Rumor: Cards have made a trade

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

True, there's just a ton of guys who I think have a better upside and attitude than Diggs. Sure, there's value to having a top 20 WR, but I want a guy who could be top 10.

And not top ten in advanced analytics, or ranking based off of a bunch of subjective factors which WRs you'd want, but top ten in true production up against his peers.

I get that. I don’t think that guy is in this draft. There’s no Fitz. No megatron. No Julio. No moss.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

A bunch of assets? You mean a 2nd rounder that we would strongly hoped to be as good as Diggs?

I want to aim for players that I believe are entering their prime like a Diggs or Drake(not a super overpay). Hell, Chandler Jones was a gigantic example of one. Not players that shows cracks of getting out of their prime(like a Patrick Peterson for example). It seems like you’re more toward the latter. You don’t want to let go.

Yup. This is where I reside. You want to bet on the come.

 

[Solar7]

A run-dominant offense that doesn’t cater to his fullest potential. He doesn’t have the situation that Chris Godwin & Mike Evans are in(high octane passing attack) or a Tyreek Hill & Sammy Watkins.

Dude, you got account for the scheme players are in. You never do for some reason!


I’m usually against hypotheticals, but I guarantee if he would a career year by far if he got traded to us.


& holy hell, I just noticed you wanted AJ Green. What is with you & wanting these players that’s clearly out of their/heading out of their prime???

I account for the schemes. The Minnesota Vikings had a 50/50 Run pass split this year, so a high run %, but threw the ball at a higher % in 2018 than all but three teams. 2017, rushing was back up, 2016, again in the top 10 of passing teams.

I account for the scheme, I look at all of the data, and I back it up.

Edit: As far as AJ Green, I was looking for a holdover option on a reasonable contract to try to help Kyler Murray get some outside help. There wasn't a lot out there, and I wasn't even going to pretend Cooper was an option. Green was a high-risk, high-reward option.

 

[Solar7]

I get that. I don’t think that guy is in this draft. There’s no Fitz. No megatron. No Julio. No moss.

I'm not talking generational talent here, but there's no reason that in this deep a class, we're not going to see another Michael Thomas, Juju Smith-Schuster, Keenan Allen, Tyreek Hill, Davante Adams, etc.

 

[football karma]

does anyone have perspective on why a trade announcement would have to wait until the start of the League year?

CAR and LAC just swapped players last week.

I know franchise tags don't have to be declared until then, but that's a deadline. If its about a tag and trade, they can do that right now

 

[Chopper0080]

does anyone have perspective on why a trade announcement would have to wait until the start of the League year?

CAR and LAC just swapped players last week.

I know franchise tags don't have to be declared until then, but that's a deadline. If its about a tag and trade, they can do that right now

Cap space.

 

[football karma]

Cap space.

wouldn't that be waiting for the new CBA to pass?

 

[Chopper0080]

One possibility would be the Cardinals trading the #8 pick for Stefon Diggs and the #25 pick of the Vikings. This would enable the Vikings to free up 14.3 mil in cap space by trading Diggs and cutting Riley Reiff and be in a great position to draft an OT at 8.

Ain't no party like a pick-swap party cuz a pick-swap party don't stop.

So, essentially.

Cardinals receive
Stefon Diggs
#25 pick overall
take on 11.5 mil in salary

Vikings receive
#8 overall to select Mekhi Becton or Tristan Wirfs
and free up 14.3 mil by trading Diggs and cutting Riley Reiff

 

[Chopper0080]

wouldn't that be waiting for the new CBA to pass?

We are still under the 2019 cap where the Cardinals were pretty close to the max. I DJ's deal won't actually be official until the new league year.

 

[wa52lz]

Guy has never been top 15 in any category, and the contract isn't that reasonable...

But I do get the need for someone who is at least semi-reliable.

