Free QBs Anyone?

Harry

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Gimmedaball(sp?) asked me for the toughest task ever; rating the free agent QBs. This is tougher than college because typically these guys have already somewhat failed or they wouldn’t be available. It’s true you occasionally find a QB who benefits from a change of scenery. They have even won the Super Bowl. The trick is far more fail than succeed. I’m going to include some possible availabilities that may not materialize.

Lets start at the perceived top. Cousins is the number one guy on most lists. He is at worst a solid QB. The question is can he be a big winner? I’m not sure but I think not. He certainly didn’t fully convince Washington. He can throw. He’s sturdy. He’s decent but not great at reading defenses. He’s also expensive and would prevent fixing other critical needs. My read is he’s safe but not worth it.

Teddy Bridgewater is on the Cards list and is a good compromise choice. He won’t cost as much as Cousins and he’s actually better at reading defenses. He has a good arm, but slightly below a Cousins. He is likely not sturdy. For him to work the Cards would have to keep him from running and they must fix the O-line. Not my top chioice, but a good gamble.

Bradford is not currently a free agent but may become one. His stability is less than Bridgewater’s. He doesn’t have to run to get hurt. On the other hand if he weren’t so fragile he’d be in the discussion of the NFC’s best QB. He does everything you’d want from a pocket passer. I’d pay the money and take the chance but the Cards must also get one of the top prospects in the draft.

Foles is the most expensive since he’d be a trade. He’s talented. Maybe he’s the best, but the Cards can’t afford that price. Plus once taken forget having the money for Norwell or a pick for your QBOTF. I’ll pass.

Old friend Josh McCown is changing teams. He’s still serviceable and would be an affordable bridge to the QBOTF. He might even be good enough to make the playoffs especially if they sign Norwell.

Mike Glennon is a non-starter for me.

McCarron is the biggest unknown. I had him as the fourth QB the year he came out. He’s more of a game manager than a great athlete. However, he could be a really good game manager for a long time. With a great team, like the Pats, he could get it all done.

Tyrod Taylor may well be available for a modest price. He runs better than he throws. Could he be improved? Maybe, but I hate to give a draft pick for a project. I’ll pass.

Case Keenum changed quite a few minds last year. He didn’t change mine. He a good, but not great QB. He can make some plays but he’s been mistake prone. I’m betting that won’t change over the long run.

So I guess my list would be Bradford, Bridgewater the McCown.
 

BW52

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For your information Harry Bridgewater was injured in the pocket in practice.He is not a runner unless he has to.Not really a big scrambler.
 

Ohcrap75

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Nice write up Harry. Many focus on the high price tag of Cousins, which is projected to be around $30M per year. That is a ton, but most of the media talk about just signing Keenum for cheap, when they don't realize he projected to get at least 20M per year.

I would love to hear what price you would be comfortable paying Bridgewater, Bradford, McCarron and Keenum. Most debate who is better, but the debate needs to be relative to price. I don't really like the strategy of signing a guy to 15M per year that doesn't project to lead the team long term. I would rather use that money to build the team around a young QB.
 

GimmedaBall

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Thanks for the summary Harry and how you view the FA QB.

Talent-wise, Bradford is the top of the list but he is also a summary of every injury possible inflicted on a QB. It's a wonder he can get out of bed and tie his shoelaces. He should be financially secure for the rest of his life (he was one of the last guys before the salary limits on picks). I wouldn't be surprised if he doesn't just retire while he can still walk. A shaky yes depending on his contract and playing time expectations should the Cards go with him as a bridge QB.

Bridgewater's injury was pretty awful with players on the practice field getting ill at the damage. Non-contact and he tore up his leg so badly he came close to having it amputated. He still walks with a limp---Vikes put him in for one game last year but then went with a recovering Bradford as their backup in the playoffs. Pass for me on Bridgewater.

