Thoughts on the first round of the upcoming draft...

Chopper0080

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I have some thoughts regarding the first round of the upcoming draft that I feel like I needed to get out of my head, so you all get to suffer.

1-The more and more I look at the Cardinals roster, FA, and the draft, I'm thinking they will feel a ton of pressure to move back. Right or wrong, they are going to have an unique opportunity to be at #1, and not needing a QB. Moving back makes a ton of sense if you are reloading a roster...see Colts in 2018 draft. So, where would they move. Most likely, unless Oakland trades Carr, it would be with the Giants or Jags. This means you would have to have 6 prospects that you love to move back. Here would be mine...
1-Nick Bosa-EDGE
2-Quinnen Williams-DL
3-Brian Burns-EDGE
4-Josh Allen-EDGE
5-Ed Oliver-DL
6-Derrick Brown-DL (DISREGARD_WENT BACK TO SCHOOL)

What I see here is a group of defensive players who are talented, but do not really hit an overall team need which is OL. At some point, you have to start looking at ways to add WRs, OL, TEs, LBs, CBs in this draft, and it will be tough without acquiring additional picks.

2-What do we need at the key positions. I classify key positions as OL, QB, EDGE, CB, DT.

QB...is set whether you like or dislike Rosen...so move on.

EDGE...my big issue is that I would argue that we lack a speed rusher more than anything. Chandler Jones is a great player, but he is not a speed rusher from the edge. He is more Demarcus Ware than Von Miller. This is why I value Brian Burns over Josh Allen. Burns offers a speed element off the edge that we lack.

OL...We lack a difference maker on the line. Humphries is ok. I believe Cole is ok. Pugh is ok. What we are missing is someone who is really good. I hate to continue to go back to the Colts, but adding an OG who is a special player improved the entire unit. We need to add a player like that for our line to become significantly better. Our new scheme will help a bit.

CB...we need to add bodies. I understand that talent is important, and a #2 CB is a big need, but more than that, we need to have young, cost-controlled 3rd, 4th, and 5th CBs to develop.

DT...we need to an interior disruptor. I had hoped we would see more of this from Pierre, and maybe we will moving back to a 3-4, but I'm not waiting on it. Nkemdiche was awful in a 3-4 before so I'm also not counting on him. We need a player like Chris Jones of the Chiefs.

3-The other big issue is that we need WRs, TEs, and ILBs, and only ILB has much value in FA. So, we are going to have to address these positions somehow in the draft. The real question is where? Rounds 2 and 3 seem ideal for the WR and TE needs. Both spots should have good players available at those spots, but there is a trade off because you are going to have to move off of either DL, EDGE, or OL to do so.

4-Some of my favorite players heading into the process (not necessarily the best)...

RB-Joshua Jacobs-Alabama
-Not a ton of wear and tear, and he is a grinder with talent.

WR-Riley Ridley-Georgia
-Big WR who is a precise route runner which is how he creates separation. Nice hands. Can be very effective with an accurate QB.

TE-TJ Hockenson-Iowa
-Big, physical TE who can block and be an impact receiver. He is what we all want Gresham to be. Would also enable us to see if RSJ can further develop with a better offense.

OT-David Edwards-Wisconsin
-I think he has a chance to be a LT in the NFL. He played opposite of Ramcyzk, and then they just left him on the right side. Big, raw OT who can play the power game. I think he can be an Anthony Castanzo type OT.

IOL-Chris Lindstrom-Boston College
-He would be an ideal 3rd round pick for me. Tough and physical type player who makes in the NFL. Very solid technique. Not an amazing athlete but definitely good enough for the NFL. He is a plug and play guy for years similar to Mason Cole.

DL-Derrick Brown-Auburn (DISREGARD_WENT BACK TO SCHOOL)
-I like Derrick Brown because I see a lot of Chris Jones in his game. When Brown is playing with best technique, he is a really tough matchup. He doesn't always, and that is why he won't be the first DL off the board. A really long player with the frame to add on some muscle.

EDGE-Brian Burns-Florida St.
-Really good athlete off the edge who bends very easily which leads to sacks in the NFL. An example of a guy who does not bend well is J Clowney and it is a primary reason he has never been a big sack guy. Burns has burst which puts the fear of God into OTs. he would be an awesome compliment to Chandler Jones who is more of a length/counter pass rusher. Also, Burns never seemed to let up even if games where Florida St was getting crushed which counts for something in my book.

