Report: Gregg Williams had bounty with other teams

[sportznutt]

The Buffalo News reports Rams DC Greg Williams' bounty system was in place as coach of the Bills from 2001-2003.

Two former Bills players confirm a reward for "knockout shots," similar to Williams' off-the-books compensation in New Orleans and reportedly with the Redskins as well. Pressure is mounting for commissioner Roger Goodell to suspend Williams for a year -- and perhaps ban him for life -- if he's found to be lying about the bounty system that deep into his past. Rams coach Jeff Fisher was defensive coordinator for Buddy Ryan, who coached against the Cowboys in the infamous 1989 "Bounty Bowl" game.

rotoworld.com

 

[52brandon]

A Redskins player that played under Williams said he had the bounty system in place there as well

 

[AsUdUdE]

I heard an interview this morning with some nfl insider on nfl radio.. He said Gregg will coach this year probably, but he expects atleast an 8 game suspension if not longer for the rams new DC..

And if he continues with anything of the sort he faces stiffer penalties including possible expullsion from the league..

Fantastic!!

 

[Buckybird]

I heard an interview this morning with some nfl insider on nfl radio.. He said Gregg will coach this year probably, but he expects atleast an 8 game suspension if not longer for the rams new DC..

And if he continues with anything of the sort he faces stiffer penalties including possible expullsion from the league..

Fantastic!!

He might not coach this year because more players are coming out & saying more & more. It's only going to uglier for Williams & I believe the Saints also.

I still say Goodell should strip the Saints franchise tag, plus more to really send a message to anyone trying this in the future, gven the new safety rules & former players sueing the league.

Just wait until the IRS starts snooping around in this matter

 

[CtCardinals78]

I heard an interview this morning with some nfl insider on nfl radio.. He said Gregg will coach this year probably, but he expects atleast an 8 game suspension if not longer for the rams new DC..

And if he continues with anything of the sort he faces stiffer penalties including possible expullsion from the league..

Fantastic!!

In terms of the game and imact on the NFL this is way worse than what Pacman, Roethlisberger, Vick and others have done. Those guys all served substantial suspensions for their off field conduct. Their conduct had no effect on fellow players. Williams was out to injure and quite possibly end guys careers. What he did led to one of the best QBs in the modern era to retire, cost a HOF QB a shot at another Super Bowl and did major damage to one of the best players to ever play the game. Plus how many more players were hurt because of Williams thuggery? If Vick and Pacman can be indefinitely suspended for their crimes than Williams should be banned for life for this, which can be argued is assault.

 

[52brandon]

In terms of the game and imact on the NFL this is way worse than what Pacman, Roethlisberger, Vick and others have done. Those guys all served substantial suspensions for their off field conduct. Their conduct had no effect on fellow players. Williams was out to injure and quite possibly end guys careers. What he did led to one of the best QBs in the modern era to retire, cost a HOF QB a shot at another Super Bowl and did major damage to one of the best players to ever play the game. Plus how many more players were hurt because of Williams thuggery? If Vick and Pacman can be indefinitely suspended for their crimes than Williams should be banned for life for this, which can be argued is assault.

whether or not the beating they put on Kurt directly led to his retirement is unknown. But you make an excellent point on the suspensions from breaking the off-field CoC being less relevant to the game than what Williams did

also, I just read that Tony Dungy said that he believes Manning's neck problems stemmed from a Williams coached Redskins D vicious hit on him. So if that proves true, Warner and Manning (2 of the top 5 QBs of all time) suffered serious, potentially career-ending injuries because of his bounty program. I'd say that's enough to boot him from the NFL IMO

 

[mojorizen7]

Loomis,Payton and Williams need to be punished.
The St Louis Rams do not.

Goodell needs to take his time and get this right.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Loomis,Payton and Williams need to be punished.
The St Louis Rams do not.

Goodell needs to take his time and get this right.

The Rams hired him and it's pretty clear that Fisher has known about this practice in the past. I think the Rams should be given a lifetime ban from the playoffs. Next, we need to take a close and impartial look at Seattle and San Francisco to see if we can't somehow implicate them also. Justice must prevail.

Steve

 

[52brandon]

The Rams hired him and it's pretty clear that Fisher has known about this practice in the past. I think the Rams should be given a lifetime ban from the playoffs. Next, we need to take a close and impartial look at Seattle and San Francisco to see if we can't somehow implicate them also. Justice must prevail.

