The right thing to do.

[Chris_Sanders]

How is it an odd example? A mobile QB versus a pocket QB and comparing sacks between the two with very little change of OL personnel.

Anyone that thinks mobile QB automatically equals less sacks isn’t paying attention to league history.

Because his 7% improvisational scramble rate isn't abnormal

 

[Zeno]

So again I would point to the fact that Murray isn't a Tebow or Jackson. He is hyper accurate within the QB and most of his runs are designed.

I get the midget commentary. Yes he is short.

He is a pocket QB who can scramble, not a pure RPO QB

His pocket was not a traditional pocket it was mostly from the shotgun with an additional 3 step drop. He wasn’t stepping in to a normal pocket...he was between the tackles so it is technically a pocket but not in any traditional sense.

 

[Chris_Sanders]

RPO QBs in the current NFL will be successful based on the rules for hitting a QB right now.

That is why Lamar Jackson in the right situation can get you to round 2 of the playoffs

They won't get you beyond that though and the risk of injury far outweighs the reward

 

[Chris_Sanders]

His pocket was not a traditional pocket it was mostly from the shotgun with an additional 3 step drop. He wasn’t stepping in to a normal pocket...he was between the tackles so it is technically a pocket but not in any traditional sense.

Yes that is the modern NFL

 

[Chris_Sanders]

Again this is the Ayton/ Doncic debate .

 

[Zeno]

Yes that is the modern NFL

Aside from KC where is that the norm? The 2 teams in the Super Bowl played from under center a higher % NE 45% and LA 62%...the NFL average is 40% or so from under center. Nobody runs exclusively from shotgun, KC led the league at 80%

 

[Zeno]

Again this is the Ayton/ Doncic debate .

I have no idea what that is.

 

[CardsFan88]

I have no idea what that is.

NBA Suns picked first last year. Those were the boards favorites. We took the center Ayton who looks good, but the point guard Doncic is great and having a bigger impact so far.

Not a good year for AZ Sports

 

[Zeno]

NBA Suns picked first last year. Those were the boards favorites. We took the center Ayton who looks good, but the point guard Doncic is great and having a bigger impact so far.

Not a good year for AZ Sports

Ah, since I could honestly not care any less for basketball the reference was lost on me.

 

[Chris_Sanders]

Ayton represented the traditional NBA basketball in every sense. Get a guy that meets the measurements

Doncic was the new NBA. No position. Bad measurables, but can impact the game on many levels

This board is older and just beat the Ayton drum to the point that even suggesting that the game was evolving based on current rules or analytics was shouted down

So ultimately you couldn't even suggest that both will be good.

And that is where we are now

 

[New Mexico]

It’s funny cause you expect Keim to actually hit on those picks.

Exactly.

 

[Proximo]

Look, if they can get quinton Williams at 4, and they probably can, because it will go Murray, Bosa, Haskins, it would be fine - if josh turns it around.

I really think it is going to come down to what the raiders are willing to offer.

 

[Chris_Sanders]

Well as I have said before I really want Williams 1st and Murray 2nd

 

[Proximo]

Well as I have said before I really want Williams 1st and Murray 2nd

Not me. I want Murray because I have lost faith in Rosen.

But, if the raiders give us a bunch of picks I will get over it probably.

 

[CardsFan88]

Ayton was the type of quality big man/center that we've always wanted, and he went to high school in Phoenix and UofA in his one year at college. He was also seen as the safe, quality blue chip #1. He is. But Doncic is starring in the Mavericks turnaround. The Suns are in the running to be in a three way tie for the best odds in the draft lottery to get the #1 pick again.

Even crazier, Doncic had once played for our new head coach Koskov. Meanwhile KK recruited Murray out of HS and Murray ended up at Oklahoma which presumably is similar in many of the base concepts to a KK offense.

Rosen is the classic near prototypical size pocket QB. Can read a defense, check plays and command a huddle. A true QBOTF prospect we've waited ages for.

Murray is what NFL GM's want QB's to be (sans height). A pocket passer who can scramble like a god and make accurate passes on the run. At least in college. A guy like Wilson and Mahomes. In 10 years, there might be half a dozen or more like it. That's what the Cardinals might be vying for to win the division, make the playoffs, and win a ring. The game may or may not change into that, but many of the young guys are athletic and the presumed future QB's of Tua and Lawrence are also. Plus mobility might become the average.

I wanted Ayton overall. But I also saw some tantalizing talent and the potential value of Doncic at the position we were most lacking, pg. Part of me hoped the Suns would select him. Either way I was fine with it.

I can see that same potential in Murray that Doncic possesses. If Murray hits, he hits big and is one of those guys that can possibly give a team an edge for the next 10-15 years. He could also bust.

 

[Chris_Sanders]

Not me. I want Murray because I have lost faith in Rosen.

But, if the raiders give us a bunch of picks I will get over it probably.

