Rosen Signs contract with Cards

WisconsinCard

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First of the QB class to sign. Its not a big deal because all their draft positions are $$'s slotted but it just shows he is anxious to get started and be a Cardinal.

Don't say that to Joey Bosa. It really just shows that the cards are a team that falls in line with the 21 century way of thinking and not trying to get something that no other team is getting. I remember the good old days when BB had to wait until the TV money came in to sign the players because of their bonus money.
 

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Glad it's a 5th year team option. That being said I hope he succeeds, and thankfully we didn't somehow get nutjob Mayfield .
 

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Two weeks after becoming the 10th overall pick in the draft, Cardinals quarterback Josh Rosen has become the first top-10 pick to sign a contract.The good news for Rosen is that, because the Cardinals traded up to No. 10 to get him, his option year in 2022 will be the transition tag for quarterbacks in 2021. One pick lower, and the fifth-year salary would have been much lower.

The good news for Rosen is that, because the Cardinals traded up to No. 10 to get him, his option year in 2022 will be the transition tag for quarterbacks in 2021. One pick lower, and the fifth-year salary would have been much lower.

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2018/05/10/josh-rosen-signs-rookie-deal/
 

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I guess when he stated he wanted to get to Arizona and go to work he meant it. I am going to enjoy watching him and DJ on offense for years to come.
 

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Cardinals first-roujnd quarterback Josh Rosen deal: $17.597 million guaranteed, $10.878 million signing bonus
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Gandhi

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Don't say that to Joey Bosa. It really just shows that the cards are a team that falls in line with the 21 century way of thinking and not trying to get something that no other team is getting. I remember the good old days when BB had to wait until the TV money came in to sign the players because of their bonus money.

To be fair, Bosa’s situation was highly abnormal. Bosa’s holdout is the longest for any rookie since the rookie wage scale were announced in 2011. As I recall it the dispute were over the payout schedule of the signing bonus and potential offset language in the contract. I do know that in the end Bosa got the biggest upfront signing bonus ever paid by the Chargers, either to a rookie or veteran, and in return accepted that the team included offset language in the contract. Offset language became the battleground between an organization and players’ agent with the introduction of the rookie wage scale.

If, for example, a rookie is scheduled to earn two million in base salary in the fourth year of his contract, and thus those money is guaranteed, but he is cut after his third year, offset language might come into play. Say another team signs the player on a two million contract. If there was no offset language in the original contract, then the player will receive two million both from his former team and his current. If there is offset language in the original contract, then the former team is completely off the hook and the player will only get two million from his new team. In other words, teams want offset language in contracts. Players do not want offset language in contracts.

As far as I remember there has not been any reported problems with rookie contracts in the last couple of years, and really, they are kind of simple to negotiate because they are slotted.

I don’t think anyone not with the Chargers organization can tell if Bosa or the Chargers was mostly at fault, but I think the important lesson is that if the parties want to create problems, then they still can. It is, however, extremely rare and easy to avoid, also in the case of Rosen and the Cardinals. I guess you could argue that him signing a deal this quick shows that he and his agent didn’t want to fight the Cardinals, and it could in theory be because Rosen wanted to participate in this week’s rookie minicamp, but in reality there isn’t much to fight about in these negotiations if the parties don’t want to act like little spoiled kids that always want to get their will.
 

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To be fair, Bosa’s situation was highly abnormal. Bosa’s holdout is the longest for any rookie since the rookie wage scale were announced in 2011. As I recall it the dispute were over the payout schedule of the signing bonus and potential offset language in the contract. I do know that in the end Bosa got the biggest upfront signing bonus ever paid by the Chargers, either to a rookie or veteran, and in return accepted that the team included offset language in the contract. Offset language became the battleground between an organization and players’ agent with the introduction of the rookie wage scale.

If, for example, a rookie is scheduled to earn two million in base salary in the fourth year of his contract, and thus those money is guaranteed, but he is cut after his third year, offset language might come into play. Say another team signs the player on a two million contract. If there was no offset language in the original contract, then the player will receive two million both from his former team and his current. If there is offset language in the original contract, then the former team is completely off the hook and the player will only get two million from his new team. In other words, teams want offset language in contracts. Players do not want offset language in contracts.

