The Past 25 Years In The NBA - It's Fantastic For 6 Teams

[Gee!]

With the exception of the Heat in 05-06 (that was a Shaq thing), the NBA has consistently crowned the same 6 teams.. And if you take out Jordans retitrement when the Rockets won 2, you get down to the NBA's 5 favorite teams.. Every year, year after year and year.. And is it any surprise that this all started right around the time Stern became comissioner? I can honestly say I am not excited for the NBA in any shape or form.. Then if you read Donaghey's book, he enlightens us even more how things go down behind the scenes.. NBA sucks..


YEAR CHAMPION
2008-09 Los Angeles Lakers
2007-08 Boston Celtics
2006-07 San Antonio Spurs
2005-06 Miami Heat
2004-05 San Antonio Spurs
2003-04 Detroit Pistons
2002-03 San Antonio Spurs
2001-02 Los Angeles Lakers
2000-01 Los Angeles Lakers
1999-00 Los Angeles Lakers
1998-99 San Antonio Spurs
1997-98 Chicago Bulls
1996-97 Chicago Bulls
1995-96 Chicago Bulls
1994-95 Houston Rockets
1993-94 Houston Rockets
1992-93 Chicago Bulls
1991-92 Chicago Bulls
1990-91 Chicago Bulls
1989-90 Detroit Pistons
1988-89 Detroit Pistons
1987-88 Los Angeles Lakers
1986-87 Los Angeles Lakers
1985-86 Boston Celtics
1984-85 Los Angeles Lakers
1983-84 Boston Celtics

 

[82CardsGrad]

Huh? Ya mean Kobe, Dwayne and LeBron aren't enough to make this game great??

The game started its' spiral when Bird and Magic left... Mike was a freak, but he wasn't the all-around team player that Bird and Magic were... and he had no true competition. Bird and Magic had eachother. Mike had.... well, he had Mike. That's was it...

Can't believe how bad the refs were tonight... Wow!

 

[Gee!]

I just went and checked.. And looky what I found.. I know, it's shocking..

On February 1, 1984, Stern became the fourth Commissioner of the NBA, succeeding Larry O'Brien.

 

[Brian in Mesa]

The Lakers won 8 before 1984 and only 7 after.

The Celtics won 14 before 1984 and only 3 since.

That's 22 (before Stern) and 10 (after Stern) for the league's top two franchises.

FAIL

 

[82CardsGrad]

The Lakers won 8 before 1984 and only 7 after.

The Celtics won 14 before 1984 and only 3 since.

That's 22 (before Stern) and 10 (after Stern) for the league's top two franchises.

FAIL

I'm not sold on any Stern conspiracy...just not sure what he or the NBA really gets from consolidating winning and power into the hands of 4-5 teams... However, 10 wins for the Lakers and Celts in 25 years of Stern could cause folks to raise an eyebrow or two...

 

[TJ]

What's funny is that the "Frozen Envelope" theory started only a year after his inception.

You can choose to believe in a conspiracy or not, but it is hard to disagree with the fact that the NBA is the worst officiated professional sport in the world and the Lakers have been benefactors of it. Game 6 2002 WCF 4th quarter. Need I say more?

 

[mojorizen7]

YEAR CHAMPION
2008-09 Los Angeles Lakers-NOT A SOFT,JUMP SHOOTING TEAM
2007-08 Boston Celtics-NOT A SOFT,JUMP SHOOTING TEAM
2006-07 San Antonio Spurs-NOT A SOFT,JUMP SHOOTING TEAM
2005-06 Miami Heat-NOT A SOFT,JUMP SHOOTING TEAM
2004-05 San Antonio Spurs-NOT A SOFT,JUMP SHOOTING TEAM
2003-04 Detroit Pistons-NOT A SOFT,JUMP SHOOTING TEAM
2002-03 San Antonio Spurs-NOT A SOFT,JUMP SHOOTING TEAM
2001-02 Los Angeles Lakers-NOT A SOFT,JUMP SHOOTING TEAM
2000-01 Los Angeles Lakers-NOT A SOFT,JUMP SHOOTING TEAM
1999-00 Los Angeles Lakers-NOT A SOFT,JUMP SHOOTING TEAM
1998-99 San Antonio Spurs-NOT A SOFT,JUMP SHOOTING TEAM
1997-98 Chicago Bulls-JORDAN
1996-97 Chicago Bulls-JORDAN
1995-96 Chicago Bulls-JORDAN
1994-95 Houston Rockets-NOT A SOFT,JUMP SHOOTING TEAM
1993-94 Houston Rockets-NOT A SOFT,JUMP SHOOTING TEAM
1992-93 Chicago Bulls-JORDAN
1991-92 Chicago Bulls-JORDAN
1990-91 Chicago Bulls-JORDAN
1989-90 Detroit Pistons-NOT A SOFT,JUMP SHOOTING TEAM
1988-89 Detroit Pistons-NOT A SOFT,JUMP SHOOTING TEAM
1987-88 Los Angeles Lakers-NOT A SOFT,JUMP SHOOTING TEAM
1986-87 Los Angeles Lakers-NOT A SOFT,JUMP SHOOTING TEAM
1985-86 Boston Celtics-NOT A SOFT,JUMP SHOOTING TEAM
1984-85 Los Angeles Lakers-NOT A SOFT,JUMP SHOOTING TEAM
1983-84 Boston Celtics-NOT A SOFT,JUMP SHOOTING TEAM

