Why we should have traded Kendall instead of cutting him

[Russ Smith]

The thing that always bothered me the most on that move was the cut not trade. I was watching Total Football or something similar yesterday while stuck at home and they were discussing the Jets and martin's hot start and they both instantly said ask anybody on the Jets what's the difference and they'll say Pete Kendall.

Instant Impact: Left guard Pete Kendall. No wonder everyone in the NFL was after Kendall. At 6-5, 292 pounds, Kendall looks like a tackle and plays huge. If Kendall got beat at camp, we didn't see it happen. He is a tough, gritty player who should make a difference down in the trenches.

Kevin Mawae: "Pete's a smart player. He added a lot of depth and experience to the offensive line, so we're doing well right now."


From Newyorkjets.com

At one point on the show they said that Mawae, a good friend of Kendalls, who's now out injured, was so convinced Kendall would help the Jets that he'd been lobbying them BEFORE Kendall was cut to suggest they contact Arizona for a trade because Kendall had told him privately he was concerned that Green didn't like him and might get rid of him.

I realize there's a million and one tv shows on about fantasy football and the like and that comment isn't necessarily the gospel but come on. We know how many NFL teams asked about Kendall after we cut him, we knew where he'd probably be interested in playing (near his home), and we knew MONTHS ago the Jets had LaMont Jordan and his annual I want to be traded campaign going.

If Green really felt he had to get rid of Kendall, why not do so while improving the team in another area? Kendall for Jordan, done deal you may have to throw in a later pick. Kendall may have had to rework his contract(don't know the Jets cap situation) but to just cut a guy with that much market value was outright dumb.

Again, I have no more issue with Green's thinking he needed Pete gone, I just think cutting not trading him was silly and gave up the one realistic chance we had to acquire a RB this year without giving up a high draft pick.


Fire away.

 

[spanky1]

IMO AZ management clearly dropped the ball letting him get away for nothing. I think it's a great example of Green doing a knee jerk without sitting down with Graves and thinking this through carefully.

 

[clif]

The thing that always bothered me the most on that move was the cut not trade. I was watching Total Football or something similar yesterday while stuck at home and they were discussing the Jets and martin's hot start and they both instantly said ask anybody on the Jets what's the difference and they'll say Pete Kendall.

Instant Impact: Left guard Pete Kendall. No wonder everyone in the NFL was after Kendall. At 6-5, 292 pounds, Kendall looks like a tackle and plays huge. If Kendall got beat at camp, we didn't see it happen. He is a tough, gritty player who should make a difference down in the trenches.

Kevin Mawae: "Pete's a smart player. He added a lot of depth and experience to the offensive line, so we're doing well right now."


From Newyorkjets.com

At one point on the show they said that Mawae, a good friend of Kendalls, who's now out injured, was so convinced Kendall would help the Jets that he'd been lobbying them BEFORE Kendall was cut to suggest they contact Arizona for a trade because Kendall had told him privately he was concerned that Green didn't like him and might get rid of him.

I realize there's a million and one tv shows on about fantasy football and the like and that comment isn't necessarily the gospel but come on. We know how many NFL teams asked about Kendall after we cut him, we knew where he'd probably be interested in playing (near his home), and we knew MONTHS ago the Jets had LaMont Jordan and his annual I want to be traded campaign going.

If Green really felt he had to get rid of Kendall, why not do so while improving the team in another area? Kendall for Jordan, done deal you may have to throw in a later pick. Kendall may have had to rework his contract(don't know the Jets cap situation) but to just cut a guy with that much market value was outright dumb.

Again, I have no more issue with Green's thinking he needed Pete gone, I just think cutting not trading him was silly and gave up the one realistic chance we had to acquire a RB this year without giving up a high draft pick.


Fire away.

Of course Russ you may not get this since I am probably still on ignore, but realistically how many teams would have TRADED for an aging lineman who has a history of injuries when they probably (just like what happened) could have gotten him for next to nothing.