As far as I remember there has not been any reported problems with rookie contracts in the last couple of years, and really, they are kind of simple to negotiate because they are slotted.

I don’t think anyone not with the Chargers organization can tell if Bosa or the Chargers was mostly at fault, but I think the important lesson is that if the parties want to create problems, then they still can. It is, however, extremely rare and easy to avoid, also in the case of Rosen and the Cardinals. I guess you could argue that him signing a deal this quick shows that he and his agent didn’t want to fight the Cardinals, and it could in theory be because Rosen wanted to participate in this week’s rookie minicamp, but in reality there isn’t much to fight about in these negotiations if the parties don’t want to act like little spoiled kids that always want to get their will.

IMO the Charges were completely at fault. They want to spread out the bonus money and have off-set language in the contract. It's either one or the other but you don't get both, no team gets both. No team has ever gotten both, they get one or the other.

In the end the chargers caved and gave JB exactly what he wanted, so they could have prevented the hold out from ever happening.

Don't want to pay out big bonus checks then either win more games, or trade your high picks for lower one or players.
 

RON_IN_OC

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This should be a "Caption This" segmet
Rosen: Good to meet you Sam...can't wait to learn from you.

Sam: (Speaking) Yeah, this year is gonna be fun...(Thinking) I wonder if he has any fatal food allergies...

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk
 

WisconsinCard

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Rosen: Good to meet you Sam...can't wait to learn from you.

Sam: (Speaking) Yeah, this year is gonna be fun...(Thinking) I wonder if he has any fatal food allergies...

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk


OR

Rosen: Good to meet you Sam...can't wait to learn from you.

Sam: Can I get a picture of you in the hot tub post dated the night before game 1? Oh wait wrong thread....
 

Gandhi

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IMO the Charges were completely at fault. They want to spread out the bonus money and have off-set language in the contract. It's either one or the other but you don't get both, no team gets both. No team has ever gotten both, they get one or the other.

That is not correct.

Actually, on a more technical level, in this case offset language applies to rookie deals, and it is only relevant in regard to guaranteed money. All rookie first round picks will get a contract for four years that includes a fifth year option for the team. That option must be picked up at the end of the third year, and if a team does that then the rest of the contract, including the fifth year, becomes fully guaranteed. So, in essence, the team will have to decide after year three whether they want to be on the hook for the remaining money in the now five year contract. In the fourth year offset language becomes relevant because if it is included in the contract it allows the team to save money if they release the player before the end of the rookie contract. If another team picks up the player, then whatever that team pays him must be deducted from the rookie deal signed with the original team. If it is not included, then the player can double-dip and receive both the remaining guaranteed money from their rookie deal and whatever the new team pays them.

Joey Bosa signed a fully guaranteed deal with a 17 million signing bonus. He received 85% of the signing bonus up front whereas Bosa wanted it all paid up front. The contract does include offset language.

In 2013 edge rusher Barkevious Mingo was the #6 overall pick. He signed a fully guaranteed contract with a 10.7 million signing bonus. He received 100% of the signing bonus up front. The contract did include offset language.

In 2013 offensive tackle Luke Joeckel was the #2 overall pick. He signed a fully guaranteed contract with 13.8 million in signing bonus. He received 100% of the signing bonus up front. The contract did not include offset language.

In 2017 runningback Leonard Fournette was the #4 overall pick. He signed a fully guaranteed contract with 17.9 million guaranteed. He received 100% of the signing bonus paid up front. The contract did not include any offset language.

In 2017 safety Jamal Adams was the #8 overall pick. He signed a fully guaranteed contract with a 14.3 million signing bonus. He received 100% of the signing bonus up front. The contract did include offset language.

I think the lesson is that there are different ways to structure a rookie contract and different languages that can be included, and it is impossible to know if Bosa or the Chargers are mostly at fault because we haven’t been present at the negotiations.

Teams protects themselves by including different clauses in rookie deals. For example, they can put language in the contracts that says that guaranteed money in a contract can be voided if the player gets suspended, or even if the players get a fine. Yes, being late to a team meeting can then potentially cost millions of dollars. Offset language versus signing bonus payment structure is another way of protecting a team. In reality, it is more important to the player than the team, but I guess rookies have realized in the last couple of years that it is much more important to get the second contract, and thus they are more inclined to accept the team’s demand of including offset language in the rookie contract.