Steve

I know you're joking about SF and SEA, but if the Rams did know about his history doing that and hired him knowing it and maybe partially because of it, they should in fact be punished. Proving it will likely be pretty hard though

 

[Totally_Red]

Loomis,Payton and Williams need to be punished.
The St Louis Rams do not.

Goodell needs to take his time and get this right.

There's a reason the Saints didn't extend Greg Williams. Jeff Fisher had to have an inkling of what was coming. He may not have known how serious it was, but if he didn't have an inkling that there was a reason behind the Saints apparently making no move to extend Williams then he is clueless IMO.

 

[mojorizen7]

The Rams hired him and it's pretty clear that Fisher has known about this practice in the past. I think the Rams should be given a lifetime ban from the playoffs. Next, we need to take a close and impartial look at Seattle and San Francisco to see if we can't somehow implicate them also. Justice must prevail.

Steve

The Rams currently dont need anything to ban them from the playoffs,they're doing just fine on their own in that regard.
----
Goodell does need to decide which approach to take here....is he going to go after every franchise that Williams ever broke the rules with while he was employed there? Sort of high on the ridiculous scale that one.

Heavy fines for individuals involved? Definitely. When we talk about game suspensions for coaches who are no longer with the team they broke the law with? Touchy.

 

[AzStevenCal]

I know you're joking about SF and SEA, but if the Rams did know about his history doing that and hired him knowing it and maybe partially because of it, they should in fact be punished. Proving it will likely be pretty hard though

Nah, I don't think it's reasonable to expect the Rams to (in effect) take action when the league has failed to. Unless the NFL finds documents that show the Rams hired him because they wanted him to come in and initiate an illegal pay-for-big-hits scheme, I can't see the league having any interest in the Rams decision to hire Williams. Even if they could prove they wanted Gregg to start up a bounty system in St Louis, it would get a little dicey trying to punish them for something they've yet to do.

Steve

 

[AzStevenCal]

The Rams currently dont need anything to ban them from the playoffs,they're doing just fine on their own in that regard.

Okay, if the Rams promise to keep on keeping on, I'm willing to let them off the hook.

Steve

 

[mojorizen7]

I know you're joking about SF and SEA, but if the Rams did know about his history doing that and hired him knowing it and maybe partially because of it, they should in fact be punished. Proving it will likely be pretty hard though

Ridiculous. How far would you take this approach? Lets go after every one that had any knowledge of this practice then....then we can go after the teams that hired those individuals too....and make those teams pay also.

That'll teach everybody.

 

[sportznutt]

To me, it seems unfair to take away a draft pick from them......not for the Saints, but for the fact that there will be fewer players drafted......why should someone from college r university get punished for the Saints?

 

[52brandon]

Nah, I don't think it's reasonable to expect the Rams to (in effect) take action when the league has failed to. Unless the NFL finds documents that show the Rams hired him because they wanted him to come in and initiate an illegal pay-for-big-hits scheme, I can't see the league having any interest in the Rams decision to hire Williams. Even if they could prove they wanted Gregg to start up a bounty system in St Louis, it would get a little dicey trying to punish them for something they've yet to do.

Steve

it's a red ball man. The pre-cogs told Tom Cruise to take care of it already


but sure they can, it's conspiracy. I've heard of people getting locked up for hiring somebody to commit murder. Also have heard of conspiracy to commit robbery. I'm sure there's more similar, but they don't make as good of news stories I guess lol

 

[52brandon]

Ridiculous. How far would you take this approach? Lets go after every one that had any knowledge of this practice then....then we can go after the teams that hired those individuals too....and make those teams pay also.

That'll teach everybody.

how do you figure? It's intent

 

[sportznutt]

Former Indianapolis coach Tony Dungy has said a hit on Peyton Manning in a 2006 game with the Redskins may have started the neck problems that eventually sidelined the Colts quarterback all of last season.

Pat Yasinskas @ espn

 

[AzStevenCal]

it's a red ball man. The pre-cogs told Tom Cruise to take care of it already


but sure they can, it's conspiracy. I've heard of people getting locked up for hiring somebody to commit murder. Also have heard of conspiracy to commit robbery. I'm sure there's more similar, but they don't make as good of news stories I guess lol

There's a difference between "conspiracy" and desire. In the real world, the conspiracy itself is a crime but just wanting to rob a bank or wanting to murder someone doesn't count.

Steve

 

[sportznutt]

News the NFL's bounty investigation will expand from New Orleans to Washington cannot be good for the St. Louis Rams' new defensive coordinator.

Gregg Williams was coordinating the Saints' and Redskins' defenses when those teams' defensive players allegedly earned extra cash for knocking out opponents. And with similar revelations coming out from Buffalo, where Williams was once head coach, Williams appears additionally vulnerable to NFL discipline.