2019 #15 in yards for WR, #10 WR in yards per game, and #4 in yards per reception.
https://www.pro-football-reference.com/years/2019/receiving.htm

2018 #11 in receptions (all positions) and #10 (tied) in TDs.
https://www.pro-football-reference.com/years/2018/receiving.htm

2017 #8 in TDs (tied)
https://www.pro-football-reference.com/years/2017/receiving.htm

2016 #14 in receptions for WRs
https://www.pro-football-reference.com/years/2016/receiving.htm

 

[Solar7]

2019 #15 in yards for WR, #10 WR in yards per game, and #4 in yards per reception.
https://www.pro-football-reference.com/years/2019/receiving.htm

2018 #11 in receptions (all positions) and #10 (tied) in TDs.
https://www.pro-football-reference.com/years/2018/receiving.htm

2017 #8 in TDs (tied)
https://www.pro-football-reference.com/years/2017/receiving.htm

2016 #14 in receptions for WRs
https://www.pro-football-reference.com/years/2016/receiving.htm

Well, I did mess up with the 2018 stat there with receptions, but the others, I'm still counting getting outperformed by TEs or other players as not being at the top, or being #8 for TDs with 11 other guys when you could easily call him 19th.

Either way, it doesn't change my mind - he's not a top ten WR, is not an elite option, and a 1st or second are too much for me to think it's a good idea.

 

[Chopper0080]

For those who haven't watched as much Vikings football as I have, it is tough to look at a stat sheet and appreciate all that Stefon Diggs does despite their desire to run the football. I also hear that folks don't like his attitude...probably the same people who don't like Richard Sherman. Guys who overcome their draft position are rarely soft spoken. Their attitude is what helped them get them to the top.

 

[Zeno]

Ain't no party like a pick-swap party cuz a pick-swap party don't stop.

So, essentially.

Cardinals receive
Stefon Diggs
#25 pick overall
take on 11.5 mil in salary

Vikings receive
#8 overall to select Mekhi Becton or Tristan Wirfs
and free up 14.3 mil by trading Diggs and cutting Riley Reiff

Do you think the Vikings are reworking Diggs contract? According to OTC trading Diggs would free up only $5.5 million and put $9 million on their dead cap...the big freeing of space is next year when he was due to count $15 million.

He'd be a steal for the Cardinals in year 1 at $5.5 million--then would be $12 million a year the rest of his contract, which is still super reasonable for a WR of his caliber.

https://overthecap.com/player/stefon-diggs/3994/

 

[Solar7]

For those who haven't watched as much Vikings football as I have, it is tough to look at a stat sheet and appreciate all that Stefon Diggs does despite their desire to run the football. I also hear that folks don't like his attitude...probably the same people who don't like Richard Sherman. Guys who overcome their draft position are rarely soft spoken. Their attitude is what helped them get them to the top.

My position on this trade is probably making me sound like I dislike Diggs as an overall player more than I do. I think he's a good, passionate player, and I watch a lot of Vikings football since my best friend is a fan.

I just don't like him for the Cardinals based on the level of compensation and what I view as a limited ceiling.

 

[Zeno]

Do you think the Vikings are reworking Diggs contract? According to OTC trading Diggs would free up only $5.5 million and put $9 million on their dead cap...the big freeing of space is next year when he was due to count $15 million.

He'd be a steal for the Cardinals in year 1 at $5.5 million--then would be $12 million a year the rest of his contract, which is still super reasonable for a WR of his caliber.

https://overthecap.com/player/stefon-diggs/3994/

I have his 2020 salary wrong for us but the rest should be right

 

[CardinalCovfefe]

I get that. I don’t think that guy is in this draft. There’s no Fitz. No megatron. No Julio. No moss.

If I had to choose a WR in this draft, I'd take Laviska Shenault.

 

[Chopper0080]

Do you think the Vikings are reworking Diggs contract? According to OTC trading Diggs would free up only $5.5 million and put $9 million on their dead cap...the big freeing of space is next year when he was due to count $15 million.