 

[82CardsGrad]

What's funny is that the "Frozen Envelope" theory started only a year after his inception.

You can choose to believe in a conspiracy or not, but it is hard to disagree with the fact that the NBA is the worst officiated professional sport in the world and the Lakers have been benefactors of it. Game 6 2002 WCF 4th quarter. Need I say more?

I would never argue just how all-world CRAPPY the officiating is in the NBA. Just horrendous and it actually seems to be getting worse with each passing season. Wow...

 

[Gee!]

The Lakers won 8 before 1984 and only 7 after.

The Celtics won 14 before 1984 and only 3 since.

That's 22 (before Stern) and 10 (after Stern) for the league's top two franchises.

FAIL

The only fail here is that you twisted it in a way so it makes the NBA seem like there isnt any problems.. Heck, if the Suns were one of the teams on that list I would be doing it too.. But here is what I said.. I said since 1984 only 6 teams teams have won the title if you exclude the Heat.. Thats 25 years and only 6 teams winning the trophey year after year.. I did not say, that the lakers and celtics have only won titles under Sterns reign, as you implied..

 

[Brian in Mesa]

I did not say, that the lakers and celtics have only won titles under Sterns reign, as you implied..

First, you can't throw out the year the Heat won it just because it doesn't fit your conspiracy theory.

Second, my point was that the Lakers and Celtics won more than twice as many titles before Stern took over as they have since he took over.

 

[Milgod]

It's not like those teams have constantly been at the top for the whole time you mention. Detroit have had some pretty sucky teams inbetween their championships. The Lakers were pretty poor for a few years in the 90s. Boston were garbage for YEARS as well.

Why do we have to exclude the Heat? Just to make your argument sound better?

 

[Milgod]

What's funny is that the "Frozen Envelope" theory started only a year after his inception.

You can choose to believe in a conspiracy or not, but it is hard to disagree with the fact that the NBA is the worst officiated professional sport in the world and the Lakers have been benefactors of it. Game 6 2002 WCF 4th quarter. Need I say more?

Quite a bold statement. You clearly don't watch much football (Soccer).

 

[Gee!]

First, you can't throw out the year the Heat won it just because it doesn't fit your conspiracy theory.

Second, my point was that the Lakers and Celtics won more than twice as many titles before Stern took over as they have since he took over.

It's not like those teams have constantly been at the top for the whole time you mention. Detroit have had some pretty sucky teams inbetween their championships. The Lakers were pretty poor for a few years in the 90s. Boston were garbage for YEARS as well.

Why do we have to exclude the Heat? Just to make your argument sound better?

Im not excluding it to make it fit.. In fact I believe the Heat are a part of the theory, just for a different reason.. They are a part of it because they wanted Shaq to win.. If you rememer back to that magically Heat run, there were some very questionable calls in the Heats favor.. I did exclude them though because they only won one over that span..

 

[elindholm]

Second, my point was that the Lakers and Celtics won more than twice as many titles before Stern took over as they have since he took over.

The pre-Stern era was longer than the Stern era, and there were fewer teams, so this is a pretty laughable counter. There are plenty of legitimate ways to deflate conspiracy theories; stick to those.

 

[HooverDam]

What a moronic thread. Those teams have won a lot of titles because they've had the best players, not some vast conspiracy. Why would the NBA conspire to have the San Antonio Spurs, one of the least sexy, least fun to watch, smallest market teams win titles? If you think past the end of your nose you can see through this sort of drunken logic.

