The Result Doesn’t Count and Other Fairy Tales

[Harry]

Nothing to say about the great streveler?

He was better than KC’s 3rd string defense. Somehow that doesn’t seem like much of an endorsement. I’m

 

[Harry]

The starters need to play the first half or until they show they are in sync. It’s one thing if the starters come out if they are playing well but the way they played against KC they should have not come off the field until they deserved it. I believe in tough coaching not babying players.

It seems clear to me that K1 & K2 do not understand the difference between intersquad practices and playing a different opponent. If the offense looks flat to start game 1 & KK survives until next year, the decision to player regular offensive players in preseason should be taken away from Kingsbury!

 

[Harry]

I have made my opinion known that after years of watching pro ball the preseason does not give much of a indication of what a team looks like, but holy freaking WT^ when your starting offense cannot get just one freaking first down. Think about that. Well, I did and I am sure you did. Look, I do not think this spread offense to a college extreme is going to work. There is just not enough space and pro athletes even when fooled can still make the distance up on defense to stifle that. Kliff needs to ask himself if he's about winning on the pro level or being the patron saint of a spread college offense that actually worked in the NFL. Drop the freaking obsession Kliff, when you implemented more runs and got out of the damn WR galore package, this offense was moving on the ground without Kyler having to offer his body to sacrificial hits. Dump this college crap as a full definition of your approach and just pepper your offense with that because it does not work and Kyler needs to suck it up and start taking some snaps under center because we really do have enough talent to make the playoffs even in the NFC West

No passing game works when the receiver & QB are envisioning different routes.

 

[kerouac9]

It seems clear to me that K1 & K2 do not understand the difference between intersquad practices and playing a different opponent. If the offense looks flat to start game 1 & KK survives until next year, the decision to player regular offensive players in preseason should be taken away from Kingsbury!

How would he know? To my knowledge Kingsbury hasn’t had the opportunity to run any inter squad training practices. I imagine part of the reason is because he doesnt have any NFL coaching connections really.

Id also guess that Michael isn’t willing to spend the money to pick the team up and move them elsewhere for a week. Did we have inter squad practices under Arians when we stayed at that hotel in West Virginny(?)?

 

[Harry]

This could be an example of good communication misinterpreted, but people are constantly talking to Isaiah Simmons pre-snap and making sure he’s in position. People across the defense were gesturing to him on that out route he cut short on third and long.
I’m certain he has A LOT to do in this defense; just hope he creates a mental structure to carry it all faster. He came from inside the box and closed out a Mecole Hardman out route to force fourth down.

This is a good observation. It would bother me more if he’d had a normal year last season. I think his confidence is intact. Hopefully by mid-year he’ll have the vast majority of the defense down. I did think he had a decent game against both the run and the pass.

 

[DVontel]

How would he know? To my knowledge Kingsbury hasn’t had the opportunity to run any inter squad training practices. I imagine part of the reason is because he doesnt have any NFL coaching connections really.

Id also guess that Michael isn’t willing to spend the money to pick the team up and move them elsewhere for a week. Did we have inter squad practices under Arians when we stayed at that hotel in West Virginny(?)?

I’m pretty sure we did with the Chargers back in ‘16.

 

[Harry]

How would he know? To my knowledge Kingsbury hasn’t had the opportunity to run any inter squad training practices. I imagine part of the reason is because he doesnt have any NFL coaching connections really.

Id also guess that Michael isn’t willing to spend the money to pick the team up and move them elsewhere for a week. Did we have inter squad practices under Arians when we stayed at that hotel in West Virginny(?)?

I had “intrasquad“ but my spell checker didn’t like it. I was referring to practicing against the Cards’ defense. Typically by now those sessions have advanced to playing extended game situations, like 2 minute drills. I agree informal practice games against other teams would help, though I don’t see Murray liking those either.

 

[kerouac9]

I had “intrasquad“ but my spell checker didn’t like it. I was referring to practicing against the Cards’ defense. Typically by now those sessions have advanced to playing extended game situations, like 2 minute drills. I agree informal practice games against other teams would help, though I don’t see Murray liking those either.

If Murray is the competitor many people on the board assert he is, I imagine he'd really enjoy the opportunity to compete against other squads and not beat up what could be the worst corner group in the NFL.

 

[SoonerLou]

I had “intrasquad“ but my spell checker didn’t like it. I was referring to practicing against the Cards’ defense. Typically by now those sessions have advanced to playing extended game situations, like 2 minute drills. I agree informal practice games against other teams would help, though I don’t see Murray liking those either.

If Murray is the competitor many people on the board assert he is, I imagine he'd really enjoy the opportunity to compete against other squads and not beat up what could be the worst corner group in the NFL.

Why would he not like those? If the preseason game was any indication he just doesnt want those extra hits. Especially with now 17 games.

I think we have to be honest about Kyler thats both positive, but realistic. He's going to be like an Allen Iverson or Zeke Thomas in basketball. He wont be physical capable of playing into his mid 30s. At least really well. Or a better comparison is he's like a RB. You dont see them in their 30s much. There is a reason Cam, Vick, McNabb, etc all looked physically shot. The exception being Russell Wilson. Thats ok because I think the next 5 to 6 years can be REALLY good.

