What role will JuJo play?

[hsandhu]

Jumaine Jones is a better defender (at the 3 AND the 4) and rebounder than Tim Thomas. That allows KT, Amare, and Diaw more minutes to defend the 5, so adding Jones significantly enhances the frontcourt depth.

What tim thomas was a great defender.

I mean he did limit dirk to 50, after mouthing off against him, in game 5.

 

[JCSunsfan]

huh - all we heard about Salmons was his ball-handling skills makes him attractive tio the Suns because he would be able to handle ball-handling duties as a backup PG and would allow Leo to play off the ball - thus, Salmons wouldn't be coming in for Marion or Bell, in essence, what we were being told was that Salmons was going to part of the plan as far as running backup PG, just like Banks.

Thus, you have to take both into consideration and when you do, it's at best a wash.

I never considered Salmons a legit option at pg. I don't think he has proven that at all. He is a 2-3.

BTW, the team NEVER said ANYTHING about the role Salmons would play, since they never even got him inked. The role speculation was all on the discussion boards.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Jumaine Jones is a better defender (at the 3 AND the 4) and rebounder than Tim Thomas. That allows KT, Amare, and Diaw more minutes to defend the 5, so adding Jones significantly enhances the frontcourt depth.

can I ask you what you're basing this on? Have you actually ever watched Jumaine Jones over the course of a season? The guy is at best an average defender on 3s and actually doesn't have the speed to keep up with most of them and CAN NOT defend the 4. I mean, if Jumaine Jones was such a good commodity as you say, can you tell me why he's going to make the league minimum this season - you know, taking a PAY CUT from the previous year?

I've seen the guy play for an entire year with the Lakers. If he could actually do what you're saying, can you tell me why a coach like Phil Jackson, who preaches defense over everything else just let him go without trying to get him back?

Jumaine Jones is a solid pickup at league minimum, but a lot of people here are beginning to over-rate his abilities.

 

[Cheesebeef]

I never considered Salmons a legit option at pg. I don't think he has proven that at all. He is a 2-3.

uh, well, the Suns apparently did.

 

[JCSunsfan]

If Jumaine Jones is an AVERAGE defender as you say, then he's better than Tim Thomas who was a TERRIBLE defender and a worse rebounder.

Thomas is the better offensive player, but that's not what we are talking about here.

 

[Cheesebeef]

If Jumaine Jones is an AVERAGE defender as you say, then he's better than Tim Thomas who was a TERRIBLE defender and a worse rebounder.

Thomas is the better offensive player, but that's not what we are talking about here.

eh - forget it - this is pointless - and I'm sure Chap will come in any moment and pronounce me in one "my moods", so I'll just say, I hope you're right and that Banks and Jones end up being the moves that provide us with the depth we need.

 

[JCSunsfan]

done

 

[Folster]

JJ and TT comparison in a nutshell.

Jumaine Jones

Born: Feb 10, 1979
Height: 6-8
Weight: 218lbs.


2005-06
Statistics MPG 27.5, PPG 10.5, RPG 4.90, APG 0.8, EFF+ 10.30Position: F

Tim Thomas
Born: Feb 26, 1977
Height: 6-10
Weight: 240 lbs.

2005-06
Statistics MPG 22.9, PPG 10.3, RPG 4.50, APG 0.7, EFF+ 9.59Position: F

Pretty similar numbers. TT was slightly more productive with lesser minutes. The Suns system probably makes the numbers hard to compare. The biggest difference is TT's size. The extra two inches and 22 pounds(I suspect he was heavier than listed in Phoenix) allowed him to defend 5's, although, how well he did is open for debate. I thought TT played fairly solid D in the playoffs considering how short handed we were. JJ won't be able to guard 5's but I'm sure D'antoni will make him regardless. All in all it was a great pick-up.

Edit: I just read in another thread that NBA.com measurements are out dated so apparently JJ is listed at 242 on other sites.

 

[Errntknght]

I was very skeptical about Salmons being able to help much at PG, and to me that was crucial. Banks may not be able to give Steve much rest either but the odds are a lot better he will than that Salmons would have.

As far as Jumaine Jones vs. TT, I don't think the former could have helped the team last year in the playoffs the way Tim did. On the other hand I have doubts about how well Tim would do on the Suns this coming year - he has the ability to get himself in D'Antoni's doghouse with his lackadaisical regular season play. I expect Jumaine will give the effort during the regular season and be a useful piece but my faint memories of his play are more in line with what the observer of him on the Lakers said about him than the typical expectation of him on here. In other words he won't be filling in much at PF unless we have heavy injuries and he won't be displacing Bell when it comes to defending the tough SFs that Raja takes on. He's deep insurance in general and specific insurance against James Jones not being able to find his shot. The odds that he'll step his game in the playoffs are rather long I imagine, too.

 

[Chaplin]

eh - forget it - this is pointless - and I'm sure Chap will come in any moment and pronounce me in one "my moods", so I'll just say, I hope you're right and that Banks and Jones end up being the moves that provide us with the depth we need.

The only thing I would say is that your "uhs" and "ehs" are condescending, but we all do that once in a while, so it's not a big deal. But you certainly do have some experience with seeing Jones in LA. But also keep in mind, nobody is saying he is Bruce Bowen here.

Actually, I think if you are going to start talking about Salmons as a PG, then you have to start talking about guys like Boris Diaw as a PG as well. We all know he isn't one, but he certainly can assume the role. And that becomes a much larger issue that isn't restricted to TT/Salmons vs. Banks/Jones.

