Would this make us real contenders

[AzStevenCal]

Well, I have mixed feelings. I would probably do it, but I feel like we would be sacrificing our future.

That said, it does seem difficult to justify paying Ayton the max right now.

I think it's moot, because I don't think Orlando would do this deal.

Yeah, I pretty much agree with you. This deal would take away some of the potential of our long term future, balanced by removing some of the risk. If we didn't have an aging Chris Paul, I'd be adamantly opposed to the trade. But we do have Paul. And Ayton, if he becomes a true difference maker, is probably 4 or 5 years from reaching that level. And if I were to wager whether DA would ever be as good as Vucevic is currently, it would be a tough call but I think I'd bet against it.

As for whether Orlando would really make that deal, I have no idea. But if they really are looking to clean the slate and rebuild around Fultz and Isaac, I'm not sure they can find a better deal. They'd get the somewhat tarnished but still superstar potential of Ayton and assume the burden of a max contract decision but that risk wouldn't be quite so high for them as it would be for us (Ayton probably loses a little leverage because of the trade and perhaps gains a little motivation).

 

[AzStevenCal]

This is not what I said.

Adding a player like Bobby Portis to the Suns current rotation of players would get the Suns close to being a title contender.

I think we'd be a better team with Vucevic than we would be with Ayton and Portis but we'd also be losing Crowder which makes it a tougher call. I think I'd still lean towards Vucevic since he is by far the best player out of Ayton, Portis and Crowder but our depth would take a hit. Not that we're getting Portis, he's playing better with the Bucks than he ever has anywhere else.

 

[Mainstreet]

I think we'd be a better team with Vucevic than we would be with Ayton and Portis but we'd also be losing Crowder which makes it a tougher call. I think I'd still lean towards Vucevic since he is by far the best player out of Ayton, Portis and Crowder but our depth would take a hit. Not that we're getting Portis, he's playing better with the Bucks than he ever has anywhere else.

I could live without Crowder but the Suns would still need a power forward. IIRC, we both have been fans of Portis or at least his potential.

 

[AzStevenCal]

I could live without Crowder but the Suns would still need a power forward. IIRC, we both have been fans of Portis or at least his potential.

Yeah, I liked him coming into the draft but he's been a disappointment until this season. I haven't followed him closely or anything but his stats this year look good.

I feel better about the Vuc deal but another trade that could possibly make us contenders would be to send Jalen (or Kaminski) and Jevon plus picks for Markkanen. Lauri has also been a bit of a disappointment, especially since he's missed so much time, but the potential is still there.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Yeah, he would do it. But there are very few of those types of guys in the league anymore.

Craig seems like a good pickup for cash - but we really need a legit big somehow.

would Aaron Gordon fit that Bill?

 

[Proximo]

would Aaron Gordon fit that Bill?

I don’t think so, but not sure how we could trade for him even if he did.

 

[elindholm]

would Aaron Gordon fit that Bill?

No. Aaron Gordon isn't good. His numbers have been going steadily downward for four years, and he was a below-average shooter in the first place.

 

[Mainstreet]

Yeah, I liked him coming into the draft but he's been a disappointment until this season. I haven't followed him closely or anything but his stats this year look good.

I feel better about the Vuc deal but another trade that could possibly make us contenders would be to send Jalen (or Kaminski) and Jevon plus picks for Markkanen. Lauri has also been a bit of a disappointment, especially since he's missed so much time, but the potential is still there.

I'm not sure the Suns have the right pieces to get Vucevic.

I like Markkanen but the Suns really don't have a first round pick they can trade until 2026 unless they work out something with OKC.

Maybe something falls in the Suns lap.

 

[AzStevenCal]

I'm not sure the Suns have the right pieces to get Vucevic.

I like Markkanen but the Suns really don't have a first round pick they can trade until 2026 unless they work out something with OKC.

Maybe something falls in the Suns lap.

I don't worry about that, we only owe one pick so solving the protection problem isn't much of an issue.

 

[Mainstreet]

I don't worry about that, we only owe one pick so solving the protection problem isn't much of an issue.

If so, the Suns should solve it and make a trade. The window is now.

 

[Hoop Head]

I'm not sure the Suns have the right pieces to get Vucevic.

I like Markkanen but the Suns really don't have a first round pick they can trade until 2026 unless they work out something with OKC.

Maybe something falls in the Suns lap.

You are well versed on when we can trade a 1st round pick again but one thing you haven't mentioned is offering up some pick swaps. That would solve the issue of dealing a pick and might be enticing to a team that owns some extra 1sts, like OKC. Since they own so many picks they might want to bet that our pick will be better than some of the Clipper picks they own, for example.

 

[AzStevenCal]

If so, the Suns should solve it and make a trade. The window is now.

I guess I don't see the window quite as open as I think you do. IMO there is no (reasonably attainable) one person fix that would put us on par with the Nets or the Lakers if those teams are healthy.

Replacing Ayton with Vucevic though could put us into the conversation for 3rd best team. And I think it's worth trying to become the 3rd best team given the health history of AD, Kyrie and Durant. But to me, our biggest weakness is not at the 4 spot, it's at the starting 5 especially with Ayton's play of late. So adding someone like Portis or Gordon might make us a little better but we'd still have that huge problem at the 5.

 

[taz02]

I guess I don't see the window quite as open as I think you do. IMO there is no (reasonably attainable) one person fix that would put us on par with the Nets or the Lakers if those teams are healthy.

