Suns to Make a Play for Howard

[BC867]

It was Cotton's philosophy to win at home and play .500 on the road.

Before Cotton, it was John MacLeod's philosophy as Head Coach under JC from 1973-1987.

From '75-'88, his Center was the 212 lb. Center he coached in college, Alvan Adams.

Jerry, John and Alvan were intertwined for thirteen seasons of small-ball. In other words, put on a good show for the home crowd, don't embarrass yourself on the road and make an appearance in the playoffs.

Regarding Cotton, he was the Coach whose KC-Omaha Kings (ironically) had previously bounced the Suns from the playoffs, despite losing his backcourt of Ford and Birdsong to injuries.

Instead of going weak, Cotton started two Centers and three Forwards. He knew that muscle beats finesse, especially in the post-season. It did and the Suns were upset by Cotton.

Unfortunately, when he joined the Suns, he was pretty much bound by Jerry's
win-at-home, etc., philosophy.

 

[Mainstreet]

Before Cotton, it was John MacLeod's philosophy as Head Coach under JC from 1973-1987.

From '75-'88, his Center was the 212 lb. Center he coached in college, Alvan Adams.

Jerry, John and Alvan were intertwined for thirteen seasons of small-ball. In other words, put on a good show for the home crowd, don't embarrass yourself on the road and make an appearance in the playoffs.

Regarding Cotton, he was the Coach whose KC-Omaha Kings (ironically) had previously bounced the Suns from the playoffs, despite losing his backcourt of Ford and Birdsong to injuries.

Instead of going weak, Cotton started two Centers and three Forwards. He knew that muscle beats finesse, especially in the post-season. It did and the Suns were upset by Cotton.

Unfortunately, when he joined the Suns, he was pretty much bound by Jerry's
win-at-home, etc., philosophy.

The philosophy of winning at home and playing .500 on the road will theoretically get a team about 60 wins in a normal NBA season. IMO, it is not a flawed philosophy but offers a guideline to having a highly successful season.

 

[BC867]

The philosophy of winning at home and playing .500 on the road will theoretically get a team about 60 wins in a normal NBA season. IMO, it is not a flawed philosophy but offers a guideline to having a highly successful season.

But what it takes to have a successful season doesn't equate to what it takes to have a successful post-season. As history has proven.

Whereas the Suns have the fourth best winning percentage in NBA history during regular seasons, they are only tenth best in playoff appearances.

Seventeen teams have won championships. The Suns are not one of them.

Winning-at-home-etc. as a guideline to having a highly successful season? Only to a point. Even then, I would drop the word "highly".

And, no, it does not get a team 60 wins in a normal NBA season as you theorized. The Suns have done it only three times in 43 seasons.

The philosophy adds up to . . . pretty good, but never a championship powerhouse.

Once again, put on a good show at home, don't embarrass yourself on the road and make an appearance in the playoffs.

Long term fans consider that a disappointment.

 

[Mainstreet]

But what it takes to have a successful season doesn't equate to what it takes to have a successful post-season. As history has proven.

Whereas the Suns have the fourth best winning percentage in NBA history during regular seasons, they are only tenth best in playoff appearances.

Seventeen teams have won championships. The Suns are not one of them.

Winning-at-home-etc. as a guideline to having a highly successful season? Only to a point. Even then, I would drop the word "highly".

And, no, it does not get a team 60 wins in a normal NBA season as you theorized. The Suns have done it only three times in 43 seasons.

The philosophy adds up to . . . pretty good, but never a championship powerhouse.

Once again, put on a good show at home, don't embarrass yourself on the road and make an appearance in the playoffs.

Long term fans consider that a disappointment.

Do the math. In theory winning the home games and playing .500 on the road will get you near 60 wins. This is a good guideline for most any team. I'm sure you understand the difference between theory and reality. It is a good guideline. It's sort of like the lottery, you can't win a championship if you're not in the playoffs.

Winning a championship takes a special blend of talent, depth, chemistry and coaching to win it. The Suns just have never quite put it together. However, a team like Dallas finally got it right when it finally came together so there is hope for the Suns when the window opens again... someday. However, the Suns need some horses right now. Maybe they can get some help in 2012.

Besides, I gave you your big man in Gortat. What more do you want?

 

[AzStevenCal]

Do the math. In theory winning the home games and playing .500 on the road will get you near 60 wins. This is a good guideline for most any team. I'm sure you understand the difference between theory and reality. It is a good guideline. It's sort of like the lottery, you can't win a championship if you're not in the playoffs.

Winning a championship takes a special blend of talent, depth, chemistry and coaching to win it. The Suns just have never quite put it together. However, a team like Dallas finally got it right when it finally came together so there is hope for the Suns when the window opens again... someday. However, the Suns need some horses right now. Maybe they can get some help in 2012.

Besides, I gave you your big man in Gortat. What more do you want?

It takes all those things but you can never overstate the importance of luck. Whether it's luck with the officiating crew, injuries, matchups etc, it can easily make or break a playoff run.