He's only got so many hits/carries in his career. So we probably should maximize it. The same way the Ravens seem to have no intention of letting Lamar take any preseason snaps. Even the Bills didnt let Allen.

Now is about maximizing those years till he's about 29 or 30. We can hope he's the Russell Wilson exception, but thats just hope right now.

 

[Harry]

G*

Why would he not like those? If the preseason game was any indication he just doesnt want those extra hits. Especially with now 17 games.

I think we have to be honest about Kyler thats both positive, but realistic. He's going to be like an Allen Iverson or Zeke Thomas in basketball. He wont be physical capable of playing into his mid 30s. At least really well. Or a better comparison is he's like a RB. You dont see them in their 30s much. There is a reason Cam, Vick, McNabb, etc all looked physically shot. The exception being Russell Wilson. Thats ok because I think the next 5 to 6 years can be REALLY good.

He's only got so many hits/carries in his career. So we probably should maximize it. The same way the Ravens seem to have no intention of letting Lamar take any preseason snaps. Even the Bills didnt let Allen.

Now is about maximizing those years till he's about 29 or 30. We can hope he's the Russell Wilson exception, but thats just hope right now.

interesting perspective.

 

[PACardsFan]

Why would he not like those? If the preseason game was any indication he just doesnt want those extra hits. Especially with now 17 games.

I think we have to be honest about Kyler thats both positive, but realistic. He's going to be like an Allen Iverson or Zeke Thomas in basketball. He wont be physical capable of playing into his mid 30s. At least really well. Or a better comparison is he's like a RB. You dont see them in their 30s much. There is a reason Cam, Vick, McNabb, etc all looked physically shot. The exception being Russell Wilson. Thats ok because I think the next 5 to 6 years can be REALLY good.

He's only got so many hits/carries in his career. So we probably should maximize it. The same way the Ravens seem to have no intention of letting Lamar take any preseason snaps. Even the Bills didnt let Allen.

Now is about maximizing those years till he's about 29 or 30. We can hope he's the Russell Wilson exception, but thats just hope right now.

I see Murray having a long career, if that’s what he chooses to do. He’s nothing like Cam, Vick, or McNabb. Those guys exposed themselves to big hits. And enjoyed big hits. There has never been a QB in NFL history that slides better than Murray. With his size, he has to be very good at that. And he is. Does Murray want to play well into his 30’s? No idea. He does want to win. So, if the Cardinals don’t share that will to win, he WILL move on. I do see him reaching the pinnacle. Just not sure it’ll be as a Cardinal. Sad, but true. And when he’s gone, we’ll continue to be a Bidwill owned team that LOSES.

 

[THESMEL]

I guess I’m the only one left that thinks 4 preseason games are important, And that starters must participate for the better of the team and the season. i remember NFL as a child in the 60s with a shorter season. Each game was even more important than each game in a contemporary season,(but are they?) the teams first game meant as much as the last game, we are waiting for modern teams to improve the first 1/4 of each season - when they got better as a TEAM in the preseason. People get hurt in training, cops, soldiers, nurses,even American gladiator - they are paid for training ! Paid a lot!

 

[Phrazbit]

Preseason is absolute, worthless, trash.

If I was a coach I wouldn't let anyone with a guaranteed roster spot put on a uniform. The football is not a sport that conforms itself to exhibitions. The preseason serves 2 purposes; season ending injuries before the season even starts and to line the pockets of the owners by forcing season ticket buyers to pony up money for this horse crap.

 

[Phrazbit]

The owners won't give up the money so what they should do is expand the season to 18 games with 0 preseason.

 

[Red on White]

I've found it a strange experience following the preseason games.

Seems to be an attitude of it'll be alright on the night. Or at least trying to project that facade.

Outside of the question Who's going to make up the bottom end of the 53 (which by itself has some value) I don't see us getting anything out of the exercise. Any gain made by practising under game conditions is seen as less valuable than the risk of injury to a starter which renders the whole exercise obsolete as far as projecting how the team will fare this season.

Having said that, it feels like some players see D Hop coast through preseason (and training in general) but turn it on when it counts. This swagger looks cool and he has built up the credits to go that way, plus has years on the clock so has earned the right.

Younger players can get seduced by this cool image and act the same, not understanding the hard work and years of game performances that have gone into reaching that status.

 

[iLLmatiC]

The sooner this coaching staff is out of here the better. Kliff talking about how he isn't concerned about Kyler's reps during preseason produced a huge eye roll from me.

 

[Phrazbit]

The sooner this coaching staff is out of here the better. Kliff talking about how he isn't concerned about Kyler's reps during preseason produced a huge eye roll from me.

Like half the starting QBs in the league are sitting out the entire preseason.

Preseason for established players is 100% risk, 0% reward. I'd prefer a coach who didn't let Kyler put on pads during these garbage games.

 

[Krangodnzr]

Like half the starting QBs in the league are sitting out the entire preseason.