Williams' cooperation with the NFL's investigation into the Saints, signaled by his recent statement of contrition, will presumably help his cause. However, Williams' cooperation with investigations into the Redskins and/or Bills would seem to work against him.

Williams is in prime position to cooperate with the Saints investigation. He no longer works for the team, so he would not face internal pressure to withhold information. Williams loses nothing if the Saints incur fines or lose draft choices. The league obviously has much invested in making an example of the Saints, adding value to whatever Williams can tell them. But if the NFL determines Williams was a driving force behind bounty systems in Washington and Buffalo, then what?

Coy Wire, a former safety for the Bills during Williams' tenure there, described a culture of "malicious intent" toward opposing players, according to the Buffalo News. Another teammate said the culture was mostly player-driven.

"There were rewards," Wire told the News. "There never was a point where cash was handed out in front of the team. But surely, you were going to be rewarded. When somebody made a big hit that hurt an opponent, it was commended and encouraged."

The NFL will have to determine just how far it wants to go in changing the culture of its game. Formal bounty systems obviously cross the line. But if a pass-rusher could privately guarantee knocking out the opposing quarterback every week, let's face it, that player would rank among the highest-paid in the league. Punishing quarterbacks will always be a top priority.

Former Redskins linebacker LaVar Arrington, appearing on Sirius radio, framed what happened during his Washington tenure within the broader NFL culture.

"My intent was to deliver what would be considered a kill shot within the framework of what football is," Arrington said. "Not trying to hurt somebody or injure them, but again, the reality that exists, we all know what happens in pileups, from the names that are called during pileups to what ankles might get turned, private parts get punched and grabbed, people get scratched. There are a lot of things that go on."

Sando

 

[52brandon]

There's a difference between "conspiracy" and desire. In the real world, the conspiracy itself is a crime but just wanting to rob a bank or wanting to murder someone doesn't count.

Steve

I completely agree there. But to hire the guy for that purpose (in the murder example, a hitman) is illegal

 

[mojorizen7]

how do you figure? It's intent

I figure thats a futile,ridiculous road of litigation in this case. Thats how.

I'm speaking from the view of a Rams fan sure,but what should be on trial here is the practices of a DC and his FORMER superiors who had knowledge. The Rams organization hired this guy to be DC. So what?
Williams hasn't coached a single practice or offered up a single "bounty" there. Thats a fact.

Think about it in terms of a company hiring someone who(after the fact) comes under investigation for prior criminal activity.

Where's all the former and wanna-be lawyers in here to straighten this out?

 

[52brandon]

I figure thats a futile,ridiculous road of litigation in this case. Thats how.

I'm speaking from the view of a Rams fan sure,but what should be on trial here is the practices of a DC and his FORMER superiors who had knowledge. The Rams organization hired this guy to be DC. So what?
Williams hasn't coached a single practice or offered up a single "bounty" there. Thats a fact.

Think about it in terms of a company hiring someone who(after the fact) comes under investigation for prior criminal activity.

Where's all the former and wanna-be lawyers in here to straighten this out?

I'm more thinking of a person hiring a hitman that simply hasn't been caught yet. Or to use your example, it would be like hiring an accountant known for cooking books that just hasn't raised any red flags yet to be investigated

If the Rams were aware that he was putting out these bounties throughout his coaching career and hired him for that, yes they should be penalized

 

[Crazy Canuck]

I figure thats a futile,ridiculous road of litigation in this case. Thats how.

I'm speaking from the view of a Rams fan sure,but what should be on trial here is the practices of a DC and his FORMER superiors who had knowledge. The Rams organization hired this guy to be DC. So what?
Williams hasn't coached a single practice or offered up a single "bounty" there. Thats a fact.

Think about it in terms of a company hiring someone who(after the fact) comes under investigation for prior criminal activity.

Where's all the former and wanna-be lawyers in here to straighten this out?

I have a law degree, but will abstain from involving myself in a hundred point, counterpoints with someone hooked on Law and Order re-runs.

 

[AzStevenCal]

I have a law degree, but will abstain from involving myself in a hundred point, counterpoints with someone hooked on Law and Order re-runs.

Fortunately for me, my knowledge of the legal system comes straight from the source (Grisham novels, of course). I say it's hard to prove and even if you can prove it, it might be moot. According to the information Google just provided for me, more and more courts are requiring a covert action in addition to the agreement to commit a crime. If you can't trust Grisham and Google, who can you trust?

Steve