Steve

 

[Mainstreet]

It takes all those things but you can never overstate the importance of luck. Whether it's luck with the officiating crew, injuries, matchups etc, it can easily make or break a playoff run.

Steve

Exactly. Horry hip-checks Nash into the bench in game 4 of the Western Conference Finals at San Antonio (Suns win, tie series 2-2) and the Suns lose Amare and Diaw for a critical game 5 at home against the Spurs. Poof.

The NBA where _ _it happens!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hs147_VdQXs

 

[mojorizen7]

The philosophy of winning at home and playing .500 on the road will theoretically get a team about 60 wins in a normal NBA season. IMO, it is not a flawed philosophy but offers a guideline to having a highly successful season.

+1
I agree,but it depends on what your other philosophy is in terms of how to approach winning those games.

Anyway,whats Dwight Howard gonna do here with this lousy roster? Get tissue soft and retire on a fat contract probably....
Now,if you want to bring him in,get rid of the current leaders of this team and make it Dwight's team,surround him with "other" good players then yeah....i'd buy into this fantasy.

Whatever it takes to bring the Suns out of 2005 and into current reality i'm all for.

 

[Mainstreet]

+1
I agree,but it depends on what your other philosophy is in terms of how to approach winning those games.

Anyway,whats Dwight Howard gonna do here with this lousy roster? Get tissue soft and retire on a fat contract probably....
Now,if you want to bring him in,get rid of the current leaders of this team and make it Dwight's team,surround him with "other" good players then yeah....i'd buy into this fantasy.

Whatever it takes to bring the Suns out of 2005 and into current reality i'm all for.

The Suns do not need a center as much as in previous seasons with the presence of Gortat, however, Howard is nothing to sneeze at if the Suns could actually land him. Our approaches that the Suns need to rebuild now has pretty much merged with the departure of Stoudemire.

I can't understand the Suns wanting to keep Nash, if he has any value, unless they plan to sign him to a reasonable contract in 2012, thus driving you crazy again. I bet you would love to have Rondo at PG and Howard at center. I wouldn't mind either.

 

[wilycoyote24]

The Suns do not need a center as much as in previous seasons with the presence of Gortat, however, Howard is nothing to sneeze at if the Suns could actually land him. Our approaches that the Suns need to rebuild now has pretty much merged with the departure of Stoudemire.

I can't understand the Suns wanting to keep Nash, if he has any value, unless they plan to sign him to a reasonable contract in 2012, thus driving you crazy again. I bet you would love to have Rondo at PG and Howard at center. I wouldn't mind either.

Howard is nothing to sneeze at? Would you also say that there are worse things than winning an NBA championship?

 

[mojorizen7]

The Suns do not need a center as much as in previous seasons with the presence of Gortat, however, Howard is nothing to sneeze at if the Suns could actually land him. Our approaches that the Suns need to rebuild now has pretty much merged with the departure of Stoudemire.

I can't understand the Suns wanting to keep Nash, if he has any value, unless they plan to sign him to a reasonable contract in 2012, thus driving you crazy again. I bet you would love to have Rondo at PG and Howard at center. I wouldn't mind either.

Lol yes sir i would. I'd also like a guy like Channing Frye(complimenting Howard) and Jared Dudley on that team. There'd be alot of work to do filling out the rest of the roster though...

 

[Cheesebeef]

The Suns do not need a center as much as in previous seasons with the presence of Gortat, however, Howard is nothing to sneeze at if the Suns could actually land him. Our approaches that the Suns need to rebuild now has pretty much merged with the departure of Stoudemire.

I can't understand the Suns wanting to keep Nash, if he has any value, unless they plan to sign him to a reasonable contract in 2012, thus driving you crazy again.

are you saying keeping nash past this year wouldn't drive you crazy? why the hell would we keep running a system that is way past it's prime and is destined to leave us in purgatory hell forever by keeping Nash as our leader?

 

[Mainstreet]

are you saying keeping nash past this year wouldn't drive you crazy? why the hell would we keep running a system that is way past it's prime and is destined to leave us in purgatory hell forever by keeping Nash as our leader?

I guess I don't view Nash as one dimensional. He can run pretty much any system if healthy. Sure he has defensive limitations but there are four other players on the court that need to play defense as well. If the Suns could sign him in 2012 to a reasonable contract there are much worse moves than keeping Nash on the roster. One can never can have enough talent.

The major problem with the Suns is they do lack enough talent to be a contender or even a playoff team. I sure did not think Dallas would be going anywhere with Jason Kidd playing PG (not to draw a comparison because they are different players). However, there is something to be said for adding quality depth and a key player or two. The addition of Tyson Chandler made a huge difference for Dallas defensively. I could see Nash on a contender pushing them over the top much like Kidd. I noticed Lebron during the strike pushing for Crawford or Nash.

 

[BC867]

Besides, I gave you your big man in Gortat. What more do you want?

