Richard Soloman

[Stout]

Nidan, I'm absolutely thrilled with what's happened thus far in the offseason, so don't take this post the wrong way. I'm very far from being on the 'dark side' right now. I'm drinking Green and Red Kool-Aid every day now!

Regarding Rod Graves and his abilities...well, if he makes a gaffe like he did in last year's draft, then my faith will be completely lost in him. He traded from a position of strength, traded BACK in the 2nd round (everyone seems to credit him with trading UP to get Boldin, but we were actually lucky he was still on the board), gave UP a 4th rounder IN ADDITION, and reached hard core for our 1st rounders.

Even if Pace and Johnson turn into average to decent players, it was a stupid decision. He paid far over market value to trade BACK, not UP, got burned, and hopefully learned his lesson. If so, I'll be absolutely thrilled. If not, I'll be destroyed, and will be calling for his head.

Now, I'm not going to pre-judge him on the draft. I'll wait and see what we do, and take into consideration any input we KNOW for a FACT Coach Green puts into it. But if he completes another draft-day trade disaster like that again, I'll want his head on a platter, thank you very much

 

[vikesfan]

Let me set the record straight on what happened to DG (Denny Green) and Solomon in Minnesota.

(1) Solomon was a defensive coach on the #1 defense and the #6 defense in the NFL in Minnesota. He was also a "sounding board" for DG and helped in personnel decisions (personnel decisions that had PFW rank DG #1 in the NFL and TSN give DG a top 3 ranking). Decisions that resulted in 9 straight seasons without a losing record, 4 division titles, 8 playoff appearences and 2 nfc final.

(2) Please don't believe what Reusse said about the Redskins demanding that Solomon not be hired. Reusse is a long time DG hater who has made up many lies about DG. Both the NY TIMES and WASH. POST documented that DG was the victim of a high tech lynching in Minnesota. The media was out to get DG in Minnesota. So they made up stuff. They also applied a racist doublestandard.

Some of the great lies told about DG: he couldn't draft defense or get good defense FAs, he lost the 98 final. the 2001 season was his fault, he was fired, he was a bad coach, he lost control of the team, the players did not respond to him, etc etc etc etc etc. One lie after another. With many of the lies having a racist base. I can expose each and everyone of these lies if you want me to.

(3) Every coach in the NFL has guys they hire cause they trust them. Parcells, Belichek, etc. Solomon is DG's guy and helped him build the most successful record in the NFL over their time together in the NFL. It is patently racist to say a black coach cannot have his "caddy coach" when white coaches do it all the time. But this guy is more then a caddy. He was crucial to incredible success. As inside LB coach he helped develop Wong into a good nfl player.

(4) DG was not fired in Minnesota. What happened in Minnesota was that McCombs decided to sell the team. In order to sell the team for maximium profit he was no longer willing to spend the money on quality FAs or coaches or front office staff that DG expected.
McCombs in order to save money wanted DG to resign if he resigned McCombs wouldnt have to pay out his contract. So he told him to fire his best friend. DG told him to stick it and didn't resign.
When McCombs made it clear that he would not spend the money on FAs, front office etc that DG expected and when DG made it clear he would not resign and lose the millions owed him they came to a deal. DG resigned and was paid a large portion of his contract and he kepty his mouth shut about McComb's new thrift plan. When people said racism was involved in the DG resignation DG came out and put a halt to that talk.

Then Red proceeded to destroy the Vikings with his Thrift Plan. He cut the Front Office to the lowest paid in the NFL. He didn't hire a GM. He imposed a coaches salary cap ensuring low paid and hence low quality coaches would be hired. He hired a head coach who was the cheapest in the NFL and has no business being a head coach. The Vikes had the second most cap money to spend in the last 2 years (only Texas 2 years ago and Cards last year had more in cap to spend.) And he didn't spend it all and he only spent it on low quality FA who don't require upfront money that would come out of his pocket on a sale.

DG expects to win a SB not maximize profit for the owner when he sells the team. DG took a hit in the 2001 season to free up cap for 2002 and 2003 and he wanted to upgrade the Front Office and Coaching staff and when Red said no DG said good bye.

P.S. I honestly believe that no matter what Graves or anyone says DG will have final say on the draft. Remember all the teams that passed on Moss. DG would never allow that to happen. Conventional wisdom was pass on Moss.
Also when he was in Minnesota before he took over as de facto GM DG wanted to draft Sapp and was not allowed to do this. Imagine Sapp and Randle on those great Minnesota teams they would have been winning SBs. After he was prevented from taking Sapp DG then assumed control of the team so when a Sapp (Moss) came up in the future he could snap him up. I have no idea what kind of GM Graves is but he must know that DG is a great judge of talent both in drafts and FA. Some of the CARDS draft picks have been weak and I don't think there is any way DG would accept weak drafts.

 

[RLakin]

Originally posted by nidan
I think it is simple, we hired Dennis Green he wanted Solomon.

You don't bring in a top level HC then ignore him on the staff he wants. This is a Dennis Green call not RG.

I don't agree with you about Rod Graves but then I have had the luxury of talking to him at some length. What you see as mistakes, I see as a longer term plan, partly because I have slightly (and I do mean only slightly, no digs or sarcasam intendtended) more info.

With a GM I think we need to see what happens over the next few years to really judge him.

