safety position??

[Twist18]

I wouldn't mind bringing back Corey Chavous for FS if the price is right.

 

[sundevil04]

Go

chavous has been playing ss for min not fs. there are a lot of good fa's that will be available, will demps from balt and chris hope from pitt are two of the bigger names.
________
Arizona Marijuana Dispensaries

 

[Shogun]

chavous has been playing ss for min not fs. there are a lot of good fa's that will be available, will demps from balt and chris hope from pitt are two of the bigger names.

Damn, the FA class is that weak @ FS?

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

I think Ohalete is finally done trying to chasing down Pittsburgh's WR's. He is available.

 

[fball13]

I know you vultures are going to jump all over this one... and I realize it'll never happen, but I think we have one of the leagues best FS on our roster... his name is Antrel Rolle.

I realize that he is too good a corner to be moved back (although I'm not sure there's such thing as a 'shut down corner' in the league anymore with the Pass Interference rules), but let's face it, he's smart, strong, fast and has great vision. I think he's built for the FS position.

Plus, he'd see the ball a ton since all of our other corners stink...

 

[joeshmo]

I know you vultures are going to jump all over this one...

Plus, he'd see the ball a ton since all of our other corners stink...

Macklin, Green, one of the better pass D's in the League, thats pretty good for CB's that stink, but that isnt what I want to debate.

In you scenerio, since our CB's stink, lets go ahead and take one of our better ones and make him a FS????? I dont see the logic in that.

It is much easier to find a capable FS then it is to find a capable CB. Now if we had another CB to replace Rolle then why the heck not move him to FS, it puts the 4 best DB's on the field at one time and I have no problem with it. But until their is a replacement for Rolle and a capable Nickel to backup that guy up, Rolle to FS would make things a little weaker then they are right now.

 

[fball13]

Macklin, Green, one of the better pass D's in the League, thats pretty good for CB's that stink, but that isnt what I want to debate.

In you scenerio, since our CB's stink, lets go ahead and take one of our better ones and make him a FS????? I dont see the logic in that.

It is much easier to find a capable FS then it is to find a capable CB. Now if we had another CB to replace Rolle then why the heck not move him to FS, it puts the 4 best DB's on the field at one time and I have no problem with it. But until their is a replacement for Rolle and a capable Nickel to backup that guy up, Rolle to FS would make things a little weaker then they are right now.

Ok, stink may have been a bit strong, but I don't think they're any better than average.

My point is this: I think that the FS position is undervalued in today's football. Getting a "capable" FS isn't the way you create a dominant defense. Where a player like Rolle may be weak as a FS is the mental part of the game, due to his NFL inexperience (not his lack of smarts). However, I think his speed, size and vision would inherently make our average corners much more effective (no corners shut down anymore, but with good help, average corners can produce). Remember, the QBs primary coverage key is the safety position. If there's a weakness there, it makes the corners jobs much harder. Wilson makes offenses adjust by being a dominate SS, now add a great coverage FS (Rolle) and the entire defense gets much stronger. Look at how good the safeties are on the Bears and Steelers... The FS is the QB of the defense (along with the MLB), you need much more than "capable" at that position... you can get away with "capable" corners...

 

[NEZCardsfan]

Ok, stink may have been a bit strong, but I don't think they're any better than average.

My point is this: I think that the FS position is undervalued in today's football. Getting a "capable" FS isn't the way you create a dominant defense. Where a player like Rolle may be weak as a FS is the mental part of the game, due to his NFL inexperience (not his lack of smarts). However, I think his speed, size and vision would inherently make our average corners much more effective (no corners shut down anymore, but with good help, average corners can produce). Remember, the QBs primary coverage key is the safety position. If there's a weakness there, it makes the corners jobs much harder. Wilson makes offenses adjust by being a dominate SS, now add a great coverage FS (Rolle) and the entire defense gets much stronger. Look at how good the safeties are on the Bears and Steelers... The FS is the QB of the defense (along with the MLB), you need much more than "capable" at that position... you can get away with "capable" corners...

I'm not going for this. We had this debate quite a bit in the stadium.

If he isn't that "football" smart, why are you putting him at FS where he'll have to make decisions on where he has to help out. If our corners are so average, and Rolle isn't that "football" smart, won't he make wrong decision after wrong decision, on whom to help over the top??

Teams could just cross their routes in front of Rolle, confuse him, and giggle all the way to the end zone.

 

[fball13]

I'm not going for this. We had this debate quite a bit in the stadium.