Hindsight is 20-20... of course now knowing that 15 or so teams were interested sounds good, but who many would have actually pulled the trigger?

 

[DevonCardsFan]

I think it was to make a statement, that if you do not want to be on board Green will send you on the way. He stated earlier any player that did not want to be there will not be there. Plus Kendall snitched on Green. I think it was to establish Greens role as a dictator, I have no problem with it.

 

[football karma]

I agree Russ --

here is where a more established GM would have helped.

I understand Rod wanting to make Denny feel like he is getting the support he needs, but at the same time, I would have liked Rod to come back with --

"If you dont want him, I understand, but lets try to get something for him, and if we cant, we can always let him go in two weeks"

At the same time, I am just not going to get too worked up over Kendall. To a certain extent, Kendall was similiar to Mac in that the media LOVED him. So of course, the media takes every chance to point out how he is missed.

I sense the strategic element to these moves -- for cap purposes, you have to spend your offensive line money on the tackle positions. Guards and centers are easier to find and cheaper. To have a bunch of money tied up in a center (Kendall) and a guard (Big) meant that you are grossly overpaying for positions that are easier to find, and that makes it tougher pay for a position that is much harder to find (like a new right tackle). I recognize that they are under the cap today, but going forward, when this team gets good, and keeps a 35 player core, all of those players will expect raises going forward.

 

[Russ Smith]

I think it was to make a statement, that if you do not want to be on board Green will send you on the way. He stated earlier any player that did not want to be there will not be there. Plus Kendall snitched on Green. I think it was to establish Greens role as a dictator, I have no problem with it.

I understand why he did it, but here's the timing. August 2nd we sign Fitz, and cut Kendall, same day. Sign my first round pick, cut the guy I think is a mole, a clear statement. August 6th, Shipp gets hurt and we're in desperate need of a RB.

now if we'd cut Kendall AFTER the injury I would be saying Green was beyond stupid, but doing so before it is still shaky at best because as en fuego stated there was no clear reason to do it when he did it. IT wasn't to clear caproom we were under already, it wasn't to meet some roster size limit deadline we were already there. He chose to do it when he did it for a reason, to make a big statement to the team.

and in doing so he took away his chance to trade for someone when Shipp got hurt.

The fact is the day Shipp's injury was announced, everyone started speculating on who we'd try to get in a trade, I guarantee you every NFL team who had a RB they didn't want, contacted us. The Jets were openly looking to upgrade their OL, Herman Edwards said they'd made it a priority to try and do so, but they at best had assumed they would be able to get some depth, they had no expectation that a starter as good as Kendall would come free.

To me it's pretty clear if we had NOT cut Kendall, on August 8th we could have been on the phone working a deal with the Jets. Remember the whole NFL was stunned by this cut, the only one who apparently saw it coming was Kendall(according to Mawae) and even he said he was stunned when it happened. So this wasn't a case of everyone knowing we wanted to cut him, they had no idea.

Obviously if Shipp doesn't get hurt we could still have traded Kendall for something else, pick, player.

 

[Snakester]

I think this was a stupid move period. Kendall was our best lineman. He played at a probowl level and was well liked. He was a straight talker and told it how it was. Denny Green didn't like him for whatever reason and released him. Yes he should have at least traded him and got some sort of compensation but he didn't. Green got his way. Was he right. I disagree. I think this was a dumb move no matter how you look at it, but it's done.

 

[clif]

He played at a probowl level .

says who? How can that be when he missed 2 games last year, 4 in 2002, and 5 in 2001?

 

[conraddobler]

I understand why he did it, but here's the timing. August 2nd we sign Fitz, and cut Kendall, same day. Sign my first round pick, cut the guy I think is a mole, a clear statement. August 6th, Shipp gets hurt and we're in desperate need of a RB.

now if we'd cut Kendall AFTER the injury I would be saying Green was beyond stupid, but doing so before it is still shaky at best because as en fuego stated there was no clear reason to do it when he did it. IT wasn't to clear caproom we were under already, it wasn't to meet some roster size limit deadline we were already there. He chose to do it when he did it for a reason, to make a big statement to the team.

and in doing so he took away his chance to trade for someone when Shipp got hurt.

