Todd Gurley gets paid

Cheesebeef

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I honestly don't know how he even walks with all of the devastating injuries he's had. Poor guy.

I honestly don't know why you think continually misrepresenting other's arguments will benefit the discussion.
 
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Ouchie-Z-Clown

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Going one each year...

2013 - Fred Jackson (32 years old)
4.3 YPC, 1277 scrimmage, 10 TD’s

2014 - Frank Gore (31 years old)
4.1 YPC, 1269 scrimmage, 9 TD’s

2015 - Adrian Peterson (30 years old)
4.5 YPC, 1707 scrimmage, 11 TD’s

2016 - LeGarrette Blount (30 years old)
3.9 YPC, 1199 scrimmage, 18 TD’s

2016 - DeAngelo Williams (32 years old)
4.5 YPC, 1274 scrimmage, 11 TD’s

More in the last 10 years:

09’ - Thomas Jones (31 years old)
4.2 YPC, 1460 scrimmage, 14 TD’s

09’ - Ricky Williams (32 years old)
4.7 YPC, 1385 scrimmage, 13 TD’s

11’ - Willis McGahee (30 years old)
4.8 YPC, 1200 scrimmage, 5 TD’s
Are those all of them or you only tried to identify one per year?
 

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So you think his wrist injury will significantly impact the rest of his career?

I'm saying he's been injured. I don't think a guy missing a ton of time due to injury is an indicator that in future years he is less likely to wear down.
 

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Rams allegedly offered a deal that would pay $21 million a year, making him the highest paid defensive player in history. His agent reportedly wants QB money, $25 million a year.

As a Rams fan, I think that’s a bit too far.
 

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Rams allegedly offered a deal that would pay $21 million a year, making him the highest paid defensive player in history. His agent reportedly wants QB money, $25 million a year.

As a Rams fan, I think that’s a bit too far.

Where have we seen a DT get that kind of money before?

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My first post here. And I and not coming to talk smack. I just wonder why you say the rams window is very short. Considering the following

Rams have 2nd youngest team in NFL
In 2019 and 2020 Rams will have tons of cap space despite Cooks and Gurleys contracts. 60 Mill for 2019 and 130 mil for 2020.
Rams five core players are all 27 or under

Donald 27
Gurley 23
Cooks 24
Goff 23
Peters 25

Seems like the window is a good 5 years.

Compare that to Cards.

28th in age
Core players, Jones, Peterson, DJ, Fitz , Rosen are older except for Rosen

Peterson 28
Jones 28
DJ 26
Fitz 34
Rosen 21

Cardinals have good cap space in 2019 and 2020 but less than Rams.
The Rams being in cap hell is completely exclusive of whatever the Cardinals are doing. Your team is not only going to have to deal with Cooks and Gurley's contracts, but in all likelihood, back up dump trucks full of money for Aaron Donald this year/next, and for Goff next year or the year after. And that's ignoring Marcus Peters, who is probably going to demand a bunch of cash too. It's all well and good to say your core is intact, but it's really not going to be unless you give all of these players these huge contracts, and then the overall talent of your team is going to decline.

You guys have a good defense and are essentially going to ignore it for three players on offense I just don't have trust in up to this point. I'm not sold on Goff until his head coach doesn't have to call in adjustments for him. And I have a feeling McVay gets completely caught up this year in having too many egos to manage on the defensive side of the ball to be able to focus on holding Jared's hand anymore.

I have a very strong feeling that this is going to be one of those "dream teams" that falls apart because McVay is too young to handle it all, even with Wade Phillips.
 

Ouchie-Z-Clown

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The Rams being in cap hell is completely exclusive of whatever the Cardinals are doing. Your team is not only going to have to deal with Cooks and Gurley's contracts, but in all likelihood, back up dump trucks full of money for Aaron Donald this year/next, and for Goff next year or the year after. And that's ignoring Marcus Peters, who is probably going to demand a bunch of cash too. It's all well and good to say your core is intact, but it's really not going to be unless you give all of these players these huge contracts, and then the overall talent of your team is going to decline.

