Will Kyler Murray become a franchise QB...

[cardncubfan]

Ertz seems to think so.

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[SoonerLou]

But he refuses to go into the pocket, he's getting sacked on the edge and never there... which maybe is him telling the front office our guards suck or the possibility what I believe Stout stated is that he's too short to go there and see when the play is beyond a quick strike, hence why does Kliff not roll him out more often

Because he has no faith in Garcia/Jones and he's not skilled enough like Brees was to find throwing lanes.

That 2nd Rams game was devastating in more ways than one. We lost Hopkins. And after giving up 13? pressures to Donald he lost trust in the interior. We can talk film all day, but eventually he has to learn to trust the pocket, manipulate the pocket and be willing to take some hits on certain throws. That and maybe upgrading the Oline.

 

[ScooterVanNeuter]

He is talented but falling down in the fetal position is not a good look. The defense was laughing at him.

But at least falling down 15 yards behind the line of scrimmage gets him far enough from most of the other players that they can't laugh directly at him.

 

[Harry]

In my mind a franchise QB is one whose team contends for at least for the playoffs virtually every year. There are 3 elements that make up your typical franchise QB. 1. Does he have the physical ability/athleticism to be a dominant factor? In my opinion Murray meets this element. He is one of the finest athletes playing the game. He has the arm, legs and elusiveness the job demands. Sometimes the elusiveness is not running, it’s about being able to move around in the pocket. Palmer was the perfect example. Sometimes it’s the ability to read defenses so well, the QB can dump the ball and elude the rush that way. That was Warner. 2. Does the QB possess the intellectual commitment to control the game? This one is in doubt, Murray-wise. It’s not just being smart. It’s about having the mental discipline to put in the time required to master the game. The top QBs are students of the game. They adjust to the play that to the one that has the potential for the optimum outcome. They always put their team in the best position to win. 3. Does the quarterback have the heart to win? Does he have the courage, determination and leadership skills to get the job done? Again this point is up in the air. Murray’s leadership style is unique. Time will tell if it’s good enough. One would also be concerned about the panic he appeared to display in the playoffs.
So, will he grow into a franchise QB? I don’t know. It’s true he has progressed year-to-year, but in my mind at too slow a rate. I would expect more dedication. I would expect him to be more demanding of himself. I would expect more self-awareness of what he doesn’t know. I think whatever happens this year with the coaching staff, how much development Murray shows this year will tell us everything we need to answer the question.

 

[Crimson Warrior]

But at least falling down 15 yards behind the line of scrimmage gets him far enough from most of the other players that they can't laugh directly at him.

A taunting observation from the weighty depths of six posts. Completely credible.

 

[Crimson Warrior]

Because he has no faith in Garcia/Jones and he's not skilled enough like Brees was to find throwing lanes.

That 2nd Rams game was devastating in more ways than one. We lost Hopkins. And after giving up 13? pressures to Donald he lost trust in the interior. We can talk film all day, but eventually he has to learn to trust the pocket, manipulate the pocket and be willing to take some hits on certain throws. That and maybe upgrading the Oline.

Donald actually had 14 QB pressures in the 2nd game against us.

Guess how many he had against Jimmy G and SF this past Sunday? Four.

Watch Murray's highlight reel for this past season. Watch how many moonshots he heaves off his back foot as a tidal wave of defenders bears down on him. It's disgusting, but somehow he made almost all of those throws.

It's tough to "see open receivers" and "read defenses" when Aaron Donald is in your face 14 times in one game. But whatever. Let the Murray Truthers (copyright Crimson Warrior 2022) keep saying that it's all on him, and that he's regressing. lol.. Thank God they're not the ones making our roster decisions.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Donald actually had 14 QB pressures in the 2nd game against us.

Guess how many he had against Jimmy G and SF this past Sunday? Four.

Watch Murray's highlight reel for this past season. Watch how many moonshots he heaves off his back foot as a tidal wave of defenders bears down on him. It's disgusting, but somehow he made almost all of those throws.

It's tough to "see open receivers" and "read defenses" when Aaron Donald is in your face 14 times in one game. But whatever. Let the Murray Truthers (copyright Crimson Warrior 2022) keep saying that it's all on him, and that he's regressing. lol.. Thank God they're not the ones making our roster decisions.

Awesome. You’re coining new names to insult people. That’ll be good for the board.

 

[Stout]

I’m not sure he ever leads a team to the super bowl.

Hammer, meet nail.

 

[Stout]

Donald actually had 14 QB pressures in the 2nd game against us.

Guess how many he had against Jimmy G and SF this past Sunday? Four.