The fact is the day Shipp's injury was announced, everyone started speculating on who we'd try to get in a trade, I guarantee you every NFL team who had a RB they didn't want, contacted us. The Jets were openly looking to upgrade their OL, Herman Edwards said they'd made it a priority to try and do so, but they at best had assumed they would be able to get some depth, they had no expectation that a starter as good as Kendall would come free.

To me it's pretty clear if we had NOT cut Kendall, on August 8th we could have been on the phone working a deal with the Jets. Remember the whole NFL was stunned by this cut, the only one who apparently saw it coming was Kendall(according to Mawae) and even he said he was stunned when it happened. So this wasn't a case of everyone knowing we wanted to cut him, they had no idea.

Obviously if Shipp doesn't get hurt we could still have traded Kendall for something else, pick, player.

I agree with you completely Russ after thinking about it it was a knee jerk power grab move that I understand but it was still not smart.

The players aren't really that scared by it heck Pete benefited from it and while I am sure it sent a message a better message would have been trading him to a terrible team not the Jets with Pennington.

Kendall basically got rewarded for his behavior and if Green wants to play Dirty Harry maybe he needed to put more thought into it. I think trading him for something of value would have been a ton smarter.

All the better if you could plunk him on a horrible team and make him watch the guy we traded for help us be better than the team he got stuck with.

Instead he is laughing at us and Green so I'd say that whole situation sort of makes Green look like Wylie Coyote launching the ACME rocket at Kendall and having it come back and blow him up, then knock off the ledge which causes him to fall having the last piece of the ledge land on him for good measure.

 

[Duckjake]

This time last year we had all of our veteran Olinemen in the positions many posters seem to want them in this year and a 13 year veteran QB and people were labeling the team one of if not the worst team in NFL history. The names that posters called the Oline were "Fat","lazy","overpaid","horrible".

The two safeties in the Dallas game really set people off.

The best thread title was "we're so bad we made Emmitt cry..."

You gotta love Cardinal football.

 

[Snakester]

says who? How can that be when he missed 2 games last year, 4 in 2002, and 5 in 2001?

The games that he played he played very well. He was a solid player for us whether it was at center or left guard.

 

[Cheesebeef]

The games that he played he played very well. He was a solid player for us whether it was at center or left guard.

I've got a question - if Kendall played at a PRO BOWL level last year and LJ Shelton played at a high level last year and Big was mediocre - with 3 of the five positions on the offensive line at least on the adequate level - can someone tell me WHY THE HELL IT WAS THE WORST O-LINE IN THE LEAGUE? You guys over value our own players. Kendall was a cancer - an slightly above average Guard and nothing special as a center . . . the difference between Curtis this year and last is Pete Kendall - as if Martin didn't light the entire league on fire last year once Pennington came back - what a joke.

 

[vince56]

I think it was to make a statement, that if you do not want to be on board Green will send you on the way. He stated earlier any player that did not want to be there will not be there. Plus Kendall snitched on Green. I think it was to establish Greens role as a dictator, I have no problem with it.

I agree 100%. In Green's first year in Minnesota he inherited an 8-8 football team, and he wound up cutting 4 starters in training camp, including Herschel Walker. I heard Mike Bidwill talking about this during a pre-game show a few weeks ago. Interesting stuff. Green's philosophy is simple... it's not about the players, it's about the team. Do it his way, or you'll be cut.

 

[Cardsmasochist]

same goes for Boston and Plummer

we could have traded both Jake Plummer and/or David Boston using the franchise tag.

Denver's GM said they would have given us a 2nd round pick in a heart beat for Plummer.

I'm sure we could have gotten a 3rd round pick for Boston from San Deigo considering the amount of money the paid him.

