What did people ever see in Bobbie Massie?

[Unsterblich856]

That's a sincere question. I didn't hear his name much during the draft process, but during the draft he was being billed as "a first round worthy prospect" and him falling to us in the fourth was supposed to be a big steal. Sure, the draft is a crapshoot and evaluations don't always amount to much, but I have not seen any redeeming quality to Massie. If he hasn't given up double digit sacks yet, he's creeping really close (8.5 was the last tally I saw), and unlike Levi Brown who offsets his terrible pass blocking by being a good run blocker, I haven't seen anything of note in his run blocking.

Is he really a diamond in the rough that was thrown in before he was ready, or is he just another bad tackle in the long list of bad tackles that we've drafted?

 

[SissyBoyFloyd]

All I will say is that the Cards are famous for picking those guys who fall way down in the draft. It is like the whole league, except the Cards, has done their homework and know the guy isn't worth it. We seem to love grabbing these injury prone and skill lacking sort of guys. Sure there are times we don't "luck out" and pick one of these falling players (Wells). Those would be the times we reach and draft a player way to high (Floyd).

 

[Russ Smith]

He seems like a guy who has a couple of fatal flaws that if fixed, he'll be pretty good.

he plays way too high, so he's off balance. And he isn't as strong as he should be at his size. Fix the playing high thing, weights, and he could be pretty good.

But yeah after a nice start he's gotten much worse.

 

[Unsterblich856]

All I will say is that the Cards are famous for picking those guys who fall way down in the draft. It is like the whole league, except the Cards, has done their homework and know the guy isn't worth it. We seem to love grabbing these injury prone and skill lacking sort of guys. Sure there are times we don't "luck out" and pick one of these falling players (Wells). Those would be the times we reach and draft a player way to high (Floyd).

I wouldn't say Floyd was a reach, he was expected to have gone in the top half of the first round and most likely would have been picked by the Rams right after us if we opted for someone else. Didn't like the pick then and still don't, however.

He seems like a guy who has a couple of fatal flaws that if fixed, he'll be pretty good.

he plays way too high, so he's off balance. And he isn't as strong as he should be at his size. Fix the playing high thing, weights, and he could be pretty good.

But yeah after a nice start he's gotten much worse.

Plays too high, off balance, not strong as his size would indicate, bad footwork, torn to shreds by speed rushers seems to be the hallmark of every Russ Grimm tackle. Quite a coincidence.

 

[kerouac9]

I've seen Massie look good at times, especially in the run game.

I think that Adam Snyder being hurt (is it Snyder's left or right elbow?) has really challenged Massie. The level of competition is higher, and he's seen more than his fair share of elite pass rushers these last few games--few teams are as good on the right side as the group of Cameron Wake-Chris Long-Mario Williams.

Massie is okay handling the outside rush early in the game, but when the DL starts countering his dropstep by bull rushing or making an inside move, he doesn't have any help. That's why he doesn't start looking cover-your-eyes awful until the second and third quarters.

I think that Massie will improve with time, but probably never fulfill the lofty expectations that Mike Mayock helped instill in his biggest proponents on this board.

 

[52brandon]

I really hope we replace Grimm. I think Massie could be a great value, and a legit starter (as opposed to a Cardinals starter) if he gets proper coaching. Another year with Lott should do wonders for his strength too...

 

[Crazy Canuck]

All I will say is that the Cards are famous for picking those guys who fall way down in the draft. It is like the whole league, except the Cards, has done their homework and know the guy isn't worth it. We seem to love grabbing these injury prone and skill lacking sort of guys. Sure there are times we don't "luck out" and pick one of these falling players (Wells). Those would be the times we reach and draft a player way to high (Floyd).

Sam Acho

 

[Bodha]

Massie was good in College for sure.



I distinctley remember him playing vs LSU.


He took on, and did very well, vs current Rams bust Mike Brockers, and future Lotto pick Barkevious Mingo.

I think he gave up 1 sack to one of the two. But otherwise, held his own.

