What the Cardinals Were/Are Thinking?

[Mitch]

Clearly the plan this off-season has been focused primarily on keeping last year's roster intact, as much as that is possible. From the tenders that were offered to 3rd year players such as Hyphen and Rashad Johnson---to the re-signings of T Levi Brown, T D'Anthony Batiste, WR Early Doucet, K Jay Feely, LS Mike Leach and P Dave Zastudil---to younger players such as T D.J. Young and WR Jaymar Johnson---to awarding of the $7M roster bonus to QB Kevin Kolb---what the Cardinals have done is stayed in house.

The two UFA signings of note, G/T Adam Snyder and CB William Gay were coupled respectively with decisions to release RG Rex Hadnot and to decline matching the Dolphins' $5-6M per year deal for CB Richard Marshall.

The belief is that having won 7 of the last 9 games with this roster---and with the luxury this time around of having a full off-season training regimen---that the Cardinals can continue to build on continuity and momentum.

Only time will tell whether this was the best and correct strategy---

A tantalizing reality in contrast is that New England Patriots, fresh off their 5th Super Bowl appearance in the last decade---found the means to sign 12 new free agents, in addition to their annual manipulation of the NFL Draft to the point where this year, after the Cardinals pick at #13, the Patriots have 4 of the next 49 picks---thus the Patriots will have already selected 4 players before the Cardinals pick again at #80...unless, of course, the Patriots elect to trade one or two of the picks for future 1st and 2nd rounders.

Another tantalizing reality is that despite the focus on keeping their own players---it looks like the Cardinals are heading into the draft still very unsettled at the starting RT, #2 WR, and SOLB positions.

I guess the most significant question is---do the coaches already believe they have answers (short and/or long term) at those positions? For example, are the coaches seriously considering starting D'Anthony Batiste at tackle or guard (switching Snyder to T), starting Andre Roberts or Early Doucet at #2 WR, and starting Stewart Bradley at SOLB (or switching Sam Acho over with O'Brien Schofield starting at the WOLB)?

The Cardinals typically do not like to start rookies---and realistically only the #13 pick is going to have a decent chance to start...and possibly the #80.

So what do you think the Cardinals' rationale is?

Here's a position by position hunch:

QB: While this is being billed as an open competition, the financial commitment the Cardinals have made to Kevin Kolb would suggest that he will be the starter. If he falters early in the year as he did last year---how many games would it take before he gets the hook? Hopefully this time around Kolb gets the team off to a great start and the situation is moot---but, on the other hand if Kolb falters, let's hope the team isn't 1-6 again before a change is made.

Draft considerations: late round pick or UCFA...or so one would think.

RB: Status quo all the way.

Draft considerations: mid to late round pick, if at all?

FB: Status quo.

Draft considerations: very doubtful.

WR: It's interesting that on the first day of free agency the Cardinals were hosting WR Chaz Schilens---to no avail---and there has been no interest in any other free agent. Perhaps, the attempt to add Schilens was out of concern for possibly losing Early Doucet---and once Doucet re-signed the need was satisfied.

However, I believe that because the Cardinals have made little effort to try to sign a legit #2 WR this off-season, this puts a WR squarely in play at #13 (Michael Floyd, Kendall Wright or Stephen Hill) or if not there certainly at #80 (A.J. Jenkins, Ryan Broyles, T.Y. Hilton, Jeff Fuller, Marvin McNutt, Nick Toon, Dwight Jones, Greg Childs, Marvin Jones, etc.).

T: I think the Cardinals do not intend to move Levi Brown to RT...and never have. He is staying at LT where he showed significant improvement the second half of last season---and they are paying him as such. The plan at this point seems very simple---and it is a give away---we are either going to see one of the following three players taken at #13: RG David DeCastro, Stanford, RT Riley Reiff, Iowa or RG/RT Cordy Glenn, Georgia...and this is probably the order of preference. if DeCastro is the pick, Adam Snyder kicks out to RT---Reiff would start at RT with Snyder remaining at RG---and with Glenn the coaches could see where he most naturally fits, either at RG or at RT and put Snyder next to him in either case.

