Twolves at Suns (Game Thread)

[arthurracoon]

80 - 72

Marbury hit a 3

TO Minny

 

[Chaz]

This SUCKS

FRANK SUCKS

THE REFS SUCK

THE SUNS SUCK

 

[Chaz]

Obivously the refs are just letting them play.

F***ING GET PHYSICAL!

I wish shawn would have just hammered Sprewell, instead he goes for some weak challenga and gives him the 3 pt play.

I am so frustrated with this team right now.

I think I need to turn this off now to save my sanity.

 

[matt_whitlock]

These past 2 games show how much better these other power forwards are than Amare. It's huge.

 

[sly fly]

No heart. No brains.

Leave Sprewell open. Leave Hoiberg open. Leave Cassell open.

Don't get back on D. Ervin Johnson beats you down the court.

Marion playing like MaryAnne.

JJ clanks. Penny clanks.

Gugliotta throws up off-balance hook shots.

Amare trying to dunk the ball from 20 ft.

Marbury sulking. Can't do it all by himself.

Voskuhl can play on my team anytime.

This team is in trouble.

 

[Chaz]

Jacking up outside shots in the fourth again.

Teams just pack it and dare the Suns to shoot from the outside and they just play right into their hands.

Long rebounds and they don't get back. No energy, no agressiveness. They don't control rebounds, nobody is going after loose balls, they just stand around and watch, or let guys come in and take the ball from them.


This team needs a shake up some how. They are getting worse.

 

[scotsman13]

oh what was that saying? oh yea.
"the suns play much better with penny on the floor." NOT

if marbury hadnt had his best game of the season for scoring then this would have been the suns lowest scoring output of the season, as is this is tied for second lowest scroing game of the season. yea right penny bring so much to the table. go ahead and tell me how much of a differance penny makes. hoiburg scores 11 when hardaway in the first half. jj comes in and nothing else.

yes we miss marions production but that has been gone almost all year. amare did a great job on garrnet wow what job he did defensively. now if he had rebounded better we may have gotten somewhere. also we are really seeing how bad having zarko and barbosa how has hurt our bench. there was almost no production from it.

 

[Wally]

The players we have are enough to get the job done with one exception.... we NEED a shooter. Other than that, we NEED a coach. Coach's rule # 1 - Don't take the hot hand out of the game while he's still hot. Coach's rule # 2 - Don't belittle a good effort by any player even if you don't like him. Coach's best rule - Let someone else who knows more make the decisions. I believe the guys know tha FJ is not gonna be around much longer and the little effort they had before has gone out the window. It's like they don't care.

 

[scotsman13]

you know it is so easy to blame the coach. well maybe if we had another coach they would get amare the ball more and sit penny back in the lockerroom for the rest of the season.

 

[Chaz]

To blame this loss on Penny is BS. Just as it would be BS to give Penny credit if we had won.

I am so tired of the JJ vs. Penny argument. The problems are so much deeper than who is the starting SG.

Penny this, JJ that, WHO CARES????


This is a team effort, or lack of, as the case may be.


It doesn't look like these guys are playing for Frank anymore.

 

[Joe Mama]

This Phoenix Suns team is just not that good. Shawn Marion and Joe Johnson shot a combined 4-19 tonight. Tom Gugliotta and Scott Williams shot a combined 2-14. That's just not going to get it done.

Again, thought the referees struggled tonight. The Suns players were getting smacked across the arms almost every time they went to the basket, yet the whistle was rarely blown. I know it was really frustrating Amare Stoudemire. Joe Johnson was also frustrated.


Joe Mama

 

[Cheesebeef]

Originally posted by scotsman13
you know it is so easy to blame the coach. well maybe if we had another coach they would get amare the ball more and sit penny back in the lockerroom for the rest of the season.

you know if you could see that both guys have sucked for the majority of the season - maybe we would take your ******** seriously. Besides - JJ had 16 games to look like crap - Penny deserves at least two before you post something as stupid as you usually do.

 

[Chris_Sanders]

Originally posted by cheesebeef
you know if you could see that both guys have sucked for the majority of the season - maybe we would take your ******** seriously. Besides - JJ had 16 games to look like crap - Penny deserves at least two before you post something as stupid as you usually do.

I have to agree with this. Your blatant bias makes your arguements unconvincing Scotsman.