Cousins is a young vet who has paid some dues playing for Washington. No parts of his game are elite but there is enough ability to put the right team over the hump. With surrounding talent he'll have that All-Pro season or two that can get a team to the SB. The knock will be his salary expectations---top $$$ for a slightly above average QB. I was on his bandwagon until the salary expectations started getting rumored and how much guaranteed money he was expecting. It ain't going to get any cheaper as both the cap and salary demands increase. I'd still hate to see the Cards lock themselves into salary cap Hell for any player.

I'd group Keenum, Foles, and McCarron in the same bunch and in that order. Keenum is a possibility--his numbers have gone up and provided with the right playbook would do a competent job. For those who want a 'small' QB like Brees or Mayfield, he fits the bill. He's got a bad throw or two each game---but will keep a team in the game with his play. An affordable option. Foles will be costly--draft picks and then a high-contract. McCarron is strictly contract and would be a very affordable choice---I think he has a chance to be a 'Alex Smith' type player---and that is not a slur.

I noticed that you left our three FA QBs off your list. Gabbert may have well lost his chance at being viewed as a starter when he couldn't seize the day or job in his extended audition. Stanton did as asked and held the clipboard---I'd pass on him simply because he showed no fire to take the job from Palmer but was happy to run along the sidelines and play when Palmer went down. Matt Barkley--who does s have the determination to be the guy--looks to bounce around the league as a backup having had auditions with a couple of teams. Ditto with Glennon. Ditto Taylor.

My preference has been a young vet following the same tactic that got us KW and CP. I don't see a QB in this draft worth the draft capital to go from #15 to the top to draft.

My first choice was Alex Smith---scratch that.
My second choice was Cousins---too much scratch for that.
My third choice--Bradford and or Keenum. If the BPA available at #15 is a QB take him there. The 4th or 5th QB off the board will not be worth a major draft capital investment. If no QB at #15, Gabbert as our backup with one more chance to be the starter.

We can win our Division now that both the Rams and Seachicks are dealing with cap issues and an aging roster. SF is still in rebuild and there is no guarantee that JG is going to continue to walk on water. We need a competent QB for this coming season.
 
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Southpaw

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Other FAto be QBs;
Ryan Fitzpatrick, QB, Buccaneers. Age: 35.

  • Ryan Fitzpatrick's days as a starting NFL quarterback are over, but he's at least a very strong backup. He quarterbacked the Buccaneers to a couple of wins in relief of Jameis Winston, throwing seven touchdowns to just three interceptions.
  • Matt Moore, QB, Dolphins. Age: 34

  • Matt Moore has been one of the better backup quarterbacks in the NFL over the past several years, but that could change soon, given that he turns 34 over the summer.

    Jay Cutler, QB, Dolphins. Age: 35.

    Jay Cutler was atrocious in most of his games this past season, and it's clear that he's no longer a starting-caliber quarterback. He would be a good backup, but he'll likely reenter the world of broadcasting instead.
  • Derek Anderson, QB, Panthers. Age: 35.

    Drew Stanton, QB, Cardinals. Age: 34.


    Tom Savage, QB, Texans. Age: 28.
  • Chad Henne, QB, Jaguars. Age: 33.
  • Blaine Gabbert, QB, Cardinals. Age: 28.
  • E.J. Manuel, QB, Raiders. Age: 28.
  • Mark Sanchez, QB, Bears. Age: 31.
  • Ryan Mallett, QB, Ravens. Age: 30.
  • Joe Webb, QB, Bills. Age: 31.
  • Kellen Clemens, QB, Chargers. Age: 35.
  • Austin Davis, QB, Seahawks. Age: 29.
  • Scott Tolzien, QB, Colts. Age: 30.
  • Taylor Heinicke (RFA), QB, Texans. Age: 25.
  • Ryan Griffin, QB, Buccaneers. Age: 28.
  • Tyler Bray, QB, Chiefs. Age: 27.
  • David Fales (RFA), QB, Dolphins. Age: 27.
  • Chase Daniel, QB, Saints. Age: 31.
  • Brandon Weeden, QB, Titans. Age: 34.