You guys have a good defense and are essentially going to ignore it for three players on offense I just don't have trust in up to this point. I'm not sold on Goff until his head coach doesn't have to call in adjustments for him. And I have a feeling McVay gets completely caught up this year in having too many egos to manage on the defensive side of the ball to be able to focus on holding Jared's hand anymore.

I have a very strong feeling that this is going to be one of those "dream teams" that falls apart because McVay is too young to handle it all, even with Wade Phillips.
Terrible problem to deal with, too much talent and a too talented head coach who is young. They don’t make an eye roll emoji large enough to fully represent the amount of ridiculousness of your post.
 

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The Rams being in cap hell is completely exclusive of whatever the Cardinals are doing. Your team is not only going to have to deal with Cooks and Gurley's contracts, but in all likelihood, back up dump trucks full of money for Aaron Donald this year/next, and for Goff next year or the year after. And that's ignoring Marcus Peters, who is probably going to demand a bunch of cash too. It's all well and good to say your core is intact, but it's really not going to be unless you give all of these players these huge contracts, and then the overall talent of your team is going to decline.

You guys have a good defense and are essentially going to ignore it for three players on offense I just don't have trust in up to this point. I'm not sold on Goff until his head coach doesn't have to call in adjustments for him. And I have a feeling McVay gets completely caught up this year in having too many egos to manage on the defensive side of the ball to be able to focus on holding Jared's hand anymore.

I have a very strong feeling that this is going to be one of those "dream teams" that falls apart because McVay is too young to handle it all, even with Wade Phillips.
Except the Rams are not in cap hell. Most of teh Cooks and Gurley money fall hit in 2019 and 2020. After those two signings rams have 58 mill in 2019 and 110 mil in 2020. That would rank as 7th most and 5th most.
 

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Terrible problem to deal with, too much talent and a too talented head coach who is young. They don’t make an eye roll emoji large enough to fully represent the amount of ridiculousness of your post.
The 2011 Eagles were a "dream team" that completely failed to launch. Like it or not, team chemistry is an important thing. The team has one unexpectedly good year, and you're already anointing them. More power to you. I still think they win the West, but they don't become this unstoppable juggernaut for five years.

Except the Rams are not in cap hell. Most of teh Cooks and Gurley money fall hit in 2019 and 2020. After those two signings rams have 58 mill in 2019 and 110 mil in 2020. That would rank as 7th most and 5th most.
I don't know why I need to repeat it, but those numbers don't include your star quarterback who is soon going to be queued up to be a $30+ million a year guy, Aaron Donald, or Marcus Peters - all guys who are going to be asking for contracts either now, or in 2019/2020.

Keep in mind that in 2020, you may "have 110 million," but you also only have 38 players on the roster... and Gurley and Cooks alone will be taking up nearly 50% of your current spend to date. Then 17 players you need to add just to field a team. Now loop in a contract for Donald and Goff, and you're looking at a major amount of your cap being wrapped up in four players that year, before counting in dead money or Marcus Peters. If we want to play the Cardinals-Rams comparison game, the top two contracts on the Cardinals that year will only take up 34% of their current spend, with 41 players under contract.
 

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Except the Rams are not in cap hell. Most of teh Cooks and Gurley money fall hit in 2019 and 2020. After those two signings rams have 58 mill in 2019 and 110 mil in 2020. That would rank as 7th most and 5th most.

People are talking about being set up for cap hell/dismantling with the contracts signed and soon to be signed. Restrictions will be there. Not that you are in it right now. 2020 is likely when it would hit, 2021 definitely. 2018 and 2019 are all-in years. Even 2019 is iffy, but they could make it fly.

In reality there hasn't been cap hell for years. Not really. With ~10 mill cap increases, we've been in a goldilocks situation. But it won't go on forever. Teams set up to pay big money in the 2020-2021 seasons are going to have those contracts go into the new CBA, and that is a BIG QUESTION MARK. I won't go into it much now, but I would expect the cap to be flat to down (best case scenario) for 2022-2025. It could be sharply down.

People forget that when the new CBA was signed, we had a flat cap for a few years, including one DOWN year. That under a CBA that was a 'happy days are here again' scenario. The next one will not be that.

Of course, some of this can be stopped by not signing guys, but then the Rams are without those players. Will they let Donald go so they can keep 3 other guys?

