What would it take to sign and trade for Martin?

[slinslin]

Would New Jersey sign and trade Martin for Eisley, the rights to Milos and Joe Johnson?
Not sure if that works because I thought I read that teams could only receive half of the salary the signed and traded player makes.

Kenyon Martin would make 10M$ in his first year I guess. So he would cost the Suns only 1.2M$ caproom. We would still have 14M$ caproom (assuming the Bobcats deal is done and we pay our #7 pick) to sign Nash (7M$) and Dampier or Bowen and a lesser center or something like that depending what we get in the draft.

New Jersey gets Joe Johnson to replace Kerry Kittles who is probably gone.

Martin/Voshkul/FA
Amare/Lampe
Marion/Zarko
Iguodala/Jacobsen/FA (if we didn't get Iggy and instead someone less ready sign Bruce Bowen and a cheap center if not sign a better center)
Nash/Barbosa

New Jersey
McDyess/Collins/Krstic
Abdur-Rahim/Rogers
Jefferson/
Johnson/Harris/Vujanic
Kidd/Planinic/Eisley

Or Kenyon Martin for Zarko, Casey and the rights to Milos? That would cost us about 8M$ capspace and leave 8M$ capspace to go for Nash or Dampier.
I think this would be a lot better for New Jersey than just letting Martin walk because they get some cheap young players and cap relief.

Martin/Voshkul/Williams(vet minimum)
Amare/Lampe
Marion/Smith(#7)
Johnson/Person(vet minimum)
Nash/Barbosa

Nets
Split MLE on Milos and Divac. Sign Dice to the veteran minimum and Krstic to his rookie contract.

Divac/Collins/Krstic
McDyess/Rogers
SAR/Zarko
Jefferson/Jacobsen/Harris
Kidd/Vujanic/Planinic

With all those serbian players they might have a good shot to get Divac.

New Jersey is probably interessted in signing McDyess to replace Martin in any scenario if they let Martin walk.

 

[Joe Mama]

You must be joking. The New Jersey Nets have made some bad deals and some bad signings, but that's just awful. Essentially you are asking the next to trade their all-star power forward and $10 million for Joe Johnson and the rights to Vujanic. I'll bet they could do better than that if you substituted Jahidi White for Howard Eiseley in that deal. At least that's a little more reasonable though.

Joe Mama

 

[slinslin]

I think the 2nd deal is pretty good for New Jersey since they are only taking back 2.3M$ or so in return. It is better than just letting him walk for sure.

 

[slinslin]

Frugal Ratner may cost Nets
Bruce Ratner spent $300 million to purchase the Nets and will dish out millions more to relocate tenants in Brooklyn to make way for a new arena. However, there is growing speculation that the real estate developer may not be willing to pay millions more to keep Kenyon Martin.

Three league sources believe that Ratner, whose bid for the Nets is expected to be formally approved by the league's Board of Governors as early as this week, wants to save money - which could make things difficult when it comes time next month to open talks with Martin, a restricted free agent.

...

The Atlanta Hawks and Denver Nuggets could be two suitors for Martin when the free-agent negotiating period opens on July 1. The Nets will have an opportunity to match any offer to him, but if they can't, they could pull off a sign-and-trade deal. Still, even if they make a trade, it would be a devastating blow to the Nets to lose Martin.

...

"I know how Rod feels, I know how everybody else feels," Martin told reporters last month. "But at the end of the day, it's not his decision. He can go to bat for me until he's blue in the face ... he can go in there and fight tooth and nail, but if a higher power is like 'No,' then it's no."




Nets May Let Martin Walk

In developments that could break up the Nets' trio of Jason Kidd, Kenyon Martin and Richard Jefferson, prospective owner Bruce Ratner has ordered cost-cutting measures that might drastically alter next year's team, according to multiple sources around the club.

...

In developments that could break up the Nets' trio of Jason Kidd, Kenyon Martin and Richard Jefferson, prospective owner Bruce Ratner has ordered cost-cutting measures that might drastically alter next year's team, according to multiple sources around the club.

 

[elindholm]

So if their reason for letting him go is money, they're much more inclined to let him go for free than to take bad contracts in return, aren't they?

Besides, the notion of Martin playing center in the West is absurd.

