Suns Draft Grades

[YouJustGotSUNSD]

what does that have to do with grading, and how were you planning to use my answer to save face?

 

[Mulli]

what does that have to do with grading, and how were you planning to use my answer to save face?

just wondering. Do you think you just got sunsed in a different manner?

 

[YouJustGotSUNSD]

East Valley Tribune absolutely assaulting the FO for their draft efforts:

Draft shows Suns' delusional thinking

Suns needed a starter, not a role player

 

[dreamcastrocks]

East Valley Tribune absolutely assaulting the FO for their draft efforts:

Draft shows Suns' delusional thinking

Suns needed a starter, not a role player

Anyone expecting a starter with the at 15 with the players that we already have starting is delusional. Nobody at 15 will crack our top 7 no matter what.

 

[Mulli]

potential starters like Western Kentucky guard Courtney Lee or Memphis swingman Chris Douglas-Roberts, who was the steal of the draft, going to New Jersey with the 40th pick overall

who is delusional?

 

[YouJustGotSUNSD]

just wondering. Do you think you just got sunsed in a different manner?

I havent really commented on what I think of the choice, but I guess im apathetic. Im not excited, and im not flipped out pissed. I am more disappointed in the suns' failure to move up/trade effectively than I am with the pick. The fact that Lopez will be nothing but a backup for us through his rookie contract make me mad that we probably wont use the much needed MLE to fill the rest of our gaps.

If getting "suns'd" now means accepting the hype and being disappointed, yeah, I got suns'd. But I guess ive been getting suns'd for 25 years then.

 

[nashman]

I guess I don't get some of the disappointment, what would you have rather done trade a proven scorer in Barbs to move up a few spots and get who? Who would we get that would produce more than Barbs and Lopez this year? I mean honestly this team has the core to win we just need some backups and thats what they got. If the new coach plays the bench and teaches a little D we could be very good and not run down the starters all season so they are fresher for the playoffs. And their still is free agency, I tell you one thing if your gonna trade Barbs it had better be for a proven NBA player that can hit a 3 not just to move up in the draft. Sorry but I for one am freakin glad we didn't trade a proven player just to move up a few spots and bring in a total unknown! And if Porter uses Boris at PF and SF we will see more production than him trying to play the bigs!

 

[JoRain]

I havent really commented on what I think of the choice, but I guess im apathetic. Im not excited, and im not flipped out pissed. I am more disappointed in the suns' failure to move up/trade effectively than I am with the pick. The fact that Lopez will be nothing but a backup for us through his rookie contract make me mad that we probably wont use the much needed MLE to fill the rest of our gaps.

That is actually a good point. Again Suns made all that talk about moving up in the draft or getting another pick with all those rumors surfucing about trade with Clippers and/or Raptors. And then comes the draft night and you see Portland, Indiana, NJ and other making one deal after another...

It is frustrating than again nothing happened. Why nothing happened ? was it inability to strike a deal or indecisivnes or price was too high or maybe Sarver just put a veto on everything?
anyway, last few years its been the same song so starting to get used to it. But then theres bright side - At least they didn't sold this pick for cash

As for Lopez - I am fairly happy with that pick as the guy is 7 feet and plays D - its that the Suns need. I have seen a couple of Stanfords games last seasons, and I actually think he didn't do bad In my mind he is closer to Biedrins than Varejao and I think he's gonna fit in

 

[nashman]

Again don't see the point in trading Barbs a proven scorer and one of the fastest guys in the league to move up and draft WHO???? No one unless we got a top 3 or 4 which was NEVER EVER going to happen is gonna produce more than what we already have. Lopez was their guy according to Kerr even if they had moved up to 10 or whatever so why trade away a good player and great bench guy?

 

[JCSunsfan]

Did they really get the player they wanted though? I have yet to hear a team say on draft day "we didn't get the guy we wanted and had to settle on this guy". It's usually something we will never know. If ultimately Lopez was the 4 of 5 guy they wanted...I am not sure I would call that getting who they wanted. The draft is a weird entity in itself...that's for sure.

I think it's fair to grade the draft based on whether or not you improved your team and filled need.

