Steve Keim's Line in The Sand

Mitch

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Steve Keim's "Draw A Line in the Sand" FA & Pre-Draft Policy: CB

Prior to the start of this year's free agency period, Steve Keim said the following:

“In some instances we’ll make (contract) offers yet those offers won’t linger,” Keim said Wednesday at the NFL Scouting combine. “It’s a situation where, ‘You know what, if you leave it on the table and test free agency, the offer may not stand.’ To me, that’s where you have to be disciplined, so you don’t get caught flat-footed. You have to draw your line in the sand, this is where we are at and if you don’t want it, we’re willing to move on as well. But you can’t say you’re willing to move on unless you are truly willing to move on.”

Keim is becoming particularly astute at judging players' market value.

Case In Point---prior to the FA period, MJ reported from his sources that Jerraud Powers was looking for a 3 year deal that averaged $6-7M per year. MJ said on is show a few times that, "the Cardinals should be able to offer $5.5M per and get the deal done." Now---to be fair to MJ---he and many of us were of the belief that Powers was still a favorite of BA's and that the Cardinals should and would like to keep him in the nest.

While there is no proof that Keim offered Powers a deal prior to the start of free agency, either one of two things happened: (a) Keim offered the "draw the line in the sand" deal and Powers declined it and entered into the FA market; (b) Keim did what he said he was going to do and moved on---which can be corroborated by Keim's selections of CB Brandon Williams (3rd Round) and CB Harlan Miller (6th Round) and highly coveted UDFA CB Elie Bouka.

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Back in late January Keim signed three CBs to "futures" contracts: Asa Jackson, Shaun Prater and Cariel Brooks. Jackson has a few NFL starts under his belt. Prater and Brooks have been PS squad players who made it all the way to final cuts with their teams last year.

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Keim has also shown a degree of interest in FA CB Leon Hall---Hall is coming off back surgery, but, when healthy, he's a tenacious cover man. According to Larry Fitzgerald, Hall covered him as well as any CB he faced last year. Hall recently met the with Falcons and apparently the Falcons were not convinced that Hall will be ready to play.

Curiously, the Cardinals took a gamble on TE Jermaine Gresham last off-season as he was coming off back surgery. Perhaps Gresham can convince his former Bengals' teammate to come to AZ at the veteran minimum plus incentives to reset his market as Gresham is doing.

What's curious about Powers' situation is that having tested the FA market and realized that he was not getting the type of lucrative contract offers he was hoping for, reports were a few weeks ago that Powers was "visiting" the Cardinals. But---it now seems quite clear that Keim had done what he had said he was going to do---draw the line in the sand and move on. Powers signed a one year deal worth $1.75M...apparently Keim wasn't even willing to match that figure.

ESPN's Josh Weinfuss blogged after Powers' signing with Baltimore that the Cardinals still very much need to add a veteran CB.

What do you think?

Keim has stockpiled the position with young talent---talent that i believe he wants to keep on the roster and not risk losing to the waiver wire. I do not think Keim wants any other team to get anywhere near the trio of Brandon Williams, Harlan Miller and Elie Bouka.

If adding those three rookies, plus Asa Jackson, Shaun Prater and Cariel Brooks weren't enough, the last two UDFA CBs Keim signed, Trevor Hartfield of SW Oklahoma St. and Ronald Zamort of Western Michigan are classic sleepers and a testament once again to the far-reaching scouting the Cardinals are doing.

Interview with Trevon Hartfield:

http://www.nfldraftdiamonds.com/nfl...ld-cb-southwestern-oklahoma-state-university/

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I also believe that Keim is confident in Justin Bethel and in knowing that if Bethel struggles they can turn to Tyrann Mathieu or Tyvon Branch at RCB if need be, if the rookies are not quite ready.

Moreover, I think that Keim is confident that if need be he can make a training camp trade or waiver wire acquisition for another CB.

I think Keim's line in the sand is clear---I think he doesn't want to give up a roster spot for another CB, because, as it is, they may have to risk waiving one or two of the talented young CBs they have on the 90 man roster.
 
