still havent recovered from.
Loomis could just be like the typical Louisiana coon-ass and not be very smart..... or he could still be butt hurt about how Payton did the team and intentionally trying to screw him back, like a bitter exe that wont give you your box of important papers so you can move out of state.

Are the cap issues and lack of QB Sean's fault? Didn't Loomis build the roster and spend the money? Maybe that's why Sean wants more say/control with a new team?????

I really don't know the full dynamic of how everything was handled in New Orleans....Do any of us?

 

[ASUCHRIS]

I never claimed I did, but since Bidwill has moved onto other candidates, especially highly qualified ones like Lou Anarumo, that doesn’t seem like a good sign for the #ProPayton guys on here.

Moved on intimates Payton is no longer in consideration - perhaps Bidwill is interviewing other highly qualified candidates to show he's willing to go that route?

And no, I don’t believe Bidwill is doing that for “leverage”. What would Loomis even lose from Bidwill doing that?

Outside of the Cards, who else can he convince to trade for Payton at this point? If Bidwill makes a move, the market for Payton is basically gone.

Loomis has gotten embarrassed badly by Howie not once, but twice in the past year. I bet Loomis feels the embarrassment, too. I doubt he wants to get made to look like a fool anymore, which is why he’s being so hard-headed with the demands.

Possible, you might be right.

Payton really doesn’t have a choice. It’s not up to him or Bidwill or George Paton. Loomis holds all the cards. I’m convinced it’s over for the Arizona Cardinals.

Possible, you might be right. If Bidwill bends over and gives Loomis whatever he wants, (2 firsts), he'll probably get what he wants.

 

[oaken1]

Are the cap issues and lack of QB Sean's fault? Didn't Loomis build the roster and spend the money? Maybe that's why Sean wants more say/control with a new team?????

I really don't know the full dynamic of how everything was handled in New Orleans....Do any of us?

well I wasnt in the building but word around town was that SP made the personnel decisions

 

[imaCafan]

Doing a trade now is stupid. Especially since teams know we are doing it to get Payton. There is no doubt in my mind if we played this card we would get fleeced.

Personally, I don't think Payton is worth a 1st or 2nd in this draft. I can handle a conditional pick next year. But if New Orleans won't take that, then eff em.

I am glad MO is bringing in more candidates. It's leverage in negotiations with NO. And, who knows? Maybe one of these guys blows everbody away and gets the job.

Right, hence saying zero leverage. Should have stated also I wouldn't do that trade either. Actually, the other coach I wanted if not getting SP was Reich, but he's gone...

 

[daves]

If the Cardinals didn't have #3 pick and we're down in the teens or 20s, this deal is already done.

If the Cards were picking in the teens or 20s, they're probably not trying to trade for Sean Payton because they were a good team.

Weird take.

Houston has #12 & Denver has #29.

...dave

Yes, but those draft picks came to them via trade. The picks they earned are 2nd overall (HOU) and 5th overall (DEN). I don't understand what your point is.

Really? Did @RON_IN_OC say anything about what picks the Cardinals EARNED? No, he talked about the pick the Cardinals HAVE. Your response to Ron was pedantic and incorrect, as I pointed out with two examples of teams that are looking for head coaches THIS YEAR who ARE PICKING in the 10's and 20's.

Hope you "understand" now.

...dave

 

[RON_IN_OC]

well I wasnt in the building but word around town was that SP made the personnel decisions

Cool, I haven't heard that or seen it anywhere.

 

[BirdGangThing]

Sean Payton isn't coming to Arizona and although I feel for those who still think he might, I also can't fathom why anyone would

Questionable and severely injured QB who's legs are his only protection due our O-line being in complete shambles. Not to mention the that same QB eating up all cap space. Our center basically retired during the season. Our best receiver wants out. Our second best receiver is only 4 feet tall. Our third best receiver and our injured QB's best homie on the team is only signed thru 2023, we'll be lucky to see Hollywood Brown and Kyler Murray play another 5 games together. Not to mention Ertz is also hurt.

Then there's a rookie GM who made his bones in the Draft. He's supposed to trade our best immediate future to bring Sean Payton in? That's pretty freakin counter productive if you ask me

It's just not gonna happen. If I'm wrong here I'll own it. But there are just better options for Sean Payton out there, including the FOX gig. It's just not happening people

 

[oaken1]

Cool, I haven't heard that or seen it anywhere.

IIRC it was a " what SP wants, SP gets" type scenario... but it could be just as possible that Loomis running the team into the ground was a factor in why SP retired.

I dunno, everything in the nfl is like investing in stocks.
past performance is not a guarantee of future success.

Mike just needs to pick a guy. Then get his guy.

 

[Totally_Red]

Payton ain't coming here IMO. Michael and Monti are moving on and hopefully one of these three coordinators are the next Kyle Shanahan.