Sealed our losing ways for the next 5 years

[Renz]

Originally posted by CardinalChris
I think this win more than anything shows the underachievement of this team. I believe we could have gone 8-8 this season. No major injuries during the year, so-so schedule. We just got outplayed and out coached.

Agree. I've said all year that we had more talent than our record indicated. We need a new coaching staff more than anything else and we will have one soon.

Relax. It's all good.

 

[CaptTurbo]

Originally posted by Renz
Agree. I've said all year that we had more talent than our record indicated. We need a new coaching staff more than anything else and we will have one soon.

Relax. It's all good.

coaching staff and qb.......unless of course we get parcells than I agree.

 

[red desert]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Sealed our losing ways for the next 5 years

Originally posted by swd1974
why do people think I am stuck on eli LOL Id take either.

Well you're getting niether. LOL

 

[CaptTurbo]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Sealed our losing ways for the next 5 years

Originally posted by red desert
Well you're getting niether. LOL

yup and your so happy. Makes one wonder why no?

 

[red desert]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Sealed our losing ways for the next 5 years

Originally posted by swd1974
yup and your so happy. Makes one wonder why no?

There's nothing to wonder about. I'll tell you why I'm happy. The Cards won... and in dramatic fashion.

 

[Espo]

swd why dont you wait until you sober up to post anything else. You say its a given that we wont trade up, why wont we? I think that if they want one of these qb's they will make the move to get him. Yes we need a big name qb and mccown isnt the answer but if you wanted these guys to lay down and die that stupid. you dont lose on purpose no matter who you can get in a draft. Nothing is given in a draft and you know what i dont think you can make some of these comments until we know what we get in the draft.

 

[JeffGollin]

Name 1 good thing that came from the win please.
How about more than one -

1. The way we won it (and when we won it) has the potential to be an attitude-changer up and down the entire organization.

2. No doubt lots of potential free agents will have watched the highlights (and more than once). This plus the fact that the Cards can point out that they beat 4 legitimate contenders (GB, SF, Cincy and now Minny) makes them a pretty interesting team to come and play for.

3. Some of the younger players in this organization will have learned a valuable lesson - that if you dig your nails into the cliff and manage to hang around long enough during games, when the breaks start falling your way, you'll be in a position to capitalize on them.

4. Fan-base - If the Cardinals could play just had 4 games a year of this nature, we'd fill the seats every Sunday.

5. You guys can look all those Snow Birds in the eye tomorrow and grin from ear to ear.

6. We won in our spiffy all-red uniforms (as Dave McGinnis looks on proudly). Maybe the Cards will be supertitious and make it a habit.

So far as the draft is concerned, I've always felt that where you draft should be a function of fate - i.e. where you came out after you played your ass off for 16 regular season games.

Manipulating the system by deliberately losing a game completely defeats the whole concept of competition. (Imagine how the Packers would feel if the Cardinals deliberately packed it in. Imagine the kind of garbage their players would spread around the entire league about the Cardinals. Visualize the kind of grief Anquan Boldin would have to put up with by other players at the Pro Bowl).

Sorry, Swd - The way for us to get better is to manage better, compete for talent better and play better.

Wanting your team to lose so you can get higher draft picks would only perpetuate the losing aura that has permeated this franchise for oh so many years.

 

[CaptTurbo]

Originally posted by JeffGollin
Name 1 good thing that came from the win please.
How about more than one -

1. The way we won it (and when we won it) has the potential to be an attitude-changer up and down the entire organization.

2. No doubt lots of potential free agents will have watched the highlights (and more than once). This plus the fact that the Cards can point out that they beat 4 legitimate contenders (GB, SF, Cincy and now Minny) makes them a pretty interesting team to come and play for.

3. Some of the younger players in this organization will have learned a valuable lesson - that if you dig your nails into the cliff and manage to hang around long enough during games, when the breaks start falling your way, you'll be in a position to capitalize on them.

4. Fan-base - If the Cardinals could play just had 4 games a year of this nature, we'd fill the seats every Sunday.

5. You guys can look all those Snow Birds in the eye tomorrow and grin from ear to ear.

6. We won in our spiffy all-red uniforms (as Dave McGinnis looks on proudly). Maybe the Cards will be supertitious and make it a habit.

So far as the draft is concerned, I've always felt that where you draft should be a function of fate - i.e. where you came out after you played your ass off for 16 regular season games.

Manipulating the system by deliberately losing a game completely defeats the whole concept of competition. (Imagine how the Packers would feel if the Cardinals deliberately packed it in. Imagine the kind of garbage their players would spread around the entire league about the Cardinals. Visualize the kind of grief Anquan Boldin would have to put up with by other players at the Pro Bowl).

Sorry, Swd - The way for us to get better is to manage better, compete for talent better and play better.

Wanting your team to lose so you can get higher draft picks would only perpetuate the losing aura that has permeated this franchise for oh so many years.

Jeff I appreciate the time you took to write this post a few points. I like #2, and #6 The rest in my opinion is bunk. We have been in the position mnay times before. But it really is a wait and see.

I think I miss the fact that the draft talk will be all about us if we were #1. I hate draft day on espn because no one cares about us. They would if we were #1 though.

