BC867
Long time Phoenician!
Chad Tracy had a ball hit right to him at 3B and couldn't field it, to put the tying run on base in the bottom of the 8th.
His (lack of) fielding is an embarrasment. Get 'im the hell out of here.
Webb for Cy Young
- Thread starter Stallion
- Start date
His (lack of) fielding is an embarrasment. Get 'im the hell out of here.
Stallion
Cats, Cards, Bax, Suns
Wins
1. B Webb, ARI 16
1. B Penny, LAD 16
1. C Zambrano, CHC 16
4. C Carpenter, STL 15
4. S Trachsel, NYM 15
4. A Harang, CIN 15
4. D Lowe, LAD 15
4. J Smoltz, ATL 15
ERA
1. B Webb, ARI 2.88
2. R Oswalt, HOU 3.07
3. C Carpenter, STL 3.07
4. J Johnson, FLA 3.10
5. B Arroyo, CIN 3.27
The Republic has a side-by-side stat comparison here.
It's very interesting that they've thrown the exact same number of pitches on the year, yet Brandon has given the D-backs an entire game's worth of additional innings.
They posed the question on Baseball Tonight last night and Tino Martinez brought up the lame "his team is contending" argument to justify his vote for Carpenter. But if Carpenter gets credit for them building their big lead in the division, shouldn't he get some of the blame for the their horrid slide?
With Carpenter's consecutive bad starts down the stretch, I would argue that Oswalt is now a better Cy Young candidate (his team is actually winning).
My ballot would look like this:
1. Webb
2. Hoffman
3. Oswalt
4. Carpenter
One more start to go. Please, D-backs, catch the ball.
GO WEBBY!
1. B Webb, ARI 16
1. B Penny, LAD 16
1. C Zambrano, CHC 16
4. C Carpenter, STL 15
4. S Trachsel, NYM 15
4. A Harang, CIN 15
4. D Lowe, LAD 15
4. J Smoltz, ATL 15
ERA
1. B Webb, ARI 2.88
2. R Oswalt, HOU 3.07
3. C Carpenter, STL 3.07
4. J Johnson, FLA 3.10
5. B Arroyo, CIN 3.27
The Republic has a side-by-side stat comparison here.
It's very interesting that they've thrown the exact same number of pitches on the year, yet Brandon has given the D-backs an entire game's worth of additional innings.
They posed the question on Baseball Tonight last night and Tino Martinez brought up the lame "his team is contending" argument to justify his vote for Carpenter. But if Carpenter gets credit for them building their big lead in the division, shouldn't he get some of the blame for the their horrid slide?
With Carpenter's consecutive bad starts down the stretch, I would argue that Oswalt is now a better Cy Young candidate (his team is actually winning).
My ballot would look like this:
1. Webb
2. Hoffman
3. Oswalt
4. Carpenter
One more start to go. Please, D-backs, catch the ball.
GO WEBBY!
ActingWild
Hall of Famer
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- Posts
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Baseball tonight said last night that Carlos Zambrano could steal the award because voters are also looking at the hitting statistics for pitchers
That would be ridiculous. Isn't there a "silver bat" award or something like that for the best hitting pitcher? The Cy Young should never take into account how well a pitcher handles the bat. Besides, it already does a little because of the W-L factor...typically more hits = more wins.
If it were a perfect world (at least my perfect world), the Cy Young would be determined on ERA, Opponent batting average, strike outs, innings pitched/complete games, strike:walk ratio and finally win/loss but pitcher batting average should never be included.
On a separate note, I know it would be almost impossible to have a pitcher lead the league in every category but still have a bad record...but then I also used to think the Electoral College would never come into play. (and I don't mean that as a political statement). I just don't like that if a pitcher were to dominate the league but had a crappy fielding team behind him and no hitting, that he could lose out on the Cy Young because Joe Schmoe had a 4.00 ERA for a super offensive team and managed to win 20 games.
(steps off soap box)
I don't have insider but here is Jayson Starks article on why he thinks Zambrano deserves it
http://insider.espn.go.com/espn/blo...espn.go.com/espn/blog/index?name=stark_jayson
http://insider.espn.go.com/espn/blo...espn.go.com/espn/blog/index?name=stark_jayson
- Joined
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- Posts
- 38,968
- Reaction score
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Webb should get it, but I think Hoffman will win it.
Frankly, it's a pretty weak race overall. At least, that's how it seems to me.
Frankly, it's a pretty weak race overall. At least, that's how it seems to me.
ActingWild
Hall of Famer
- Joined
- Aug 10, 2002
- Posts
- 1,474
- Reaction score
- 66
I completely agree. Closers only face a batter once a game. No chance for that batter to adjust to the pitcher. Plus, they don't have to pace themselves...they can go all out on every pitch.
I wonder what type of numbers Webb, Zambrano, Carpenter and other top starters would put up as closers.
