Shaq to Dallas?

[leclerc]

I can understand veterans who want to play for a contender. I think highly of both Nash, Grant Hill and Shaq. Shaq's impressed us with his dedication and play this season. I did not think he'd be this good for us.

If any of them want to go somewhere else I think that's fine. We can't exactly rebuild with 35 year olds. If some of them want to stick around we need a mix of veterans and youngsters anyhow.

So if Shaq wants to go to Dallas I'd be all for it as long as we get something good in return. There's not much on their roster I like. Maybe Jose Barea and Stackhouse.

 

[lou_skywalker]

Get rid of Shaq it would be great. Lets get Damp and Stackhouse and a pick for the Diesel. We could buy out Stack and that could save us money AND improve a bit on defense.

 

[greensborohill]

Couple things,

Damp essentially has an expiring contract after the season over. The final year was contingent on his making 2 all-star games and other performance based measures.

Secondly, Stack goes from being a 2 mill expirer to a 7 or 9 (not sure which) once the season is over.

The pieces fit, just can't see such a cost cutting move happening like this. . . . we'll see.

 

[Ronin]

-- Mannix doesn't think the Mavericks have the right players to offer Phoenix to get Shaquille O'Neal next season. The Mavs reportedly are dangling Jerry Stackhouse and Eric Dampier.
--Mannix says the Suns like Shaq's expiring contract.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/danpatrick/blog/60981/index.html

 

[lou_skywalker]

why would Dallas want to hold on to Stack?
All in all, Shaq needs to be moved, no matter where coz otherwise we are going nowhere next season.

 

[SactownSunsFan]

Good riddance, Shaq. With him gone, hopefully we can pick up a center that will make an attempt to guard even the simplest of pick and rolls.

 

[Covert Rain]

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/danpatrick/blog/60981/index.html

Thank god someone seems to have a brain. Damp & Stack??? That is about as useless as a trade gets. Let his contract expire if that is the best you can do.

Good riddance, Shaq. With him gone, hopefully we can pick up a center that will make an attempt to guard even the simplest of pick and rolls.

What????. Shaq is a force. So he is bad at pick and rolls. I could go up and down every freaking roster in the NBA and point out something their center does bad. When you look at his overall game he is better then what most teams have at that position. Give it a rest.

Shaq has been great. However, it's time to move on if we can. If we can trade him for something more then Damp & Stack then do it. If not, his expiring contract is more valuable from a cap space perspective. I am not for taking on other teams garbage. Damp & Stack are garbage even it their contracts expire at the same time as Shaq (which I don't know...have not looked up).

 

[SactownSunsFan]

What????. Shaq is a force. So he is bad at pick and rolls. I could go up and down every freaking roster in the NBA and point out something their center does bad. When you look at his overall game he is better then what most teams have at that position. Give it a rest.

Shaq has been great. However, it's time to move on if we can. If we can trade him for something more then Damp & Stack then do it. If not, his expiring contract is more valuable from a cap space perspective. I am not for taking on other teams garbage. Damp & Stack are garbage even it their contracts expire at the same time as Shaq (which I don't know...have not looked up).

Bad? Shaq hasn't just been bad at guarding pick and rolls, he flat out refuses to try, allowing the ballhandler to shoot uncontested jump shots on virtually every pick and roll. It's one of the main reasons we're near dead last in opponent field goal percentage. His offensive contributions are nearly negated by his defensive deficiencies. He's a fun player to watch, but as entertaining as he is, his play doesn't lead to victories. Not anymore.

 

[cly2tw]

Bad? Shaq hasn't just been bad at guarding pick and rolls, he flat out refuses to try, allowing the ballhandler to shoot uncontested jump shots on virtually every pick and roll. It's one of the main reasons we're near dead last in opponent field goal percentage. His offensive contributions are nearly negated by his defensive deficiencies. He's a fun player to watch, but as entertaining as he is, his play doesn't lead to victories. Not anymore.

He was pointing fingers at Nash for letting his man drive by him too easily, maybe the reason for his reluctance to try?

 

[95pro]

nash+shaq = bad at guarding pNr

they are both terrible defenders at guarding the pick and roll, especially combined together. thats why you see teams attack both of them in one play.

 

[SactownSunsFan]

He was pointing fingers at Nash for letting his man drive by him too easily, maybe the reason for his reluctance to try?