Yet---what if the Cardinals take WR Michael Floyd at #13?---then the #80 pick HAS to be a guard or tackle for the right side (Amini Silatolu, Midwestern St., Brandon Brooks, Miami (OH), Brandon Washington, Miami, James Brown, Troy, Zebrie Sanders, Florida St., Jeff Allen, Illinois, Bobbie Massie, Mississippi, Matt McCants, UAB, Mitchell Schwartz, California, Brandon Mosely, Auburn, Kelechi Osemele, Iowa St., Nate Potter, Boise St., Levy Adcock, Oklahoma St.)

TE: Status quo.

Draft considerations: Only TE Coby Fleener, if the coaches feel he is the game changer they need---but they would have to trade down from #13 one would assume.

NT: Status Quo.

Draft considerations: little to none.

DE: Status Quo, especially if they re-sign Vonnie Holliday, to keep their 3 man sub package of Nick Eason, David Carter and Vonnie Holliday. And if Holliday elects to retire, the coaches like Ronald Talley.

Draft considerations: possibly a late round pick to develop on the PS.

ILB: Status Quo. It is significant that the Cardinals are sticking with Stewart Bradley---and they continue to like Paris Lenon as the starter. This, imo, rules out Luke Keuchly at #13 due to other priorities, even though he may be the BPA if he is still on the board.

Draft considerations: I think that if Emmanuel Acho or James-Michael Johnson is on the board at #151 (5th round)...the Cardinals could make a move there---but not before.

OLB: The Cardinals are going to make one of their first three picks (#13, #80, #112) on an OLB. If Melvin Ingram, South Carolina is surprisingly still on the board at #13---he's the one pass rusher they would take there---but ONLY if DeCastro and/or Floyd have been taken.

The most likely scenario is with the #112 pick. They picked a 4th round gem in Sam Acho last year and used the 4th round pick on O'Brien Schofield the year before and i see them trying to doing it again. The sleepers I see here are Jaquies Smith, 6-3, 255, Missouri or Jake Bequette, 6-4, 264, Arkansas.

The Wild Card is Shea McLellin, 6-3, 248, Boise St. But, he is quickly moving up draft boards so much so that Mel Kiper in his 4.0 Mock today has McLellin going to the Patriots at #27---and I could see them making that pick because McLellin is relentless.

CB: Status quo now that William Gay has been signed.

Draft consideration: mid to late round is possible.

S: Status quo if the Cardinals sign James Sanders, which I think they will. This likely rules out Mark Barron at #13---but you never know because if there is player on defense in this draft who epitomizes what Ray Horton wants it's Barron.

ST: Status quo, with Feely, Leach and Zastudil re-signed.

Draft consideration: possibly a punter like Bryan Anger, California with one of the two 6th round picks, who would have a legitimate chance to unseat Zastudil.

Summary:

Cardinals' Board at #13:

1. David DeCastro, G, Stanford
2. Michael Floyd, WR, Notre Dame
3. Melvin Ingram, OLB, South Carolina.

One of these three will be the newest Cardinal.

If DeCastro is the pick:

Cardinals' Board at #80:

1. Shea McLellin, OLB, Boise St.
2. Juron Criner, WR, Arizona
3. A.J. Jenkins, Illinois

If Floyd is the pick:

At #80:

1. Shea McLellin, OLB, Boise St.
2. Bobbie Massey, RT, Misissippi
3. James Brown, G/T, Troy
4. Jeff Allen, G/T, Illinois

 

[juza76]

the signing of jamie sanders make me think if they will draft a safety like iloka or the guy from l.s.u they can trade kerry rhodes and his high contract..next season i would like to see what they will do with wilson cause is old and has a high salary too..it s really sad starting an offseason with few chances of taking good players cause we have no room in salary cap

 

[82CardsGrad]

Nick Toon is going to be a marginal back-up WR at best... certainly nothing close to a potential #2 WR in the NFL! In fact, I wouldn't be surprised at all if he never sticks with a team and is not in the NFL at all...

