2010 Free For All

[Skkorpion]

Please understand this. The city itself is not enough to make the Suns an attractive free agent destination (the Cards are a case in point). What makes a team an attractive destination is

Money
Winning potential
Money
Ownership commitment
Money
Coaching philosophy
Money
Teammates
Money

JC made this place a popular FA destination because he did not nickel and dime players. He talked straight with players and treated them fairly and with respect.

I hope that Sarver will learn this, but it is not his reputation so far.

I don't like Sarver either, so far, but JC was playing mostly with other people's money. It's a lot easier when your own exposure is minimal.

 

[Chris_Sanders]

sign wade and amare to max deals.

sign nash for the minimum, let him come off the bench

sign tmac for the full MLE

Do you see that little sub forum that says "Trade Forum"?

That is where complete nonsense like this goes. Please keep it there with the other fantasy land posts.

 

[sunsallday]

1. Stoudemire's trade value is far, far higher than Nash's.

So what if his trade value is higher. Doesn't mean we have to trade him. He is our best player, is in my opinion the best offensive PF, and will only get better. He is just entering his prime. You can't just trade long time players and sign superstars together.

2. Stoudemire's knees are due to blow up again in two or three years. The problem that led to the cartilage breakdown has not been solved. Microfracture is a band-aid.

That is possible, but the fact that he is playing at the same level now when he did in 05 is astonishing considering the fact that he had three knee surgeries. Most if nba players playing level drops. There points go down year by year. The worst case scenario is Chris Webber. Stoudemire is the greatest comeback story of micro fracture surgery. The moves he is doing now should have blown his knees out a long time ago. If he is able to still play at this level after three knee surgeries now, he is in good shape. Most players would be lucky to even average 20 points.

3. What's the point of hanging onto an elite scorer who can't elevate the play of his teammates when his supporting cast will be lousy? Do you honestly think the Suns are going to find a way to put a better team around Stoudemire than the one he's had the last two years?

That is why there is free agency. After SHAQ, Nash, and Bell's contracts are up in 2010, we will have a butt load of cap space. Anybody can come here if the Suns lure here. All we would really need is a good wing player to play along side Amare and a PG. If Dragic is good enough to run the team, we are set. Nobody can predict the future, including you. Yes they can put a better team around Amare. They had a better team in 05 which was three years ago, so anything can happen the roster surrounding Amare in a few years.

FREE AGENCY.

 

[Chris_Sanders]

Don't bold all your posts again sunsallday. It is annoying and rude.

 

[Splinters81]

We are one of the fastest developing cities in the nation. We have 360 days of sunshine. We have high end residential communities that are close to their job. We have more golf courses per capita than anywhere on the planet. We will have unbelievable cap space. We have a miracle working training staff. We are six hours from Mexico and the coast.

I hope you understand most of us are aware LA, NYC. etc are better, but we have a lot to offer. Your comment suggests that you haven't traveled much...

Wow, I have lived in Phx most of my life and this has made me want to move here haha. Perfectly said.

 

[Splinters81]

The Spurs are very well know internationally. They have international players like Parker and Ginobli, and Stern wants the NBA to be popular in places like China and most of Europe. Maybe in the league's best interest comment is going overboard, but their has been a lot of very questionable actions and events that have happened over the past few years. Even if it is not a conspiracy, Stern is a idiot and I hope Phoenix residents boo him in the 2009 All-Star games in Phoenix.

You know what; your comment is not overboard. It is right on par. Think about all the crap, cheating refs, BS suspension, why was there no suspension during the Celtics game when players left the bench.

Peirce goes down in agony and has to be wheel chaired off the court, but still manages to win finals MVP. Something aint right in basketball, hell maybe all of pro sports.

 

[Splinters81]

What disturbs me quite a bit is how San Antonio has somehow become a preference by free agents over us. I have lived in San Antonio. It is a ******** town with a cavernous and crappy arena.

Scottsdale by itself is a better city than 80% of the other NBA cities, yet so far no one is knocking down our door this year (or even really mentioning us).

Why would Scottsdale need a NBA team?? Scottsdale is nothing more than a sub-city of phoenix, I am sick of Scottsdale people thinking their **** don't stink. We don't need don't need four basketball teams to choose from like Cali.