 

[Lex]

The quote from the Jets center, and old buddy of LisFrac Kendall, is most interesting.

I think the NFL should open up a tampering investigation.

I had thought Denny may have drafted TWO centers, because HIS old buddy Mike Holmgren had clued him in on what kind of player Kendall was, and decided to go in a different direction.

Now I think LisFranc Kendall may have orchestrated this entire move all by himself.

It'll be fun to see if LisFranc is still playing on Nov 28th at SDS. Perhaps we'll re-visit ol' LisFranc injury.

We should have traded Boston and Kendall for two twelve packs.

 

[Russ Smith]

I've got a question - if Kendall played at a PRO BOWL level last year and LJ Shelton played at a high level last year and Big was mediocre - with 3 of the five positions on the offensive line at least on the adequate level - can someone tell me WHY THE HELL IT WAS THE WORST O-LINE IN THE LEAGUE? You guys over value our own players. Kendall was a cancer - an slightly above average Guard and nothing special as a center . . . the difference between Curtis this year and last is Pete Kendall - as if Martin didn't light the entire league on fire last year once Pennington came back - what a joke.

He didn't, he averaged 3.7 without Chad, and 4.2 with Chad. Better for sure but when you consider the opponents they faced without Chad not surprising, Miami, New England, Dallas and Buffalo(and Washington and Houston).

he did better against NE and Miami with Chad than without. but the point is THIS year he's averaging 5.2 YPC, has more TD's this year than all of last year, and has 2 runs over 20 this year after only 5 all last year. The difference between Kendall, and the guy he replaced, has been big according to the Jets players(not just Mawae).

on September 16th he told the Newark Star Ledger that Pete was his new best friend on the OL(Curtis Martin did) because he's making such a big difference on this OL so far this year.

Admittedly Cincy and San Diego aren't the ultimate test, he'll have bad days before it's over, but the Jets players love Kendall.

The point is simple, Pete had trade value, it doesn't appear Green even tried to trade him.

 

[Russ Smith]

The quote from the Jets center, and old buddy of LisFrac Kendall, is most interesting.

I think the NFL should open up a tampering investigation.

I had thought Denny may have drafted TWO centers, because HIS old buddy Mike Holmgren had clued him in on what kind of player Kendall was, and decided to go in a different direction.

Now I think LisFranc Kendall may have orchestrated this entire move all by himself.

It'll be fun to see if LisFranc is still playing on Nov 28th at SDS. Perhaps we'll re-visit ol' LisFranc injury.

We should have traded Boston and Kendall for two twelve packs.

What they said was that Mawae said Kendall was concerned Green didn't like him, and Mawae told the jets we should trade for him. That's not tampering, the Jets didn't contact Kendall and say hey we want you, a friend of his suggested to his team that Kendall might be available.

Remember you're one of many who says when we drafted 2 centers the writing was on the wall, it would have been logical for the Jets to also assume and see if they could get him no?

 

[Lex]

Russ-

Please.

Name ONE other NFL player under contract, that calls a player on another team, weather it's in his home town or not, and claims the new coach doesn't like him, so perhaps the team in his home town should consider bringing him in somehow.

That's tampering. It's even worse when said player allegedly tries to start a union revolt in the clubhouse when it seemed clear that he was going to training camp till the night before his release.

This whole thing stinks like Pete Kendall did whatever it took to end up on the team he wanted to go to, even though he was under contact here. So forget about a trade, Kendall was only going to one place.

 

[DevonCardsFan]

This time last year we had all of our veteran Olinemen in the positions many posters seem to want them in this year and a 13 year veteran QB and people were labeling the team one of if not the worst team in NFL history. The names that posters called the Oline were "Fat","lazy","overpaid","horrible".

The two safeties in the Dallas game really set people off.

The best thread title was "we're so bad we made Emmitt cry..."

You gotta love Cardinal football.

Good post

 

[Russ Smith]

Russ-

Please.