LB-Joe Giles-Harris-Duke
-I don't love many LBs outside of the first round guys, but at least Giles-Harris is not a liability in coverage. He goes hard. Seems to be a smart player, and has nice size.

CB-Byron Murphy-Washington
-Technician at CB which I love. Good athlete. A first rounder which is a spot where I don't see us adding a CB.

S-None outside of the first round yet.
 
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oaken1

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nice take chopper.

The weakness in first round oline talent kinda sucks this year....would be nice to see a guy slip and get him at 33... but as it stands I would prefer TE at 33, WR in round three...and OG in round four...or with a third round comp pick. I think thats where we find the best value this year.
Lots of good TE's, several with first round grades.

but as you mentioned,...trading back makes sense. If we can net another second round pick it would allow us to grab TE and WR both in that round which would be a nice influx of talent for our offense.
 

slanidrac16

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Thanks for your perspective. Here are my thoughts. We need to address the offensive side of the ball in free agency. We need to spend the money to bring in a bonifide badass guard( Ramon Foster?)and an offensive tackle that we can plug in day one. We cannot go into next season with what we have now nor do I want to see us depend on a rookie lineman. With the draft being top heavy in defense we can fill some hole with a Bosa, Allen , Burns or whatever. Add a wr like tyrell Williams ( or 2 ) and perhaps a te and we’ll be well on our way of fixing this offense personnel wise. From that point we can draft bpa . Wr , oline, lb or cb.
 

az jam

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Always enjoy your pre-draft updates. I do think the Cards should trade the number one for some team that really needs a QB and the Giants and Jags certainly would work well as they have the 6th and 7th picks in the draft. I also think they can get extra picks with the 1st pick in the 2n round. Lots of teams will want to move up for that one. Cards have lots of holes to fill and you covered the needs very well.
 

Ohcrap75

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Maybe we can receive a bunch of picks to move back to 6 or 7. then we can use some of those to move up to number 3 and take Bosa/QWilliams.

I'm a big fan of Ridley, Jacobs, Edwards, Lindstrom and Murphy(#1 CB in the draft)
 

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good stuff

I think right below the six players you mention are one or two the three corners: Greedy Williams, Deandre Baker and Byron Murphy. I think ranking them depends on team preference.

I think Baker is the safest pick, with Byron Murphy having the highest upside but also risk
(also local kid, so my pick on that alone) -- Greedy Williams between the two

It wouldn't be the worst thing in the world to take another (potential) shutdown corner -- especially with PP having 2 years left on his current deal.
 

az jam

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Is Jacobs in the draft.? He’s my favorite RB if he is.

Yes, he is coming out for the draft.

01/11/19 - Four Alabama players are skipping their final seasons to enter the NFL draft, including All-America left tackle Jonah Williams and Outland Trophy-winning defensive lineman Quinnen Williams. Those projected first-rounders announced their intentions on Friday, along with versatile tailback Josh Jacobs and tight end Irv Smith Jr. Jonah Williams and Quinnen Williams are unanimous All-Americans rated as potential Top 10 picks. Jacobs and Smith are also listed as potential late first-rounders in at least one mock draft. Jacobs was a diverse threat for the Tide on offense and special teams. He ran for 640 yards and a team-high 11 touchdowns while catching 20 passes for 247 yards and three scores. Once a lightly recruited player who was a late addition to his Alabama recruiting class, he averaged 30.6 yards on 14 kick returns with a TD. "This decision has definitely been tough for me," he said. "Even on the ride here, I still didn't know exactly what choice I wanted to make." - AP College Football
 

slanidrac16

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Hypothetically, if you knew Murray was the next Patrick Mahomes would you take him with our first pick. Can you imagine if we don’t or we trade the pick and Murray turns out to be just that. So much is going to riding on the combine.
 

DVontel

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Derrick Brown decided to stay 1 more year at Auburn.

Although I’m not in favor of trading back, great post otherwise.
 