 

[illazmatic]

Great write up. For the 13th pick, if both OT Rieff and WR Floyd are gone, I would love to see them trade down and scoop up a few other picks. With no 2nd rounder, those extra picks could really help us address those needs that were outlined in your post. There should be some solid players available later in the 1st (Martin, Glenn, Adams at OL... Hill, Wright at WR) and would add some much needed depth to this team. Also, would absolutely love McLellin at 80 if he falls that far.

 

[JeffGollin]

Seven hours ago, my mock had it between Ingram and DeCastro. I gave it to Ingram because he'd be more likely to make a bigger impact to win games.

After the Bell signing, I switched back to DeCastro because, in case of BPA ties, you give it to the guy who best fills the need.

It also increases the possibility we'll be more amenable to trading down and grabbing a tacke project (i.e. a G who might project to tackle) like J Brown, Glenn or even Adams at a better value-point plus getting another Day 2 pick.

 

[Chopper0080]

For someone who tends to drift off the map a bit, this is a pretty solid post. Good job.

 

[Chopper0080]

I don't think we are locked in at OL in round 1 quite yet. I wouldn't be shocked to see our draft go...

1-Melvin Ingram-OLB
3-Brandon Brooks-RT (I think he is very similar to Cordy Glenn)
4-Senio Kelemente-RG
5-Ryan Broyles-WR

...and I would totally be ok with this.

 

[Dr. Jones]

I was surprised to find out that Ingram was never credited for a forced fumble in his entire college career.

It kind of scares me. Anyone else aware of this?

Decastro has been my guy for a month now. Seems like the perfect to me if Reiff isnt on the board.

 

[juza76]

I don't think we are locked in at OL in round 1 quite yet. I wouldn't be shocked to see our draft go...

1-Melvin Ingram-OLB
3-Brandon Brooks-RT (I think he is very similar to Cordy Glenn)
4-Senio Kelemente-RG
5-Ryan Broyles-WR

...and I would totally be ok with this.

i like this mock but i m not fully convinced about ingram..i saw some video of him..he doesnt have great burst in his first step.not a lot of success running around the tackle and as a bull rusher is not so powerfull..i prefer mercilus coples or bruce irvin in round 3

 

[Dayman]

Their thought process on the O-line remains a mystery to me. Especially with quotes like this:

http://blog.azcardinals.com/2012/04/04/offensive-line-options/

First, a word from offensive line coach Russ Grimm about free agent signee and versatile lineman Adam Snyder. “He was tops on our free agent list as far as offensive line was concerned,” Grimm said. “He’s a big physical guy, he’s smart, he has played a number of positions. Right now we have him penciled in at right guard but if we have to move it around before camp we’ll move it around.”

I don't think that's coach-speak, either. I fully believe Snyder was the target from day one over guys like Bell and Gaither. Urban also talks about the possibility of bringing back Keith and Deuce, so the O-line situation is even more baffling.

Being forced into drafting an O-linemen in round one this year might be a blessing. It seems like the only way the FO will add some legitimate talent to the position instead of the recycled crap we've seen for years.

 

[Cardiac]

I agree with the vast majority of your post Mitch.

Correct me if I'm wrong but it seems the FO has been paying a lot of attention to DE/DL prospects in this draft. It may be a perception thing on my part but the reason it sticks in my mind is that I was thinking the same thing as you and then noticed a couple of predraft visits from college Dlinemen.

I also wonder if the FO sticks with a weighted BPA with more weight placed on talent instead of position. If this is the case then the top 3 needs you have listed may not be addressed with the first 3 picks the Cards make. It will be interesting to see how the draft unfolds.

 

[MrYeahBut]

It wouldn't surprise me in the least if the Cards didn't pick OL until the 6th round. However baffling to us all, I get the feeling the coaches think they are set with what they've got now. What they plan for RT is anyone's guess.