Watch Murray's highlight reel for this past season. Watch how many moonshots he heaves off his back foot as a tidal wave of defenders bears down on him. It's disgusting, but somehow he made almost all of those throws.

It's tough to "see open receivers" and "read defenses" when Aaron Donald is in your face 14 times in one game. But whatever. Let the Murray Truthers (copyright Crimson Warrior 2022) keep saying that it's all on him, and that he's regressing. lol.. Thank God they're not the ones making our roster decisions.

Psst, your homerism is showing. Would you even be here if KM played for, say, USC? Nobody here, at least nobody credible, is saying everything is KM's fault. We are, quite rightly, saying KM reverted to awful play and bad habits late in the season and especially in the playoffs. For instance, with all that pressure in the playoffs, how many hits did KM take to try to make a play? The kid got scared and absolutely refused to put his body on the line IN THE PLAYOFFS. Inexcusable.

 

[TheCardFan]

Awesome. You’re coining new names to insult people. That’ll be good for the board.

Like "Battered Cards Fan Disorder (BCFD) or Syndrome (BCFS)" or Ostrich? I don't remember you calling out either of those two.

Someone who liked your post above has used both of them...regularly.

 

[BritCard]

Ertz seems to think so.

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Ertz QB's have been Nick Foles, Sam Bradford, Mark Sanchez, Carson Wentz and Jalen Hurts.

I'm sure Kyler looks real good in comparison.

 

[BullheadCardFan]

Nobody here, at least nobody credible, is saying everything is KM's fault. We are, quite rightly, saying KM reverted to awful play and bad habits late in the season and especially in the playoffs. For instance, with all that pressure in the playoffs, how many hits did KM take to try to make a play? The kid got scared and absolutely refused to put his body on the line IN THE PLAYOFFS. Inexcusable.

This

When the lights came on he melted under the pressure

 

[TheCardFan]

Ertz QB's have been Nick Foles, Sam Bradford, Mark Sanchez, Carson Wentz and Jalen Hurts.

I'm sure Kyler looks real good in comparison.

Except he said ‘Most Talented Player I’ve Ever Been Around’ - not QB and maybe not even just on his own team.

 

[Crimson Warrior]

Psst, your homerism is showing. Would you even be here if KM played for, say, USC? Nobody here, at least nobody credible, is saying everything is KM's fault. We are, quite rightly, saying KM reverted to awful play and bad habits late in the season and especially in the playoffs. For instance, with all that pressure in the playoffs, how many hits did KM take to try to make a play? The kid got scared and absolutely refused to put his body on the line IN THE PLAYOFFS. Inexcusable.

Explain what you're asking me in the bolded sentence please. I'm not quite clear.

 

[Stout]

Explain what you're asking me in the bolded sentence please. I'm not quite clear.

I was wondering if you follow the Cards simply for KM. My memory is garbage so I don't know when you joined the board and...oh, never mind, we have our freaking join dates listed. I withdraw the question and apologize for asking it

 

[Crimson Warrior]

I was wondering if you follow the Cards simply for KM. My memory is garbage so I don't know when you joined the board and...oh, never mind, we have our freaking join dates listed. I withdraw the question and apologize for asking it

I've been a Cardinals fan longer than most on this board Stout. My dad is from St. Louis and turned me on to the Cardinals when I was a little, little kid. 1976 are my earliest memories of the team. So okay, no problem.

I get that I'm defending Murray to a fault, but I would do the same for any Cardinal QB with the redbird on the side of his helmet. I did it for Plummer for a long time. I defended Kolb momentarily. McCown for a while, Leinart briefly, Warner after he had a bad day. Anybody that, for even a brief amount time I thought had the possibility of leading our team to victories, I would stick up for on this board.

And what bugs me the most is people making criticisms of a player who plays for my beloved cardinals and stating the criticisms as fact. For example you saying Murray was "scared". You don't know that Stout. You can't even say it with a high degree of probability. Or people saying that Murray doesn't read defenses well, as if it were gospel, when there's more statistical evidence to support that he does read defenses well. I don't get why people publicly rip a player, that plays for their team, for lacking some trait or ability when there really isn't a preponderance of evidence that their criticism is true. I'll never understand it. But whatever. As long as I'm allowed to offer dissenting opinions to your criticisms (and give you the business a little while I'm doing so, haha j/k), then it's cool. I'm wise enough to know that it takes all kinds, and that you're as big a fan of of the team as me.

I admit that I have some emotional investment in Murray because of his OU playing days, and because I lobbied for him pre-draft. However, I also defend him so adamantly because I really, honestly and truly believe that he can QB us to a Superbowl someday, if everybody else on the team does their job.