Read more at http://www.walterfootball.com/freeagents2018QB.php#IbTqvZCfr3sjMsV3.99
 

MadCardDisease

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I like Bradford and McCown as stopgap QBs should we draft a rookie. I wouldn't mind Case Keenum as a game manager if the price is right and the Cardinals decide to build around their defense and a running game.

Bridgewater scares the crap out of me.
 

Solar7

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Great thread, Harry.

I'm personally convinced that on the right team, Kirk will be a winner and even possibly All-Pro. Having watched a lot of his games (my dad is a Redskins fan, Kirk has been my QB in fantasy for multiple years), I'm convinced that with more talent and less drops from his receivers, he could put up even better numbers than he has. If he has a defense he can count on to not just let the other team march down the field, or a running game that means the pass rushers can't just tee off on him, that he'll succeed. You'd have one happy guy in Vegas if #8 comes to the desert this year.

Next up, I'm most intrigued by McCarron. I think he can be a capable game manager that doesn't take us out of competition financially for free agents, and doesn't preclude us from selecting a rookie QB in the first or second round. I'd like to see what he can do, knowing the compensation will only be money - and that I think he can stay healthier than the other true FAs.

Third, Bradford is probably the best fit in between what he wants to do with his career, and our needs. If his knee hadn't taken him out of all last year, I'd be all-aboard... he strikes me as having potential to be the next Warner or Palmer back there, his career resurrected in the desert. (But for how long, is the question... both of those players highly benefited from Larry on the field, and that's coming to a close.) But the injuries? Ugh. It makes it hard to trust.

Same with Bridgewater. If we can get him cheaply and get a rookie QB? I guess I'll be okay, but a little disheartened. I liked Teddy coming out, I liked him with the Vikings, but I fear he won't have the confidence on the field.

I want to stay away from Foles and Keenum. Two guys that had miserable years with renaissance seasons, but still haven't drawn the confidence of teams to be "the guy." No thanks, especially for Foles' compensation.
 

az jam

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Great thread, Harry.

I'm personally convinced that on the right team, Kirk will be a winner and even possibly All-Pro. Having watched a lot of his games (my dad is a Redskins fan, Kirk has been my QB in fantasy for multiple years), I'm convinced that with more talent and less drops from his receivers, he could put up even better numbers than he has. If he has a defense he can count on to not just let the other team march down the field, or a running game that means the pass rushers can't just tee off on him, that he'll succeed. You'd have one happy guy in Vegas if #8 comes to the desert this year.

Next up, I'm most intrigued by McCarron. I think he can be a capable game manager that doesn't take us out of competition financially for free agents, and doesn't preclude us from selecting a rookie QB in the first or second round. I'd like to see what he can do, knowing the compensation will only be money - and that I think he can stay healthier than the other true FAs.

Third, Bradford is probably the best fit in between what he wants to do with his career, and our needs. If his knee hadn't taken him out of all last year, I'd be all-aboard... he strikes me as having potential to be the next Warner or Palmer back there, his career resurrected in the desert. (But for how long, is the question... both of those players highly benefited from Larry on the field, and that's coming to a close.) But the injuries? Ugh. It makes it hard to trust.

Same with Bridgewater. If we can get him cheaply and get a rookie QB? I guess I'll be okay, but a little disheartened. I liked Teddy coming out, I liked him with the Vikings, but I fear he won't have the confidence on the field.

I want to stay away from Foles and Keenum. Two guys that had miserable years with renaissance seasons, but still haven't drawn the confidence of teams to be "the guy." No thanks, especially for Foles' compensation.


I'm pretty much in tune with your choices. I would go 1. Cousins 2. McCarron and 3. Bradford.
 

Southpaw

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Cousins makes me wonder why Redskins would not lock him up. Do they know something the Twitter world does not know?

McCarron has a 4 game resume' and co,mes from the unvaunted Alabama school of QBs.

Bradford is a permanent patient.

None of them come without question marks.
 

