The NBA is rigged

[JCSunsfan]

People can discuss lopsided officiating and conspiracy without it being fake like WWE

Its not about conspiracies, it is about personal vendettas. It is such an easy thing to solve by the league. In every other realm of society, workers get performance evaluations from those that are being served. Accreditation on all levels receives performance evaluations from students and even parents. In negotiations, both sides agree on an arbitrator. It would be so easy to let both teams agree on ref crews--especially in the playoffs where it is so critical. Not solving this problem is negligence at the league office level.

 

[Rivercard]

People can discuss lopsided officiating and conspiracy without it being fake like WWE

That is true, but the word "rigged" is in the thread title and has been used continually in the responses here, hence the WWE connection.

 

[BigRedRage]

Its not about conspiracies, it is about personal vendettas. It is such an easy thing to solve by the league. In every other realm of society, workers get performance evaluations from those that are being served. Accreditation on all levels receives performance evaluations from students and even parents. In negotiations, both sides agree on an arbitrator. It would be so easy to let both teams agree on ref crews--especially in the playoffs where it is so critical. Not solving this problem is negligence at the league office level.

I was just being broad with those words. My personal issue is with:
Referee Vendettas
Referee gambling (proven and costed the suns specifically)
The NBA potentially looking away from these things to extend playoff serie$$$

 

[SirStefan32]

Scott Foster didn't make the Suns give up rebounds. He didn't make Bridges disappear, he didn't make Booker miss hit shots. He didn't make the Bucks hit their shots. I am sorry, but the Suns beat themselves in game three. Scott Foster had nothing to do with it.

 

[sinsay]

Scott Foster didn't make the Suns give up rebounds. He didn't make Bridges disappear, he didn't make Booker miss hit shots. He didn't make the Bucks hit their shots. I am sorry, but the Suns beat themselves in game three. Scott Foster had nothing to do with it.

I agree but the way a ref calls a game can affect the way players play. The flow of the game can be altered dramatically. The shots they take, the way they play D their aggressiveness or lack thereof. If a player knows a ref will not call a foul on the defending player does the player go to the hole? If a player knows the ref will call a foul on the other player he is more likely to go to the hole. After Jae gets ran over then called for a foul what does that plant in the minds of him and or his teammates. How does those type of plays affect the way Monty coaches a game?

 

[Covert Rain]

Scott Foster didn't make the Suns give up rebounds. He didn't make Bridges disappear, he didn't make Booker miss hit shots. He didn't make the Bucks hit their shots. I am sorry, but the Suns beat themselves in game three. Scott Foster had nothing to do with it.

Agree with you 95%. Scott Foster made some really bad calls against the Suns. B.S. fouls. One of them displayed in the game 3 thread. It's what he does against any team that Paul is on. The Suns beat themselves more than anything though. That's a fact. So, no we didn't lose this game because of him.

You can bank dollars to donuts that if the game was close? All of the sudden Foster calls impact the game. When your 0-12 against a Scott Foster crew? It's no longer coincidence. I don't believe that means the NBA is rigged. I think that just shows what an a-hole Scott Foster is and how incompetent the league is when it comes to using him. I hope we don't see that tool again.

 

[Sunburn]

Any intentional action by the league, direct or indirect, to favor a team, or extend a series, for the purpose of generating money or whatever reason, is ILLEGAL. The whole league gets brought down, the entire competitive history is destroyed, and A LOT of people go to jail.

 

[SirStefan32]

Agree with you 95%. Scott Foster made some really bad calls against the Suns. B.S. fouls. One of them displayed in the game 3 thread. It's what he does against any team that Paul is on. The Suns beat themselves more than anything though. That's a fact. So, no we didn't lose this game because of him.

You can bank dollars to donuts that if the game was close? All of the sudden Foster calls impact the game. When your 0-12 against a Scott Foster crew? It's no longer coincidence. I don't believe that means the NBA is rigged. I think that just shows what an a-hole Scott Foster is and how incompetent the league is when it comes to using him. I hope we don't see that tool again.

That I absolutely agree with. 100%!

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

I agree but the way a ref calls a game can affect the way players play. The flow of the game can be altered dramatically. The shots they take, the way they play D their aggressiveness or lack thereof. If a player knows a ref will not call a foul on the defending player does the player go to the hole? If a player knows the ref will call a foul on the other player he is more likely to go to the hole. After Jae gets ran over then called for a foul what does that plant in the minds of him and or his teammates. How does those type of plays affect the way Monty coaches a game?

This is fair.

and Jae getting a foul pinned on him when he got trucked should not only have been the reverse, but every ref from last nights game owes him a personal apology.