If he isn't that "football" smart, why are you putting him at FS where he'll have to make decisions on where he has to help out. If our corners are so average, and Rolle isn't that "football" smart, won't he make wrong decision after wrong decision, on whom to help over the top??

I'm not sure how "football smart" he is, from what scouts said about him, he's very smart. I just brought that up as a possible risk to my proposal here.

Side Note: Wilson is very bad at coverage decision making, but one he** of an athlete... that's why he made such a huge impact when he started getting close to the LOS (a great SS/4th LB).

So my point about Rolle is this: if the coaches determine that he has the smarts to run the FS position, I think he's could be one of the best and I think he would have a bigger impact to the team then at CB.

 

[NEZCardsfan]

I'm not sure how "football smart" he is, from what scouts said about him, he's very smart. I just brought that up as a possible risk to my proposal here.

Side Note: Wilson is very bad at coverage decision making, but one he** of an athlete... that's why he made such a huge impact when he started getting close to the LOS (a great SS/4th LB).

So my point about Rolle is this: if the coaches determine that he has the smarts to run the FS position, I think he's could be one of the best and I think he would have a bigger impact to the team then at CB.

I guess we'll just have to disagree then. I value a good CB way more than a HOF FS. A safety is just that.....the last line of defense. He is there lots of time to offer over the top or inside help so that the CBs can be more aggressive.

 

[joeshmo]

Ok, stink may have been a bit strong, but I don't think they're any better than average.

My point is this: I think that the FS position is undervalued in today's football. Getting a "capable" FS isn't the way you create a dominant defense. Where a player like Rolle may be weak as a FS is the mental part of the game, due to his NFL inexperience (not his lack of smarts). However, I think his speed, size and vision would inherently make our average corners much more effective (no corners shut down anymore, but with good help, average corners can produce). Remember, the QBs primary coverage key is the safety position. If there's a weakness there, it makes the corners jobs much harder. Wilson makes offenses adjust by being a dominate SS, now add a great coverage FS (Rolle) and the entire defense gets much stronger. Look at how good the safeties are on the Bears and Steelers... The FS is the QB of the defense (along with the MLB), you need much more than "capable" at that position... you can get away with "capable" corners...

First, our CB's are without a doubt above average. Our pass D stats have proven that for 2 straight years now.

Second, the Bears have one good SS in Green and one capable FS in Chris Harris (Who?), to go along with 2 good CB's and a great front 7. Bad example for your arguement

Third, the Steelers have one good SS in Polamalu, and one capable FS in Chirs hope to go along with 2 above average CB's and a great front 7. Another bad example for your arguement.

You dont make your CB's worse off for the sake of having a FS who has never played FS before. Any Coach will tell you they would rather have 2 great CB's and 2 capable S's then the other way around. Just look at their pay scale difference, thats a very telling story as to where teams put their focus on.

 

[joeshmo]

So my point about Rolle is this: if the coaches determine that he has the smarts to run the FS position, I think he's could be one of the best and I think he would have a bigger impact to the team then at CB.

Thats all well and good IF they had someone to replace Rolle as a starting CB without making the position worse off, if and only then I will jump on your bandwagon with you.

 

[spanky1]

The safety position is easy to fill. Each year in FA there are many FS and SS available as they are cheap. Often some quite good ones. The Cards should be able to get a solid upgrade at FS this offseason. Either a proven FA FS, an older CB looking to extend their NFL life, or a college CB who is just a tad slow to play CB in the NFL should work fine.

I don't know what Denny was thinking trying to convert Griffith from SS to FS. He was supposed to be old and wise, but a FS needs more speed than a SS. He was old and slow for a SS in 2004 and just don't know why they thought he could be an improvement by converting to a position where he needs to be faster.

If the safety position is easy to fill and with players who would come cheap,over and above Marlon McCree, name me two DECENT FA's at the FS position this year. You make it sound SO EASY. The way you put it, any scruff off the street would suffice.

Incredible.

 

[spanky1]

How about moving Macklin to FS and starting Green.

C'mon man........Macklin has never played FS in his life. I'm tired of people trying to reinvent positions for players.

 

[SuperSpck]

David Macklin- FULLBACK!

It'll work because he has the speed to get ahead of the linemen and running backs. He's got good ability to locate the ball in traffic, so he won't lose track of the ball during them crazy running plays.

He might need to put on some weight, but that's not hard, I've put 25lbs on with my "Just Cookie Dough" Diet, so we'll get him on that.
It'll be perfect, a combination of Lorenzo Neal and J.J. Stokes! Without a doubt he will be the greatest hybrid FB of all time!

Or Middle Linebacker.

Whichever.