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pinetopred

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That's been my contention with the Powers signing with the Ravens I think you have to find out what you have with these young guys, it's risky but I think it is an educated risk, with the knowledge a Vet can be added later.
 
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Thank you, cardncubfan.

:thumbup: Thanks for the reading material Mitch. Always enjoy your posts whether I agree or not. Much better than the guy that goes around giving your posts a one star rating acting like an immature adolescent. ;)
 

ASUCHRIS

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As our roster stands, at CB we have PP, and a bunch of major question marks.

I would feel much more comfortable with Powers still in the mix.
 

cardpa

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I thought Cariel Brooks looked good last pre season and hope he made some strides being on the practice roster last year. He may very well be a pleasant surprise this coming training camp.
 
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I thought Cariel Brooks looked good last pre season and hope he made some strides being on the practice roster last year. He may very well be a pleasant surprise this coming training camp.

I agree. There is a reason the staff thinks we are okay at CB. I think if during TC it looks like they need a vet they will sign one. But for now they are comfortable with what they have.
 
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Good stuff Mitch.

I'm still trying to make up my mind on what want to see happen in regards to our CB situation. Any vet CB that SK would sign at this point would have to be above average IMO because of all the young talent he has accumulated. None of that young talent is proven or near a sure thing so that's why many fans are nervous and want a vet CB signed.

SK took to long to fix the LT situation but he did fix it.

OL was a mess and now it's more than solid.

ILB is sorta fixed, it's not a hole on the roster but Minter starting means it isn't a strength.

OLB has been at best okay but mostly a big hole on the D. Now it's going to be good to very good.

CB was good then outstanding and then okay and now?????

C and CB are to two big concerns at this point but they may just be more than good. Boehm feels like he will be more than up to the task and play at least at Sendleins level. I truly believe Boehm will beat out Shipley and be an upgrade over what we have had at the C position for quite some time now.

CB, I have a lot more faith in Bethel than many if not most fans on this board. We have also seen rookie CB's play fairly well in their first year. With the numerous amount that SK has signed and drafted one will step up enough to play at least at a solid level.
 

BullheadCardFan

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I still think we need help at ILB. We lack quality depth behind Deone and Minter. Minter is not much above average and lacks coverage skills. Are we really going to rely on guys like Fua and Martin?
 

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That's been my contention with the Powers signing with the Ravens I think you have to find out what you have with these young guys, it's risky but I think it is an educated risk, with the knowledge a Vet can be added later.

I agree. He stockpiled the position with young, unproven talent when they missed out on vets, that they wanted to sign. OTA and training camp will show if they trust the young guys. I not. A veteran will be added - kinda like the CJ situation. Evaluate and execute if needed
 

Sunburn

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Little bit scary. I remember the times going into the season when we thought the O-line was going to be OK. Long way off though.
 

Totally_Red

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Regarding Powers and Johnson, I think the Cardinals meant it when they said they wanted to add speed and size to secondary. Powers had a poor 2015 season IMO and they felt they could upgrade the position.

When they paid Justin Bethel during the season last year, they obvously felt he could handle the #2 cornerback role. Hopefully, they are correct.
 

Chopper0080

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All I know is that I would rather be thin in the secondary than be thin at pass rush. We will see if it works out, but we seem to be the deepest we have ever been along the front 7 in terms of rushing the passer, especially if they sign Freeney later on.
 

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All I know is that I would rather be thin in the secondary than be thin at pass rush. We will see if it works out, but we seem to be the deepest we have ever been along the front 7 in terms of rushing the passer, especially if they sign Freeney later on.

agreed, but this doesn't appear to be an either or situation. We still have a little cap room, and 1 year @ 1.7 million dollars is a pretty good just in case investment, considering how thin we were last year at the position and appear to be even more this year.
 

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Regarding Powers and Johnson, I think the Cardinals meant it when they said they wanted to add speed and size to secondary. Powers had a poor 2015 season IMO and they felt they could upgrade the position.