Then there is the effects of stripping depth. Just because you can fit say 15 or so good players under the cap, doesn't mean you can have a depth filled roster. With 53 people on the roster, and many of them still on rookie deals, those guys will move on. What happens then is you either get lucky with current and future draft picks or you have to sign guys off the street for minimum alongside those draft picks/UDFA. Thus overall quality on the bottom 2/3rds of the roster tends to decline.

Obviously the 2018 Rams didn't infuse alot of young draft picks to the pool (no 1st or 2nd rounder, top pick being a low end 3rd #89 overall). Rams don't have a 2nd rounder next year. Not a huge draw down, but still 3 of your top 4 picks for a two year period. It's basically can be viewed as busting on 1st and a 2nd rounder one year and a 2nd the next in addition to whatever busts come out of this years and next years class. Of course you could hit on a few lower rounders, but this is rare. Expect that not to happen.


This is what you need to look at. It'll show you your players, via positional grouping. As you can see, there's a ton of important positions and groups barren by 2019-2020 until you make decisions that will decrease that cap space.

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/los-angeles-rams/yearly/cap/


In other words, here are the main guys you need to re-sign or be replaced by 2020. (and obviously as a Cards fan, I might not know about a 3rd string 2nd or 3rd year LB or whatever that might also need a new contract in a couple of years).

So you have a bunch of core guys and competent starters to sign/replace/let go with that cap space for 2019-2020.

Goff
Marcus Peters
Rodger Saffold
Jamon Brown
Rob Havenstein
Suh
Donald
Longacre
Hager
Lamarcus Joyner
Brockers
Talib
Higbee
Whitworth
Zuerlein

Many of these are high dollar positions. QB, LT, DT, CB, etc.

Including most of your OL, DL, secondary.

Then you have anyone else that surprises. Draft picks pool. Everyone else to fill out the roster and fill holes due to sudden ineffectiveness/injuries.

What happens if Robert Woods doesn't pan out? Yeah it's not a huge hit going forward, but it's not just THAT, it's also the cost of replacing him. If the Rams then try to go out and spend 15 million a year on a replacement, that will effect everything else.

As you can see, you have the core of your team to re-sign and only have that much space.

So yeah, the Rams have decisions. Big decisions. They can't pay them all, and if we seen anything, the Rams also might decide they like someone else's players more.

Think of it this way. If I told you that of Peters, Saffold, Havestein, Joyner, Higbee, Whitworth, Donald, Suh, Brockers, Talib, and Zuerlein that say, 8 of those 11 weren't going to be on the team this year.... The talk about the Rams and what they can achieve this year would be alot lower. It's very possible it's going to be an exodus something along these lines. Maybe they pick up a guy here or there from somewhere else, but there is just no way they are going to keep these guys.

That's the point. The Rams are in position to pick and choose, but they are going to be forced to pick and choose. (This is also why people have been questioning WHO they have been choosing and FOR HOW MUCH.)

Some are older like Whitworth, Suh, Talib. Lots of that 'cap space' you talk about are from their deals expiring. But they also create major holes at expensive positions.

110 million isn't enough. You'd need more like 210 million.

But this is the NFL. One way or another, eventually the cap gets in the way. 2017-2019 was/is the Rams chance to shine either as a brilliant firework or as a dud.
 
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The 2011 Eagles were a "dream team" that completely failed to launch. Like it or not, team chemistry is an important thing. The team has one unexpectedly good year, and you're already anointing them. More power to you. I still think they win the West, but they don't become this unstoppable juggernaut for five years.


I don't know why I need to repeat it, but those numbers don't include your star quarterback who is soon going to be queued up to be a $30+ million a year guy, Aaron Donald, or Marcus Peters - all guys who are going to be asking for contracts either now, or in 2019/2020.

Keep in mind that in 2020, you may "have 110 million," but you also only have 38 players on the roster... and Gurley and Cooks alone will be taking up nearly 50% of your current spend to date. Then 17 players you need to add just to field a team. Now loop in a contract for Donald and Goff, and you're looking at a major amount of your cap being wrapped up in four players that year, before counting in dead money or Marcus Peters. If we want to play the Cardinals-Rams comparison game, the top two contracts on the Cardinals that year will only take up 34% of their current spend, with 41 players under contract.