 

[BigRedRage]

Scott Foster didn't make the Suns give up rebounds. He didn't make Bridges disappear, he didn't make Booker miss hit shots. He didn't make the Bucks hit their shots. I am sorry, but the Suns beat themselves in game three. Scott Foster had nothing to do with it.

did he have anything to do with Ayton being in foul trouble the entire game?

Did Ayton being on the bench in foul trouble impact our rebounding?

 

[SirStefan32]

did he have anything to do with Ayton being in foul trouble the entire game?

Did Ayton being on the bench in foul trouble impact our rebounding?

He officiated the game where Ayton was not in foul trouble too, and the Suns won. Blaming the ref for last night's loss is a cop out. Suns played like garbage. That's why they lost.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

He officiated the game where Ayton was not in foul trouble too, and the Suns won. Blaming the ref for last night's loss is a cop out. Suns played like garbage. That's why they lost.

The game we would’ve lost had Jae and Ayton not connected for an almost miraculous play with 0.7 seconds? That game we won where he reffed? Not exactly a sterling example of a foster reffed game going either way. We all but lost that game getting mugged the entire time.

 

[SirStefan32]

The game we would’ve lost had Jae and Ayton not connected for an almost miraculous play with 0.7 seconds? That game we won where he reffed? Not exactly a sterling example of a foster reffed game going either way. We all but lost that game getting mugged the entire time.

Yes, but they still managed to win and not get blown out by 20 points.

 

[sinsay]

He officiated the game where Ayton was not in foul trouble too, and the Suns won. Blaming the ref for last night's loss is a cop out. Suns played like garbage. That's why they lost.

Paul did not play

 

[Covert Rain]

He officiated the game where Ayton was not in foul trouble too, and the Suns won. Blaming the ref for last night's loss is a cop out. Suns played like garbage. That's why they lost.

Bad example. Foster's officiating many people felt led to that close game that we would have lost without a miracle play.

 

[CardNots]

After Jae gets ran over then called for a foul what does that plant in the minds of him and or his teammates. How does those type of plays affect the way Monty coaches a game?

It certainly affected my viewing behavior as after the play mentioned I literally turn off the broadcast and went to bed.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Yes, but they still managed to win and not get blown out by 20 points.

It was also a game Paul didn’t play in. So still 0-12 for games in which Paul played.

I’m not blaming the reffing for getting our doors blown in. We had too many in-house reasons for that. But neither did last nights game do anything to bolster the argument that foster-reffed games are likely losers for Paul teams.

 

[Bufalay]

Yes, but they still managed to win and not get blown out by 20 points.

So you're saying Foster made some good adjustments and bounced back from a poor showing in his previous game?

 

[Hoop Head]

So you're saying Foster made some good adjustments and bounced back from a poor showing in his previous game?

By blaming that loss on the refs you're saying the Suns are incapable of losing to the Eastern Conference Champions in a fair game when the majority of Suns starter played poorly? Ok, that's reasonable.

 

[Bufalay]

By blaming that loss on the refs you're saying the Suns are incapable of losing to the Eastern Conference Champions in a fair game when the majority of Suns starter played poorly? Ok, that's reasonable.

That's not what I was saying. The fact that the outcome isn't exactly the same every time Foster officiates a Suns game doesn't disprove any bias or conspiracy, which seems to be the prevailing argument here. The fact that a "small market" team made the finals only disproves the most simple-minded of all conspiracies.

I think these refs have agendas and biases. I don't know what their preferred outcome is. I don't know their motivations. I know that there are huge inconsistencies from game-to-game. I also know that certain calls can have bigger impacts on games and so these biases or fixes can be accomplished very subtly.

Of course, the burden should be on us conspiracy-minded people to provide evidence of such biases. In the case of Foster and Donaghy, there are clear statistical anomalies. These anomalies could be a fluke, but their worth paying attention to.

 

[Hoop Head]

That's not what I was saying. The fact that the outcome isn't exactly the same every time Foster officiates a Suns game doesn't disprove any bias or conspiracy, which seems to be the prevailing argument here. The fact that a "small market" team made the finals only disproves the most simple-minded of all conspiracies.

I think these refs have agendas and biases. I don't know what their preferred outcome is. I don't know their motivations. I know that there are huge inconsistencies from game-to-game. I also know that certain calls can have bigger impacts on games and so these biases or fixes can be accomplished very subtly.

Of course, the burden should be on us conspiracy-minded people to provide evidence of such biases. In the case of Foster and Donaghy, there are clear statistical anomalies. These anomalies could be a fluke, but their worth paying attention to.