He'd be a steal for the Cardinals in year 1 at $5.5 million--then would be $12 million a year the rest of his contract, which is still super reasonable for a WR of his caliber.

https://overthecap.com/player/stefon-diggs/3994/

Spielman is really good with the cap so I don't think the difference will be an issue. Their big issue is that they need to upgrade at LT (or RT of they want to move Brian O'Neil) and they can't afford one in FA and draft to late to get a good one. This upgrades their line and their run game, and frees up space so they can keep some defensive guys. All things that Zimmer wants.

Keep in mind, the Cardinals would likely be paying 11.5 mil, not 5.5. The dead space is the remaining bonus the Vikings owe Diggs accelerated.

 

[Zeno]

Spielman is really good with the cap so I don't think the difference will be an issue. Their big issue is that they need to upgrade at LT (or RT of they want to move Brian O'Neil) and they can't afford one in FA and draft to late to get a good one. This upgrades their line and their run game, and frees up space so they can keep some defensive guys. All things that Zimmer wants.

Keep in mind, the Cardinals would likely be paying 11.5 mil, not 5.5. The dead space is the remaining bonus the Vikings owe Diggs accelerated.

You are definitely right on that last part--I was looking at it wrong. Still $11.5 for a WR of his caliber is a good deal.

 

[Chopper0080]

My position on this trade is probably making me sound like I dislike Diggs as an overall player more than I do. I think he's a good, passionate player, and I watch a lot of Vikings football since my best friend is a fan.

I just don't like him for the Cardinals based on the level of compensation and what I view as a limited ceiling.

Diggs was the 34th most targeted WR in 2019 with 94. His target share of the total WR targets(200) the Vikings was 47%.

If Stefon Diggs maintains a similar target % for the Cardinals who had 342 total WR targets in 2019, Diggs would be targeted 160 times. If you multiply that by his career average for yards per target, he would generate 1398 yards.

Before you say it isn't feasible, keep in mind that Kirk had 98 targets in 2019 and all other WRs combined had 142 targets. Plenty of meat on that bone.

So, Diggs upside is the best WR in football in terms of production.

 

[slanidrac16]

I account for the schemes. The Minnesota Vikings had a 50/50 Run pass split this year, so a high run %, but threw the ball at a higher % in 2018 than all but three teams. 2017, rushing was back up, 2016, again in the top 10 of passing teams.

I account for the scheme, I look at all of the data, and I back it up.

Edit: As far as AJ Green, I was looking for a holdover option on a reasonable contract to try to help Kyler Murray get some outside help. There wasn't a lot out there, and I wasn't even going to pretend Cooper was an option. Green was a high-risk, high-reward option.

Yep. And if would have signed gGreen and he got hurt you’d be screaming same old Keim.

 

[slanidrac16]

does anyone have perspective on why a trade announcement would have to wait until the start of the League year?

CAR and LAC just swapped players last week.

I know franchise tags don't have to be declared until then, but that's a deadline. If its about a tag and trade, they can do that right now

Because there ain’t one.

 

[Solar7]

Yep. And if would have signed gGreen and he got hurt you’d be screaming same old Keim.

Keep making assumptions man. Have I blamed Keim for Darius Philon? Evan Mathis? Marcus Gilbert?

My issue with Keim is the inability to draft. It's not his fault when someone gets injured.

 

[slanidrac16]

Keep making assumptions man. Have I blamed Keim for Darius Philon? Evan Mathis? Marcus Gilbert?

My issue with Keim is the inability to draft. It's not his fault when someone gets injured.

You talk about holes yet you were willing to sign an aging vet coming of a foot injury, ( a wide receiver no less) and pay him $$m?.

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

I’ll take Diggs over Cooper but I’m not giving the 8th pick for either. Neither should Keim and I doubt he would.

I like Solar too.

 

[cardsfanmd]

Rams traded up to get the Titans 1st overall Pick.
Eagles traded up to get Browns 2nd overall pick

Read my post again lol.