The QB Goff hits in 2021 not 2019 or 2020.

And I realize they need to sign other players. The cap is 200 million and those 38 players take up about 80-90 mill. Leaving 110 mill for 15 players. Say Peters and Donald take of 40 mil. That leaves 70 mil for 13 players.

Will there be some contract casualties. Yes. All teams have that.
 

Rams1Fan

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People are talking about being set up for cap hell/dismantling with the contracts signed and soon to be signed. Restrictions will be there. Not that you are in it right now. 2020 is likely when it would hit, 2021 definitely. 2018 and 2019 are all-in years. Even 2019 is iffy, but they could make it fly.

In reality there hasn't been cap hell for years. Not really. With ~10 mill cap increases, we've been in a goldilocks situation. But it won't go on forever. Teams set up to pay big money in the 2020-2021 seasons are going to have those contracts go into the new CBA, and that is a BIG QUESTION MARK. I won't go into it much now, but I would expect the cap to be flat to down (best case scenario) for 2022-2025. It could be sharply down.

People forget that when the new CBA was signed, we had a flat cap for a few years, including one DOWN year. That under a CBA that was a 'happy days are here again' scenario. The next one will not be that.

Of course, some of this can be stopped by not signing guys, but then the Rams are without those players. Will they let Donald go so they can keep 3 other guys?

Then there is the effects of stripping depth. Just because you can fit say 15 or so good players under the cap, doesn't mean you can have a depth filled roster. With 53 people on the roster, and many of them still on rookie deals, those guys will move on. What happens then is you either get lucky with current and future draft picks or you have to sign guys off the street for minimum alongside those draft picks/UDFA. Thus overall quality on the bottom 2/3rds of the roster tends to decline.

Obviously the 2018 Rams didn't infuse alot of young draft picks to the pool (no 1st or 2nd rounder, top pick being a low end 3rd #89 overall). Rams don't have a 2nd rounder next year. Not a huge draw down, but still 3 of your top 4 picks for a two year period. It's basically can be viewed as busting on 1st and a 2nd rounder one year and a 2nd the next in addition to whatever busts come out of this years and next years class. Of course you could hit on a few lower rounders, but this is rare. Expect that not to happen.


This is what you need to look at. It'll show you your players, via positional grouping. As you can see, there's a ton of important positions and groups barren by 2019-2020 until you make decisions that will decrease that cap space.

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/los-angeles-rams/yearly/cap/


In other words, here are the main guys you need to re-sign or be replaced by 2020. (and obviously as a Cards fan, I might not know about a 3rd string 2nd or 3rd year LB or whatever that might also need a new contract in a couple of years).

So you have a bunch of core guys and competent starters to sign/replace/let go with that cap space for 2019-2020.

Goff
Marcus Peters
Rodger Saffold
Jamon Brown
Rob Havenstein
Suh
Donald
Longacre
Hager
Lamarcus Joyner
Brockers
Talib
Higbee
Whitworth
Zuerlein

Many of these are high dollar positions. QB, LT, DT, CB, etc.

Including most of your OL, DL, secondary.

Then you have anyone else that surprises. Draft picks pool. Everyone else to fill out the roster and fill holes due to sudden ineffectiveness/injuries.

What happens if Robert Woods doesn't pan out? Yeah it's not a huge hit going forward, but it's not just THAT, it's also the cost of replacing him. If the Rams then try to go out and spend 15 million a year on a replacement, that will effect everything else.

As you can see, you have the core of your team to re-sign and only have that much space.

So yeah, the Rams have decisions. Big decisions. They can't pay them all, and if we seen anything, the Rams also might decide they like someone else's players more.

Think of it this way. If I told you that of Peters, Saffold, Havestein, Joyner, Higbee, Whitworth, Donald, Suh, Brockers, Talib, and Zuerlein that say, 8 of those 11 weren't going to be on the team this year.... The talk about the Rams and what they can achieve this year would be alot lower. It's very possible it's going to be an exodus something along these lines. Maybe they pick up a guy here or there from somewhere else, but there is just no way they are going to keep these guys.