 

[Jetstream Green]

I've been a Cardinals fan longer than most on this board Stout. My dad is from St. Louis and turned me on to the Cardinals when I was a little, little kid. 1976 are my earliest memories of the team. So okay, no problem.

I get that I'm defending Murray to a fault, but I would do the same for any Cardinal QB with the redbird on the side of his helmet. I did it for Plummer for a long time. I defended Kolb momentarily. McCown for a while, Leinart briefly, Warner after he had a bad day. Anybody that, for even a brief amount time I thought had the possibility of leading our team to victories, I would stick up for them on this board.

And what bugs me the most is people making criticisms of a player who plays for my beloved cardinals and stating the criticisms as fact. For example you saying Murray was "scared". You don't know that Stout. You can't even say it with a high degree of probability. Or people saying that Murray doesn't read defenses well, as if it were gospel, when there's more statistical evidence to support that he does read defenses well. I don't get why people publicly rip a player, that plays for their team, for lacking some trait or ability when there really isn't a preponderance of evidence that their criticism is true. I'll never understand it. But whatever. As long as I'm allowed to offer dissenting opinions to your criticisms (and give you the business a little while I'm doing so, haha j/k), then it's cool. I'm wise enough to know that it takes all kinds, and that you're as big a fan of of the team as me.

I admit that I have some emotional investment in Murray because of his OU playing days, and because I lobbied for him pre-draft. However, I also defend him so adamantly because I really, honestly and truly believe that he can QB us to a Superbowl someday, if everybody else on the team does their job.

Wow, same Cardinal class of '76 when I started to follow them as a boy... except I then attended UT and you OU, which shows the Cardinal does not discriminate fore no one is safe from the curse lol

 

[Stout]

I've been a Cardinals fan longer than most on this board Stout. My dad is from St. Louis and turned me on to the Cardinals when I was a little, little kid. 1976 are my earliest memories of the team. So okay, no problem.

I get that I'm defending Murray to a fault, but I would do the same for any Cardinal QB with the redbird on the side of his helmet. I did it for Plummer for a long time. I defended Kolb momentarily. McCown for a while, Leinart briefly, Warner after he had a bad day. Anybody that, for even a brief amount time I thought had the possibility of leading our team to victories, I would stick up for on this board.

And what bugs me the most is people making criticisms of a player who plays for my beloved cardinals and stating the criticisms as fact. For example you saying Murray was "scared". You don't know that Stout. You can't even say it with a high degree of probability. Or people saying that Murray doesn't read defenses well, as if it were gospel, when there's more statistical evidence to support that he does read defenses well. I don't get why people publicly rip a player, that plays for their team, for lacking some trait or ability when there really isn't a preponderance of evidence that their criticism is true. I'll never understand it. But whatever. As long as I'm allowed to offer dissenting opinions to your criticisms (and give you the business a little while I'm doing so, haha j/k), then it's cool. I'm wise enough to know that it takes all kinds, and that you're as big a fan of of the team as me.

I admit that I have some emotional investment in Murray because of his OU playing days, and because I lobbied for him pre-draft. However, I also defend him so adamantly because I really, honestly and truly believe that he can QB us to a Superbowl someday, if everybody else on the team does their job.

Fair enough. I thought Skelton could become the QB we had been waiting for lol

 

[Crimson Warrior]

Fair enough. I thought Skelton could become the QB we had been waiting for lol

Ha! We all have a skeleton (haha) or two in our closet as far as backing former players.

Cool. You're one of the good darksiders Stout. Appreciate you man.

 

[TheCardFan]

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[ScooterVanNeuter]

A taunting observation from the weighty depths of six posts. Completely credible.

Apparently, frequency doesn't equate to intellect -

 

[blindseyed]

Question isn't clear, do you mean with the Cards or another team? Lol

 

[SoonerLou]

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After year 1. Improve his body/better use of his running ability
After year 2. Improve his intermediate passing and throwing on the run.
After year 3. Pocket presence/finding throwing lanes.

We'll see.

 

[JeffGollin]

Crowded field limits KK's chances.

 

[football karma]

i think all of these things can be true:

the sentiments he expressed in the NY Times write up are understandable ("i see things before they happen..") : he likely was interviewed right around the bye week when he was the #2 or #3 QB in the league.

He is also super competitive, and the way the season ended will motivate him to get to the next level

having a healthy D Hop and a #2 WR who is into the game (would love to know what happened with AJ Green) will also go a long way to bringing him back to unquestioned franchise QB.