 

[slinslin]

According to pre-draft measurements he is as big as Amare. Except for Yao and Shaq there is no center Amare couldn't guard anyway. Heck he was pretty effective against Yao as well.
Shaq is probably not in LA anymore if Kobe stays and the Suns have to turn their attention to Martin. And if the Lakers trade Shaq I would guess that they would prefer to trade him to the East.

And the Nets only take 2.3M$ in contracts in return for Martin which is considerably less than what he makes right now so they are definately cutting costs but still get 3 young prospects.

What would be the alternative? Phoenix could just sign Martin to a maximum offer sheet which he would probably accept if he doesn't get one from New Jersey.
In that case New Jersey would lose him for nothing or be forced to matched.


Just sign Martin ~10M$
Sign #2 pick Gordon ~2M$
Sign Vlade Divac ~4M$
Sign Milos Vujanic ~2M$

Amare/Divac/Voshkul
Martin/Lampe
Marion/Zarko
Johnson/Jacobsen
Gordon/Barbosa/Milos

We are going to be one hell of a fastbreak team with that lineup anyway.

 

[slinslin]

Livingston would also be a nice pick if we go for Martin.

Martin might not average a lot of blocks mainly because he is not a good shotblocker in the post against other big guys but he is very good at stepping up and blocking shots of small guys penetrating.

Even if Livingston struggled to keep small PGs infront of him they would have a tough time getting a good shot close to the basket if we play a good defensive system with Marion, Amare and Martin there.

Also Martin is very good defender. He is excellent at fronting his man and denying him the ball. Something Amare and him should be doing a lot if they play together against big lineups.

Actually I think signing Martin would be my favorite plan right now. Wether we just signed him or signed and traded for him.

The Nets wouldn't have a choice where to trade him unless they want to take back maximum salary in return or so there options to sign and trade him are limited to teams under the cap most of them who could just sign him for the max.

If the Suns bring in Martin for a visit and sell him on the Suns the Nets only have 2 possibilities. Let Martin walk for nothing or take a sign and trade from the Suns with the Suns being in the drivers seat.

Gordon/Johnson/Marion/Martin/Amare

That would be one heck of an exciting lineup.

The Pistons won the championship with a similiar lineup. 3 Forwards and 2 guards.

 

[elindholm]

Well, slinslin, I'm not sure what to say. Every time you launch one of these ridiculous fantasy proposals, people tell you it will never happen, and you insist that it could. So until one does happen, I guess there's no point in arguing about it.

Something tells me this isn't going to be the one to break the streak.

 

[slinslin]

Well ok my preference would be just to sign Martin to the max. Is that more realistic for you?

 

[elindholm]

Well ok my preference would be just to sign Martin to the max. Is that more realistic for you?

Yes, significantly, but I still think it would be a bad idea. I disagree that a Martin/Stoudemire front line would match up well with most teams in the league.

 

[sly fly]

According to pre-draft measurements he is as big as Amare. Except for Yao and Shaq there is no center Amare couldn't guard anyway. Heck he was pretty effective against Yao as well.
Shaq is probably not in LA anymore if Kobe stays and the Suns have to turn their attention to Martin. And if the Lakers trade Shaq I would guess that they would prefer to trade him to the East.

And the Nets only take 2.3M$ in contracts in return for Martin which is considerably less than what he makes right now so they are definately cutting costs but still get 3 young prospects.

What would be the alternative? Phoenix could just sign Martin to a maximum offer sheet which he would probably accept if he doesn't get one from New Jersey.
In that case New Jersey would lose him for nothing or be forced to matched.


Just sign Martin ~10M$
Sign #2 pick Gordon ~2M$
Sign Vlade Divac ~4M$
Sign Milos Vujanic ~2M$

Amare/Divac/Voshkul
Martin/Lampe
Marion/Zarko
Johnson/Jacobsen
Gordon/Barbosa/Milos

We are going to be one hell of a fastbreak team with that lineup anyway.

Wow. I can't believe it. I actually like this one!

 

[elindholm]

And by the way, what makes you think that the Suns won't have competitors for Divac's services? Please don't give me the nonsense about the Serbian connection.