All of this is valid

 

[Cardsfaninlouky]

murray , Rosen , blah blah blah. The right thing to do is trade down and here’s why. A great draft will assure a bright future. You could drive yourself crazy on who we could draft if we got the boatload of picks that the first pick should get us. Imagine 4,25,33,36, and 65? Imagine the holes we could fill with rookie contracts for the next 5 years at o-line, edge rusher, d-line, wr, cb? Imagine the salary cap implications assuming we draft the right guys in those spots. Look at the top 65 college prospects and think of the possibilities. That being said it takes two to tango and you don’t trade the top pick for at least 3 top picks , maybe 4. Murray MAY turn out to be great but would any player be great enough to outweigh 5 players? But before you weigh in on this post I’m going on record to say we will not do this. I think we take Murray and trade Rosen. Bottom line is Murray will pack the house and put the Cardinals in the spotlight ALL YEAR LONG. And that is the bottom line.

I totally agree. They will probably draft Murray & trade Rosen. I watched the cardinals flight plan last night, it showed Murray in the hotel room during his interview in Indianapolis, KK & Murray were watching video of football games. Keim & Bidwill had their eyes glued to the TV while KK & Murray were hand jestering at the tv. How well all that impressed SK & MB i have no idea but I would've liked to have been a fly on the wall that night lol. I want them to keep Rosen personally but who knows at this point? If they draft Murray, they will get no other picks in the 1st round, if they trade the pick, they can build the team with two extra 1st round picks & possibly at the very least an extra 2nd round pick. Having a slew of picks in the later rounds is great & all but the best players are usually taken in the first 3 rounds. Doesn't mean they can't find value in the later rounds though. Trading Rosen.....................it depends on what the compensation would be? A lot of posters on here want bosa, hell of a player yes but I feel like you do, trade down & gain extra picks in the first 2 rounds. One player isn't gonna make this team considering all the team needs.

 

[Cardinal]

Yes, trade down and select Ed Oliver please.

 

[BigRedRage]

Is that the year the Broncos got to the second round of the playoffs?

I am legit asking before I look it up

He's not your Google [emoji6]

Sent from my LG-LS993 using Tapatalk

 

[Cardsfaninlouky]

I agree that a certain type of QB can make even a below average OL look much better. And he can make an average OL look great. Slanidrac asked a very good question. Is a great Murray great enough to outweigh 5 players? If, in fact, Murray turns out to be great, then I would say yes. I think that Murray can be great behind an average O-Line, whereas for Rosen to be great (and I believe he can be), he needs a much more stout O-Line than Murray does. Considering that we can count our great O-Linemen in franchise history on 1 hand, what's the likelihood we can build the type of O-Line that Rosen needs.

If KK thinks we can build that O-Line & teach Rosen to get the ball out faster, then he may very well keep Rosen. With the right team, right system, I think Josh can be very good. For that reason, I think we can get a 1st rounder if we trade him. As much as I prayed daily for that 1st pick, I now hate the fact that we're in this Rosen/Murray predicament.

Great post, our opinions matter notta to SK & MB, they're gonna take whoever they think fits the team best. I wanna keep Rosen, he made some bad throws but also made enough good ones to give me hope on his potential. Behind the worst off line in football. I'm like you on the #1 pick, I wanted the cardinals to get it badly, now with all the Murray rumors it's became confusing. Don't get me wrong, it's exciting to keep up with the FA signings & the draft scenarios but the rumors keep me going back & forth in my head. What if they keep Rosen & it becomes obvious in a few seasons that he isnt the franchise QB, while Murray tears up the league for another team? What if they trade Rosen, draft Murray, he stinks, moves back to baseball & rosen wins a super bowl with another team? I just think they should keep Rosen, trade the #1 pick, build the team with all the extra picks. No guarantees that Murray will light up the league & that Rosen will either. Crap shoot really. Either way I just want the cardinals to get this right. I wanna feel like I did back in 2015, until the NFC championship that is, i was beyond sick after that game.

 

[Chris_Sanders]

He's not your Google [emoji6]

Sent from my LG-LS993 using Tapatalk

I still looked it up on my own

 

[Buckybird]

How well all that impressed SK & MB i have no idea but I would've liked to have been a fly on the wall that night lol. I want them to keep Rosen personally but who knows at this point? .

On NFL Live Thursday it came out by the insiders Schefter & Mort. I consider them the best in the biz so take it however you like.

These are their comments “in the interview process at the combine Michael Bidwill, Keim & K2 were wowed in every aspect by Murray’s personality & work on the board. One Cardinals executive said Murray was unbelievably unbelievable”.

 

[TheCardFan]

Ayton represented the traditional NBA basketball in every sense. Get a guy that meets the measurements

Doncic was the new NBA. No position. Bad measurables, but can impact the game on many levels

This board is older and just beat the Ayton drum to the point that even suggesting that the game was evolving based on current rules or analytics was shouted down

So ultimately you couldn't even suggest that both will be good.

And that is where we are now

Very interesting similarity!

 

[daves]

These are their comments “in the interview process at the combine Michael Bidwill, Keim & K2 were wowed in every aspect by Murray’s personality & work on the board. One Cardinals executive said Murray was unbelievably unbelievable”.

So... we shouldn't believe this?
...dbs