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Chopper0080

Chopper0080

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Hypothetically, if you knew Murray was the next Patrick Mahomes would you take him with our first pick. Can you imagine if we don’t or we trade the pick and Murray turns out to be just that. So much is going to riding on the combine.
I'm not worried about Kyler Murray. Passing on a 5'9ish QB #1 is never a bad move.
 
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Chopper0080

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And then just one thing to also get off my chest. Jonah Williams is not a top 10 guy, and is probably not a LT in the NFL. Keep that in mind when you are looking at a lot of publications that put him in without doing the research. His measurables and traits are very similar to Justin Pugh. He might be a RT in the NFL, and most likely is a guard.
 

Russ Smith

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And then just one thing to also get off my chest. Jonah Williams is not a top 10 guy, and is probably not a LT in the NFL. Keep that in mind when you are looking at a lot of publications that put him in without doing the research. His measurables and traits are very similar to Justin Pugh. He might be a RT in the NFL, and most likely is a guard.


I watched him closely against Clemson. I didn't watch the whole game, not even half, but when I watched and they had the ball I was watching him. There's one play in the first quarter where he gets absolutely pancaked by a defender, just flat levelled. There are several others where he just barely got a block or a piece of a block. Now Bama was running very well in the game and often his way so it's not like he got dominated, but I was not very impressed. I know Ferrell the kid from Clemson is a great player in his own right but it was pretty surprising to see the consensus best OL in the draft getting beaten that badly 1 on 1.
 

Ohcrap75

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And then just one thing to also get off my chest. Jonah Williams is not a top 10 guy, and is probably not a LT in the NFL. Keep that in mind when you are looking at a lot of publications that put him in without doing the research. His measurables and traits are very similar to Justin Pugh. He might be a RT in the NFL, and most likely is a guard.


I agree with Jonah. Best LT’s are Y Cajuste and possibly Edwards. Cody Ford will be a force on the right side
 

slanidrac16

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And then just one thing to also get off my chest. Jonah Williams is not a top 10 guy, and is probably not a LT in the NFL. Keep that in mind when you are looking at a lot of publications that put him in without doing the research. His measurables and traits are very similar to Justin Pugh. He might be a RT in the NFL, and most likely is a guard.
Which is exactly why we have to get a bad ass guard and offensive tackle in free agency. We HAVE to fix this line and not with rookies or injury prone cast offs.
 

Zeno

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chopper, you lost me at NOT NEEDING A QB.

Well since everyone with any semblance of sense realizes you can’t judge a rookie QB after his first season, especially in the circumstances he had last year. Rosen very well could fail but the kid isn’t even 22 yrs old yet and the potential is obvious, kind of quick to give up on him.
 

slinslin

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Stopped reading after claiming that QB is set.

Rosen has shown way too little to pass up drafting a QB at #1 if there is someone who is worth the pick.

Rosen is a lesser talent that has not even looked good so far.
 

juza76

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Well since everyone with any semblance of sense realizes you can’t judge a rookie QB after his first season, especially in the circumstances he had last year. Rosen very well could fail but the kid isn’t even 22 yrs old yet and the potential is obvious, kind of quick to give up on him.

High ceiling adequate starter
Should it stop us from getting another one in round 2 or 3 if we get additional picks by trade
Rosen has to deserve to get the starting role on the field and not just because was drafted in the top ten
Competition
 

HGC

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Kingsbury was brought in to develop Rosen not look for his replacement in year one. A developmental QB in the later rounds who fits Kingsbury’s offense is certainly a possibility.
 

TJ

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High ceiling adequate starter
Should it stop us from getting another one in round 2 or 3 if we get additional picks by trade
Rosen has to deserve to get the starting role on the field and not just because was drafted in the top ten
Competition

Rosen's ceiling is much higher than "adequate starter"

There's also no reason at all for Arizona to draft a QB, not even in the later rounds. For starters, the QB class is dreadful. Dude's who're going to be drafted Day 2 are Day 3 picks in any other draft. Further, the team has a solid QB2 in Glennon already under contract. If we trade down and accumulate extra picks, that should be to create depth across both lines, WR, and LB. Drafting a QB this offseason is about the same priority as drafting a punter, kicker, or long snapper.

If Rosen flames out next season, we'd be in a position to draft a QB high in 2020, which is a far better QB class.
 
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