Robert Sarver is in Big Trouble (ANNOUNCES SALE PROCESS)

[JerkFace]

I think the article would of hit harder if Schultz hadn’t built it up as much as he did.

 

[TJ]

I'm sad for those who experienced Sarver's hate and bigotry. I'm happy that we have the opportunity to change ownership. Far too often, we talk about ownership's failure with all four professional teams in AZ, with the symptom being bad coaching, GM and player management. We talk about firing those people, but cant change ownership. Now that Sarver is vulnerable to being ousted, I'm stoked.

 

[Cheesebeef]

He needs to go, but we also need to virtually ignore anything coming from Earl Watson. The guy WAS toxic. The misogyny from Sarver is no surprise, but I will bet that is an issue with most of the front I cannot believe how many of you are falling for an obvious Rich Paul / Earl Watson revenge stunt. All because you don't like the guy.

EDIT: I don't like the guy, and I am sure the place was toxic during all those losing years. But let's not pretend that Earl Watson doesn't have an axe to grind.

This. Let's assume the Earl Watson and even a couple of the incidents is sour grapes. THERE ARE 70 PEOPLE ON RECORD WHO WERE NOT ALL FIRED.

Let that sink in. 70 including ownership and an ex-HR head. People that didn't have an axe to grind but got the hell out because it was so toxic. Racism and sexism has no place in the organization. None. Too many people confirm the racism and sexism.

Sarver must go. He simply cannot be a bigger story than the team. I hope he does the honorable thing and resigns but based on his character that likely wont happen.

the volume of people and the fact that one of the freaking co-owners is lending credence to this report is enough even taking the Watson stuff out. Most of which I tend to believe anyway. Not ALL of Watson's stuff, but enough of it.

but i remain cynical. it's REALLY HARD to get rid of owners and unless there's tape or email trails, I think he survives this and continues to destroy the franchise from the inside. REALLY hope to be wrong though.

 

[Cheesebeef]

I think the article would of hit harder if Schultz hadn’t built it up as much as he did.

i think for the majority of people though, it will hit REALLY hard. We all knew about it in Phoenix, but the overwhelming majority of casual sports fans across the country probably didn't know much about this. ESPN literally never spoke a word until today and Schultz's tweet on Friday was pretty much forgotten by Monday. But now with people on the record, this will be the talk of the day across multiple platforms.

my question is... does this article bring any other damaging stories of racism/sexism out from people who believe they can safely or more safely say things. does this snowball into something even bigger?

 

[Cheesebeef]

That's because the Suns had a culture of covering things up by making sure it never got past HR or they settled with employees as a practice even if they were wrongfully terminated. That's according to the ex-head of HR who was NOT fired by the way.

this is super ugly.

 

[Chris_Sanders]

I pray he is out

Restated

 

[Cheesebeef]

Restated

we're all with ya!

 

[overseascardfan]

So the claims are legit? AZ Central ran another article today.

 

[CardsSunsDbacks]

I just hope that it is damning enough for swift action to be taken. Would be a shame if this drags on for a big chunk of the season.

 

[95pro]

It’s all over espn now

Vince Carter was interviewed.

ESPN will investigate. Probably not a quick process espn says. I think unless a smoking gun is found this drags out and he doesn’t get removed.

Pretty stereotypical though. White. Money. Power. Leads to stuff like this. I’m sure red flags were already waved, there are people helping keep this hush hush.

 

[Hoop Head]

What I learned from this article?

Suns HR is an absolute disaster. Who is to blame for that though? I'm not sure. It's easy to blame Sarver but how many owners of huge businesses work hand in hand with HR? Not many and it seems Sarver is too busy trying to play Head Basketball Advisor to coaches and players to be doing much with HR.

I want him out but there's no smoking gun. This is a compilation of claims from people who had negative experiences with the Suns. It sucks there were so many but I'd bet any company that employees as many people as the Suns have roughly the same percentage of pissed off former employees. Does that make it right? No. It seems the Suns are likely the worst NBA franchise to work for and that's something that shouldn't be accepted and let continue.

I really don't view Sarver differently than I did a month ago before this article was released. He sucks. He thinks buying the Suns made him part of the team as in being "one of the guys" and acted with as much maturity and class as a 20 something year old player. That's not a good thing, especially when that person also flaunts their authority when they feel pressured or questioned. Like I've always heard Mark Cuban is similar, running around with players and coaches, very involved, but I don't believe he plays the boss card like Sarver if someone dares to treat him as a peer in return. That's how Sarver seems to differ, he wants to be one of the boys for the fun but also wants to be above them as well and it doesn't work like that.