It hasn't just been on the Suns - Shaq hasn't defended the pick n roll since he got fat and happy in LA. Difference is, his offensive impact isn't great enough to offset that anymore.

 

[Chaplin]

Shaq will change his tune after 2 months without our training staff.

 

[Covert Rain]

It hasn't just been on the Suns - Shaq hasn't defended the pick n roll since he got fat and happy in LA. Difference is, his offensive impact isn't great enough to offset that anymore.

Shaq has never defended the pick and roll well to my recollection. You obviously have a beef with the guy. Like I stated before I can name something about any NBA player. It doesn't erase all the things he does well. He is still one of the best centers in the NBA period.

What he does in the paint both on defense and offense more then offsets any shortcommings on the pick and roll.

 

[SactownSunsFan]

Shaq has never defended the pick and rol well to my recollection. You obviously have a beef with the guy. Like I stated before I can name something about any NBA player. It doesn't erase all the things he does well. He is still one of the best centers in the NBA period.

What he does in the paint both on defense and offense more then offsets any shortcummings on the pick and roll.

Correction. Used to. Not anymore. I don't have any beef with the guy, other than he's being overpaid for what he brings to the table.

 

[Covert Rain]

Correction. Used to. Not anymore. I don't have any beef with the guy, other than he's being overpaid for what he brings to the table.

He is a top 10 NBA center. Is he overpaid? In this league the premium is on big guys. You could probably make that argument for most big men in the NBA. As long as the market dicatates that is what the guy is worth...I have a hard time buying the "overpaid" argument. If he was signed for another 5 years at that salary then I could buy that arguement. He has played like a to 10 NBA center this season.

 

[SactownSunsFan]

He is a top 10 NBA center. Is he overpaid? In this league the premium is on big guys. You could probably make that argument for most big men in the NBA. As long as the market dicatates that is what the guy is worth...I have a hard time buying the "overpaid" argument. If he was signed for another 5 years at that salary then I could buy that arguement. He has played like a to 10 NBA center this season.

Offensively he's still a top 10 center. On the other end of the floor,
it's . I would rank Shaq somewhere in the 10-15 range, largely because the league is suffering from a lack of talent at center and has been for about the last 7 years now.

We all know offense isn't the problem for this team. It's defense, and Shaq doesn't bring it. He's only going to get worse. $20 million is a lot to pay a player who's only real worth is on one side of the floor.

I don't even know why we're discussing this- you've said yourself we need to move Shaq this offseason, as have I.

 

[shazaam6]

So we miss the playoffs without having Amare. We have Shaq and Nash but no playoffs. I know he is not a defensive force but Amare with Nash is a much better combo than Shaq and Nash. If someone has to go due to money it should be Shaqtus.

 

[Covert Rain]

Offensively he's still a top 10 center. On the other end of the floor,
it's . I would rank Shaq somewhere in the 10-15 range, largely because the league is suffering from a lack of talent at center and has been for about the last 7 years now.

We all know offense isn't the problem for this team. It's defense, and Shaq doesn't bring it. He's only going to get worse. $20 million is a lot to pay a player who's only real worth is on one side of the floor.

I don't even know why we're discussing this- you've said yourself we need to move Shaq this offseason, as have I.

The only reason why we are discussing this is because we don't agree on why Shaq shoud be traded. It's from more of a financial/rebuilding reason for me. You indicated it's his performance which I don't get because even at this age he is one of the best.

Shaq does fill the paint on defense. The Suns used to allow on average right around 40 PPG in the paint pre-Shaq. Now they are only allowing around 30 PPG in the paint (4th best in the NBA). We are only behind San Antonio, Orlando and Boston. That a huge impact on the other end of the court and to say Shaq doesn't get it done is ridiculous. There are only 3 other teams that get it done better in the paint thanks to Shaq.

This team can't stop anybody on the perimeter. We allow nearly 34 PPG on average from the 2 (2nd worst in the NBA) and 23.1 from the 3 (3rd worst in the NBA). This team's problems defensively at the pick and roll are grossly exaggerated. This teams problems are not because Shaq can't defend. You can thank almost every other position on the floor for their lack of perimeter defense. You can thank a PG who is #3 overall in the NBA at turning the ball over. You can thank a team that is one of the worst in the NBA at turning the ball over. All that leads to easy buckets.