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Ryan Tannerhill has a good chance of being in this discussion but I don't know how to evaluate him.
 

Solar7

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Cousins makes me wonder why Redskins would not lock him up. Do they know something the Twitter world does not know?

McCarron has a 4 game resume' and co,mes from the unvaunted Alabama school of QBs.

Bradford is a permanent patient.

None of them come without question marks.
Cousins was apparently at a point where the relationship between he and the franchise had soured. It got to a point where they outright stopped talking extension.
 

oaken1

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Cousins was apparently at a point where the relationship between he and the franchise had soured. It got to a point where they outright stopped talking extension.

B.S. Talks soured because kirk didnt want to take a market deal for his services, so they get some media, build some hype...peak interest..it causes the market to rise...your always worth more to someone else than the one you work for

Cousins is playing the mercenary game. Play on the tag...big money... now he wants a short fat contract with lots of guarantees...
ya think that helps a team?? what it does is put him back on the market in a couple of years when....you guessed it...the cap is higher and he can ask for even bigger money.


its easy for lots of folks to just blame it on the skins...sure...

but one fact that has been untarnished for decades, is the fact that Daniel Snyder continually overpays for talent...its like an addiction to him, giving his money away
 

moklerman

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B.S. Talks soured because kirk didnt want to take a market deal for his services, so they get some media, build some hype...peak interest..it causes the market to rise...your always worth more to someone else than the one you work for

Cousins is playing the mercenary game. Play on the tag...big money... now he wants a short fat contract with lots of guarantees...
ya think that helps a team?? what it does is put him back on the market in a couple of years when....you guessed it...the cap is higher and he can ask for even bigger money.


its easy for lots of folks to just blame it on the skins...sure...

but one fact that has been untarnished for decades, is the fact that Daniel Snyder continually overpays for talent...its like an addiction to him, giving his money away
Didn't the Redskins GM say at one point that Cousins wasn't anything special? I'd say that's played a part in how Cousins has negotiated with them.
 

juza76

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Didn't the Redskins GM say at one point that Cousins wasn't anything special? I'd say that's played a part in how Cousins has negotiated with them.
Yes he is nothing special
U dont let your qb go if u dont a replacement in the roster
And we can read the statistics and how cousins plays were pretty mediocre against contenders
 

oaken1

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Didn't the Redskins GM say at one point that Cousins wasn't anything special? I'd say that's played a part in how Cousins has negotiated with them.

exe GM yeah,... just a couple months back


"He's a good player," McCloughan told 104.3 The Fan. "Is he special? I don't see special." McCloughan added that when he first tagged Cousins in 2016, Washington was "building a roster around him to make him special." While Cousins is "talented" and he "works his tail off", McCloughan warned that for Cousins to succeed, a team needs more than just the signal-caller.

"You just need to have some talent around him," McCloughan warned, "because you don't want him to be throwing the ball 35 to 40 times to win the game."
 

Solar7

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B.S. Talks soured because kirk didnt want to take a market deal for his services, so they get some media, build some hype...peak interest..it causes the market to rise...your always worth more to someone else than the one you work for

Cousins is playing the mercenary game. Play on the tag...big money... now he wants a short fat contract with lots of guarantees...
ya think that helps a team?? what it does is put him back on the market in a couple of years when....you guessed it...the cap is higher and he can ask for even bigger money.


its easy for lots of folks to just blame it on the skins...sure...

but one fact that has been untarnished for decades, is the fact that Daniel Snyder continually overpays for talent...its like an addiction to him, giving his money away

I don't think "market deal" is $53 million.

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/...sins-53-million-but-he-prefers-franchise-tag/

He's now going to make a lot more on top of that, so he played it right. They wouldn't pay him the year before this, and then just happened to take away all of his best weapons... but he still produced.

That 3-year deal concept is still unsubstantiated.
 

moklerman

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The nfc west were not the cream of the crop anymore.
Show his stats against teams with winning record
Just making a point as it pertains to the Cardinals. I agree that his record against the NFC East leaves a lot to be desired but it is possible that his surrounding cast may have played a part and the matchups too. The NFCW has been known for pretty good defense between AZ, SEA and LA so for him to put up good numbers against them, at least presents the possibility that he could produce better against a different division.
 