Gambo said, at 1pm, yesterday afternoon that their plan was to draft RLopez. He said their list was 1. RLopez, 2. BRush, 3. ARandolf 4. NBatum. He said it BEFORE any of them were picked.

They also announced that they were trying all night to get a 2nd to get a pg they did not feel would be available at #48.

So. It is clear that the Suns got EXACTLY the players they targeted. You may not LIKE those players, but they executed their draft plan well.

Kerr also said they are doing everything they can to get Goran over here next year. Goran and Nash share the same agent (Bill Duffy) and Duffy had given Kerr some indication that Tau Ceramica might be willing to some sort of buyout. Sarver paid $ to make the trade. If he was just trying to save cash he could have picked a nobody or sold the pick. I am certainly in the "Sarver is cheap" camp, but it is simply not accurate to say he is in this situation.

I am optimistic that Robin will be a better player than Brook (I cannot imagine giving such girly names to my twin boys). He's a legit 7 footer. He is NOT a stiff. Anyone can see that from watching film. He is a late bloomer who really began to develop his game in the second half of last season.

I gave them a B. The only way they could have gotten an A from me is to move up and get Westbrook.

I am encouraged that they did not have a fire sale on LB or Boris. At some point this year, some good player is going to be available and it will be important to have some trading chips available. Besides, I think Barbs has the potential to be a fantastic defender, but his previous coach never valued that. Porter might have some positive effect on him.

 

[nashman]

JC would Westbrook be better than Barbs & Lopez honestly?

 

[mjb21aztd]

I gave them a b they didn't sell the pick and they got a player with some size which is what we need. I was hoping we could have found a way to move up and take on of the pgs to backup nash but oh well hopefully lopez turnes out to be a solid role player and help some in the playoffs and this upcoming season. He has two good players to learn under from shaq and amare well hopefully amare doesn't try to teach Lopez defense lol

 

[JCSunsfan]

JC would Westbrook be better than Barbs & Lopez honestly?

No. But Westbrook and Lopez would be better than Barbs and Lopez. Any trade of Barbs to move up would have been Barbs for the pick, or Barbs and our pick for a pick plus another serviceable player.

 

[Griffin]

It's sad that we us fans are almost expected to be thankful to the Suns for not selling the picks this time around. As for the grade, I give them a C-. I really did not like Lopez, but I'll admit when the Suns pick came up, with Randolph just gone, there was really no one I liked at that point that wouldn't be a reach.

I do like the potential of what Lopez could bring to this team, but that was too high of a pick to draft to player with such a low ceiling. I used to laugh at teams who reach for role, lifetime-backup players this early; have we become one of those teams? Robin is often compared to players like Varejao and Turiaf: "He just can give big man energy like Anderson Varejao, Paul Millsap, Ronny Turiaf or Jason Maxiell. Leon Powe had a 21-point game in the NBA Finals on that kind of effort." (From a Coro article). Here's the thing: all those guys were drafted from late in the first round to deep into the second round. One should expect a lot more from the 15th pick than the occasional energy boost or a blocked shot. "The last two days, we thought there was no way he'd fall and we got lucky," says Kerr. And yet, there has been no report of any team thinking of drafting him before the Suns.

As for Goran Dragic, I think I like this kid. I think he could be a nice second-round steal. I have no problem there other than to note that the Suns are making such a big deal of being able to get him, and yet all they did was trade a future second and cash to move up three spots from 48th to 45th. Was Dragic really going to be taken by Detroit (via Seattle) at 46th? I have not heard of any other teams working him out other than Phoenix over the past weekend. Either way, I'm glad the Suns paid up when they thought it was worth it. But Mario Chalmers, a much more known commodity, could have also been had at the same price. I guess we'll have to wait and see if our scouts ranked them in the correct order. But with Dragic still under contract and currently no buy-out this year, that could be a long wait. Coro also mentioned "He would have been a consideration at No. 15 if Brandon Rush, Anthony Randolph and Robin Lopez were not there." Now that would have been insane.

 

[nashman]

I disagree JC, Barbs has already proven that he can score and his speed is crazy good, not sure how you think some rookie would be better than him at this point. Maybe in the future but I am much more inclined to see how Barbs does with some different coaching as he has the tools and speed to be a solid defender as well as scorer.