 

[Duckjake]

Clearly the plan this off-season has been focused primarily on keeping last year's roster intact, as much as that is possible. From the tenders that were offered to 3rd year players such as Hyphen and Rashad Johnson---to the re-signings of T Levi Brown, T D'Anthony Batiste, WR Early Doucet, K Jay Feely, LS Mike Leach and P Dave Zastudil---to younger players such as T D.J. Young and WR Jaymar Johnson---to awarding of the $7M roster bonus to QB Kevin Kolb---what the Cardinals have done is stayed in house.

Don't close the book yet. There are still 21 UFA Offensive Tackles who haven't signed AND 14 UFA's from the Pittsburgh Steelers.

 

[Darkside]

Their thought process on the O-line remains a mystery to me. Especially with quotes like this:

http://blog.azcardinals.com/2012/04/04/offensive-line-options/
I don't think that's coach-speak, either. I fully believe Snyder was the target from day one over guys like Bell and Gaither. Urban also talks about the possibility of bringing back Keith and Deuce, so the O-line situation is even more baffling.

Being forced into drafting an O-linemen in round one this year might be a blessing. It seems like the only way the FO will add some legitimate talent to the position instead of the recycled crap we've seen for years.

In my opinion it's totally hard to gauge our line based on last year. Kolb destroyed our line and made them look horrible. He ran INTO sacks. Yes, there were times where dudes totally beat our guys or guys came totally free and that's what people remember, but it wasn't the MAJORITY of the time. It's just what people remember. And the rest of the time, as I said, Kolb ran into numerous sacks and pressures. The worst is running into pressures in my opinion because the line gets tagged for that when mainly it was Kolb's fault.

Even with Skelton--we all praise his poise and pocket awareness but let's just admit that it isn't stellar the way people want to imagine. Just because he didn't run scared like Kolb doesn't mean he has great pocket awareness; it merely means he sucked less than Kolb in that area. There were many times he should have stepped up and yet continued to just stand there like a statue. That also gets credited to our Oline.

I honestly think it's almost impossible to judge our line based on last year. Or even the year before with Derwreck. How can you judge an Oline with such bad QB play? Seriously.

Good QB's make mediocre lines look good. GB has Rodgers who can throw from any position, any body angle--hell, sometimes he seems more accurate throwing on the run than when he's just standing there. Tom Brady, seriously fast release and they run primarily middle crossing patterns so it comes out fast. Even Flacco, whom I don't consider elite, at least he has a stellar running game with some throws to the flats to his RB to keep people off balance. We have none of that.

I don't fault our line as much as most of you, I think our QB's suck so bad they make them look worse. You put any good QB back there with a quick release and our line will improve to average or even good. Even Vick has a terrible, totally terrible, line, but they graded above ours, even though Vick is running around like crazy trying not to die because his line sucks. Same thing with Big Ben. Terrible line, and he doesn't have a fast release, but he's big enough and smart enough to survive long enough to make throws, unlike the scrubs we have behind center. His line grades above ours. Because our QB's make our line look like total sh*t.

It's a complete misnomer to infer that a line makes the QB better. It's the exact opposite. No line is going to make what we have look good. I think it's a shame we blame the line when obviously we've had sub-par QB play since Warner left. I actually blamed our line more when Warner was here than I do now. When Warner got blasted, I knew beyond a doubt it was our line's fault. He had a quick release. He could throw it in the dirt or throw it away. If he got hit it was definitely the line's fault. Now however, I think it's unfair, because our QB play is so terrible and erratic. Our dudes on the line don't know what the freak behind center is going to do, he may run left or right, or backwards, or he may just stand there. You can't play that way.