As a result, the matter of offset language in rookie contracts are nowadays usually non-negotiable to teams, and though I don’t know for sure, I doubt there isn’t any offset language in Rosen’s contract. He did not receive all of the signing bonus up front.
 

WisconsinCard

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That is not correct.

Actually, on a more technical level, in this case offset language applies to rookie deals, and it is only relevant in regard to guaranteed money. All rookie first round picks will get a contract for four years that includes a fifth year option for the team. That option must be picked up at the end of the third year, and if a team does that then the rest of the contract, including the fifth year, becomes fully guaranteed. So, in essence, the team will have to decide after year three whether they want to be on the hook for the remaining money in the now five year contract. In the fourth year offset language becomes relevant because if it is included in the contract it allows the team to save money if they release the player before the end of the rookie contract. If another team picks up the player, then whatever that team pays him must be deducted from the rookie deal signed with the original team. If it is not included, then the player can double-dip and receive both the remaining guaranteed money from their rookie deal and whatever the new team pays them.

Joey Bosa signed a fully guaranteed deal with a 17 million signing bonus. He received 85% of the signing bonus up front whereas Bosa wanted it all paid up front. The contract does include offset language.

In 2013 edge rusher Barkevious Mingo was the #6 overall pick. He signed a fully guaranteed contract with a 10.7 million signing bonus. He received 100% of the signing bonus up front. The contract did include offset language.

In 2013 offensive tackle Luke Joeckel was the #2 overall pick. He signed a fully guaranteed contract with 13.8 million in signing bonus. He received 100% of the signing bonus up front. The contract did not include offset language.

In 2017 runningback Leonard Fournette was the #4 overall pick. He signed a fully guaranteed contract with 17.9 million guaranteed. He received 100% of the signing bonus paid up front. The contract did not include any offset language.

In 2017 safety Jamal Adams was the #8 overall pick. He signed a fully guaranteed contract with a 14.3 million signing bonus. He received 100% of the signing bonus up front. The contract did include offset language.

I think the lesson is that there are different ways to structure a rookie contract and different languages that can be included, and it is impossible to know if Bosa or the Chargers are mostly at fault because we haven’t been present at the negotiations.

Teams protects themselves by including different clauses in rookie deals. For example, they can put language in the contracts that says that guaranteed money in a contract can be voided if the player gets suspended, or even if the players get a fine. Yes, being late to a team meeting can then potentially cost millions of dollars. Offset language versus signing bonus payment structure is another way of protecting a team. In reality, it is more important to the player than the team, but I guess rookies have realized in the last couple of years that it is much more important to get the second contract, and thus they are more inclined to accept the team’s demand of including offset language in the rookie contract.

As a result, the matter of offset language in rookie contracts are nowadays usually non-negotiable to teams, and though I don’t know for sure, I doubt there isn’t any offset language in Rosen’s contract. He did not receive all of the signing bonus up front.


There is a lot of gibberish in there but here is the way I remember it.

https://www.sbnation.com/2016/8/8/12402198/joey-bosa-contract-holdout-san-diego-chargers-why
 

Gandhi

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There is a lot of gibberish in there but here is the way I remember it.

https://www.sbnation.com/2016/8/8/12402198/joey-bosa-contract-holdout-san-diego-chargers-why

Do you mean there is a lot of gibberish in the article you linked to or in my post?

I thought the article explained the situation well? Like I stated, in the end the parties compromised with Bosa getting a lot of the signing bonus up front in return for offset language being included in the contract.

In my post I based it on your claim that teams had to choose between spreading out the payment of a signing bonus or include offset language in the contract. You claimed they could not have it both way, and that no team had ever gotten both parts in a rookie’s contract. I proved that it was a wrong claim, but it’s very possible that I could have phrased some of it more clearly. If so, I apologize.
 

ajcardfan

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Jesus, we sign our first round pick before anyone else and we still have multiple postings on the nuances of first round contracts. I think some of you kind of miss the old school training camp holdouts.
 