I guess a good comparison would be John Smoltz. He's always been an All-Star pitcher, but by far his best numbers came as a closer.
Smoltz's average seasons as a healthy starter:
14-9 3.25 ERA 223 innings pitched 194 Ks (.87 Ks per inning)
As a closer:
2002
55 saves 3.25 ERA 80.1 innings pitched 85 Ks (1.06 Ks per inning)
2003
45 saves 1.12 ERA 64.1 innings pitched 73 Ks (1.14 Ks per inning)
2004
44 saves 2.76 ERA 81.2 innings pitched 85 Ks (1.05 Ks per inning)
Dude....
Steve Bedrosian
Mark Davis (Former Dback pitching coach)
Dennis Ecklersley
Rollie Fingers
Bruce Sutter
...whom I forgetting, (oh yeah) Eric Gagne have all won the Cy Young as relievers
p.s..... totally off topic but I met Steve Bedrosian at a baseball card convention circa 1989. Really nice guy, chatted with me about baseball and his favorite players as a kid, he apparently lived here and probably still does. Glad to meet a Philly guy who isn't a jerk
I would love to have Hoffman pitch to me, the guy can't even hit 85 but he gets guys out. Gagne was the lost totally dominating closer, but I agree that Hoffman better not win or else I'll be pissed
Stallion
Cats, Cards, Bax, Suns
Oswalt now has a sub-3 ERA after his big-time performance last night.
If the Astros win that division he probably becomes the favorite.
Webb (and the bats/gloves behind him) really need to come up big on Sunday.
If the Astros win that division he probably becomes the favorite.
Webb (and the bats/gloves behind him) really need to come up big on Sunday.
BC867
Long time Phoenician!
Good time for Chad Tracy to rest.
howlincoyote2k1
Rookie
Webb has one more start this year. He needs to be dynamite in order to win it. I'm not sure about Carpenter or Oswalt as far as their next starts, but if they get beat up a bit and Webb comes up big, I think he might have it locked up.
But then again, Webb plays out here in Arizona, and isn't really a big-name pitcher like Randy Johnson was. That may be a factor that screws him over.
But then again, Webb plays out here in Arizona, and isn't really a big-name pitcher like Randy Johnson was. That may be a factor that screws him over.
FinleyLover
Veteran
Well if Webby's chances depend upon the D being there on Sunday, chances are you can kiss this one goodbye...
I can't even imagine how you would REALLY feel knowing that your chances didn't really depend on you, but your defense in the VERY LAST game of the year.
Maybe the post about the votes already being cast are true and this is all a moot point.
The fact that he is being gracious about his teammates (at least to the media) speaks volumes for his character. He has my vote all the way, last game be damned!!!
I can't even imagine how you would REALLY feel knowing that your chances didn't really depend on you, but your defense in the VERY LAST game of the year.
Maybe the post about the votes already being cast are true and this is all a moot point.
The fact that he is being gracious about his teammates (at least to the media) speaks volumes for his character. He has my vote all the way, last game be damned!!!
Phill11
The Payphone Man
4 innings, 7 ER. Brings his season ERA to 3.10...
What a shame to potentially lose the CY in the last game...
What a shame to potentially lose the CY in the last game...
Stallion
Cats, Cards, Bax, Suns
Wins
1. B Webb, ARI 16
1. B Penny, LAD 16
1. D Lowe, LAD 16
1. J Smoltz, ATL 16
1. C Zambrano, CHC 16
1. A Harang, CIN 16
7. R Oswalt, HOU 15
7. C Carpenter, STL 15
7. T Glavine, NYM 15
7. S Trachsel, NYM 15
7. G Maddox, LAD 15
ERA
1. R Oswalt, HOU 2.98
2. C Carpenter, STL 3.09
3. B Webb, ARI 3.10
4. B Arroyo, CIN 3.29
5. C Zambrano, CHC 3.41
Well, that last game stunk. Win it and Webby is along in first for wins and possibly ERA and the award is his. Now I think Webb is out and it'll go to Oswalt or Hoffman.
1. B Webb, ARI 16
1. B Penny, LAD 16
1. D Lowe, LAD 16
1. J Smoltz, ATL 16
1. C Zambrano, CHC 16
1. A Harang, CIN 16
7. R Oswalt, HOU 15
7. C Carpenter, STL 15
7. T Glavine, NYM 15
7. S Trachsel, NYM 15
7. G Maddox, LAD 15
ERA
1. R Oswalt, HOU 2.98
2. C Carpenter, STL 3.09
3. B Webb, ARI 3.10
4. B Arroyo, CIN 3.29
5. C Zambrano, CHC 3.41
Well, that last game stunk. Win it and Webby is along in first for wins and possibly ERA and the award is his. Now I think Webb is out and it'll go to Oswalt or Hoffman.
SI.com's baseball writer plans to vote for Webb.