That's the point. The Rams are in position to pick and choose, but they are going to be forced to pick and choose. (This is also why people have been questioning WHO they have been choosing and FOR HOW MUCH.)

Some are older like Whitworth, Suh, Talib. Lots of that 'cap space' you talk about are from their deals expiring. But they also create major holes at expensive positions.

110 million isn't enough. You'd need more like 210 million.

But this is the NFL. One way or another, eventually the cap gets in the way. 2017-2019 was/is the Rams chance to shine either as a brilliant firework or as a dud.

They are not going to keep all those guys. No team ever keeps all of their players. Joyner I am sure will be gone next year because they wont pay big for a safety. Much like the Cards and Honey Badger. You either fill in with the draft or get cheap FA's.

Whitworth and Sullivan will probably retire after this year. Talib may also be released after this year as they have pretty good depth at CB.


And I know of spotrac. that is where I got the numbers from.
 

MadCardDisease

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The QB Goff hits in 2021 not 2019 or 2020.

And I realize they need to sign other players. The cap is 200 million and those 38 players take up about 80-90 mill. Leaving 110 mill for 15 players. Say Peters and Donald take of 40 mil. That leaves 70 mil for 13 players.

Will there be some contract casualties. Yes. All teams have that.

Sure they can pick up the 5th year option for Goff but he will be finishing his 3rd season with the Rams after this year. Therefore he can technically negotiate a contract extension beginning after this season ends (See Todd Gurley). If Goff has another good season this year, the Rams won't want to mess around with their franchise QB and they will extend him.

It will be more than what Russell Wilson got ($88M four year extension) after his 3rd season. That included a $31M signing bonus! However that was signed 4 years ago and a lot has changed since then.

In fact Goff's new contract extension will probably be closer to what Matt Ryan just got. So expect the $30M per year range if Goff plays well.
 
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Solar7

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Sure they can pick up the 5th year option for Goff but he will be finishing his 3rd season with the Rams after this year. Therefore he can technically negotiate a contract extension beginning after this season ends (See Todd Gurley). If Goff has another good season this year, the Rams won't want to mess around with their franchise QB and they will extend him.

It will be more than what Russell Wilson got ($88M four year extension) after his 3rd season. That included a $31M signing bonus! However that was signed 4 years ago and a lot has changed since then.

In fact Goff's new contract extension will probably be closer to what Matt Ryan just got. So expect the $30M per year range if Goff plays well.

Thanks to you and @CardsFan88 for reinforcing the point I was making. Goff's camp isn't going to let him sit on a rookie contract if he has a spectacular set of seasons. Ryan has set the market, and $30 million a year is going to be peanuts compared to what other young QBs are in line for.

But CardsFan hit it best - the depth on that team is going to be eradicated in short order. The reason that team is succeeding is because of the solid roster they created up and down, not the "elite" young five players that are going to get paid.
 

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The Rams aren't a dream team. Some of you could do with some research before regurgitating this nonsense. The fact that you have shared the division with the Rams only adds to the bizarre lack of knowledge.

Let's start with the offense that is returning 10 of 11 starters.
Goff, drafted
Gurley, drafted
Kupp, drafted
Higbee, drafted
Saffold, drafted
Sullivan, FA
Brown, drafted
Havenstein, drafted
Woods, FA
Whitworth, FA
Cooks, trade, new starter

Defense returning 6 starters, 2 promotions and 3 new faces
Donald, drafted
Brockers, drafted
Suh, FA, new starter
Longacre, UDFA, promoted
Ebukam, drafted
Hager, drafted, promoted
Barron, trade
Johnson, drafted
Joyner, drafted
Peters, trade, new starter
Talib, trade, new starter

ST's
Zuerlein, drafted
Hekker, UDFA
Cooper, drafted

Looks a whole lot like a mostly homegrown team to me @Solar7


Rams addressed and rebuilt the offense a year ago with the regime/coaching change. WR core and some Oline tweaks. This year the defense was tweaked to better fit Wade Phillips 3-4 scheme. This is not unusual or "Dreamy."
 
