Washington Post: Phoenix Has Become Valley of the Subsidy

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Originally posted by wallyburger
Do the tourists really come to Arizona to go to Wal - Mart?

that, and the grand canyon.

 

[Ryanwb]

Originally posted by wallyburger
Do the tourists really come to Arizona to go to Wal - Mart?

I have to go there tomorrow and I will take a picture of the rows and rows of out of state plates. Pretty much if you were playing the license plate game, you could finish in 3 minutes if you don't allow Alaska and Hawaii

 

[BigRedArk]

Why is it that the media/press conviently fail to mention all of the jobs that are created and the turnover of dollars in the local community due to the building of a stadium. They only talk about how rich the ownership is getting on the back of the taxpayers. Won't fans pay a sales tax on the concessions and possibly parking at these events? Seems like a few jobs ought to be created to take care of the fans at the games too i.e. concession workers, security personnel, parking attendants, etc. Also, the county that Glendale is in (Maricopa?) might also be the beneficiary of property tax dollars on the stadium. If that is true, won't the various school districts in the county benefit from that?

 

[vince56]

Originally posted by BigRedArk
Why is it that the media/press conviently fail to mention all of the jobs that are created and the turnover of dollars in the local community due to the building of a stadium. They only talk about how rich the ownership is getting on the back of the taxpayers.

Because TRUTH ain't sexy, and it appears you gotta rip someone to sell newspapers these days.

 

[BigRedArk]

vince56 quote:
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Originally posted by BigRedArk
Why is it that the media/press conviently fail to mention all of the jobs that are created and the turnover of dollars in the local community due to the building of a stadium. They only talk about how rich the ownership is getting on the back of the taxpayers.
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Because TRUTH ain't sexy, and it appears you gotta rip someone to sell newspapers these days.

Sad but true vince.

 

[40yearfan]

Two different people wrote that article and you can tell where the first one stops and the second one starts. At least they printed both sides.

 

[Bobcat]

Originally posted by ajcardfan
I'm surprised the article didn't point out the Cards stadium funding are "tourist taxes". Then, they find two retards that live here bitching about the funding, when they haven't put one penny towards it.

You are so right!!! Julie Tate has it all wrong. WDC cannot get a major league baseball team to play there. I think that it is just sour grapes on her part.


Allan

 

[Southpaw]

Originally posted by BigRedArk
Why is it that the media/press conviently fail to mention all of the jobs that are created and the turnover of dollars in the local community due to the building of a stadium. They only talk about how rich the ownership is getting on the back of the taxpayers. Won't fans pay a sales tax on the concessions and possibly parking at these events? Seems like a few jobs ought to be created to take care of the fans at the games too i.e. concession workers, security personnel, parking attendants, etc. Also, the county that Glendale is in (Maricopa?) might also be the beneficiary of property tax dollars on the stadium. If that is true, won't the various school districts in the county benefit from that?

Wouldn't the job creation take place if the stadium was built with owner's money or fans ticket surcharges ? Outside of construction jobs, those concession jobs aren't exactly career builders with pension plans.

 

[RedStorm]

Originally posted by ajcardfan
I'm surprised the article didn't point out the Cards stadium funding are "tourist taxes". Then, they find two retards that live here bitching about the funding, when they haven't put one penny towards it.

I agree with you. However, they are saying that it is money that could be used for other things. That is the bottom line.

I think the best arguement is that fact that a major portion of our local economy is tourism. Hosting major sporting events boost that part of our economy. As people see this area on TV and in person, they come back for vacations. That is the big picture that people need to keep in mind.

I have a question about the Gov's comment

Napolitano, a Democrat who took office after the Cardinals' stadium deal was approved, said the battle over the merits of the team's arrangement with local authorities was over. But she cautioned that the team no longer has any excuses, and will soon need to start showing results on its state-of-the-art playing field.

"The Cardinals have to establish some credibility," the governor said.

What does she plan to do if the Cards don't "establish some credibility"? What can she do?

As far as attendance, winning cures all ills. That is why I only judge this team on the wins and loses and how they perform doing so. The rest of the percieved "change" in this organization means squat. Wins is what matters in sports. To quote Lombardi (paraphrased) "..A good loser is still a loser.."

 

[ajcardfan]

Originally posted by RedStorm
I agree with you. However, they are saying that it is money that could be used for other things. That is the bottom line.

I've heard that many times since the propistion was passed. The smart thing about the way this stadium was funded was that they generated a NEW source of tax money. So, you can say "The money would be better spent on schools." Well, "Duh!", of course it would. But, the money wouldn't be there to spend AT ALL if the stadium wasn't there. These guys could've voted down Prop. 302 and come up with their own legislation to implement a tax to fund whatever they thought should be funded instead.

Over the long term, I think this will be one of the smartest moves this state has ever made. Especially as the youth sports projects continue to get millions of dollars they otherwise never would've gotten. People didn't believe those things would ever get paid for, but they are. By the time the Super Bowl comes around, it'll be obvious that the Cards stadium was a much better deal for all than any of the 3 other stadiums/arenas funded with public funds here.

 

[BuckeyeCardinal]

Not Closet

Originally posted by Ouchie-Z-Clown
ah, see, here i disagree . . . well, kind of. yeah, the overall perception will take time to change, but just one winning season will bring closet fans out to the stadium. i am telling you, this state is just champin' at the bit to embrace an nfl football with the same fervor that we've seen for the suns in the past. two winning seasons and this will be cardinals territory.

The correct term is Bandwagon fan....which Websters defines as "someone who only goes on the successful side".

They can't stand defeat because they're not true fans. We'll keep them as long as we win.

 

[RedStorm]

Originally posted by ajcardfan
I've heard that many times since the propistion was passed. The smart thing about the way this stadium was funded was that they generated a NEW source of tax money. So, you can say "The money would be better spent on schools." Well, "Duh!", of course it would. But, the money wouldn't be there to spend AT ALL if the stadium wasn't there. These guys could've voted down Prop. 302 and come up with their own legislation to implement a tax to fund whatever they thought should be funded instead.

Over the long term, I think this will be one of the smartest moves this state has ever made. Especially as the youth sports projects continue to get millions of dollars they otherwise never would've gotten. People didn't believe those things would ever get paid for, but they are. By the time the Super Bowl comes around, it'll be obvious that the Cards stadium was a much better deal for all than any of the 3 other stadiums/arenas funded with public funds here.

I agree with you that funding these stadiums could be one of the best moves we made for our economy in some time. We already scored the Super Bowl. The NHL, I thought, is considering PHX for there all-star game. BB should consider us soon for a BB all-star game. There is also the Fiesta bowl and possibly getting the final four. Most of those never would have happened without the stadiums that we have built. Much less saving the cactus league and drawing some teams from Fla.

Those can pay off in the long term and will make our investment seem small compared to what we reap.

 

[Bobcat]

Originally posted by wallyburger
Wouldn't the job creation take place if the stadium was built with owner's money or fans ticket surcharges ? Outside of construction jobs, those concession jobs aren't exactly career builders with pension plans.

Typical "Repulican" response!!! Before Jerry got involved with Amerca West Arena downtown Phoenix was a Ghost town after 6:00pm every night. Since then it has openned up a huge new revinue base for the store owners and propriters of that area. The BOB has more than paid for itself. In the first year alone it's cost to the tax payers was recouped. It is pretty much burdon free. What a mistake, right.

Allan

will comment back later.