Robert Horry = Greatest Role Player Ever

[Cheesebeef]

Can anyone tell me how Detroit leaves that guy wide-freaking open for 3 with 8 seconds left? Detroit - welcome to Paxson for 3 - the play that will be shown ad naseum for the next half decade.

 

[asudevil83]

as much as i HATE the guy....he's probably the most clutch player i've ever seen. he's hit so many big shots in the playoffs throughout his career.

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

Greatest role player ever? Eh, perhaps.

Most clutch role player ever? Probably.

 

[O]

Clutch, absolutely.

 

[WizardOfAz]

Didn't they say he broke some three-point record held by Jordan?

That's huge!

 

[elindholm]

He was certainly clutch today, but he's also missed his share in the past. It's just that no one remembers those.

This was one of the greatest games of his career -- seriously -- so it's not realistic to judge him based on just tonight.

 

[Cheesebeef]

He was certainly clutch today, but he's also missed his share in the past. It's just that no one remembers those.

This was one of the greatest games of his career -- seriously -- so it's not realistic to judge him based on just tonight.

don't you think the reason that no one remembers that shots he's missed is because they are so overwhemlingly over-shadowed by the ones he has hit in route to being a 6 time champion?

Tonight was merely the exclamation point in his career. Honestly - did you think his last three wasn't going in?

 

[ajcardfan]

Man, he's made as many big shots at the end of the game in the playoffs as anyone I remember. Hell, he's right up there with Bird, Magic and Jordan. At least in my memory.

In fact, the only team the SOB played for that he didn't hit a game winning shot in the playoffs for was the Suns!

 

[elindholm]

don't you think the reason that no one remembers that shots he's missed is because they are so overwhemlingly over-shadowed by the ones he has hit in route to being a 6 time champion?

Sure, but what people remember -- what makes an impression -- isn't always the same as what, over time, objectively happened. Try this test: Guess what Horry's career 3FG% is in the playoffs. You'll be surprised at how low it is.

Honestly - did you think his last three wasn't going in?

What difference does it make what I thought? My gut feeling while the ball is in flight doesn't mean anything.

 

[George O'Brien]

Typically the difference between stars and super stars is how they play in big games; yet how do you explain otherwise medicore players who routinely play well in big games?

During the regular season Horry shot 41.9% from the field and 37% for three. In the playoffs, he has averaged 41.4% for three prior to this evening. Tonight he shoots 5 of 6 for three and 21 points in the biggest game of the season for the Spurs. Unbelievable.

 

[elindholm]

yet how do you explain otherwise medicore players who routinely play well in big games?

Because it doesn't happen "routinely." It happens a few times, under particularly memorable circumstances, and people's memories get a little subjective.

 

[Cheesebeef]

don't you think the reason that no one remembers that shots he's missed is because they are so overwhemlingly over-shadowed by the ones he has hit in route to being a 6 time champion?

Sure, but what people remember -- what makes an impression -- isn't always the same as what, over time, objectively happened. Try this test: Guess what Horry's career 3FG% is in the playoffs. You'll be surprised at how low it is.

Honestly - did you think his last three wasn't going in?

What difference does it make what I thought? My gut feeling while the ball is in flight doesn't mean anything.

Actually, it wouldn't surprise me at all. The guy really only shows up at the end of the third quarter/fourth quarter. Now if those numbers were low, I'd be surprised.

As to the second part of your post - I guess the "difference" if you['re looking for one is if you did think the shot was going in that would be pretty good proof of your thoughts on Horry as a clutch player. Sheesh - I was just asking a question - no reason to act like a crotchety old man.

 

[Joe Mama]

I can't remember where I read this, but I think it was that Robert Horry actually has a surprisingly low field-goal percentage during the last few minutes of his career playoff games. I could be messing that up though. I remember I was quite surprised when I saw that it was something like 38%.

What I like about Horry is the hustle plays he makes during big games.

Joe Mama

 

[elindholm]

As to the second part of your post - I guess the "difference" if you['re looking for one is if you did think the shot was going in that would be pretty good proof of your thoughts on Horry as a clutch player.

Sorry, I misunderstood. I thougth you were asking whether Horry actually is a clutch player, not whether people think of him as one. I definitely agree that people think of him as one. My only point is what people "think" isn't always the same as what is really true, particularly when it comes to long-term statistical fluctuations.

no reason to act like a crotchety old man.