 

[Mainstreet]

It's sad that we us fans are almost expected to be thankful to the Suns for not selling the picks this time around. As for the grade, I give them a C-. I really did not like Lopez, but I'll admit when the Suns pick came up, with Randolph just gone, there was really no one I liked at that point that wouldn't be a reach.

I do like the potential of what Lopez could bring to this team, but that was too high of a pick to draft to player with such a low ceiling. I used to laugh at teams who reach for role, lifetime-backup players this early; have we become one of those teams? Robin is often compared to players like Varejao and Turiaf: "He just can give big man energy like Anderson Varejao, Paul Millsap, Ronny Turiaf or Jason Maxiell. Leon Powe had a 21-point game in the NBA Finals on that kind of effort." (From a Coro article). Here's the thing: all those guys were drafted from late in the first round to deep into the second round. One should expect a lot more from the 15th pick than the occasional energy boost or a blocked shot. "The last two days, we thought there was no way he'd fall and we got lucky," says Kerr. And yet, there has been no report of any team thinking of drafting him before the Suns.

As for Goran Dragic, I think I like this kid. I think he could be a nice second-round steal. I have no problem there other than to note that the Suns are making such a big deal of being able to get him, and yet all they did was trade a future second and cash to move up three spots from 48th to 45th. Was Dragic really going to be taken by Detroit (via Seattle) at 46th? I have not heard of any other teams working him out other than Phoenix over the past weekend. Either way, I'm glad the Suns paid up when they thought it was worth it. But Mario Chalmers, a much more known commodity, could have also been had at the same price. I guess we'll have to wait and see if our scouts ranked them in the correct order. But with Dragic still under contract and currently no buy-out this year, that could be a long wait. Coro also mentioned "He would have been a consideration at No. 15 if Brandon Rush, Anthony Randolph and Robin Lopez were not there." Now that would have been insane.

I gave the Suns a "B" based on what they had to work with in the draft. I think they made the most of what they had.

I want to compare Lopez with a more athletic version of Scott Pollard when he played for Sacramento. He played like a mad man back then and really gave the Kings a lift as a energy guy. I remember being impressed about the intensity he brought to the Kings and how he elevated the play of the team. Also how does one place a value on a similar dirt work player like Kurt Rambis when he played for the Lakers? As Lopez is young and appears to be a high intensity player I most certainly will give him the benefit of the doubt. He strikes me as a player that will drive himself harder than the coaches.

As I said earlier, if just Goran Dragic pans out and he becomes the Suns PG of the future, this draft alone would merit an "A" by the Suns. However, obviously the jury is still out and it may take years to fully know the verdict. At least this year I have some hope after the draft. Last year I never felt the Suns really targeted anyone. I thought the Suns treated the selection of Tucker as a afterthought and the selection of Strawberry... well he just happened to be there. At least the Suns FO seems excited about this year's picks. Last year, it was more or less just blah.

 

[CardsFan88]

I gave a B because Portland has out shined everybody in the last 2 drafts by such a large degree, that they solely own the only A grade I give out this year. Everybody else MUST be a notch lower.

Thus a 'B' for the potential. We'll see how it works out, but I feel we made the right choices.

Let's hope the part of actually picking our picks is a trend.

 

[Joe Mama]

Well, I would have been as disappointed as many of you are with Robin Lopez if Brandon Rush had been on the board. I think Rush is going to be a really good player.

I do think it's funny that a lot of you guys are so disappointed that the Phoenix Suns weren't a to pull off some of the moves like Portland and Indiana. Hello. The drop-off in talent from 13 to 15 was significant. Those teams also have a bunch of movable pieces that the Phoenix Suns don't have right now. If you want to complain about why we don't have those pieces I totally understand. I'm there with you. But last night to fix those teams had were much more valuable than the #15.

Freaking Atlanta.

Joe

 

[Chaplin]

For those that voted B, how would you vote Indiana, Portland, Milwaukee?

Because I see a Grand Canyon sized gap between those with an A on their report card, and the Phoenix Suns.

B is a not a very well thought out choice. Dont get me started on the A voters.