I agree that there are definitely referees with agendas and it sucks but players need to work to overcome it. I saw this boards reaction to Foster being named an official in game 3 and the vast majority acted like the game was lost right then, before a minute was even played. Based on how flat some players looked it wouldn't surprise me to learn that some felt similarly defeated when they learned Foster was officiating. It sucks because it seemed to be a pretty even game through the first half of the 2nd quarter and it didn't appear the game was being called too different from previous outings but the Suns let it slip away on their own. I don't think its worth complaining about Foster because he wasn't making bad calls that cost us the game, we just played poorly.

 

[Bufalay]

I agree that there are definitely referees with agendas and it sucks but players need to work to overcome it. I saw this boards reaction to Foster being named an official in game 3 and the vast majority acted like the game was lost right then, before a minute was even played. Based on how flat some players looked it wouldn't surprise me to learn that some felt similarly defeated when they learned Foster was officiating. It sucks because it seemed to be a pretty even game through the first half of the 2nd quarter and it didn't appear the game was being called too different from previous outings but the Suns let it slip away on their own. I don't think its worth complaining about Foster because he wasn't making bad calls that cost us the game, we just played poorly.

Yes, its bad for players to worry about biased refs and they should overcome it.

I don't know what the problem with fans thinking there is a bias, its not like our state-of-mind influences the outcome.

The Suns didn't play well, but a few calls can have a big influence on a game. The Suns were within 4 points in the 3rd quarter. Ayton was playing like David Robinson, but was glued to the bench because of 2 garbage foul calls. Maybe the Suns would've lost anyway, or maybe not.

 

[Hoop Head]

Yes, its bad for players to worry about biased refs and they should overcome it.

I don't know what the problem with fans thinking there is a bias, its not like our state-of-mind influences the outcome.

The Suns didn't play well, but a few calls can have a big influence on a game. The Suns were within 4 points in the 3rd quarter. Ayton was playing like David Robinson, but was glued to the bench because of 2 garbage foul calls. Maybe the Suns would've lost anyway, or maybe not.

I don't see a problem with fans claiming there is a bias. I took your comment the wrong way and thought you were implying more than you were, for that I apologize. I just think the Suns played awful and it didn't matter who the refs were, with how they played they weren't going to win.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Yes, its bad for players to worry about biased refs and they should overcome it.

I don't know what the problem with fans thinking there is a bias, its not like our state-of-mind influences the outcome.

The Suns didn't play well, but a few calls can have a big influence on a game. The Suns were within 4 points in the 3rd quarter. Ayton was playing like David Robinson, but was glued to the bench because of 2 garbage foul calls. Maybe the Suns would've lost anyway, or maybe not.

I have no issue with people thinking there is referee bias because clearly there is. But this nonsense (and it IS nonsense) that any time we lose it must be due to some vast conspiracy does none of us any good. Officials make bad calls and miss obvious calls, every referee does it every single game - without fail. It doesn't mean the game is rigged.

Some referees take issue with the way certain players play the game and they watch for certain actions which can lead to poor results for the team that person plays on. And that's not even bias, it's decision making influenced by experience. But yes, on top of that, there is real bias in the game. And sometimes it impacts the final outcome. But the vast majority of time, IMO, it's neither agenda based nor consequential.

Years ago I'd just smile when I heard the latest conspiracy theory, I always considered them and the purveyors of such as harmless. The last few years have forced many of us to stare into the inescapable truth that conspiracy theories, all of them, are harmful, sometimes to the extreme.

 

[BigRedRage]

I have no issue with people thinking there is referee bias because clearly there is. But this nonsense (and it IS nonsense) that any time we lose it must be due to some vast conspiracy does none of us any good. Officials make bad calls and miss obvious calls, every referee does it every single game - without fail. It doesn't mean the game is rigged.

Some referees take issue with the way certain players play the game and they watch for certain actions which can lead to poor results for the team that person plays on. And that's not even bias, it's decision making influenced by experience. But yes, on top of that, there is real bias in the game. And sometimes it impacts the final outcome. But the vast majority of time, IMO, it's neither agenda based nor consequential.

Years ago I'd just smile when I heard the latest conspiracy theory, I always considered them and the purveyors of such as harmless. The last few years have forced many of us to stare into the inescapable truth that conspiracy theories, all of them, are harmful, sometimes to the extreme.

I doubt anyone thinks every time we lose is happens to be on the refs. I just do believe that scott foster speficially calls bad games for us and puts us at a disadvantage which impacts the rest of the game as well. Even that is not "we lost because of scott foster" it is scott foster puts us at a competitive disadvantage AND we lost