In basketball more than other sports because there are fewer players on the playing surface, one player can have a larger impact. If you get a high draft pick and end up with Magic, Bird, Jordan, Hakeem, etc you're going to win titles. Sadly the Suns have never had the #1 pick and when they have had top 10 picks here's what they've done with them:

• 1969 #2 Neal Walk
• 1970 #10 Greg Howard (Calvin Murphy & Nate Archibald were taken in Rd 2)
• 1972 #4 Corky Calhoun. They took a guy named Corky. Paul Westphal & Dr J were available
• 1973 #8 Mike Bantum
• 1974 #4 John Shumate. 2 Future All Stars were selected directly after him and 10 All Stars total were taken after him
• 1975 #5 Alvan Adams- hey a good pick!
• 1976 #10 Ron Lee. Alex English and Dennis Johnson were taken later
• 1977 #5 Walter Davis- another good pick
• 1985 #10 Ed Pinckney. Karl Malone was on the board (and Stockton was on the board the year prior when they drafted) as was Joe Dumars, AC Green and Terry Porter- whoops!
• 1986 #6 William Bedford. Mark Price, Dennis Rodman, Nate McMillan, Arvydas Sabonis, Jeff Hornacek (who the Suns got in Round 2), Del Curry and Drazen Petrovic were all on the board
• 1987 #2 Armen Gilliam. Scottie Pippen, KJ, Horace Grant, Reggie Miller, Marc Jackson & Reggie Lewis were all available.
• 1988 #7 Tim Perry. Rex Chapman and Ronny Seikaly were selected directly after him.
• 1999 #9 Shawn Marion- Hey a good pick
• 2002 #9 Amare Stoudemire- another good pick at 9
• 2004 #7 Loul Deng- good pick, but they sold it. Andre Iguodala, Al Jefferson, Josh Smith, Jameer Nelson, Kevin Martin and Trevor Ariza were also on the board

You'll notice, when the Suns drafted well as you'd expect they had some up years after that. With Adams and Davis on the squad, they stopped picking so high for a few years, what a shock.

So how about instead of idiotically claiming 'conspiracy!' we just look at reality and say 1. the Suns have never been luck enough to get a #1 pick 2. The top 10 picks the Suns have had, they've usually done poorly with.

The teams on your list that have won titles have almost all had high picks they hit out of the park:

• 80s Celtics: Bird, 1978 Pick #6
• 80s Lakers: Magic, 1979 Pick #1
• 80s Pistons: Isiah, 1981 Pick #2
• 90s Bulls: Jordan, 1984 pick #3
• 90s Rockets: Hakeem, 1984 pick #1
• 90s Spurs: David Robinson, 1987, pick #1
• 00s Lakers: Kobe, pick #13 received in a trade, Shaq #1 pick in 92, received in a trade
• 00s Pistons: the anomaly team that likely would've lost if the Lakers had their poop in a group
• 00s Heat: Wade, #5 2003
• 00s Celtics: Pierce, 1998 #10, plus KG 1995 #5 acquired in a trade, Allen 1996 #5 acquired in a trade

So outside of that one Pistons team everyone either drafted a superstar themselves or was lucky/shrewd enough to trade for one.

If the NBA was conspiring to make certain teams good the Knicks would've received a lot more than 1 frozen envelope to help put more talent around Ewing.

 

[elindholm]

So outside of that one Pistons team everyone either drafted a superstar themselves or was lucky/shrewd enough to trade for one.

Well, it's not quite that simple. Star players have a lot of power in determining where they play. Abdul-Jabbar forced his way out of Milwaukee, O'Neal bailed on the Magic, Garnett made it easier for the Celtics to acquire him by agreeing to a below-market extension -- the list goes on and on. Except for Jordan, none of those top picks could have won titles without a major supporting cast, usually with another top-10 player. Stars gravitate toward each other because they know they'll have a better chance of winning; teams with winning reputations usually get the benefit of the officiating; and once you put enough stars together, the team will in fact be pretty good, especially with a little nudge from the referees. It's all self-perpetuating.

The league doesn't conspire to make certain teams good, but the system in place clearly reinforces the class divide between the "haves" and the "have nots."

 

[Gee!]

What a moronic thread.

Do you really expect anyone to take you serious or give you a decent answer when you start you post with sentences like this?

 

[TucsonDevil]

If you want to focus on the real conspiracy - it's not in the fact that only a few teams have won, but the question "why does it require a 'Superstar' to win?"

This is directly related to officiating. Not in individual games, but as a collection. Rookies are never given breaks, and All-Stars receive preferential treatment (Dennis Rodman was a clear exception to the rule... try and guess why). This is why the NBA will never overtake the NFL... never. In the 80s, the sport leadership (Stern and others) realized the marketability of star players and the growth of the bottom line for those players. Thus, the longer they stay on the court, the greater likelihood that ratings will increase.