(Edit: I should add that in 2008 when we lost the SB, Pitt had the worst Oline in football. DD set a record in the SB with 3 sacks. We had pressures all game long. Point is, the offensive line doesn't make the QB. There is no great line on earth that will turn our QB's into actual NFL QB's if they aren't already. The line will not fix those problems. The line may be a concern--and I'm iffy on that because I haven't seen a decent QB play for us since Warner--but it isn't the reason our QB's suck so much ass.)

 

[WildBB]

If DeCastro is the pick:

Cardinals' Board at #80:

1. Shea McLellin, OLB, Boise St.
2. Juron Criner, WR, Arizona
3. A.J. Jenkins, Illinois

If Floyd is the pick:

At #80:

1. Shea McLellin, OLB, Boise St.
2. Bobbie Massey, RT, Misissippi
3. James Brown, G/T, Troy
4. Jeff Allen, G/T, Illinois

I think there's a good chance of it being Ingram. Then you'd def. have to think they're going with a OT or OG at 80. But they'd pass on some very good WR talent to do that and at 112 there should still be some talent left either at ILB or OT as well, so

Also every thing I hear about Massey is buyer beware. Workout wonder.

I like Brown and Scwartz earlier, maybe Potter or Adcock later on.

 

[Dayman]

In my opinion it's totally hard to gauge our line based on last year. Kolb destroyed our line and made them look horrible. He ran INTO sacks. Yes, there were times where dudes totally beat our guys or guys came totally free and that's what people remember, but it wasn't the MAJORITY of the time. It's just what people remember. And the rest of the time, as I said, Kolb ran into numerous sacks and pressures. The worst is running into pressures in my opinion because the line gets tagged for that when mainly it was Kolb's fault.

Your post brings up some excellent points. Well done.

The dire QB situation around here has definitely made the O-line look worse. When Pitt runs a play that leaves a pass rusher virtually unblocked on the edge, which actually does happen from time to time, Ben fires the ball to the other side before the D can take advantage. Kolb, on the other hand, often runs into the unblocked defender for some unknown reason, which makes the play design look moronic. Skelton's infamous back-to-back sacks against the Rams are another prime example.

Still, I have to question the overall talent across the line after ignoring all three positions in the draft for so long. Who was the last Cards' O-linemen to leave the team and receive playing time somewhere else? Keydrick Vincent? Deuce can't stop eating long enough to make another team. Gandy retired once he was done here after washing out in Chicago previously. Teams aren't exactly beating down Brandon Keith's door. Reggie Wells was a bust in Philly. None of these players have very strong skill sets, with the exception of a motivated Deuce.

Someone brought up the possibility of the game passing Russ Grimm by already. I think it's an excellent observation. The days of judging O-linemen by how many regurgitated hot dogs they can eat are over. Today's defensive players require actual athletes to keep them at bay, not a bunch of ornery fat guys. Filling the line with a bunch of Russ Grimm Jrs. just doesn't get it done anymore.

 

[THESMEL]

Well I think Graves and whiz have been solid on the 1st round picks, but after that they get awful loose treading up - so we aint got a 2nd? may be a good thing -Ha Ha?

They have kissed a lot of frogs that stay frogs.

 

[cardpa]

I agree with the vast majority of your post Mitch.

Correct me if I'm wrong but it seems the FO has been paying a lot of attention to DE/DL prospects in this draft. It may be a perception thing on my part but the reason it sticks in my mind is that I was thinking the same thing as you and then noticed a couple of predraft visits from college Dlinemen.

I also wonder if the FO sticks with a weighted BPA with more weight placed on talent instead of position. If this is the case then the top 3 needs you have listed may not be addressed with the first 3 picks the Cards make. It will be interesting to see how the draft unfolds.

Something just dawned on me and that is if the Cards go DE/DL in the first round does that mean the days of CC being a Cardinal are done after the 2012 season? This team has pulled some stupid moves over the years and this would not surprise me. Draft a replacement for CC.