When they paid Justin Bethel during the season last year, they obvously felt he could handle the #2 cornerback role. Hopefully, they are correct.

Very little about the actual contract makes that clear—as does the Cards' pursuit of multiple starting-caliber cornerbacks in free agency.

The Cards basically extended Bethel for one year with two team options in 2017 and 2018. He's a very affordable starting cornerback if he keeps that job (and Urban and others are already hedging on that), and as a pro bowl special teams player who can contribute at corner, he's right in line with the salary.

IMO, these futures contracts players are all scrubs (they always are) and have a barely more than a nonzero chance of making the roster. The Cards have yet to see on-field work from any of them. Cards are likely to bring in a veteran as training camp approaches or once they're certain only one or two of these guys can add value this year.
 

BACH

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IMO, these futures contracts players are all scrubs (they always are) and have a barely more than a nonzero chance of making the roster. The Cards have yet to see on-field work from any of them. Cards are likely to bring in a veteran as training camp approaches or once they're certain only one or two of these guys can add value this year.
Agree. All the hype about Bouka from Canada might earn him a roster spot, but I Will be Surprised if he's even in the competition for a starting job. From undrafted to starter is rare and basicly only happens over a couple of seasons.
 

ASUCHRIS

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I'm a bit surprised people aren't more worried about corner. HB wasn't ready until 2 years after his last ACL, Powers is gone, and Bethel was shaky at best as a #2.

What have we added at CB that could reasonably be expected to contribute immediately? I like the potential of many of them, but our window is small.

I really hope Leon Hall is a consideration, any credible depth at this point would be a major upgrade.
 

BACH

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I'm a bit surprised people aren't more worried about corner. HB wasn't ready until 2 years after his last ACL, Powers is gone, and Bethel was shaky at best as a #2.

What have we added at CB that could reasonably be expected to contribute immediately? I like the potential of many of them, but our window is small.

I really hope Leon Hall is a consideration, any credible depth at this point would be a major upgrade.

Still lots of qualityveterans with starting potential available out there..
Hall, Brandon Boykin, Leodis McKelvin, Antonio Cromartie, Cortez Allen, Prince Amukamara, Chris Culliver, Charles Tillman, Trumaine McBride & Walter Thurmond
 

Cbus cardsfan

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Still lots of qualityveterans with starting potential available out there..
Hall, Brandon Boykin, Leodis McKelvin, Antonio Cromartie, Cortez Allen, Prince Amukamara, Chris Culliver, Charles Tillman, Trumaine McBride & Walter Thurmond
Think Prince signed with Jax and McKelvin with Philly.
 

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I'm a bit surprised people aren't more worried about corner. HB wasn't ready until 2 years after his last ACL, Powers is gone, and Bethel was shaky at best as a #2.

What have we added at CB that could reasonably be expected to contribute immediately? I like the potential of many of them, but our window is small.

I really hope Leon Hall is a consideration, any credible depth at this point would be a major upgrade.

I hadn't realized we'd left the position so unstocked, so yes, I am worried.
 

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I'm in the minority but I think Bethel will be fine. I think he was good at covering his man but not good at making the play to either break up the pass or pick it off. That will come with experience. I don't think he's ever going to be a great CB but I think he will become an above average one and that's good with me.

The good thing is, if the #3 CB or CB depth, is the biggest concern for a defense, that's a pretty good defense.
 

Austin Zonie

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I'm in the minority but I think Bethel will be fine. I think he was good at covering his man but not good at making the play to either break up the pass or pick it off. That will come with experience. I don't think he's ever going to be a great CB but I think he will become an above average one and that's good with me.

The good thing is, if the #3 CB or CB depth, is the biggest concern for a defense, that's a pretty good defense.

I agree that Bethel does seem to put himself in position to make a play on the ball, just rarely seemed to be able to turn around and locate the ball in air. Hopefully that come with experience. How many years has he been playing corner now?
 
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