Worst case draft scenario

[Cbus cardsfan]

What would you do, or who would you take, if the draft played out like the following(or something similar with the top 3 defensive guys gone), which could easily happen?
1-Car: Dareus
2-Den: Peterson
3-Buf: Miller
4-Cin: Newton/Gabbert
5-Az: ????

Whiz has pretty much let it be known that the Cards aren't taking a QB at 5, so no QB. You can't count on a trade materializing within the allotted 10 minutes, remember it's Graves, so no trade. Who's left?

Quinn: the best fit, but probably a tad early
Fairley: talented but not a great fit
Bowers: again, talented, but not the best fit.
Green: probably considered BPA but not a position of great need.
Amukamara: would be a reach at 5
Tyron Smith: a bit of a reach but would be a good fit.
Julio Jones: I'd love the pick but same thing as Green. I like Jones better than Green.

anybody else would be a colossal reach.

 

[MadCardDisease]

I would jump on Bowers in a second.

 

[AsUdUdE]

If Green is sitting there at #5 I'm on the phone with the Pats and trying to get the #17 and #28 pick for the 5th pick, and let them snag their next great reciever while we pick up an extra 1st round pick..

Otherwise... Go with Quinn...

 

[az jam]

Fairley. Rotate Fairley,Williams, Campbell, Dockett & Branch.

 

[Stout]

Quinn. For some reason my gut is telling me he should be the pick no matter what. I'll be disappointed with Peterson, but only because we could really use help elsewhere on the roster, and picking at #5 is a great opportunity to get an impact player at a position of greater need. I know, I know, that's just silly and he is projected to be a great draft pick--and I'll be happy to add the talent, believe me--and what I just said is the kind of thinking that led us to Levi Brown over Adrian Peterson--but there it is.

 

[BigRedRage]

well if there is a rookie cap, reaching wont be as big of a deal anymore.

 

[john h]

What would you do, or who would you take, if the draft played out like the following(or something similar with the top 3 defensive guys gone), which could easily happen?
1-Car: Dareus
2-Den: Peterson
3-Buf: Miller
4-Cin: Newton/Gabbert
5-Az: ????

Whiz has pretty much let it be known that the Cards aren't taking a QB at 5, so no QB. You can't count on a trade materializing within the allotted 10 minutes, remember it's Graves, so no trade. Who's left?

Quinn: the best fit, but probably a tad early
Fairley: talented but not a great fit
Bowers: again, talented, but not the best fit.
Green: probably considered BPA but not a position of great need.
Amukamara: would be a reach at 5
Tyron Smith: a bit of a reach but would be a good fit.
Julio Jones: I'd love the pick but same thing as Green. I like Jones better than Green.

anybody else would be a colossal reach.

Are we jumping to the conclusion that Whiz is making the choice of who we draft? Do you think the choice of who we will take has already been made? Perhaps the guys we want will already have been drafted by the time we select. If you are picking at #5 I would hope we had already lined up the top 5 players we want to draft and need only about 30 seconds on the clock to make our pick unless we do make a trade. We need so many different positions filled we just might trade down and then all bets are off as to who we would select. Maybe even Mitch's V 11.0 might come true. As for me I still want Gabbert and it is looking more and more like I have about as much chance as Mitch does with his V 11.0.

 

[john h]

What would you do, or who would you take, if the draft played out like the following(or something similar with the top 3 defensive guys gone), which could easily happen?
1-Car: Dareus
2-Den: Peterson
3-Buf: Miller
4-Cin: Newton/Gabbert
5-Az: ????

Whiz has pretty much let it be known that the Cards aren't taking a QB at 5, so no QB. You can't count on a trade materializing within the allotted 10 minutes, remember it's Graves, so no trade. Who's left?

Quinn: the best fit, but probably a tad early
Fairley: talented but not a great fit
Bowers: again, talented, but not the best fit.
Green: probably considered BPA but not a position of great need.
Amukamara: would be a reach at 5
Tyron Smith: a bit of a reach but would be a good fit.
Julio Jones: I'd love the pick but same thing as Green. I like Jones better than Green.

anybody else would be a colossal reach.

John H backup draft plan if we do not take Gabbert:

The Arizona Cardinals with their second round selection take Ryan Mallet from the University of Arkansas. Woooooooooo-Pig-Soooooieeee!

 

[football karma]

I would jump on Bowers in a second.

he doesn't have a position in the 3-4 defense

bowers is a pure 4-3 defensive end who needs to play with his hand on the ground

he cant stand up and play linebacker, and lacks the bulk to anchor

he is a good player, but not for the Cardinals.

 

[football karma]

What would you do, or who would you take, if the draft played out like the following(or something similar with the top 3 defensive guys gone), which could easily happen?
1-Car: Dareus
2-Den: Peterson
3-Buf: Miller
4-Cin: Newton/Gabbert
5-Az: ????

Whiz has pretty much let it be known that the Cards aren't taking a QB at 5, so no QB. You can't count on a trade materializing within the allotted 10 minutes, remember it's Graves, so no trade. Who's left?