They get a C from me for: Trying to improve, failing to improve, staying the course with what they could once they failed.

C = average

I think that's bull and a little insulting. That's the problem with this board, there is so much disrespect toward each other. It's quite sickening. I don't understand how you can claim to be a fan of the team and be so awful to other fans of said team. I admit I'm guilty of that myself, but most of the time it's to defend my opinion and getting attacked.

I chose B simply because the Suns went into the draft with 3 needs and theoretically filled 2 of those 3.

I don't know how anyone can look at this draft as "failing to improve". What do you people expect with picks 15 and 48? They weren't all of a sudden going to have the next Shawn Marion fall into their laps to start at SF. If you thought Brandon Rush was that guy, then you are sadly mistaken.

Everyone loves to pan the pick yet they offer no tangible alternative to it. Arthur, Speights, Greene? Those guys are much bigger projects than Robin Lopez, who will be able to contribute right away. Unfortunately, everybody wants a guy who not only is the best defender in the NBA, but who will also score 20 points a night. That isn't going to happen, even with the #1 pick in the draft.

I can see giving the draft a C, but as far as what was there and available, I don't see how anyone except the people who already have set the Suns up to fail can give them a D or F.

 

[mojorizen7]

I'm of the opinion that when you analyze/grade an offseason ie;draft,free agency you first need to look at
a) what are the goals/expectations of success in the short term?
b) where is the team at with the current roster?
Well it seems to me that according to the SUNS FO the expectations are to win a championship next year right? Ok...so what kind of sense does it make to stand pat at #15 and take a role player in Lopez(who btw i think can help this team in the "long term.") and take a PG who will not play here for at least a year?
That looks like moves that a team might make thats rebuilding to me. There's still free agency granted, but i think we all know how thats going to end up.
I graded this draft as a "C."
To clarify, If the FO really believes that this team can contend for a title next year...i'll change my grade to an "F" based on this draft.
If the SUNS brass is attempting to put some pieces in place to contend in a few years i'll change my grade to a "B."
IMO the SUNS don't know whether or not their rebuilding or reloading....thus i graded this draft as a 'C.'

When you think you're on the cusp of winning a title you don't draft a role player at #15 and a kid at #48 that will not play for at least a year.
There were deals to be had and Portland was driving the bus.

 

[nowagimp]

Suns management is getting paid millions of dollars to make these decisions and should be held to a much higher standard that the wisdom of ASFN posters who are, at best part-timers, in this area. What I like to see from talent evaluators getting paid silly money is the ability to make picks that sometimes turn out to be hidden talent, and to address team needs.

I waited to consider and get more information about the picks/moves. I am willing to give management the benefit of the doubt going forward as the young PG was really cheap, I like the move even if he isnt coming over this year. This kid has a big upside, so the suns could win big on that small risk. I am a little concerned that lopez will be skinner-lite without the baseline shot. Im not sure lopez can even hold his position down low to defend and rebound in the NBA yet at the '5', he could even be a bit of a project there defensively. I'll bet skinner could pretty much control him down low, strengthwise. Its rare to draft a big man that young who is strong enough down low to control area in the paint, and he will still have to learn the physical NBA techinques down there that are permitted by the officials. I will be happy overall if suns management goes out and signs a permiter shooting wing who can defend, with james jones as the required level of skill. More is better, hope they dont use grant hill full time this year, and they just have to get another shooter who can defend the wings. Having considered everything, I do have one reservation. Lopez is neither an athlete or a fundamentally skilled player, so I am having some difficulty figuring out his value to the suns.

If it turns out that greene or koufas>>kopez, I will lose faith in suns talent evaluation, Kerr specifically. I am willing to give kerr the benefit of the doubt, wait and see, as he has seen alot more than I have of the two guys. But if koufas becomes an NBA rotation level talent who can score, rebound, and defend, and lopez ends up a 10-15 min a game one dimensional player no better than skinner, Steve Kerr/Griffin will be exposed in my eyes as unable to evalutate big man talent. And this will mean that the #15 will have been wasted as skinner could just have been resigned, probably at vet min. I would hope that lopez>> skinner or else the suns had a chance to get an upside guy and blew it by drafting "son of skinner". It will likely be 4-5 years before the suns get to draft this low again, and the future will tell who the stars of the draft were, players and GM's. I just hope the suns got something good in lopez and that there arent 2-3 guys taken after their pick that are superior players in 2 years.