 

[Northern Card]

Jeff... thanks for your sane perspective...

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by JeffGollin
Name 1 good thing that came from the win please.
How about more than one -


Manipulating the system by deliberately losing a game completely defeats the whole concept of competition. (Imagine how the Packers would feel if the Cardinals deliberately packed it in. Imagine the kind of garbage their players would spread around the entire league about the Cardinals. Visualize the kind of grief Anquan Boldin would have to put up with by other players at the Pro Bowl).

Not to mention that tanking a game is illegal and immoral (think Black Sox). I thought it sucked that the Broncos played their second string today.

 

[CaptTurbo]

Originally posted by Red Dawn
Not to mention that tanking a game is illegal and immoral (think Black Sox). I thought it sucked that the Broncos played their second string today.

Its not tanking. Im not saying go out and run half speed. But what about what parsons have to offer. To keep mccown in for the win doesnt make sense. I wanted parsons to get a half see what he has. If he scores 30 points in the second half than so be it. But how about seeing some of the backups?

 

[Evil Ash]

Originally posted by PHX Phan
Yes we need a big name qb

Why is that exactly? All of the so-called "franchise" QBs (i.e. Manning, McNair, McNabb, etc.) have won 0 Superbowl titles (and that is the only thing that matters) while guys like Tom Brady (a 6th round draft pick), Kurt Warner (undrafted), and even Trent Dilfer (who although was a first round pick was labeled as a bust and was taught not to lose games) have won Superbowl titles. Folks welcome to the new NFL parity at its finest, no assurances of anything with a "franchise" QB.

and mccown isnt the answer

I'd like to see more of him before I make that conclusion. Besides the point, there will always be another hyped (or often overhyped) player that will be considered to be the next "franchise" QB. Hell there's a new one every year!

but if you wanted these guys to lay down and die that stupid. you dont lose on purpose no matter who you can get in a draft. Nothing is given in a draft and you know what i dont think you can make some of these comments until we know what we get in the draft.

Agreed in every sense! I don't think I will ever understand how people are so obsessed with these QBs. We have absolutely no idea if they are going to pan out in the NFL or not!

For example remember that supposedly "great" QB class there was for the 1999 draft... only 2 of the 5 taken are even worth a damn, 1 is mediocre or slightly above, and 2 are completely out of the league! There are no givens.

 

[ajcardfan]

It seems to me that some of us are missing the obvious. Drafting with the number 1 pick guarantees jack squat!

swd, you may be a wiz at running a company, but you are a terrible gambler. Give it up.

 

[CaptTurbo]

Originally posted by ajcardfan
It seems to me that some of us are missing the obvious. Drafting with the number 1 pick guarantees jack squat!

swd, you may be a wiz at running a company, but you are a terrible gambler. Give it up.

lol if the ravens win Im actually doing ok this week.

btw is drafting 3 better or worse than 1 in your opinion?

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Re: Re: Sealed our losing ways for the next 5 years

Originally posted by Northern Card


Oh.. and while you at it... find yourself another team...

jesus, a knew someone would have to play this card. i love that y'all don't like someone having an opinion that is the opposite of your own.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Re: Re: Re: Sealed our losing ways for the next 5 years

Originally posted by Oran
I love this win. Yeah, we lost the Manning lotto, but we found out that some people on our defense can play football, and if we get Green as coach he'll have some players to work with. Go Poole! We got three good WR who will be so much better next year!

first of all, if poole is our third wideout we're in trouble. he's not that good. today was his career.

second, no way green comes to us. it's fassel. that's it. this win just sucks for the long term.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Sealed our losing ways for the next 5 years

Originally posted by red desert
There's nothing to wonder about. I'll tell you why I'm happy. The Cards won... and in dramatic fashion.

great. happy for the players. i think it hurts us long term. can you admit that it might?

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Originally posted by PHX Phan
swd why dont you wait until you sober up to post anything else. You say its a given that we wont trade up, why wont we? I think that if they want one of these qb's they will make the move to get him. Yes we need a big name qb and mccown isnt the answer but if you wanted these guys to lay down and die that stupid. you dont lose on purpose no matter who you can get in a draft. Nothing is given in a draft and you know what i dont think you can make some of these comments until we know what we get in the draft.

you are absolutely insane if you think we'll trade up to get a qb. look at our history. we trade DOWN only. i think you'll find that even the bulk of koolaiders on this board will agree that trading up is such a remote possibility that it is almost nonexistant. live in reality son, live in reality.

 

[ajcardfan]

Originally posted by swd1974
lol if the ravens win Im actually doing ok this week.

btw is drafting 3 better or worse than 1 in your opinion?

In advance, you want the higher pick. For the future, it has to play itself out. There's just no way to sit here TODAY, and guarantee we suck for five years. The only team I see in the playoffs with a QB as #1 are the Colts. There are a lot of ways to get to the top. Our biggest problem is that no matter where we pick, our top picks mostly disappoint. That is the real problem, there's no certainity that the number 1 pick would've cured that.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Originally posted by JeffGollin
Name 1 good thing that came from the win please.
How about more than one -

1. The way we won it (and when we won it) has the potential to be an attitude-changer up and down the entire organization.