 

[kerouac9]

Massie was good in College for sure.



I distinctley remember him playing vs LSU.


He took on, and did very well, vs current Rams bust Mike Brockers, and future Lotto pick Barkevious Mingo.

I think he gave up 1 sack to one of the two. But otherwise, held his own.

Dude, you're a crazy person. Brockers had a high ankle sprain in camp, but looked active against us, even collecting a sack that was negated by a penalty, IIRC. Started the 3 games that he's been healthy for. It's good that you have the foresight to predict busts draft picks 2 months into their careers.

Just like how you predicted that Ryan Tannehill, Christian Ponder, and Jake Locker would all be busts leaving their teams grasping for another 1st round QB this year.

 

[Bodha]

Dude, you're a crazy person. Brockers had a high ankle sprain in camp, but looked active against us, even collecting a sack that was negated by a penalty, IIRC. Started the 3 games that he's been healthy for. It's good that you have the foresight to predict busts draft picks 2 months into their careers.

Thats hardly an accomplishment

Just like how you predicted that Ryan Tannehill, Christian Ponder, and Jake Locker would all be busts leaving their teams grasping for another 1st round QB this year.

You say im quick to call them busts, but arent you being quick to call them franchise QBs? Goes both ways.

Locker, I believe will not be good in the long run.
Ponder, the jury is out still, but hes looking good.
Tannehill, I still doubt his ability. But I may be wrong.

Cam Newton looked like a future Hofr last year. Struggling this year.

 

[kerouac9]

You say im quick to call them busts, but arent you being quick to call them franchise QBs? Goes both ways.

Locker, I believe will not be good in the long run.
Ponder, the jury is out still, but hes looking good.
Tannehill, I still doubt his ability. But I may be wrong.

Cam Newton looked like a future Hofr last year. Struggling this year.

If I were doing that, I would be. I'm incredibly conservative about my estimation of quarterbacks. I wouldn't have drafted Cam Newton until the middle of round 1, and I wouldn't have drafted RG3 until round 2. You can go back and look it up. And I LOVED Cam coming out of Auburn.

Find once place where I considered any of those guys to be Franchise quarterbacks. There's a lot of room between Franchise Quarterback and "bust," which you don't seem to recognize. You were consigning all three of them to the scrap heap before they'd had 10 NFL starts between them.

 

[Bodha]

If I were doing that, I would be. I'm incredibly conservative about my estimation of quarterbacks. I wouldn't have drafted Cam Newton until the middle of round 1, and I wouldn't have drafted RG3 until round 2. You can go back and look it up. And I LOVED Cam coming out of Auburn.

How can you say Im a poor judge of talent if you saw Loved Cam, yet wouldve deferred RG3 to the 2nd round?

RG3 >>>> Cam, even prior to etiher being drafted. The fact that you saw RG3 as a 2nd rounder is even more confundling. Besides the stats, skill and ability, he was one of the most intelligent, well spoken QBs ive ever seen.

 

[kerouac9]

How can you say Im a poor judge of talent if you saw Loved Cam, yet wouldve deferred RG3 to the 2nd round?

RG3 >>>> Cam, even prior to etiher being drafted. The fact that you saw RG3 as a 2nd rounder is even more confundling. Besides the stats, skill and ability, he was one of the most intelligent, well spoken QBs ive ever seen.

My concerns with RG3 were his coming out of a gimmick offense in college and being small for what you look for in a quarterback. I also wasn't pleased about his unwillingness to do a private workout for anyone and that he played his own rap tracks at his campus pro day. I still think that Cam Newton can be successful. As I said, I'm conservative about these things. If you're going to toss Cam in the dustbin of history and crown RG3, more power to you. I'll remind you about that in a year.

I'm always going to be nervous about spread-option QBs coming out of school. The transition hasn't historically been very smooth. RG3 and the Shanaclan have been successful using a lot of Baylor's plays early in the year; I'm interested to see if that continues as the season goes along, and if Griffin can be successful in more traditional offensive plays.