GRADE B pending developments in the NBA

 

[ReddBird]

I think this is a "B". Suns management is delighted (they're thinking "A"), fans aren't quite as happy -- but most of us voted "B", as well.

If Lopez is as smart, prepared, and eager to be here as the Republic reports, I may be wishing I'd graded a little higher.

 

[mojorizen7]

Suns management is getting paid millions of dollars to make these decisions and should be held to a much higher standard that the wisdom of ASFN posters who are, at best part-timers, in this area.

Nowagimp is currently on the SUNS payroll for the vet min* and his job is to keep the teams reputation and image in this forum polished to a fine shine....and also to remind us that because we are not working for the SUNS in player personel that we don't have a clue as to how to evaluate,speculate,opinionate,or otherwise bash any decisions made by this....or any other organization in terms of "basketball" decisions.
Well THANK YOU pal...i'm glad your here to remind us of these things.
You seem to have some educated(but not professional) insights into all things related to SUNS basketball and i can appreciate your knowledge but please, step off.

*false accusation used for effect

 

[nowagimp]

Nowagimp is currently on the SUNS payroll for the vet min* and his job is to keep the teams reputation and image in this forum polished to a fine shine....and also to remind us that because we are not working for the SUNS in player personel that we don't have a clue as to how to evaluate,speculate,opinionate,or otherwise bash any decisions made by this....or any other organization in terms of "basketball" decisions.
Well THANK YOU pal...i'm glad your here to remind us of these things.
You seem to have some educated(but not professional) insights into all things related to SUNS basketball and i can appreciate your knowledge but please, step off.

*false accusation used for effect

BAHA BAHA!, if you think Im a supporter of the suns management, you havent read many of my posts, have you?

Bash all you want, I've no problem with that. But perhaps I wont be convinced that you know your stuff as well as an NBA scout, let alone a good NBA scout who actually watches these guys in workouts, games etc. After all someone has validated their skills, and they do it for a living. If these guys screw up, I'll bash them all right, they'd derserve it at their pay grade if they screw up. But fans can bash and not get ripped for their failure or lack of insight, ever. Nothing ventured nothing gained dude. If you feel insecure about the post and need to respond, sorry, it wasnt directed at anyone in particular, just stating my views. Bashing is OK, though is gets tiresome when its hysterical and baseless. For that reason I'll skip the shrill posts without objective criticism, no offense.

 

[YouJustGotSUNSD]

I think that's bull and a little insulting. That's the problem with this board, there is so much disrespect toward each other. It's quite sickening. I don't understand how you can claim to be a fan of the team and be so awful to other fans of said team. I admit I'm guilty of that myself, but most of the time it's to defend my opinion and getting attacked.

I chose B simply because the Suns went into the draft with 3 needs and theoretically filled 2 of those 3.

I don't know how anyone can look at this draft as "failing to improve". What do you people expect with picks 15 and 48? They weren't all of a sudden going to have the next Shawn Marion fall into their laps to start at SF. If you thought Brandon Rush was that guy, then you are sadly mistaken.

Everyone loves to pan the pick yet they offer no tangible alternative to it. Arthur, Speights, Greene? Those guys are much bigger projects than Robin Lopez, who will be able to contribute right away. Unfortunately, everybody wants a guy who not only is the best defender in the NBA, but who will also score 20 points a night. That isn't going to happen, even with the #1 pick in the draft.

I can see giving the draft a C, but as far as what was there and available, I don't see how anyone except the people who already have set the Suns up to fail can give them a D or F.

Except for the fact that B leaves no room between portland and phoenix, and I cant fathom how you dont see any teams between those two. I also cant fathom how youre taking into account the attempts the FO made to improve with absolutely nothing coming to fruition, and still give them a B. They tried and failed on multiple accounts, and I cannot see that being above average.

I think many of us are used to the US school grading system where you can do enough to get by and get A's.