I know you have a lot of love for Tim Thomas, Cheese, you have barely stopped singing his praises all summer, but I'm curious--do you agree with Stefan that Tim Thomas ALONE is better than both Jones and Banks? You've also never really acknowledged any of TT's weaknesses and risks with signing him to a long contract. I'm curious what your thoughts are on that.

 

[JCSunsfan]

I know you have a lot of love for Tim Thomas, Cheese, you have barely stopped singing his praises all summer, but I'm curious--do you agree with Stefan that Tim Thomas ALONE is better than both Jones and Banks? You've also never really acknowledged any of TT's weaknesses and risks with signing him to a long contract. I'm curious what your thoughts are on that.

I certainly would not go that far. TT is a better offensive player--inside and out. He's also bigger.

But with KT and Amare coming back this year TT would have had a reduced role anyway. Jum. Jones, to me is a similar player and at a much more appropriate salary for his slot in the rotation. Plus, he's only one year, so we will have more flexibility next year.

I'll just throw this out there, since its summer and no one is posting much. Would you send the Atlanta pick and the Boston pick along with Banks to NO for Chris Paul?

Not that I am promoting such a trade, I am just trying to guage the market value of the picks and Paul.

 

[Chaplin]

I'll just throw this out there, since its summer and no one is posting much. Would you send the Atlanta pick and the Boston pick along with Banks to NO for Chris Paul?

Not that I am promoting such a trade, I am just trying to guage the market value of the picks and Paul.

Not sure, if you assume that 1) we get the Atlanta pick, and 2) we would potentially get a big man with that pick. So it would be rookie big man, best available at #21 or wherever Boston's pick will be and Banks. I love Chris Paul, but that price seems awful steep.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Let's not get carried away now- Jones and Banks are not better than Thomas and Salmons. Very good for the price we got them at, but by no means better than Thomas alone, let alone Thomas and Salmons together.

it also means our second choices are smaller (on an already small team) than our first choices. and that will effect us defensively to a certain extent. even though jumaine and banks are excellent defenders, they are still going to be defending "a position up" most of the time while TT and salmons would have been the right size, or bigger, on most of their defensive assignments therefore creating less mismatches.

don't get me wrong, i love both signings. but i am also realistic enough to recognize the drawbacks.

 

[Chaplin]

it also means our second choices are smaller (on an already small team) than our first choices. and that will effect us defensively to a certain extent. even though jumaine and banks are excellent defenders, they are still going to be defending "a position up" most of the time while TT and salmons would have been the right size, or bigger, on most of their defensive assignments therefore creating less mismatches.

don't get me wrong, i love both signings. but i am also realistic enough to recognize the drawbacks.

I can see your point with Salmons, but to say that TIm Thomas would provide anything on defense is wishful thinking, even when we consider his overachieving when he was with the Suns.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

I can see your point with Salmons, but to say that TIm Thomas would provide anything on defense is wishful thinking, even when we consider his overachieving when he was with the Suns.

i am not saying that he was good on defense, by any means. but in the playoffs he had spurts of being productive when playing against a banging big. i don't think jumaine will be as strong defensively in the post and cannot possibly even entertain the thought of defending true centers as tt can ATTEMPT to do.

 

[Chaplin]

i am not saying that he was good on defense, by any means. but in the playoffs he had spurts of being productive when playing against a banging big. i don't think jumaine will be as strong defensively in the post and cannot possibly even entertain the thought of defending true centers as tt can ATTEMPT to do.

Lucky for us there are only 2 true centers left in the league.

 

[devilalum]

Lucky for us there are only 2 true centers left in the league.

Eric Dampier and Shaq?

 

[Chaplin]

Eric Dampier and Shaq?

I was thinking Yao Ming and Shaq, but perhaps I should have said 2 "servicable" true centers.

 

[George O'Brien]

Since I haven't seen Jumaine play (at least not recently), I'm curious. Was Devean George vastly better than Jumaine defensively? He got a two year deal for $4.16 million.

Devean George
Los Angeles Lakers
Position: F
Height: 6-8 Weight: 235
College : Augsburg
Player file | Team stats

2005-06 Statistics
PPG 6.3
RPG 3.9
APG 1.0
SPG .93
BPG .48
FG% .400
FT% .674
3P% .313
MPG 21.7

Jumaine Jones
Charlotte Bobcats
Position: F
Height: 6-8 Weight: 218
College : Georgia
Player file | Team stats

2005-06 Statistics
PPG 10.5
RPG 4.9
APG .8
SPG .89
BPG .29
FG% .405
FT% .727
3P% .343
MPG 27.5

 

[JCSunsfan]

I think he just fell through the cracks. Teams first went after the top players. Then they went after the players that they thought they had a chance to get for less money. Every year there is a player or two who just got missed once everyone has spent their money.

I remember that we got Rodney Rogers that way years ago.

 

[George O'Brien]

This was certain a feast or famine year for free agents.

 

[Bada0Bing]

Eric Dampier and Shaq?

Just ask Eric Dampier. That's one of the funniest things I've heard in a long time. (Eric Dampier calling himself the 2nd best center in the NBA) That joke will never get old in my house.

 

[George O'Brien]

Just ask Eric Dampier. That's one of the funniest things I've heard in a long time. (Eric Dampier calling himself the 2nd best center in the NBA) That joke will never get old in my house.

He misspoke. He meant the second best center on the MAV.