 

[Jetstream Green]

I liked Griffin coming out (I liked Wilson too and wanted us to draft him in one of the later rounds but I think now his size will eventually do him in) but no one can make an accurate judgement on him till he suffers through his second year like Cam and defenses had a full off season to get his game down. I think it comes down to the third year, how does the guy react to the NFL's reaction to them. The sophomore slump is a real thing with most QBs, and for some the slump sags even deeper for the rest of their careers LOL

 

[Mitch]

Massie's head is still swimming---he was thrust into the starting lineup a little too soon---he has all the physical attributed you want in a RT---he needs technique refinements and experience---give it time.

 

[TJ]

Massie's head is still swimming---he was thrust into the starting lineup a little too soon---he has all the physical attributed you want in a RT---he needs technique refinements and experience---give it time.

Agree, but when & where is he going to get the technique? Our current o-line coach has yet to prove that he can develop a decent lineman in his 6 years with the squad, with maybe the lone exception being Lyle Sendlein, who is also having a terrible season.

 

[Chopper0080]

The Cardinals saw all of his physical talent annd thought they could overcome his technique and work ethic issues. I have actually been pretty pleased with his overall performance given he was thrust into the starting lineup rather than earning his way in.

 

[TJ]

The Cardinals saw all of his physical talent annd thought they could overcome his technique and work ethic issues. I have actually been pretty pleased with his overall performance given he was thrust into the starting lineup rather than earning his way in.

He had a few good games to start, but since the Dolphins game, he's been abysmal.

Some have speculated that because of the replacement refs being afraid to call infractions that he was able to get away with cheap penalties. Coincidentally, the real refs came back for the aforementioned game and he began to struggle mightily.

It's 100% technique, IMO. And I firmly believe it is a coaching concern more so than anything.

 

[Russ Smith]

The interesting thing is first 3 scouting reports I read say same thing. technique needs work(2 of 3 says plays high). Very good upper body strength, relies on size and athleticism.

To me I don't see him as being strong because I see smaller guys overpowering him but I guess that's related to leverage because he plays high and he actually is strong. Everyone seems to think he's strong enough.

The scary thing is 2 of the 3 said showed very little improvement in college got in better shape, but had same technique issues when he left school as he had when he arrived in school.

So we have an uncoachable kid with a guy who can't coach.

 

[Russ Smith]

He had a few good games to start, but since the Dolphins game, he's been abysmal.

Some have speculated that because of the replacement refs being afraid to call infractions that he was able to get away with cheap penalties. Coincidentally, the real refs came back for the aforementioned game and he began to struggle mightily.

It's 100% technique, IMO. And I firmly believe it is a coaching concern more so than anything.

I don't think that with him I think that with Batiste. He was just holding every play with the fake refs.

With Massie as you say it's technique, he's never on balance so guys are just using the old martial arts thing use his momentum against him.

I think with Massie it was simply scouting, Wake figured out what he does wrong and beat him over the head with it, and everyone since then is just copying Wake.

 

[CardLogic]

He seems like a guy who has a couple of fatal flaws that if fixed, he'll be pretty good.

he plays way too high, so he's off balance. And he isn't as strong as he should be at his size. Fix the playing high thing, weights, and he could be pretty good.

But yeah after a nice start he's gotten much worse.

"Fatal flaws, that if fixed..." That's an oxymoron?

I'm just sayin'

 

[Russ Smith]

"Fatal flaws, that if fixed... That's an oxymoron? I'm just sayin'

Well they're fatal NOW, but not necessarily forever.

But you're right I should have worded that differently.

 

[CardLogic]

Well they're fatal NOW...

Yeah, mainly to his QB!

 

[52brandon]

the biggest reason I wanted Massie was because he's already as good as or better than Bridges and he only cost us a 4th round pick

 

[Russ Smith]

Yeah, mainly to his QB!

Yes that's for sure.