Replacing Ayton with Vucevic though could put us into the conversation for 3rd best team. And I think it's worth trying to become the 3rd best team given the health history of AD, Kyrie and Durant. But to me, our biggest weakness is not at the 4 spot, it's at the starting 5 especially with Ayton's play of late. So adding someone like Portis or Gordon might make us a little better but we'd still have that huge problem at the 5.

I think the window is now if we could count on Ayton to be even his average self. But you are right his play lately has been a huge problem. Based on his recent play he is going to get destroyed in the playoffs. In the last 2 games he has played a total of 43min and received 11 fouls, grabbed 13rebounds and scored 22points, (that's like fouling out twice in one game)

If this doesn't improve the championship window is closed. The suns have been looking for a starting 5 for how many decades? If Ayton isn't it, the chances of finding one before Paul is done is not promising. The sad thing is, after all those high lottery picks we have very little to show for it.

 

[Mainstreet]

You are well versed on when we can trade a 1st round pick again but one thing you haven't mentioned is offering up some pick swaps. That would solve the issue of dealing a pick and might be enticing to a team that owns some extra 1sts, like OKC. Since they own so many picks they might want to bet that our pick will be better than some of the Clipper picks they own, for example.

If pick swaps can be negotiated without knowing when the first round picks convey. Right now the Suns look competitive with the Clippers .

 

[Mainstreet]

I guess I don't see the window quite as open as I think you do. IMO there is no (reasonably attainable) one person fix that would put us on par with the Nets or the Lakers if those teams are healthy.

Replacing Ayton with Vucevic though could put us into the conversation for 3rd best team. And I think it's worth trying to become the 3rd best team given the health history of AD, Kyrie and Durant. But to me, our biggest weakness is not at the 4 spot, it's at the starting 5 especially with Ayton's play of late. So adding someone like Portis or Gordon might make us a little better but we'd still have that huge problem at the 5.

I didn't select the Suns window. When they traded for Chris Paul, I thought this gave the Suns their best chance of competing with the best teams in the NBA.

It's hard to see the Suns having a better opportunity than the next two seasons in the foreseeable future. Maybe the Suns fall short in the playoffs but I think the Suns have to try to put their best team on the floor. If they can improve their roster by adding another big man, I think they should. They are not that far away.

 

[taz02]

I didn't select the Suns window. When they traded for Chris Paul, I thought this gave the Suns their best chance of competing with the best teams in the NBA.

It's hard to see the Suns having a better opportunity than the next two seasons in the foreseeable future. Maybe the Suns fall short in the playoffs but I think the Suns have to try to put their best team on the floor. If they can improve their roster by adding another big man, I think they should. They are not that far away.

The window was opened by Paul but shut by DA. No one really expected him to play this bad, but there is still hope. I agree they have to do what ever they can to win now, before Paul's time runs out.

 

[Mainstreet]

The window was opened by Paul but shut by DA. No one really expected him to play this bad, but there is still hope. I agree they have to do what ever they can to win now, before Paul's time runs out.

I don't think Ayton shut the window. He is just not as good as we had hoped at this stage of his career. Suns need another big man to play beside him or use in the rotation. They need big man by committee. Ayton and Saric are not enough.

 

[AzStevenCal]

The window was opened by Paul but shut by DA. No one really expected him to play this bad, but there is still hope. I agree they have to do what ever they can to win now, before Paul's time runs out.

I don't. I just do not see any way to compete with a healthy Lakers or Kings team short of turning Ayton into the player we thought we drafted. And his play the past 6 weeks says that's not going to happen. We've won a lot of games thanks to our depth but our starting 5 is not much better than middle of the pack. Adding an average starter won't make much of a difference and adding a star simply isn't feasible. Not to mention how rare it would be for a team to go from a decade of putrid to a championship run in one season.

Injuries and illnesses could move any of several teams to competitor status but I don't really consider that as having our window open. Our best bet to be a true contender has to start with fixing our starting 5, which means we need a real difference maker at one of the power spots. We'd have to get real lucky to add Drummond (following a buy out) but that's about the only way I could see it happening.

Add Drummond to our current roster and we would have an outside chance at competing with a healthy Lakers or Nets team. And that's only if Andre decides that winning helps his next contract more than simply collecting stats would. Short of something like that, I like our chances of ending our playoff drought but I don't see us as a championship contender. And I'm okay with that, IMO becoming a playoff contender with a chance to advance was our goal in trading for CP.

 

[taz02]

AzStevenCal. I think we are essentially saying the same thing, though you have articulated it better.

1. By win now I really mean this year or next, based primarily on CP3. Winning a championship this year would require a miracle.

2. If Ayton plays to his potential and we add a guy like Drummond we would have a chance.

3. If Ayton continues his slide we need to add a star big and a guy like Drummond, which is highly unlikely.

4. Continued injuries to the Lakers is a real possibility.

Anyway, its fun to have this problem/discussion after the last decade.

 

[Carolinacacti]

I heard Cam Johnson grew 3 inches the last two weeks

 

[Muggz]

We ARE "real" contenders.

 

[AzStevenCal]

I heard Cam Johnson grew 3 inches the last two weeks

Yeah I get all those emails too.

 

[Finito]

Yeah I get all those emails too.

what???

 

[mjb21aztd]

We ARE "real" contenders.

But just imagine if suns somehow got a guy like drummond or aldridge!! Would be good to combine one with ayton

But i still think this current roster can make a poff good showing

Gonna be sooooo fun to see book and let us hope ayton in poffs lol

 

[Proximo]

James Jones is not doing anything.

Unless something falls in his lap, the team is not changing for the rest of the season.