Geezer, thank you.

 

[O]

Big Shot Bob.

 

[thegrahamcrackr]

He was certainly clutch today, but he's also missed his share in the past. It's just that no one remembers those.

Do you remember that Michael Jordan commercial where he said how many X number of game deciding shots he made, then how many he missed?

Even the greatest players miss more end of game shots than they make. The main thing to remember is which players make the big shots the most frequently, and how effective they are.

It wouldn't surprise me if Horry's fg% was low in the clutch moments, however I would guess it is pretty good in comparison to most players.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Do you remember that Michael Jordan commercial where he said how many X number of game deciding shots he made, then how many he missed?

Even the greatest players miss more end of game shots than they make. The main thing to remember is which players make the big shots the most frequently, and how effective they are.

It wouldn't surprise me if Horry's fg% was low in the clutch moments, however I would guess it is pretty good in comparison to most players.

good point.

 

[Cheesebeef]

there really should have been a ? on the thread title. It would make for an interesting discussion.

IMO - It would be Horry though. Rarely has an outrageous contract, does the little things and is a very clutch IMO. What more can you ask for from a bench/starter?

What do you guys think? Who is the best role player of all time?

 

[elindholm]

Do you remember that Michael Jordan commercial where he said how many X number of game deciding shots he made, then how many he missed?

No. I remember a commerical in which he said how many he'd missed, only. I don't think he ever gave a comparison.

Also -- I hate to break this to you, Andy -- but not everything you hear in a TV commerical can be taken at face value.

You aren't seriously comparing Horry to Jordan, are you?

 

[arthurracoon]

I was SHOCKED when I saw them double Ginobli, and saw the pass to Horry before it happened.

Once the ball was on its way to Horry, I knew he would sink the 3.

How could he not?

You KNEW it was going in.



HOW COULD YOU LEAVE HORRY OPEN?!?!?!

He was the ONE person on that team that you COULD NOT LEAVE OPEN!!!

How could you not have ONE guy on Horry NO MATTER WHAT!



Horry would have to be one of the greates clutch role/bench players EVER.

 

[fordronken]

Larry Brown stopped just short of blaming Rasheed for that play. He seemed like he was about to, then called it a miscommunication, which, he said, ultimately falls on him as the coach.

Horry also pointed out in his press conference that his numbers are pretty much the same in the regular season and the playoffs. What does that mean? I don't know. You have to be in a position to shoot a lot of big shots to be able to make them. But regardless of that, he has made a lot and that's pretty impressive nonetheless.

 

[George O'Brien]

One of the advantages to having a PF who can shoot the three is that it always creates mismatches. Sheed is not a wing player and not used to guarding guys on the three point line. So with the game on the line an Manu driving for tying layup, all instincts say to stop the man trying to make the layup.

The real question is why LB did not have Prince on Horry, considering how Horry was shooting.

 

[elindholm]

Even before Wallace got there, Ginobili was stuck in the corner going nowhere. He wasn't a threat to drive.

 

[Errntknght]

On the replay which showed the play develope, it looked like Rasheed had forgotten about Horry - he'd dropped 15 feet off him before he went to double team Manu. If he'd have been heads up he'd have made sure where Horry was and positioned himself so Ginobili couldn't make a pass to him - it would have been bad to let Manu slip through to the hoop to tie the game but allowing the hot hand to shoot a gamewinning trey is worse. Give LB props for not blaming Rasheed because it looked like he bungled it to me. Even after Manu threw the pass by him Rasheed didn't react like he knew where it was headed.

 

[thegrahamcrackr]

No. I remember a commerical in which he said how many he'd missed, only. I don't think he ever gave a comparison.

Maybe that is how it went, I actually don't remember it to well. I guess it wasn't that good of way to make my point.

In no way am I comparing Horry to Jordan - even in "clutchness". I was simply using an example after you said people always forget the ones he misses. Every player, including the best of all time, misses a lot of game winning shots. Does that mean that the ones he makes should be taken at full value?

How about this question Eric, what players would you rather have taking the last second shot? I guess we could name a handfull of superstars like Kobe and Tmac to do it.

What about players taking the last second shot who don't create it themselves? Is there any other spot up shooter you would rather take that shot?

Take it a step further, is there any role player you would rather take a last second shot?