He sucks, hopefully he can be convinced to sell of stripped of his power as managing general partner. I'll be surprised if that happens, especially in a timely manner, unless the majority of the ownership group starts pushing him out. I don't think Adam Silver will make him sell or step down and I don't believe there's enough evidence here to do so. There does need to be some serious changes within the organization though because it seems their HR department is atrocious. Whoever runs that is a real POS.

 

[Hoop Head]

I just hope that it is damning enough for swift action to be taken. Would be a shame if this drags on for a big chunk of the season.

I'd say there's not based on what that article says. There's enough to get some people fired, probably, and a division rebuilt but that's pretty much it. Not enough concrete evidence of wrong doing on Sarver's end.

Unless an investigation into why HR is such a mess uncovers something to take down Sarver, this ain't it.

 

[overseascardfan]

Too much smoke for there to not be fire. There isn't a damning voice recording like with Sterling but 70+ people going on record is hard to brush off as disgruntled ex employees especially when there are current employees making allegations.

Hopefully Adam Silver finds us an owner with bottomless pockets like he did for the Clippers with Balmer.

 

[Hoop Head]

The Suns currently employee 556 people, according to a Google search and that sounds reasonable. 70~ are saying it sucks to work there, that's 12% or so of the workforce. Sarver has owned the team for 18 years, I believe, and I imagine with the turnover they've employed more than 2-3 times their current number of employees. So that lowers percentage that has had grievences. None of those seem damning enough for Silver to remove Sarver.


I think he sucks and I hope this causes him to sell but Id be surprised if he's forced by the league to sell without more evidence of something egregious. This is more likely to cause the ownership group to try and push him out. Who knows if they'd be successful but Id bet on that before Silver hoisting him.

 

[Dr. Jones]

What I learned from this article?

Suns HR is an absolute disaster. Who is to blame for that though? I'm not sure. It's easy to blame Sarver but how many owners of huge businesses work hand in hand with HR? Not many and it seems Sarver is too busy trying to play Head Basketball Advisor to coaches and players to be doing much with HR.

I want him out but there's no smoking gun. This is a compilation of claims from people who had negative experiences with the Suns. It sucks there were so many but I'd bet any company that employees as many people as the Suns have roughly the same percentage of pissed off former employees. Does that make it right? No. It seems the Suns are likely the worst NBA franchise to work for and that's something that shouldn't be accepted and let continue.

I really don't view Sarver differently than I did a month ago before this article was released. He sucks. He thinks buying the Suns made him part of the team as in being "one of the guys" and acted with as much maturity and class as a 20 something year old player. That's not a good thing, especially when that person also flaunts their authority when they feel pressured or questioned. Like I've always heard Mark Cuban is similar, running around with players and coaches, very involved, but I don't believe he plays the boss card like Sarver if someone dares to treat him as a peer in return. That's how Sarver seems to differ, he wants to be one of the boys for the fun but also wants to be above them as well and it doesn't work like that.

He sucks, hopefully he can be convinced to sell of stripped of his power as managing general partner. I'll be surprised if that happens, especially in a timely manner, unless the majority of the ownership group starts pushing him out. I don't think Adam Silver will make him sell or step down and I don't believe there's enough evidence here to do so. There does need to be some serious changes within the organization though because it seems their HR department is atrocious. Whoever runs that is a real POS.

This

And the attorneys for Sarver are very good. The responses they gave are just vague enough, and just slippery enough to avoid any serious liability.

Too much smoke for there to not be fire. There isn't a damning voice recording like with Sterling but 70+ people going on record is hard to brush off as disgruntled ex employees especially when there are current employees making allegations.

Hopefully Adam Silver finds us an owner with bottomless pockets like he did for the Clippers with Balmer.

Unless they have him on tape during a racist or misogynistic rant........ This isn't enough IMO.

 

[MigratingOsprey]

I read through it with a fairly skeptical eye and it is really awful stuff

I used to write employment practices liability policies in the early/mid 00s and a lot of this stuff fits the pattern we'd see in that space

I had one applicant where the owners son had 3 claims around him - the guy would literally take out his stuff and put it on female workers keyboards. Basic question is how does this happen 3 times - what corrective actions are there, is he allowed on site? The answer was nothing - it's the owners son. I kindly informed them they were uninsurable and they should probably start saving money for a large punitive damages award in their future.