 

[devilalum]

Well, slinslin, I'm not sure what to say. Every time you launch one of these ridiculous fantasy proposals, people tell you it will never happen, and you insist that it could. So until one does happen, I guess there's no point in arguing about it.

Something tells me this isn't going to be the one to break the streak.

I read this board everyday and he's never come up with a trade crazier than the Suns trade with the Knicks this year.

Or the one with Utah.

 

[slinslin]

I read this board everyday and he's never come up with a trade crazier than the Suns trade with the Knicks this year.

Or the one with Utah.

 

[elindholm]

I read this board everyday and he's never come up with a trade crazier than the Suns trade with the Knicks this year.

Or the one with Utah.

But he didn't come up with those, either.

 

[slinslin]

We haven't even pointed out the best thing.

Wouldn't it be hilarious if we stole Kenyon Martin from Jason Kidd when Jason Kidd was convinced he would steal Shawn Marion for us?

Take that Ason!

On top of it the usual critics should be satistfied as well.

We keep #7, we keep JJ , we keep Marion (yes chris_sanders ) and we keep the whole team together (scottsman).

 

[elindholm]

Wouldn't it be hilarious if we stole Kenyon Martin from Jason Kidd when Jason Kidd was convinced he would steal Shawn Marion for us?

Yes, that would be great. But Kidd will be traded away from the Nets within the next two years anyway. He wears out his welcome with each team after 3-4 years.

 

[slinslin]

And why do you think it is a bad idea?

Take away Shaq and Yao and who is left that Amare or Martin couldn't defend?

Dampier? Not an offensive force anyway. Nesterovic? Miller? Kaman? Camby? Wright? Gasol?

Against Houston we could probably go big with that roster playing Divac/Amare/Martin/Marion/Johnson. Martin can guard the 3 as he proved against TMac already.
Johnson maybe would struggle against a quick PG but the Rockets would probably not have that guy if they trade Mobley and Francis.

 

[elindholm]

Dampier? Not an offensive force anyway. Nesterovic? Miller? Kaman? Camby? Wright? Gasol?

It's rebounding that would be the bigger problem with some of those opposing big men. Neither Stoudemire nor Martin is going to keep Dampier or Camby off the glass.

And you forgot Duncan. I don't see either Martin or Stoudemire being able to defend him. I think that the Suns would have better success putting a bigger player on Duncan and having their PF guard Nesterovic.

The problem with having two PFs is that you no longer have the option of switching to avoid a bad matchup.

 

[George O'Brien]

Somehow giving a max contract to someone who can only play the position of the team's best player strikes me as absurd.

There is a simple rule of thumb with any "splash deals" - is this the basis for a championship team?

 

[slinslin]

Dampier? Not an offensive force anyway. Nesterovic? Miller? Kaman? Camby? Wright? Gasol?

It's rebounding that would be the bigger problem with some of those opposing big men. Neither Stoudemire nor Martin is going to keep Dampier or Camby off the glass.

And you forgot Duncan. I don't see either Martin or Stoudemire being able to defend him. I think that the Suns would have better success putting a bigger player on Duncan and having their PF guard Nesterovic.

The problem with having two PFs is that you no longer have the option of switching to avoid a bad matchup.

Well the Spurs are another team that the Suns could play big. In that case on JJ's cost. Divac/Amare/Martin/Marion/Gordon.
Martin would match up better with Turkoglu anyway.

And since Martin and Amare both can run the floor it will be interessting if the other teams wouldn't be forced to play two forwards as well.
Even in the halfcourt game Amare and Martin are too explosive to be guarded by a Dampier or so.

 

[elindholm]

Divac/Amare/Martin/Marion/Gordon

That is a hopeless lineup in terms of defending the perimeter.

 

[slinslin]

Why do you think that?

Martin used to defend Tracy McGrady when they played. He has the quickness and athleticism to guard the 3 especially since most of the SFs are getting bigger.

Shawn Marion can definately guard 2 guards as well as 3s probably even better because of the size.

 

[capologist]

Wouldn't it be hilarious if we stole Kenyon Martin from Jason Kidd when Jason Kidd was convinced he would steal Shawn Marion for us?

He never seriously thought that was going to happen. He just said it to get under the skin of Suns fans. Evidently, it worked.