Quinn: the best fit, but probably a tad early
Fairley: talented but not a great fit
Bowers: again, talented, but not the best fit.
Green: probably considered BPA but not a position of great need.
Amukamara: would be a reach at 5
Tyron Smith: a bit of a reach but would be a good fit.
Julio Jones: I'd love the pick but same thing as Green. I like Jones better than Green.

anybody else would be a colossal reach.

its probably Quinn at that point if you can't trade down with Tenn or Washington so they can take a QB.

the question becomes: who will be there at #8 or #10 if they do trade down?

 

[Stout]

John H backup draft plan if we do not take Gabbert:

The Arizona Cardinals with their second round selection take Ryan Mallet from the University of Arkansas. Woooooooooo-Pig-Soooooieeee!

Mallet in the 2nd? Sign me up.

 

[Pariah]

Quinn

 

[lobo]

Quinn

I second that.

 

[bg7brd]

What would you do, or who would you take, if the draft played out like the following(or something similar with the top 3 defensive guys gone), which could easily happen?
1-Car: Dareus
2-Den: Peterson
3-Buf: Miller
4-Cin: Newton/Gabbert
5-Az: ????

Whiz has pretty much let it be known that the Cards aren't taking a QB at 5, so no QB. You can't count on a trade materializing within the allotted 10 minutes, remember it's Graves, so no trade. Who's left?

Quinn: the best fit, but probably a tad early
Fairley: talented but not a great fit
Bowers: again, talented, but not the best fit.
Green: probably considered BPA but not a position of great need.
Amukamara: would be a reach at 5
Tyron Smith: a bit of a reach but would be a good fit.
Julio Jones: I'd love the pick but same thing as Green. I like Jones better than Green.

anybody else would be a colossal reach.

I would have to go with Quinn. Scott Wright has him rated 5 and Mayock ,CBS, and Huddle Report have him at 6. I'm not sure where thesmel has him on his rating system

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

I would have to go with Quinn. Scott Wright has him rated 5 and Mayock ,CBS, and Huddle Report have him at 6. I'm not sure where thesmel has him on his rating system

he did go to The UNC, which i think is close enough.

 

[kerouac9]

Quinn and Newton are interesting prospects when placed against one another. Each are guys with incredibly high ceilings, but both have real concerns about them.

I'm surprised that so many people are eager to take a chance on Quinn, who was an idiot who did something that he knew was wrong and screwed his teammates last year out of a chance to make a run at a National Championship, but are horrified at the prospect of drafting Cam Newton, an idiot who cheated on a test two years ago and lead his teammates to a National Championship this year. Go figure.

 

[Matt L]

I wouldn't be angry with Quinn...I would be excited if we took Newton.

 

[Pariah]

I'm surprised that so many people are eager to take a chance on Quinn, who was an idiot who did something that he knew was wrong and screwed his teammates last year out of a chance to make a run at a National Championship, but are horrified at the prospect of drafting Cam Newton, an idiot who cheated on a test two years ago and lead his teammates to a National Championship this year. Go figure.

I think there's two reasons (at least, for me):

1) I'm not as convinced Newton's athleticism is going to carry him as far in the NFL as people so many people seem to think.

2) The between-the-ears and leadership intangibles are WAY more important at the QB position than it is in a pass-rusher.

JMHO

 

[kerouac9]

I think there's two reasons (at least, for me):

1) I'm not as convinced Newton's athleticism is going to carry him as far in the NFL as people so many people seem to think.

2) The between-the-ears and leadership intangibles are WAY more important at the QB position than it is in a pass-rusher.

JMHO

But Newton's leadership intangibles are off the charts by all reports. The between the ears stuff should've been put to rest by an unremarkable (either way) Wonderlic score. I think it's because Cam Newton was a polarizing figure in college, and Robert Quinn didn't play last year. Newton wasn't a running QB in high school--I think that Newton's reliance on his athleticism is overstated by his critics.

 

[Pariah]

But Newton's leadership intangibles are off the charts by all reports. The between the ears stuff should've been put to rest by an unremarkable (either way) Wonderlic score.

I disagree. His handling of the time between the championship and now has been pretty poor, IMO. That speaks to both intangibles and intelligence. He's not had a ton of poise and has made some questionable decisions (reading from notes at a difficult press conference, the "I see myself as an entertainer-slash-icon" statements, poor showing at the combine).

If the worst fears are realized in a pass rusher with uber-ability, you get Simeon Rice. If they're realized in a QB, you get Ryan Leaf. (note: I'm not saying Newton will be another Leaf; I don't think he will. But I do think he'll struggle for a few years and never live up to the hype).

JMHO

 

[bg7brd]

Merril Hoge didn't have a lot of good things to say about Newton on Gambo and Ash yesterday.

http://icestream.bonnint.net:8000/az/audio/2011/03/03302011184029.mp3

 

[Stout]

I think there's two reasons (at least, for me):

1) I'm not as convinced Newton's athleticism is going to carry him as far in the NFL as people so many people seem to think.

2) The between-the-ears and leadership intangibles are WAY more important at the QB position than it is in a pass-rusher.