 

[Twist18]

chavous has been playing ss for min not fs. there are a lot of good fa's that will be available, will demps from balt and chris hope from pitt are two of the bigger names.

In Clancys scheme, there doesn't seem to be much difference between SS and FS. Chavous certainly can cover a slot receiver or TE as he used to be a CB. Very heady player as well.

 

[Redsz]

I actually got to speak with Chavous once. He actually prefered playing for the Cardinals than the Vikings (his words). I got the impression he wasn't a fan of Tice. This was awhile ago, so his opinion could of changed.

Certainly an option at FS considering he is a FA.

 

[kerouac9]

If the safety position is easy to fill and with players who would come cheap,over and above Marlon McCree, name me two DECENT FA's at the FS position this year. You make it sound SO EASY. The way you put it, any scruff off the street would suffice.

Incredible.

Sean Taylor is so far and above all the other Free Safeties in the league it's ridiculous. I challenge anyone to name five other free safeties in the NFL besides Sean Taylor, Robert Griffith, and Dexter Jackson. You're on your honor not to peek on NFL.com.

That being said, for some reason Mike Brown found himself in Lovie Smith's doghouse and will probably be released from Chicago this offseason. I wouldn't mind seeing him compete with Griffith for the starting job.

 

[Zeno]

That being said, for some reason Mike Brown found himself in Lovie Smith's doghouse and will probably be released from Chicago this offseason. I wouldn't mind seeing him compete with Griffith for the starting job.

I didn't know that, Brown is an AZ kid too maybe he'd want to come back home to play. He'd be a huge upgrade over Griffith IMO.

 

[Shogun]

Sean Taylor is so far and above all the other Free Safeties in the league it's ridiculous. I challenge anyone to name five other free safeties in the NFL besides Sean Taylor, Robert Griffith, and Dexter Jackson. You're on your honor not to peek on NFL.com.

Ken Hamlin, Seattle
Thomas Davis, Carolina
Michael Lewis, Philly
C.C. Brown, Houston
Stuart Schweigart, Oakland

That was hard, lol.

 

[kerouac9]

Ken Hamlin, Seattle
Thomas Davis, Carolina
Michael Lewis, Philly
C.C. Brown, Houston
Stuart Schweigart, Oakland

That was hard, lol.

Thomas Davis doesn't start for Carolina, and when he does, he plays Strong Safety, at least According to OurLads.com. Michael Lewis is also a Strong Safety. Ken Hamlin isn't even on anyone's rosters for the Seahawks.

Maybe this exercise was a little harder than you thought. LOL. Even then, it's not like C.C. Brown and Schweigart are household names because of their playmaking abilities.

I was wrong about Mike Brown. It's Mike Green that's going to be released by the Bears. I guess I'm a little color blind, or something.

 

[BACH]

Thomas Davis doesn't start for Carolina, and when he does, he plays Strong Safety, at least According to OurLads.com. Michael Lewis is also a Strong Safety. Ken Hamlin isn't even on anyone's rosters for the Seahawks.

Maybe this exercise was a little harder than you thought. LOL. Even then, it's not like C.C. Brown and Schweigart are household names because of their playmaking abilities.

I was wrong about Mike Brown. It's Mike Green that's going to be released by the Bears. I guess I'm a little color blind, or something.

Hamlin is on injured reserve in Seattle and he could challege Taylor for the best free safety.

However, it would be hard to make worse list to prove a point then the one Preach Faux Pas made.

Other FS's in Taylor's class: Brian Dawkins, Bob Sanders and Darren Sharper.

All this talk about FS is an easy position to fill is BS IMO. Is it easier than finding a QB? Sure, but the "rules" of when you draft what has become very blurry. Tweener players like Ware and Merriman wouldn't have been drafted in the first round 5 years ago - did the Chargers make a bad choice when they drafted Merriman? Did the Giants when they drafted Shockey?

If Huff is an elite playmaker at FS, why not take him? It would make it much less risky to play Wilson at the line and it would improve the passing game a lot and elavate our secondary into the top 5. How can that be a bad thing?

 

[Pariah]

Sean Taylor is so far and above all the other Free Safeties in the league it's ridiculous. I challenge anyone to name five other free safeties in the NFL besides Sean Taylor, Robert Griffith, and Dexter Jackson. You're on your honor not to peek on NFL.com.

I could add to the previously mentioned names:

John Lynch, Denver (yes, he's playing FS these days)
Brian Russell, Cleveland (last year played in Minn)
Mike Minter, Carolina
Todd Johnson, Chicago (I only remember him because he has his entire name on his jersey and I have a friend by the same name)