Thank you, Santa.

why the hell would we keep running a system that is way past it's prime

I guess I don't view Nash as one dimensional. He can run pretty much any system if healthy.

Nash's problem isn't about staying healthy. That is what you would say about a young player.

We are talking about a Point Guard approaching the twilight of his career. His stamina has wound down at crunch time for a few seasons now. It not only affects his health. It affects his ability to do (at an NBA pace) what he knows how to do. The mind is willing, but the body is dragging.

 

[Mainstreet]

Nash's problem isn't about staying healthy. That is what you would say about a young player.

We are talking about a Point Guard approaching the twilight of his career. His stamina has wound down at crunch time for a few seasons now. It not only affects his health. It affects his ability to do (at an NBA pace) what he knows how to do. The mind is willing, but the body is dragging.

A valid point but a suitable backup PG would and will prolong his career.

However, nothing new here. It's been a need for years and the search spans even into China.

 

[Griffin]

A valid point but a suitable backup PG would and will prolong his career.

However, nothing new here. It's been a need for years and the search spans even into China.

And not just a backup PG, but also someone who can create his own shot. The Suns last year asked Nash to virtually create shots on every play when he was on the floor, whether for himself or someone else. That means he has the ball in his hands on offense almost all the time. That takes its toll.

 

[Mainstreet]

And not just a backup PG, but also someone who can create his own shot. The Suns last year asked Nash to virtually create shots on every play when he was on the floor, whether for himself or someone else. That means he has the ball in his hands on offense almost all the time. That takes its toll.

I believe this is why the Suns were imploring Brooks to shoot the ball as was his style of play in Houston.

 

[hsandhu]

Phoenix can only offer Howard and Paul a max deal as it if if they do not sign anyone right now beyond 2012 and amnesty Childress.

The cap will be 58.000.000. The max would be 17.400.000. That means the Suns need 35.000.000 cap room at least just to sign Howard and Paul and minimum players as I believe they would have to renounce the MLE or else it would occupy capspace?


http://www.storytellerscontracts.info/resources/Phoenix.htm

1. As of right now the Suns sit at 29.700.000 for 2012 which is 28.300.000 cap room.

2. Add in a lottery pick at around 3.000.000 unless they **** us over again and trade the pick to get more caproom as they did with Iguodala then you sit at 25.300.000 cap room.

3. Amnesty Childress and you are at 31.800.000 cap room.

4. The Suns would still have to shave 4.000.000 off of their cap to afford 2 max players. (eg Warrick, Dudley, Frye or Gortat)

5. Waiving Warrick would and strechting the remaining 8.000.000 of his contract over the next 5 years would shave just 2.000.000 off of their cap.

I think your numbers are off, hoopshype has suns at 28.6 for next year, you seem to be looking at 2013-2014, or are you including morris rookie contract?

When they amnesty childress, they'll be at 22. The cap was 58 for last year, could be more in 2012. So they have 36 million, plus the rookie contract of morris and and the 2012 pick.

So i think in worst case if the cap stays at 58, and they have morris and the 2012 pick count against them, i think they could easily move those around to make sure their cap space is at least 35 million. Unless they are top 8-10 in draft moving a pick isn't going to be nearly as regrettable as trading the #7 pick in 2004 for nothing. And if they need to they could easily move hakim warrick.

IF managed correctly, big IF for these clowns, they should be able to get enough cap room for 2 max contracts.

 

[Griffin]

Now we have reports that the Lakers would try to acquire both Howard and Paul and are willing to trade everyone except for Kobe.

 

[boisesuns]

Now we have reports that the Lakers would try to acquire both Howard and Paul and are willing to trade everyone except for Kobe.

It will happen somehow, and the NBA will be even more unwatchable.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Now we have reports that the Lakers would try to acquire both Howard and Paul and are willing to trade everyone except for Kobe.

i'll be done with the NBA if this happens. even if we did have a good owner, what's the point if the most talented superstars ONLY want to play in NY, LA or Miami.

I mean... can you imagine Hakeem... or Barkley... or David Robinson... or Clyde Drexler... or Isiah Thomas talking about how there's "only so much you can do in a market like Orlando?" those guys MADE their respective teams in whatever market they were in. And they carried their own squads.

 

[JS22]

I would be REALLY pissed if the Lakers somehow got Paul and Howard. My interest has already dropped dramatically. This would probably turn me off completely.

Wasn't the lockout supposed to reduce the ability to create "super teams?" What's the point, then?

Sarver + player collusion is really testing my interest in the NBA.

 

[JCSunsfan]

I would be REALLY pissed if the Lakers somehow got Paul and Howard. My interest has already dropped dramatically. This would probably turn me off completely.

Wasn't the lockout supposed to reduce the ability to create "super teams?" What's the point, then?

Sarver + player collusion is really testing my interest in the NBA.

I am trying to get interested, but its just not happening. The NBA is really an inferior sports product.

Too bad I love basketball.

I would rather watch the Cardinals.