That type of action/culture creates an environment where people don't speak up - because it's pointless and no one cares

The worst businesses often have the fewest complaints - because it's understood the process is a sham - so you can deal with it or quit

I largely discount the Watson stuff. There is an obvious grudge. I think Watson was likely trying to leverage race while Sarver was more interested in petty vindictiveness.

Not a great way to run an operation, but nothing really actionable.

I completely disregard Corliss Williamson. That story doesn't move the needle. Sarver is known for meddling, known for outbursts, known for being vocal in pretty much any league setting. He had a 7', top draft pick who gave an appearance of being sometimes soft or not fully engaged on defense. I can see Sarver boiling over that this player wasn't even attempting to defend the rim - no blocks and no fouls. Just because your from the south and he's white and older doesn't make this a racial thing. Sarver would have yelled at any big man coach.

Drawing up plays and being involved doesn't really move the needle either. The Kings coach pushes a lot of nonsense. When Howard Schultz owned the Sonics he had big opinions. Not unique for owners to want to be direct with the players, coaches, etc - it's their toy to play with. They typically are just terrible at it.

Those 3 items just make him a crap owner. The outbursts, league level behavior, etc - just a bad owner and not great person.

The other stuff is bad, even if not all poorly intentioned.

I'm sure he felt he was sticking up for his player why the Draymond stuff - why did my guy get punished and he doesn't?

I'm sure he was trying to find coaches that could be relatable.

I'm sure he repeated stuff he shouldn't with no awareness on how any of it impacted those around him because he didn't have to care.

Pantsing someone in front of their coworkers is terrible - doesn't matter if you thought it was funny. That's actionable behavior.

Assuming the accommodations that a new mother would need and limiting opportunity because of it is wrong and frequently actionable. It sounds like his team steered him out of that mess.

Making jokes about shaving balls isn't work appropriate. Also fits with this pattern that he needs to be the guy - making the rounds - telling jokes - being over the top and since he's the boss and also vindictive he thinks everyone enjoys it

An employee calling a a black coworker Carlton is awful. The fact that he thought it was all fun and jokes speaks to the culture there. The black employee didn't like it, but definitely wasn't empowered to do anything about it - except probably complain to friends/family after work

The dysfunctional HR is terrible

The other treatment of women definitely comes of as actionable

He runs a rotting ship

It doesn't matter if that is normal or abnormal in the NBA

I've yet to see my competitor does the same or worse help out anyone in employment practices litigation. It's frankly irrelevant to your own bad actions.

It also sounds like there are members of ownership who have long grown tired of him and need something egregious to trigger contractual clauses.

I'm sure that is why one owner went on record in the investigation and another spoke out quickly today.

So where does this go? Depends what the NBA and other owners (both league and Suns group) want.

Do they want to pressure him out of running the show? Then you'll see a reputable outside investigator come in and let them do their jobs - similar to the Blackhawks.

Do they want to save face and just move forward? Then you get the Washington Football Team investigation where nothing is disclosed, they'll be a fine, some level of soft punishment, sensitivity training and call it a day

 

[Covert Rain]

The Suns currently employee 556 people, according to a Google search and that sounds reasonable. 70~ are saying it sucks to work there, that's 12% or so of the workforce. Sarver has owned the team for 18 years, I believe, and I imagine with the turnover they've employed more than 2-3 times their current number of employees. So that lowers percentage that has had grievences. None of those seem damning enough for Silver to remove Sarver.


I think he sucks and I hope this causes him to sell but Id be surprised if he's forced by the league to sell without more evidence of something egregious. This is more likely to cause the ownership group to try and push him out. Who knows if they'd be successful but Id bet on that before Silver hoisting him.

Those are only the people willing to come forward. Keep in mind sounds like there were multiple legal settlements there which means there are definitely some people who cannot come forward as well. According to HR this was a regular thing. She said it happened all the time. When you look at the raw numbers it's deceiving but if 1/5 of your workforce feels the way these people do that is significant at any level.

Using the "N" word on multiple occasions, coupled with sexist remarks and creating an atmosphere of cover up is more than enough to see him go. We have not even heard ALL THE STORIES. According to the article they insinuated there was more stories from other people about racial remarks and other mistreatment. We are only hearing a fraction or that article would have been 3 times as long. It's enough for the NBA to do a deep dive.