Preseason for established players is 100% risk, 0% reward. I'd prefer a coach who didn't let Kyler put on pads during these garbage games.

This board collectively is bashing Kingsbury and Murray over preseason, but fawn over McVay all of the time....and McVay said Stafford will never play a preseason game...

 

[BritCard]

I don't blame him for the Conner play if Conner goes forward and gets the tough yards that's a first down. He tried to get cute and didn't get anything.

But taking a loss when you can just Russell Wilson the ball forward out of bounds and lose nothing bugs me. It's preseason like the pick that Mahomes threw that he probably doesn't throw in a real game, but kyler has done that same move in multiple real games, he has to learn on that. 2 yards is huge in the NFL.

I'm not sure I can blame Connor for not fighting through multiple tackles in preseason. That's when the needle on the "Chance to get injured-o-meter" suddenly leaps into the red.

I'd imagine they are told not to make plays that increase injury risk in preseason.

 

[BritCard]

Never seen him blame others.

for not liking to run he sure piled up a ton of yards running last year.

and my god the video game silliness again?

and btw, Murray may not be a HOF at this point but he is a ROY and pro bowler and has carried this team to their victories for two years now.

I don't want to get into the point about how good Kyler is or isn't, but I've seen ROY and Pro Bowl honours used a few times recently as some kind of measurement of how good he is.

He won OROY by default. All other QB's sucked and the guy who likely would have won it (Josh Jacobs) got injured and missed a few games. And many still thought he should have won it.

The Pro Bowl is meaningless. Mitch Trubiski made the pro bowl. Nick Fowles made it in 2013. Derek Anderson. Vince Young made the pro bowl twice. The pro bowl is not, and never will be a barometer for talent. It's a barometer of hype / name recognition for lazy fans.

 

[Phrazbit]

I don't want to get into the point about how good Kyler is or isn;t, but I've seen ROY and Pro Bowl honours used a few times recently as some kind of measurement of how good he is.

He won OROY by default. All other QB's sucked and the guy who likely would have won it (Josh Jacobs) got injured and missed a few games. And many still thought he should have won it.

The Pro Bowl is meaningless. Mitch Trubiski made the pro bowl. Nick Fowles made it in 2013. Derek Anderson. Vince Young made the pro bowl twice. The pro bowl is not, and never will be a barometer for talent. It's a barometer of hype / name recognition for lazy fans.

I think that Kyler Murray as a rising superstar is a legit question.

But what people seem to be griping about right now is his lack of focus and lack of snaps in preseason football.

Is Murray too cautious? Is he injury prone? Does he have the personality to lead? Those are real questions.

Does is matter in the slightest if your obvious starting QB slays the preseason? That is NOT a question. That is as silly as thinking it wise to play an established starter in a situation where the only REALLY impactful outcome that can happen for your team is an injury.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

This board collectively is bashing Kingsbury and Murray over preseason, but fawn over McVay all of the time....and McVay said Stafford will never play a preseason game...

You’re ignoring an elephant in the room. Stafford’s experience verses kylers. And mind you, I’m okay with kyler playing limited preseason minutes.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

I don't want to get into the point about how good Kyler is or isn't, but I've seen ROY and Pro Bowl honours used a few times recently as some kind of measurement of how good he is.

He won OROY by default. All other QB's sucked and the guy who likely would have won it (Josh Jacobs) got injured and missed a few games. And many still thought he should have won it.

The Pro Bowl is meaningless. Mitch Trubiski made the pro bowl. Nick Fowles made it in 2013. Derek Anderson. Vince Young made the pro bowl twice. The pro bowl is not, and never will be a barometer for talent. It's a barometer of hype / name recognition for lazy fans.

Naw that’s a lazy perspective. The pro bowl is barometer of play that season (taking into account players who opt out or are injured). It may not be talent, but I’m guessing outside of outliers that you want to raise the talent level on average of pro bowlers tends to be higher than nonpro bowlers.

 

[BritCard]

Naw that’s a lazy perspective. The pro bowl is barometer of play that season (taking into account players who opt out or are injured). It may not be talent, but I’m guessing outside of outliers that you want to raise the talent level on average of pro bowlers tends to be higher than nonpro bowlers.

P2 made it in automatically even when he sucked. Every year there are guys who played much better who gets missed for a guy with a more well known name or who plays for a bigger franchise.

QBs especially seem to be dominated by guys with lots of splash plays and runners get an advantage too.

Its pretty crazy Tom Brady didn't make it last year for example. Dude won a SB with a new franchise and got beat out by a guy who had 6-7 good games.

 

[Hoodhero]

P2 made it in automatically even when he sucked. Every year there are guys who played much better who gets missed for a guy with a more well known name or who plays for a bigger franchise.

QBs especially seem to be dominated by guys with lots of splash plays and runners get an advantage too.

Its pretty crazy Tom Brady didn't make it last year for example. Dude won a SB with a new franchise and got beat out by a guy who had 6-7 good games.

Brady & K1 passing stats where not that far apart when Pro Bowl got announced. Of course the rushing stats pushed K1 ahead. Ppl forget that Brady was up & down until he turned it on towards end of season