GimmedaBall

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Other FAto be QBs;
Ryan Fitzpatrick, QB, Buccaneers. Age: 35.
  • Ryan Fitzpatrick's days as a starting NFL quarterback are over, but he's at least a very strong backup. He quarterbacked the Buccaneers to a couple of wins in relief of Jameis Winston, throwing seven touchdowns to just three interceptions.
  • Matt Moore, QB, Dolphins. Age: 34

  • Matt Moore has been one of the better backup quarterbacks in the NFL over the past several years, but that could change soon, given that he turns 34 over the summer.

    Jay Cutler, QB, Dolphins. Age: 35.

    Jay Cutler was atrocious in most of his games this past season, and it's clear that he's no longer a starting-caliber quarterback. He would be a good backup, but he'll likely reenter the world of broadcasting instead.
  • Derek Anderson, QB, Panthers. Age: 35.

    Drew Stanton, QB, Cardinals. Age: 34.


    Tom Savage, QB, Texans. Age: 28.
  • Chad Henne, QB, Jaguars. Age: 33.
  • Blaine Gabbert, QB, Cardinals. Age: 28.
  • E.J. Manuel, QB, Raiders. Age: 28.
  • Mark Sanchez, QB, Bears. Age: 31.
  • Ryan Mallett, QB, Ravens. Age: 30.
  • Joe Webb, QB, Bills. Age: 31.
  • Kellen Clemens, QB, Chargers. Age: 35.
  • Austin Davis, QB, Seahawks. Age: 29.
  • Scott Tolzien, QB, Colts. Age: 30.
  • Taylor Heinicke (RFA), QB, Texans. Age: 25.
  • Ryan Griffin, QB, Buccaneers. Age: 28.
  • Tyler Bray, QB, Chiefs. Age: 27.
  • David Fales (RFA), QB, Dolphins. Age: 27.
  • Chase Daniel, QB, Saints. Age: 31.
  • Brandon Weeden, QB, Titans. Age: 34.
Read more at http://www.walterfootball.com/freeagents2018QB.php#IbTqvZCfr3sjMsV3.99

Good reminder that there are plenty of guys out there who hang on as backups once they either played as a starter or never made it.

Don't see Kapernick on the list?? Believe Fitzpatrick has resigned with Tampa to be their backup again. Not a bad gig for an old dude. It might turn into some starts given Winston's pending legal problem. (Would have been great to hear Wolf call a pass play "Fitzpatrick hits Fitzgerald."

A lot of guys getting paid to hold a clipboard and stand on the sidelines until the starter goes down.

Also, a lot of names on the list were in previous debates over where they should be taken in the draft, how much to trade up, who to cut, etc

http://www.nfl.com/draft/history/fulldraft?type=position

A glance over the draft history of QBs shows the danger of picking the 5th and 6th guys off the board (actually, anywhere in the draft. LOL)
 
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Harry

Harry

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For your information Harry Bridgewater was injured in the pocket in practice.He is not a runner unless he has to.Not really a big scrambler.

I know. I just said they must stop his penchant for runnung. The part about improving the line was to improve the pocket and protect him.
 

moklerman

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I know. I just said they must stop his penchant for runnung. The part about improving the line was to improve the pocket and protect him.
Valid points but the reality is, no matter how good your line is you can't protect a guy that's getting hurt just dropping back to pass. I don't know how predictive a non-contact injury like that is but it's scary that his body gave out like that. Was it a fluke or has he got some physiological deficiencies?
 
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Harry

Harry

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How much to pay? The issue is term more than cost. I wouldn’t go more than 2 years on Bradford or Bridgewater. Bradford in the mid 40s. Bridgewater in the low 30s with less guaranteed. I think you get McCown for $6 mil guaranteed.
 

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