 

[scotsman13]

cheese, first of all i have never insulted anyone personally on this board. now dont you start with me. everyone says that that if you put penny the starting line that will fix the problems. guess what it didnt work. here is an idea bench penny and jj in the locker room and play casey and barbosa, would that make you happy? i am happy with jj's product this year? no i am not but i dont think he is any where never as bad as penny that is fine if you dont like it, but that is how i see the game.

i personally am getting sick and tired of your bad mouthing me. you may not like me, but i have only come here to talk basketball so show me the proof that penny helps this team? i have come with numbers that show that penny isnt as productive as jj. i have come in here with things from others that back this up and what you do? you call me stupid? that is fine you can think that i am stupid all you want, but werent you the one that stated that if we put penny into starting line up that it wouldnt it hurt anything and it may help the team? what am a afraid of? right? that was you that posted that wasnt it? well what happened? penny didnt help the team. face facts penny is a wart in the backside of this team. now i am not saying that jj is so much better i have never said that he was a star i have said that his defense makes him more value to this team then penny is. so if penny is a wart on the backside then right now jj is a wart on the back of this team. but that still doesnt make him anywhere close to the player that penny is.

 

[cheng]

I don't know if it is just me. I am sick and tired of scotman13, every freaking post is about Penny this and Penny that. I mean every F post!

 

[Cheesebeef]

Originally posted by cheng
I don't know if it is just me. I am sick and tired of scotman13, every freaking post is about Penny this and Penny that. I mean every F post!

that is the most frustrating thing - and Scots way to make the entire leap about Penny after one game - by the way - who was in the game from the time the score went from 54-57 to 75-66 - would that be your boy - both guys stink - I just think JJ stinks more and would like to see what Penny could do given the same opportunity - you didn't hear anyone after GAME 1 say JJ should be benched now did you - were there concerns - yes - but not outright venomous posts about how the player is a wart or something juvenile of that nature.

I mean I can actually admit that the Penny experiment didn't yield a win tonight - but that doesn't automatically prove you right - just as we weren't automatically right about JJ sucking up the place - nice game game by him by the way tonight - he sure looks like he "earned" his way back into the starting rotation as you suggested Penny needed to do.

To me this team has two major problems - our 2 guard position as a whole stinks and Shawn Marion has lost the ability to play basketball.

 

[Billythekid]

This is not a critisism of any kind, but are we overrating Amare and expecting too much from the guy? I mean he is still as raw as anything. Alot of people are labelling him the future PF of this league, but you look at guys like Zach Randolph and even the emerging Chris Bosh. Zach is avging 20 and 10 and put up 28pts tonight. Bosh also has some nice fundamental skills.

Personally i've been a lil dissapointed in him this season... In no way have I given up on the guy. Obviously the whole team hasn't been what we thought but I'd love them to try and get Amare more involved...

I also think Frank needs to go... change will send a shock throughout the team, and say, this is BS and is not good enough.



Someone like Del Harris? I wonder if he'd leave don Nelson for a head coaching job.

 

[Chaplin]

Originally posted by Billythekid
This is not a critisism of any kind, but are we overrating Amare and expecting too much from the guy? I mean he is still as raw as anything. Alot of people are labelling him the future PF of this league, but you look at guys like Zach Randolph and even the emerging Chris Bosh. Zach is avging 20 and 10 and put up 28pts tonight. Bosh also has some nice fundamental skills.

What's up Billy?

Anyway, not to sound bad, and you know it's not personal, but that's crap. I don't think anybody is expecting Amare Stoudemire to be a superstar right now. We do expect some kind of consistency, just like we expect from JJ. Amare seems to be averaging better numbers this season, but really, PF is the least of our problems right now. That said, he does get easily frustrated and needs some help on the mental side of the game, but I am more than willing to give him a chance considering he'd only be a college sophomore right now if he went to school. And don't underestimate the value of college basketball education.

Randolph is playing well, but he, like Jermaine O'Neal, wasn't a sensation right away. I'm far from disappointed in Amare as a player, but I am disappointed with how the team seems to be handling him. How long until his mother starts barking about trading him?

I do agree, however, that Frank needs to go. Sooner rather than later, but I don't expect him to go.