 

[Garthshort]

Mitch, I go back to your thread where you talked about how good a guard Snyder was last year. And then I read Darren Urban's take on the OL. He quotes Russ Grimm who said the team prefers Snyder at OG. IMO, Levi WILL remain at LT, no question, so we do need a RT. That is why I can't see us drafting any thing but a RT at #13, with Reiff our best hope, but if he's gone and I expect that he will be, then we will pick Glenn, though I'm hoping we'll first trade down. DeCastro is a great OG but that will mean moving Snyder to RT, where he's probably not as effective, so the team will have to decide whether they want a line with a VG RG (whether it's DeCastro or Snyder) and a less than VG RT (Snyder), or (Reiff or Glenn). Of course with Reiff or Glenn, they should get better with experience.

 

[Crazy Canuck]

Nice work, Mitch.

I have no thoughts on the draft beyond round one. Feel that if DeCastro is there, he's number one on their board and they'll move Snyder over to RT. If he's off the board then Glenn, to me, is not the reach some imagine and could very well be the choice. He impressed me with his athleticism and strength at the Combine and Senior Bowl.

Opening Day O-line:

Brown, Colledge, Sendlein, Decastro, Snyder

or

Brown, Colledge, Sendlein, Snyder, Glenn

 

[LarryStalling]

Personall, I would not draft a player from U of Iowa at any position this year. Last year that team had an enormous amount of off field problems that should cast a shadow over the entire roster. So I can't see the Cards drafting an OT in the first round since they seem to like squeaky clean people for the most part. I think that the first round draft will be either wr or OLB. I lean toward the OLb that can put his hand on the ground and maybe fill out to play a 3-4 DE. In fact, I don't think that it is totally out of the question that they pick someone to play 3-4 DE with an early pick because I think they are going to have a very difficult time resigning CC and Docket is is getting a little long in the tooth and we need to get someone to groom as his replacement. A selection of Nick Perry or Mercilus would not surprise me in the least bit.

 

[JeffGollin]

Something just dawned on me and that is if the Cards go DE/DL in the first round does that mean the days of CC being a Cardinal are done after the 2012 season? This team has pulled some stupid moves over the years and this would not surprise me. Draft a replacement for CC.

No position is ever deep enough (remember what happened to us at WR last year).

D-line - especially in a 34 - is a physically demanding set of positions. Ideally we should have a 6-man rotation consisting of 6 starters - all of whom are versatile enough to cross-train at the other 2 line positions.

So, no. Drafting a talented lineman in the 1st round shouldn't bode negatively or positively for CC.

(Note - By DE/DL I'm assuming you're not referring to a DE/OLB pass rush specialist like Ingram - He'd be more suited to ROLB or WOLB in a 34).

 

[Russ Smith]

Nick Toon is going to be a marginal back-up WR at best... certainly nothing close to a potential #2 WR in the NFL! In fact, I wouldn't be surprised at all if he never sticks with a team and is not in the NFL at all...

His brother Car is comically good though.

 

[Russ Smith]

I agree that you can't just blame the OL without looking at the QB.

But along those same lines, everyone assumes Snyder was a terrible RT because he gave up a lot of sacks. So the 49ers drafted another RT, very high, and guess what, he gave up a lot of sacks too.

Fact is when Alex Smith feels pressure he tends to roll to his right so the guy rushing from that side will often get sacks that may have been caused by someone else flushing Smith out.

In no way am I saying Snyder is a great player or a great pass blocker but it's hard to know how bad he really is because it doesn't matter who SF puts at RT as long as Smith is the QB, they get sacked alot by guys blocked by the RT.

 

[kerouac9]

The Huddle Report just updated their invaluable and usually accurate Top 200. Quick Cards' mini-mock:

1(13) - Michael Floyd, WR, Notre Dame
3(80) - Billy Winn, DL, Boise State
4(112) - Mitchell Schwartz, OT, California
5(151) - Justin Bethel, CB, Presbyterian
6A(177) - Emmanuel Acho, ILB, Texas
6B(185) - Lamar Holmes, OT, Southern Mississippi
7(221) - Kelcie McCray, SS, Arkansas State