That's fine. I've only spoken once to Mr. Graves briefly on the phone and he seems like a very nice man and I can see why you and others really like him. I think where you and I part ways, is that I don't ever take what someone says to me as gospel (I mean no offense by that). If the world worked that way, Joe Bugel and Dave McGinnis would be great coaches. But they aren't. As far as allowing coaches free reign on their staffs I can only imagine how some would feel if Green had made a similar demand on Joe Greene or Larry Marmie. I can also imagine how some would feel if Joe Greene was added to another NFL team's coaching staff. We'd probably be laughing as hard as Vikings fans are now. And if you look at the info on Solomon, you'd understand that this guy has Greene's background as a teacher without the hall of fame background and with some serious personal baggage.
As far as the Grave’s plan (and I don't want to turn this into another thread on him) there's no logical way to justify the method behind last off-season’s madness. He didn't trade down with the intent of drafting Jerome McDougle just so he could take Calvin Pace. He didn't tell Darren Urban that the Cardinals needed to be more aggressive in the free agent market this off-season because they were plenty proactive last year. He didn't tell everyone that they planned to add veterans on June 1st because he didn't expect there to be any available. It's not a leap of faith to believe that Graves' admitted mistakes were in fact part of a larger plan. It's a leap in logic, as in the off the cliff type.
Being close to a source can work both ways. You can be both in-the-know and blinded by personal loyalty and/or admiration. I prefer (and this is just my opinion) to take a step back and look at the data without personal feelings either way. And from that perspective, this man's respective talents as a personnel man are very weak.

 

[ajcardfan]

Thanks vikesfan. There's always two sides to the story, thanks for telling Greens'. We'll see how it plays out here.

 

[Renz]

Originally posted by ajcardfan
Thanks vikesfan. There's always two sides to the story, thanks for telling Greens'. We'll see how it plays out here.

Ditto.

 

[AzCards21]

Originally posted by ajcardfan
Thanks vikesfan. There's always two sides to the story, thanks for telling Greens'. We'll see how it plays out here.

I third that! Geezus, How bad can the guy be? It surely wasn't bad enough to make the Vikes miss the playoffs 8 out of 10 years. I'll give them a shot.

I see a huge similarity between the DG Vikes and the current Eagles. Who will be the sacrificial lamb in Philly this year?

A problem I would love to endure. NFC championships but no SB. Let's deal with that when it happens. Getting there is our goal now. DG with Soloman have gotten there. I hope they get us there for once.

 

[Red Dawn]

Yeah vikesfan, thank you for clearing that Soloman situation up.

 

[nidan]

Originally posted by RLakin
That's fine. I've only spoken once to Mr. Graves briefly on the phone and he seems like a very nice man and I can see why you and others really like him. I

No I don't take any offence at what you said but I think you misunderstood me a little.

Mac was/still is "a very nice man", not Rod Graves. That isn't say the he isn't nice but he strikes me more of a CEO who is in control and secure (boyh in his personailiy and job) enough not to need to prove it continously. Let's say I respect him, rather than just like him. It was impossible not to like Mac.

I think RG would agree that some things could have been done better in last years draft, but he did get Q so I think he is owed some slack for that.

 

[Tangodnzr]

Indeed....Thank you Vikesfan, for your input here. A different perspective, like that is nice.

Obviously you are a big Dennis Green fan. I hope the future reveals that viewpoint to be entirely justified. ]

That should indeed be good news for all of us Card fans.

At least now, as Paul Harvey would say....."and now you know.......the rest of the story." ....and some kind of explanation for the unusual "Solomon situation".

Pissing off "the media" anymore seems about akin to pissing off a cop or a judge. It can make your life miserable.

To me, learning some of these things "fit" reasonable explanations for some of the misconcepions getting spread.
I don't know that I'm still 100% convinced that there may not have been at least "some truth" in some of the criticisms. But Overall, It does allay a lot of the nagging concern I had in regard to Solomon, and just what Green's real agenda is.

As far as Graves, I pretty much like what he's done the last few years. I do think he may have gotten schooled a little this year, but, nothing THAT major. I don't see how anyone can really criticise last's year'd draft.

Bryant Johnson
Calvin Pace
Anquan Boldin
Gerald Hayes
Kenny King
Reggie Wells
Tony Gilbert

I dare anyone to step up and say this was a bad draft. Forget about numbers, or who got drafted where. Just look at the talent.

Like someone said, I think that early run on DE's took a lot of people by surprise...and to be able to predict that Philly was going to respond the way they did?
Nah, I'm not going to call Graves a moron over that. Yes, I think he/the rest of the group got a good lesson in how you can never be over-prepared going into draft day itself. Proper Preparation makes "thinking effectively on your feet" a whole lot easier when the ol' proverbial shift hits the fan. I don't think they were "negligent" by any means. But I sure hope I don't have to see the lesson "learned twice".

Likewise, I don't see any major screw up that he made in free agency. Looking back now, I actually like what they did.
I like the signing of Emmitt. I wasn't jumping for joy right when it was made, but now I think it was a great move.

I think Blake was as good of an option as there was available.

Tell me how signing Dexter Jackson was a bad move.

Holliday might have been nice, but then Johnson might very well have faded into oblivion. I think he's one of the real pluses this season.
Colvin......well he got bit by the Wadsworth curse. You can what if all you want, but would his presence have put the team in any better position ...as of this moment....than it is now.??

Marcus Robinson....to be honest, I've forgotten why we didn't get him. If that's the biggest "screw-up" you can hang on Graves...then so be it. I don't think its that big of a deal.

The one thing that did impress me most about this wild coaching bazaar was that even though Daniel Snyder forced the action, the Cards were right there, and worked their plan very efficiently.
No draft day, getting left in the dust there at all.

Cool !!!!

And to get some tangible reassurance that the plan itself does seem to be as they would say in the military......
not only locked.....loaded.......and fired......but well aimed too.

Cool again !!!!