JMHO

I'll add in that Cam Newton has run around town acting like ******* McGee, and Quinn hasn't been heard from at all. Sure, you could argue that Quinn isn't really a public figure, but if Newton isn't smart enough not to make himself look bad at just about every turn, how can we trust him to have the maturity to lead our team? The simple answer is that we can't. I wouldn't draft him in the 3rd round if he was there. I wouldn't sign him as an UDFA. I don't want him anywhere near our team.

 

[Catfish]

I am all over Quinn. Yes, he's got baggage, but he is just 20 now, and is a man-child. He is fast, but quicker even than fast. He is THE physical package we are looking for at rush OLB. With some leadership and training he will become THE playmaker we have been looking for.

 

[Russ Smith]

But Newton's leadership intangibles are off the charts by all reports. The between the ears stuff should've been put to rest by an unremarkable (either way) Wonderlic score. I think it's because Cam Newton was a polarizing figure in college, and Robert Quinn didn't play last year. Newton wasn't a running QB in high school--I think that Newton's reliance on his athleticism is overstated by his critics.

I think leadership positive leadership is usually something people talk about AFTER the fact. If Newton had fumbled on that play late in the NC game when he was supposed to take a knee and didn't you think the coach would be calling him a great leader now?

the question on Newton is can you separate the obvious character questions he's showed in the past from the decision to pick him high and pay him a ton of money. Quinn made one bad decision, for obvious reasons he was a poor kid who was offered money and took it.

Newton cheated because it was the easy way out and it reportedly happened twice not once. With the laptop thing he threw it out the window trying to avoid getting caught. The Auburn stuff seriously does anybody not related to him and not an Auburn fan really believe he didn't know what his dad was doing? He has a history of taking shortcuts and that mentality does NOT work in the NFL at QB.

I don't know if Quinn is the guy either but character seems to matter a lot more at QB than at DE. Sure you have Big Ben but he's sort of an outlier, generally speaking people that lack in that area don't excel at QB.

the reason Newton is so maligned right now IMHO is he won an NC that most people think will be vacated eventually.

He might turn out to be a great player, he might be a colossal bust due to character issues, that's a huge gamble at #5 overall.

 

[kerouac9]

I think leadership positive leadership is usually something people talk about AFTER the fact. If Newton had fumbled on that play late in the NC game when he was supposed to take a knee and didn't you think the coach would be calling him a great leader now?

the question on Newton is can you separate the obvious character questions he's showed in the past from the decision to pick him high and pay him a ton of money. Quinn made one bad decision, for obvious reasons he was a poor kid who was offered money and took it.

Newton cheated because it was the easy way out and it reportedly happened twice not once. With the laptop thing he threw it out the window trying to avoid getting caught. The Auburn stuff seriously does anybody not related to him and not an Auburn fan really believe he didn't know what his dad was doing? He has a history of taking shortcuts and that mentality does NOT work in the NFL at QB.

I don't know if Quinn is the guy either but character seems to matter a lot more at QB than at DE. Sure you have Big Ben but he's sort of an outlier, generally speaking people that lack in that area don't excel at QB.

the reason Newton is so maligned right now IMHO is he won an NC that most people think will be vacated eventually.

He might turn out to be a great player, he might be a colossal bust due to character issues, that's a huge gamble at #5 overall.

Are you saying that a guy like Steve McNair didn't succeed at the NFL level? Do you think that Tom Brady is an excellent moral specimen off the field? Give me a break, Russ.

I don't want to draft either Quinn or Newton at #5 overall. I was really just noting that people are happy to excuse Quinn's documented offenses but are all over Newton's alleged ones. I personally don't think that Newton has the "character issues" that others do, in part because all reports are that he's a film and workout junkie and that his teammates love him and look to him to make plays when it matters. Drew Brees's head in Vince Young's body.

Did Reggie Bush "fail" as the #2 overall pick because of "character concerns" similar to what Newton went through? Was Bush alienated from the New Orleans lockerroom because he had to give back his Heisman trophy? Of course not--these guys are professionals and a guy's business is his business. If Newton were running the club circuit wherever he's working out right now, don't you think it'd be all over the press? Why isn't it? Because he's taking care of business, doing his work outs for franchises, and straightening out his footwork.

I think that there's a difference between "football" character and a guy that you want dating your daughter. Jay Cutler is by all reports a complete cornholio both on and off the field--teammates don't like him. He's very likely a moral person and upright citizen and very smart, but is he going to lead a team to the Super Bowl? Hasn't happened yet. Vince Young was a guy who said all the right things to the media but was a party animal during the offseason and didn't want to do the work during the week to be successful on Sunday. Despite that, Titans teammates were willing to suffer a fine to publicly express support for their injured QB:

I am sure Britt was told to get rid of the towel, but the message was sent that there are many in the Titans’ locker room that still have Young’s back and are not afraid to publicly show it.

This is very similar to what happened in Philadelphia with Terrell Owens and the Eagles. Owens, regardless of what you’ve heard on ESPN, had a ton of support in the Eagles locker room and it splintered it.

Same thing happened with Vick in Atlanta during the dog fighting thing.