 

[joshstmarie]

the suns should be thankful for what they got out of shaq this year and cut ties with him. he and andrew can be cubans problem now.

 

[cobbler]

Top 10 Centers Salary (by PER)
1. Howard 11,000,000
2. Duncan 20,000,000
3. Jefferson 11,000,000
4. Yao 15,000,000
5. Shaq 21,000,000
6. Gasol 15,000,000
7. Bynum 3,000,000
8. Beidens 9,000,000
9. Camby 10,000,000
10. Nene 11,000,000

Shaq is the #1 highest paid center in the league. Other than Duncan he makes 6 mil more than the 3rd and 4th highest paid and 10 mil more than the best center in the league. Clearly overpaid.

But rather than get garbage players in trade his best value to the Suns would be as an expiring contract.

 

[Covert Rain]

Top 10 Centers Salary (by PER)
1. Howard 11,000,000
2. Duncan 20,000,000
3. Jefferson 11,000,000
4. Yao 15,000,000
5. Shaq 21,000,000
6. Gasol 15,000,000
7. Bynum 3,000,000
8. Beidens 9,000,000
9. Camby 10,000,000
10. Nene 11,000,000

Shaq is the #1 highest paid center in the league. Other than Duncan he makes 6 mil more than the 3rd and 4th highest paid and 10 mil more than the best center in the league. Clearly overpaid.

But rather than get garbage players in trade his best value to the Suns would be as an expiring contract.

Shaq got paid what the market bared when his contract was signed. Market dictates value. Shaq still produces. Besides, the one that stands out to me is Howard. However, if he did his deal today he would be the highest paid center in the league. Not to mention if some of the centers were on the free agent market the Suns would end up paying between 15 to 20 million for any of those guys.

To me if you have one of them regardless of salary and that players does what you wanted him to do, in this case make the team a force in the paint....your getting your monies worth and not overpaying. If there was another player available that could give you the same production at the time in a trade and was available that would be different. You pay the premium for guys that are available.

PS. Why am I not surprised you could not resist to take a shot at Shaq?

 

[cobbler]

I take every shot I can, thank you! While Shaq is getting paid what the market bared when he signed his contract, he is clearly getting overpaid with regards to his current skill level and ability to play 82 games compared with the other elite centers. I guarantee you if Shaq was being underpaid with reguards to the other players, reguardless of when he signed his contract, you would be hearing about it!

There is no doubt he played better this year than anyone expected. With that said, he is clearly not at a level to be the 8th highest paid player in the league and the top paid center no matter how much you try to justify it. It is for that very reason that Dr Buss refused to give him his 5 year 20 mil a year extension. He knew Shaqs skills would begin to diminish and they have.

Shaq is only getting the 20 mil now because Pat Riley was a fool to extend him at that rate for 3 additional years.

 

[Covert Rain]

I take every shot I can, thank you! While Shaq is getting paid what the market bared when he signed his contract, he is clearly getting overpaid with regards to his current skill level and ability to play 82 games compared with the other elite centers. I guarantee you if Shaq was being underpaid with reguards to the other players, reguardless of when he signed his contract, you would be hearing about it!

There is no doubt he played better this year than anyone expected. With that said, he is clearly not at a level to be the 8th highest paid player in the league and the top paid center no matter how much you try to justify it. It is for that very reason that Dr Buss refused to give him his 5 year 20 mil a year extension. He knew Shaqs skills would begin to diminish and they have.

Shaq is only getting the 20 mil now because Pat Riley was a fool to extend him at that rate for 3 additional years.

Show me a single center in the NBA that the Suns wouldn't have to pay $15 to $20 million to that make this team the 4th best in the paint defense for points in the paint and the best FG% in the paint on offense if there was one on the market today as a free agent.

 

[cobbler]

Show me a single center in the NBA that the Suns wouldn't have to pay $15 to $20 million to that make this team the 4th best in the paint defense for points in the paint and the best FG% in the paint on offense if there was one on the market today as a free agent.

Bynum

 

[dodie53]

if Damp and Stack are expring contracts,
i would trade shaq for the two.

i think Stat would be happy if he is paired with a defensive minded center.

btw,
can dallas include barea in that trade?