This is the great travesty of the NBA. I think Stern and others are trying to change this culture (see Kobe's suspension last season for flailing his arms in an attempt to get Manu called for a foul). However, they are so far behind, it is like trying to turn away the tide.

 

[devilalum]

If you want to create a good conspiracy theory you need to compare the NBA to the NFL and MLB over the same stretch.

 

[devilalum]

Having 2 or 3 "star" players is much more of an advantage in the playoffs. They have an extended time out every 5 minutes allowing the "stars" to play more high quality minutes than during the regular season.

 

[HooverDam]

Well, it's not quite that simple. Star players have a lot of power in determining where they play. Abdul-Jabbar forced his way out of Milwaukee, O'Neal bailed on the Magic, Garnett made it easier for the Celtics to acquire him by agreeing to a below-market extension -- the list goes on and on. Except for Jordan, none of those top picks could have won titles without a major supporting cast, usually with another top-10 player. Stars gravitate toward each other because they know they'll have a better chance of winning; teams with winning reputations usually get the benefit of the officiating; and once you put enough stars together, the team will in fact be pretty good, especially with a little nudge from the referees. It's all self-perpetuating.

The league doesn't conspire to make certain teams good, but the system in place clearly reinforces the class divide between the "haves" and the "have nots."

I don't disagree with any of that, nor does anything I posted contradict that. You're right, when you're a big market its obviously easier for you to attract stars, its why no one would be talking about LeBron maybe going to the Bucks even if they did have the most cap space next year.

Detroit isn't a particularly big market, its only 1 spot ahead of Phoenix as far as current Metropolitan Statistical Area population but they were lucky enough to get Isiah.

The Suns really high picks that they did right have all been multi time All Star type guys, Marion, Amare, Davis, Adams, but not other worldly all timers.

Do you really expect anyone to take you serious or give you a decent answer when you start you post with sentences like this?

I dont care if you take me seriously or not, Ive told you repeatedly you're one of the least intelligent people I've ever come across in my life, not just on sports message boards. If you're going to base your opinion on a well thought out post with a lot of information in it based on one sentence you're only further proving what a block head you are.

 

[Gee!]

I dont care if you take me seriously or not, Ive told you repeatedly you're one of the least intelligent people I've ever come across in my life, not just on sports message boards. If you're going to base your opinion on a well thought out post with a lot of information in it based on one sentence you're only further proving what a block head you are.

I didnt read your "well thought out post" because it started off with a ridiculous first sentence. Took you one sentence for me to ignore your post. If youd like to be taken serious and have your "well thought out posts", you shouldnt start them off the way you do. It isnt just this time. You make a career out this type of posting. But its your world, and your weird fight you are fighting.. So... As you were solider..

 

[Billy Bob]

I grew up with the suns and have been a die hard fan my whole life...... i quit nba basketball this year because I knew it would be the Kobe/Lebron show in the end. I can no longer put up with the predetermined crap. I haven't watched one game and I don't miss a thing. still watch college hoops..............

 

[Gee!]

I grew up with the suns and have been a die hard fan my whole life...... i quit nba basketball this year because I knew it would be the Kobe/Lebron show in the end. I can no longer put up with the predetermined crap. I haven't watched one game and I don't miss a thing. still watch college hoops..............

Im with you on all things you said.. Still watch college bball.. Last nites was the 1st game I watched all season because I finally felt excited about a game.. And what happened? Same ole ****.. Only thing I dont agree with what you said is I am am avid LeBron fan.. He is nice.. And I hope he wins it all this year because he never has.. But its already predetermined as you said and others have pointed out.. The NBA cant have LeBron never winning a Championship.. They would lose money.. They will not have a Dan Marino on their hands..

 

[Billy Bob]

Im with you on all things you said.. Still watch college bball.. Last nites was the 1st game I watched all season because I finally felt excited about a game.. And what happened? Same ole ****.. Only thing I dont agree with what you said is I am am avid LeBron fan.. He is nice.. And I hope he wins it all this year because he never has.. But its already predetermined as you said and others have pointed out.. The NBA cant have LeBron never winning a Championship.. They would lose money.. They will not have a Dan Marino on their hands..

what i mean to say is, it will be Kobe and Lebron in the end and the powers that be in the nba will see it that way. Just like Jordon was allowed to travel and palm, Kobe and Lebron and their teams will get the break calls all the way to the finals.