Name ONE other NFL player under contract, that calls a player on another team, weather it's in his home town or not, and claims the new coach doesn't like him, so perhaps the team in his home town should consider bringing him in somehow.

That's tampering. It's even worse when said player allegedly tries to start a union revolt in the clubhouse when it seemed clear that he was going to training camp till the night before his release.

This whole thing stinks like Pete Kendall did whatever it took to end up on the team he wanted to go to, even though he was under contact here. So forget about a trade, Kendall was only going to one place.

How you took my comment and turned it into Kendall called Mawae and asked him to get a trade going is beyond me. Again on thsi show, total football I believe, they said that mawae had been told by Kendall that he was afraid Green didn't like him, and might get rid of him.
They're good friends, you really think LJ Shelton doesn't have friends on other teams that he told hey i'm afraid I'm going to be cut?

you think NFL players don't talk to each other?

For it to be tampering the Jets had to be working a deal with Kendall while he was still a Card without our knowledge, nothing I said suggests that at all.

Now you're saying the claim that Kendall posted the rules on why the Cards were fined is = to trying to start a union revolt in the clubhouse? I haven't seen anybody else suggest Pete was trying to stage a coup, that's a huge leap there.

Look the reality Green told everyone if they don't want to be here, he can help make that happen. If Kendall wanted to be a Jet, he could have simply gone up to Green and asked for a trade. Instead you think he attempted to cause a player revolt so that Green would cut him?

 

[Snakester]

I've got a question - if Kendall played at a PRO BOWL level last year and LJ Shelton played at a high level last year and Big was mediocre - with 3 of the five positions on the offensive line at least on the adequate level - can someone tell me WHY THE HELL IT WAS THE WORST O-LINE IN THE LEAGUE? You guys over value our own players. Kendall was a cancer - an slightly above average Guard and nothing special as a center . . . the difference between Curtis this year and last is Pete Kendall - as if Martin didn't light the entire league on fire last year once Pennington came back - what a joke.

I don't think we had the worst line in the league last year. Anthony Clement and Cameron Spikes did not play that well. We did have a very sorry QB in Jeff Blake. LJ, Kendall and BIG played well. LJ had a couple of games that were bad but I think he was injured somewhat and was trying to play through the pain during those games.

 

[Redheart]

Why do we keep beating this dead horse? Is second-guessing this for the zillionth time without ANY new information feeding somebody's "I told you so" ego? Is this another "Denny is a bad coach because he doesn't do what I would do because I live in an imaginary world where I can assume or postulate anything I want to prove my point" thread. How do I put crappy threads on ignore?

Off topic: Is there a Cardinals game this weekend?

 

[CardinalLaw]

I couldn't see how Coach Herm would like Cancer Kendell, if he started a resistence group on the team against him. I don't know if they as Coach Mac don't practice over there. Its being the first year of practice for Kendall, in about 4 coach Mac years. He must have forgot what it is all about. I have always been a fan of Kendell till this resistance group against Green happened. As for a trade Denny tought everybody a nice lesson. "I am the caoch its my way or the highway"

 

[john h]

IMO AZ management clearly dropped the ball letting him get away for nothing. I think it's a great example of Green doing a knee jerk without sitting down with Graves and thinking this through carefully.

I clearly think it was a stupid move and somehow connected to DG's ego. We should never have let Kendall go. We had nothing but a rookie to replace him and he in fact is a legit NFL starter almost on any team in the NFL. We currently have the worst OL in the NFL so I see no defense for this move. It is burned into my brain as dumb.

 

[john h]

I think it was to make a statement, that if you do not want to be on board Green will send you on the way. He stated earlier any player that did not want to be there will not be there. Plus Kendall snitched on Green. I think it was to establish Greens role as a dictator, I have no problem with it.

Is a Dictator what we need or want? We have trouble enough keeping players on this team when their contract is up. Now we add to that a Dictator. So far the Dictator is 0-3 and lost all preseason games. He may end up like most Dictators if this continues. The lack of any noise from upper management is like "the silence of the lambs". Look out!