 

[Finito]

So the HR department is the problem? Huh ok

 

[MigratingOsprey]

What I learned from this article?

Suns HR is an absolute disaster. Who is to blame for that though? I'm not sure. It's easy to blame Sarver but how many owners of huge businesses work hand in hand with HR? Not many and it seems Sarver is too busy trying to play Head Basketball Advisor to coaches and players to be doing much with HR.

Owners of large businesses that give a crap are very involved with HR and their corporate culture.

I've worked for and worked with businesses of all sorts of sizes - the level of garbage for the Suns comes from the top and not just rogue/ineffective employees with no control or care.

This isn't even a question honestly

He thinks buying the Suns made him part of the team as in being "one of the guys" and acted with as much maturity and class as a 20 something year old player. That's not a good thing, especially when that person also flaunts their authority when they feel pressured or questioned.

This is very much a part of my read on how he behaves. Except he doesn't see that the basketball people don't actually enjoy him being around or take him seriously

 

[Hoop Head]

Those are only the people willing to come forward. Keep in mind sounds like there were multiple legal settlements there which means there are definitely some people who cannot come forward as well. According to HR this was a regular thing. She said it happened all the time.

Using the "N" word on multiple occasions, coupled with sexist remarks and creating an atmosphere of cover up is more than enough to see him go. We have not even heard ALL THE STORIES. According to the article they insinuated there was more stories from other people about racial remarks and other mistreatment. We are only hearing a fraction or that article would have been 3 times as long. It's enough for the NBA to do a deep dive.

It's enough to warrant a real investigation but I'm not holding my breathe that it leads to his removal. If there were a smoking gun then it would have surfaced by now.

I wouldn't bet on his removal, even with 2-1 odds. I think the chance that this brings him down is right around 15-20%, at most and that's mainly because I can see the ownership group pushing him out rather than the league office. I'd give less than 5% chance Silver does something on his own.

 

[Muggz]

I'm not saying anything until I know what's up.
All I'm saying is be careful what you ask for. What if Sarver is forced out? Woo Hoo! We get a new owner.
What if he's worse than Sarver?
What if he lives in Seattle and moves the team?

 

[Covert Rain]

Owners of large businesses that give a crap are very involved with HR and their corporate culture.

I've worked for and worked with businesses of all sorts of sizes - the level of garbage for the Suns comes from the top and not just rogue/ineffective employees with no control or care.

This isn't even a question honestly



This is very much a part of my read on how he behaves. Except he doesn't see that the basketball people don't actually enjoy him being around or take him seriously

One point that think is overlooked. Even well intentioned mistakes can get you fired in most companies in America. Just because you "didn't mean to" is a really crappy excuse. I have been in leadership for years and have seen so many upper level executives fired for things they "didn't intend". The liability is through the roof if you don't. The fact the Suns apparently have settled with many employees tells you how likely serious some of these offenses were.

Saying that there isn't enough here or there is no smoking gun isn't true. I have seen this up close and personal on many occasions for the last 30 years.

It's enough to warrant a real investigation but I'm not holding my breathe that it leads to his removal. If there were a smoking gun then it would have surfaced by now.

I wouldn't bet on his removal, even with 2-1 odds. I think the chance that this brings him down is right around 15-20%, at most and that's mainly because I can see the ownership group pushing him out rather than the league office. I'd give less than 5% chance Silver does something on his own.

Holding my breath that the NBA will have the guts to remove him is something else entirely. Trust me when I say there is enough here to get any executive fired in any company I have ever worked for. I have dealt with HR issues, Corporate liability and risk almost my entire career. Sarver was smart enough to put a clause in his contract about criminal offenses being the only grounds for the ownership group to remove him. Now it's up to the NBA regardless of how likely it is or not.

I am just shocked the ownership group didn't have a moral clause. That seems pretty standard these days.

 

[Cheesebeef]

I read through it with a fairly skeptical eye and it is really awful stuff

I used to write employment practices liability policies in the early/mid 00s and a lot of this stuff fits the pattern we'd see in that space

I had one applicant where the owners son had 3 claims around him - the guy would literally take out his stuff and put it on female workers keyboards. Basic question is how does this happen 3 times - what corrective actions are there, is he allowed on site? The answer was nothing - it's the owners son. I kindly informed them they were uninsurable and they should probably start saving money for a large punitive damages award in their future.