 

[scotsman13]

well if everyone here wasnt blaming jj for the suns problems i wouldnt be sending my time defending him. look back over the summer and see how many posts i made about penny or last year. heck my post over the summer were on how much i liked zarko and thought we would see a lot of him.

of late my posts have been about jj and some about fj because i think that a lot of your are being unfair to him. as far as penny he has played 17 games this season why should we hold him to the same standards that you are holding jj to? why do you blast him for careless passes, total lack of defense and all round looking like he is out there to only be seen by his fans and make sure he gets another chance to be in with trya banks?

ok you want me to blast others? ok here you go. first of all how come this team wont get amare the ball in a scoring position. half the time when amare gets the ball the spacing is so bad that he is double and tripled by the other team without them even having to take 2 steps. what is up with marion? my heck where is the fire that we have seen out of him before? please someone light a fire under his a$$. FJ please cut off jj from taking the 3. he just isnt shooting it well. fj you need plays for this team. 4 plays wont cut it. as much as you would like to have this team out and running you need to plan for them to get in a half court set. when they do they need to be able to have some plays to run. we need to be running iso plays for marion and amare and jj at the beginning of the game and let them get starting and get them going. fj the best that we have looked this year is when we have had the team out there trapping, not just the second team but first team. fj if someone doesnt want to play defense beanch them. it doesnt matter if they are a captian or not. marbury you have taken a big step back this year on your defense step it up again. that was one of the big things we had going for us last year. FJ give the rookies more time. barbosa and zarko when he comes back need atleast 15 mins a game. period.

 

[Joe Mama]

Originally posted by cheesebeef
you know if you could see that both guys have sucked for the majority of the season - maybe we would take your ******** seriously. Besides - JJ had 16 games to look like crap - Penny deserves at least two before you post something as stupid as you usually do.

One thing I do respect about Scotsman is that he does not make any personal attacks or comments on the other posters. Cheesebeef, you've been a great contributor on this message board. I know Scotsman's one track mind has become a bit irritating to some of us who don't agree with him, but attacked his ideas without attacking him personally. Thanks.

Joe Mama

 

[Billythekid]

Originally posted by Chaplin
What's up Billy?

Anyway, not to sound bad, and you know it's not personal, but that's crap. I don't think anybody is expecting Amare Stoudemire to be a superstar right now. We do expect some kind of consistency, just like we expect from JJ. Amare seems to be averaging better numbers this season, but really, PF is the least of our problems right now. That said, he does get easily frustrated and needs some help on the mental side of the game, but I am more than willing to give him a chance considering he'd only be a college sophomore right now if he went to school. And don't underestimate the value of college basketball education.

Randolph is playing well, but he, like Jermaine O'Neal, wasn't a sensation right away. I'm far from disappointed in Amare as a player, but I am disappointed with how the team seems to be handling him. How long until his mother starts barking about trading him?

I do agree, however, that Frank needs to go. Sooner rather than later, but I don't expect him to go.

Hey Chap, Things are good... cept for this damn Suns team!

I think Amare does need more help. The mental side of things, it's easy to forget he's only a year out of highschool. ok, maybe amare's play is a lesser concern then others, but I think generally our squad is not as good as lot of people say... I think our potential is very good but currently, we don't look that special.. on court and definatley not on paper.

but what we lack in actual skill and talent we can always and should always make up for in heart and hustle, which doesn't seem as apparant this season. We were the 4th qtr team last season... be it i think you need often a lil bit of luck in pulling out tight games... but this season, i've only seen a hand full of games... the desire and hunger doesn't seem to be there... almost as if we've come in with high expectations, and those expectations will win games... hopefully now it's time to wake up gain that respect back which we've lost.

As many have pointed out... rival teams must lick there lips when they play us. I'm sure 95% of teams write on their white boards... ZONE!





GO SUNS

 

[Cheesebeef]

Originally posted by Joe Mama
One thing I do respect about Scotsman is that he does not make any personal attacks or comments on the other posters. Cheesebeef, you've been a great contributor on this message board. I know Scotsman's one track mind has become a bit irritating to some of us who don't agree with him, but attacked his ideas without attacking him personally. Thanks.

Joe Mama

Yeah - public apology from me to Scotsman for last night's behavior - I was out of line - and apologize - I would have written this last night - but felt like crap and needed to put my head to bed. I'm just really frustrated with this club right now and there doesn't seem to be (right now) andything to get excited about this season - they are way underachieving. Again - my apologies to Scotsman - and even if I hand't made Joe Mama play Mom - I would have apologized anyway - out of line is out of line - did I say that already?