2. No doubt lots of potential free agents will have watched the highlights (and more than once). This plus the fact that the Cards can point out that they beat 4 legitimate contenders (GB, SF, Cincy and now Minny) makes them a pretty interesting team to come and play for.

3. Some of the younger players in this organization will have learned a valuable lesson - that if you dig your nails into the cliff and manage to hang around long enough during games, when the breaks start falling your way, you'll be in a position to capitalize on them.

4. Fan-base - If the Cardinals could play just had 4 games a year of this nature, we'd fill the seats every Sunday.

5. You guys can look all those Snow Birds in the eye tomorrow and grin from ear to ear.

6. We won in our spiffy all-red uniforms (as Dave McGinnis looks on proudly). Maybe the Cards will be supertitious and make it a habit.

So far as the draft is concerned, I've always felt that where you draft should be a function of fate - i.e. where you came out after you played your ass off for 16 regular season games.

Manipulating the system by deliberately losing a game completely defeats the whole concept of competition. (Imagine how the Packers would feel if the Cardinals deliberately packed it in. Imagine the kind of garbage their players would spread around the entire league about the Cardinals. Visualize the kind of grief Anquan Boldin would have to put up with by other players at the Pro Bowl).

Sorry, Swd - The way for us to get better is to manage better, compete for talent better and play better.

Wanting your team to lose so you can get higher draft picks would only perpetuate the losing aura that has permeated this franchise for oh so many years.

we finished 4-12. that IS perpetuating the losing aura in and of itself.

and you think 'quan will get less grief for 4 wins than he got with 3? c'mon . . .
attitude changer? we were 4-12 MAN!
sf, cincy and minny didn't make the playoffs, so they ain't contending for ANYTHING. we beat one playoff team, and lost 12 games. 4 wins doesn't make any more difference to fa's as does 3 wins.

i'm not advocating that the team ever PURPOSEFULLY lose, what i AM saying is that i'm upset we didn't lose 'cuz i was excited about the prospect of eli whom i now think we'll have NO shot at.

 

[KingLouieLouie]

Originally posted by Ouchie-Z-Clown
you are absolutely insane if you think we'll trade up to get a qb. look at our history. we trade DOWN only. i think you'll find that even the bulk of koolaiders on this board will agree that trading up is such a remote possibility that it is almost nonexistant. live in reality son, live in reality.

I have to look at it this way.....If someone came up to you after last year's draft and said that the Cardinals would have had all their choices signed before the exhibition season, you and most would have been shocked.....And then that they actually used the "bells and whistles" that didnt seem possible for the Cardinals to resort to, your shock would have been magnified...
Top that with signing some key players (yeah probably a couple werent deserved) to long-term deals before the season is over, again you would have been stunned beyond belief....

What Im getting at, nothing can cease to amaze anyone in the direction the franchise is headed in...Anything is possible.....

 

[Sandan]

Originally posted by swd1974
The cards wont trade up, that is a given. So now we are gonna draft who? The 3rd best guy in a weak draft. Great!!!

Man the cards cant even be good at losing. This sucks!!

I know you short sided koll aiders will bash me. But then again thats why none of you run a company. You dont look to the future.

I'm stunned, how do you know we won't trade up ?

I'm also marginaly suprised that you think we are screwed at #3, even if we want a QB. How do you know Eli or Ben won't be available at #3.

Oh, I run a company database consulting

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Originally posted by KingLouieLouie
I have to look at it this way.....If someone came up to you after last year's draft and said that the Cardinals would have had all their choices signed before the exhibition season, you and most would have been shocked.....And then that they actually used the "bells and whistles" that didnt seem possible for the Cardinals to resort to, your shock would have been magnified...
Top that with signing some key players (yeah probably a couple werent deserved) to long-term deals before the season is over, again you would have been stunned beyond belief....

What Im getting at, nothing can cease to amaze anyone in the direction the franchise is headed in...Anything is possible.....

you are very right. i guess a few changes in one season still hasn't convinced me the organization is moving in the right direction. more similar moves will get me more on board.

 

[KingLouieLouie]

Originally posted by Ouchie-Z-Clown
you are very right. i guess a few changes in one season still hasn't convinced me the organization is moving in the right direction. more similar moves will get me more on board.

I understand where you're coming from... I grew-up as a Lions fan, but have since completely changed my allegiances to the Cardinals.... So, I knew what's like to constantly root for a team that would take one step forward, but seem to manage to take several steps back...... So, even if something positive happens you always have this lingering doubt.....

I just see Graves taking some sound steps and that Michael Bidwill is making a solid imprint into this franchise....Two visionaries that they've seemed to lack....

I just say though, the coaching decision is the most significant one they can possibly make...A lot is at stake right there...Its either Fassel/Green or bust....

 

[CaptTurbo]

Originally posted by Ouchie-Z-Clown
you are very right. i guess a few changes in one season still hasn't convinced me the organization is moving in the right direction. more similar moves will get me more on board.

AMEN. Maybe they have some surprises that will allow me to not enjoy us all over tv in april!!!!!