That type of action/culture creates an environment where people don't speak up - because it's pointless and no one cares

The worst businesses often have the fewest complaints - because it's understood the process is a sham - so you can deal with it or quit

I largely discount the Watson stuff. There is an obvious grudge. I think Watson was likely trying to leverage race while Sarver was more interested in petty vindictiveness.

Not a great way to run an operation, but nothing really actionable.

I completely disregard Corliss Williamson. That story doesn't move the needle. Sarver is known for meddling, known for outbursts, known for being vocal in pretty much any league setting. He had a 7', top draft pick who gave an appearance of being sometimes soft or not fully engaged on defense. I can see Sarver boiling over that this player wasn't even attempting to defend the rim - no blocks and no fouls. Just because your from the south and he's white and older doesn't make this a racial thing. Sarver would have yelled at any big man coach.

Drawing up plays and being involved doesn't really move the needle either. The Kings coach pushes a lot of nonsense. When Howard Schultz owned the Sonics he had big opinions. Not unique for owners to want to be direct with the players, coaches, etc - it's their toy to play with. They typically are just terrible at it.

Those 3 items just make him a crap owner. The outbursts, league level behavior, etc - just a bad owner and not great person.

The other stuff is bad, even if not all poorly intentioned.

I'm sure he felt he was sticking up for his player why the Draymond stuff - why did my guy get punished and he doesn't?

I'm sure he was trying to find coaches that could be relatable.

I'm sure he repeated stuff he shouldn't with no awareness on how any of it impacted those around him because he didn't have to care.

Pantsing someone in front of their coworkers is terrible - doesn't matter if you thought it was funny. That's actionable behavior.

Assuming the accommodations that a new mother would need and limiting opportunity because of it is wrong and frequently actionable. It sounds like his team steered him out of that mess.

Making jokes about shaving balls isn't work appropriate. Also fits with this pattern that he needs to be the guy - making the rounds - telling jokes - being over the top and since he's the boss and also vindictive he thinks everyone enjoys it

An employee calling a a black coworker Carlton is awful. The fact that he thought it was all fun and jokes speaks to the culture there. The black employee didn't like it, but definitely wasn't empowered to do anything about it - except probably complain to friends/family after work

The dysfunctional HR is terrible

The other treatment of women definitely comes of as actionable

He runs a rotting ship

It doesn't matter if that is normal or abnormal in the NBA

I've yet to see my competitor does the same or worse help out anyone in employment practices litigation. It's frankly irrelevant to your own bad actions.

It also sounds like there are members of ownership who have long grown tired of him and need something egregious to trigger contractual clauses.

I'm sure that is why one owner went on record in the investigation and another spoke out quickly today.

So where does this go? Depends what the NBA and other owners (both league and Suns group) want.

Do they want to pressure him out of running the show? Then you'll see a reputable outside investigator come in and let them do their jobs - similar to the Blackhawks.

Do they want to save face and just move forward? Then you get the Washington Football Team investigation where nothing is disclosed, they'll be a fine, some level of soft punishment, sensitivity training and call it a day

The Redskins scenario is what I fear most. What the NFL let them get away with after just basically a slap on the wrist was freaking disgusting. Taking pictures of half naked cheerleaders without them knowing and sending them around, yanking the passports of cheerleaders in essence holding them hostage for high rollers? It’s flipping ridiculous Snyder still runs that ship.

 

[Hoop Head]

Owners of large businesses that give a crap are very involved with HR and their corporate culture.

I've worked for and worked with businesses of all sorts of sizes - the level of garbage for the Suns comes from the top and not just rogue/ineffective employees with no control or care.

This isn't even a question honestly

I don't think he cares how HR is ran and does what he can not to be involved. That falls on him since it appears so incompetent, of course. I believe he's too busy trying to play Red Auerbach or something to deal with it. He doesn't treat the Suns like a real business, like his banks or real estate investments. That much is clear.

 

[Covert Rain]

I don't think he cares how HR is ran and does what he can not to be involved. That falls on him since it appears so incompetent, of course. I believe he's too busy trying to play Red Auerbach or something to deal with it. He doesn't treat the Suns like a real business, like his banks or real estate investments. That much is clear.

Not to get political but it sure sounds similar to the last President using the DOJ has his personal shield. Sounds like HR was Sarver's personal shield. They were more about protecting him than actually addressing HR issues. When all else failed? Settle.