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Solar7

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The Rams aren't a dream team. Some of you could do with some research before regurgitating this nonsense. The fact that you have shared the division with the Rams only adds to the bizarre lack of knowledge.

Let's start with the offense that is returning 10 of 11 starters.
Goff, drafted
Gurley, drafted
Kupp, drafted
Higbee, drafted
Saffold, drafted
Sullivan, FA
Brown, drafted
Havenstein, drafted
Woods, FA
Whitworth, FA
Cooks, trade, new starter

Defense returning 6 starters, 2 promotions and 3 new faces
Donald, drafted
Brockers, drafted
Suh, FA, new starter
Longacre, UDFA, promoted
Ebukam, drafted
Hager, drafted, promoted
Barron, trade
Johnson, drafted
Joyner, drafted
Peters, trade, new starter
Talib, trade, new starter

ST's
Zuerlein, drafted
Hekker, UDFA
Cooper, drafted

Looks a whole lot like a mostly homegrown team to me @Solar7


Rams addressed and rebuilt the offense a year ago with the regime/coaching change. WR core and some Oline tweaks. This year the defense was tweaked to better fit Wade Phillips 3-4 scheme. This is not unusual or "Dreamy."
Those three new faces on defense are some of the more maligned personalities in the league, and their greatest star is holding out. Cooks is on his third team before his second contract - there's got to be a reason for that.

There are multiple players that are either older or within 12 months of the head coach by age. I'm sorry, that team loses a few unexpected ones and that locker room is going to be hard to handle.

I'm only calling them a "dream team" because every talking head seems to think they're already unstoppable.
 

Ouchie-Z-Clown

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The 2011 Eagles were a "dream team" that completely failed to launch. Like it or not, team chemistry is an important thing. The team has one unexpectedly good year, and you're already anointing them. More power to you. I still think they win the West, but they don't become this unstoppable juggernaut for five years.
.


Sigh . . . the old “I’m going to make up something you did not say because I don’t have a substantive response to your argument.” So tired.

Find one place I “anointed” the Rams anything.

Find one place I claimed they’d be an “unstoppable juggernaut for five years” or even one year, or even a juggernaut (much less unstoppable).

Or anything that even comes close to resembling either of those statements you’re trying to attribute to me.

I was just pointing out that the core of yiur argument is “they have too much talent” and how outright silly that is a premise for denigrating a team or prophesizing their failure. You point out the eagles as a failure but that’s only one example. The counter to that is the Seahawks who successfully parlayed a rookie contract QB into an incredibly talented team for a sustained period. Wilson’s rookie contract allowed them to hold onto other talented players and acquire other studs like Avril and jimmy graham. And it seemed to work in the opposite of what happened with the eagles.
 

Ouchie-Z-Clown

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The QB Goff hits in 2021 not 2019 or 2020.

And I realize they need to sign other players. The cap is 200 million and those 38 players take up about 80-90 mill. Leaving 110 mill for 15 players. Say Peters and Donald take of 40 mil. That leaves 70 mil for 13 players.

Will there be some contract casualties. Yes. All teams have that.
Exactly. On both points. Goff doesn’t hit for a while. Gives them incredible flexibility for a while. It’s what we’re hoping for with Rosen.

And every team has to manage to the cap. Isn’t it more desirable to have to figure it out with a talented core where you have to choose which to retain and which to let go than it is to be fretting about where to just find the talent? Clue for you guys . . . The former position (the rams impending “doom” according to a few of you) is a much more desirable position than the latter (the cards as Fitz retires, PP, David Johnson and jones reach 30, etc).
 

Ouchie-Z-Clown

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Sure they can pick up the 5th year option for Goff but he will be finishing his 3rd season with the Rams after this year. Therefore he can technically negotiate a contract extension beginning after this season ends (See Todd Gurley). If Goff has another good season this year, the Rams won't want to mess around with their franchise QB and they will extend him.

It will be more than what Russell Wilson got ($88M four year extension) after his 3rd season. That included a $31M signing bonus! However that was signed 4 years ago and a lot has changed since then.

In fact Goff's new contract extension will probably be closer to what Matt Ryan just got. So expect the $30M per year range if Goff plays well.
Extension. That means guaranteed money will be spread over the life and big hit still comes later.
 
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