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Do you mean there is a lot of gibberish in the article you linked to or in my post?

I thought the article explained the situation well? Like I stated, in the end the parties compromised with Bosa getting a lot of the signing bonus up front in return for offset language being included in the contract.

In my post I based it on your claim that teams had to choose between spreading out the payment of a signing bonus or include offset language in the contract. You claimed they could not have it both way, and that no team had ever gotten both parts in a rookie’s contract. I proved that it was a wrong claim, but it’s very possible that I could have phrased some of it more clearly. If so, I apologize.

No I think you misread my original post. The chargers wanted to spread his bonus out over several year and get off set language in the contract. They ended up paying the bonus and got their offset language. :shrug:
 

Jetstream Green

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That is not correct.

Actually, on a more technical level, in this case offset language applies to rookie deals, and it is only relevant in regard to guaranteed money. All rookie first round picks will get a contract for four years that includes a fifth year option for the team. That option must be picked up at the end of the third year, and if a team does that then the rest of the contract, including the fifth year, becomes fully guaranteed. So, in essence, the team will have to decide after year three whether they want to be on the hook for the remaining money in the now five year contract. In the fourth year offset language becomes relevant because if it is included in the contract it allows the team to save money if they release the player before the end of the rookie contract. If another team picks up the player, then whatever that team pays him must be deducted from the rookie deal signed with the original team. If it is not included, then the player can double-dip and receive both the remaining guaranteed money from their rookie deal and whatever the new team pays them.

Joey Bosa signed a fully guaranteed deal with a 17 million signing bonus. He received 85% of the signing bonus up front whereas Bosa wanted it all paid up front. The contract does include offset language.

In 2013 edge rusher Barkevious Mingo was the #6 overall pick. He signed a fully guaranteed contract with a 10.7 million signing bonus. He received 100% of the signing bonus up front. The contract did include offset language.

In 2013 offensive tackle Luke Joeckel was the #2 overall pick. He signed a fully guaranteed contract with 13.8 million in signing bonus. He received 100% of the signing bonus up front. The contract did not include offset language.

In 2017 runningback Leonard Fournette was the #4 overall pick. He signed a fully guaranteed contract with 17.9 million guaranteed. He received 100% of the signing bonus paid up front. The contract did not include any offset language.

In 2017 safety Jamal Adams was the #8 overall pick. He signed a fully guaranteed contract with a 14.3 million signing bonus. He received 100% of the signing bonus up front. The contract did include offset language.

I think the lesson is that there are different ways to structure a rookie contract and different languages that can be included, and it is impossible to know if Bosa or the Chargers are mostly at fault because we haven’t been present at the negotiations.

Teams protects themselves by including different clauses in rookie deals. For example, they can put language in the contracts that says that guaranteed money in a contract can be voided if the player gets suspended, or even if the players get a fine. Yes, being late to a team meeting can then potentially cost millions of dollars. Offset language versus signing bonus payment structure is another way of protecting a team. In reality, it is more important to the player than the team, but I guess rookies have realized in the last couple of years that it is much more important to get the second contract, and thus they are more inclined to accept the team’s demand of including offset language in the rookie contract.

As a result, the matter of offset language in rookie contracts are nowadays usually non-negotiable to teams, and though I don’t know for sure, I doubt there isn’t any offset language in Rosen’s contract. He did not receive all of the signing bonus up front.

Which makes Dak Prescott's performance for instance very crucial if he played like he did last season being in his third season of his rookie contract... stud running back or not
 

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No I think you misread my original post. The chargers wanted to spread his bonus out over several year and get off set language in the contract. They ended up paying the bonus and got their offset language. :shrug:

Okay, then I misread it as you are right. They did not pay the bonus, though. They paid a lot of it and spread the rest out over four years, and I still don’t know who were mostly at fault for the difficult negotiations, nor do I think anyone else does. I guess they were equally at fault.
 

Gandhi

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Which makes Dak Prescott's performance for instance very crucial if he played like he did last season being in his third season of his rookie contract... stud running back or not

Absolutely. I think they have to pay Prescott. After all, he is their franchise quarterback. They will probably end with the same problems as the Seahawks after they paid Russell Wilson.
 
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