I am sorry this (Scottsdale by itself is a better city than 80% of the other NBA cities, yet so far no one is knocking down our door this year) made no sense.

 

[Joe Mama]

The 2007 Phoenix Suns are twice the team that the 2006 Phoenix Suns were. People say we were better without Amare Stoudemire. Please.

We went 7 games against the 7th seeded Lakers and the formidable Clippers in 2006. We struggled basically for the entire playoffs. We also only won 54 games. Amare Stoudemire comes back and we have a 61 win season, a 17 games winning streak, and easily dispatch the Lakers in five games in 2007. Yes we lost in the semi-finals, but that was arguably affected by the refs and the league's best interest.

You didn't read my post. I said before Kurt Thomas went down the Phoenix Suns were a better team in 2005-06. I still believe that had he stayed healthy, especially if the Phoenix Suns had still been able to pick up Tim Thomas, they would have won the championship that year. That team before Kurt Thomas went down was top five in defense (ppp), yet they were still at the top of the league in scoring.

It's in the league's best interest to stimulate the small markets when the big markets are over the luxury tax.

How is that so hard to apprehend?

Silliest argument ever.

Seriously, that might be the silliest conspiracy argument I've ever heard. The San Antonio - Detroit finals was a low point for the NBA as far as ratings and popularity go, and San Antonio - Cleveland wasn't a whole lot better. The Phoenix Suns are one of the most popular teams in the NBA, especially over the last 3-4 years where everybody loved to watch their up-tempo style. David Stern would have loved to get the Phoenix Suns in the finals.

The Spurs are very well know internationally. They have international players like Parker and Ginobli, and Stern wants the NBA to be popular in places like China and most of Europe. Maybe in the league's best interest comment is going overboard, but their has been a lot of very questionable actions and events that have happened over the past few years. Even if it is not a conspiracy, Stern is a idiot and I hope Phoenix residents boo him in the 2009 All-Star games in Phoenix.

This is almost as bad as the previous argument for a conspiracy that favors the San Antonio Spurs.

You're new here, just as an FYI there is a faction of fans on this board that dislike Stoudemire, and as you can see think that he is the main reason the Suns are not in the final year in and year out. My advice would be to ignore them, but certainty don't try to give them numbers like wins, highlights and never offense numbers as they are still bitter and yearning for the Ben Wallace that nbadraft.net promised them 5 years ago.

yes, we have formed a gang of anti-Amare Stoudemire players and we are trying to systematically turn everyone against him here. Offensively he may be one of the top three players in the game. I think it's entirely fair to say that in 2006-07 he and Boris cost the Phoenix Suns a really good shot at a championship with their inability to do follow simple instructions and keep their butts on the bench.

I'm not saying that the Phoenix Suns should just dump Amare Stoudemire. I'm saying that if they can get a really good package in return it might be worth it. Unless this team is looking really strong for the 2010 season before they sign any one else I think there's a very good chance that Amare bails for another team.

Joe

 

[Irish]

I love how we can't stand our team, but pan 1/2 of the NBA All Star teams too. We are a picky lot, aren't we?

I find it curious that no one seems to get the initial point of the post. Teams are altering their behavior THIS SUMMER based on 2010. After the elite players are off the board, the number of contracts longer than 2 years are going to be very scarce. Even fairly pro-forma extsnions are going to be reduced as teams don't want to tie up cap space.

If anything, I look for some "odd" deals and teams try to unload contracts longer than two years even if one sided. Next summer, Shaq could be a hugely valuable asset since he could be traded for three or foul players with longer contracts on teams focused on free agency.

 

[Chris_Sanders]

Why would Scottsdale need a NBA team?? Scottsdale is nothing more than a sub-city of phoenix, I am sick of Scottsdale people thinking their **** don't stink. We don't need don't need four basketball teams to choose from like Cali.

I am sorry this (Scottsdale by itself is a better city than 80% of the other NBA cities, yet so far no one is knocking down our door this year) made no sense.

Sigh...

I know Scottsdale is a suburb of Phoenix. That's the point. 1 suburb of Phoenix is better than 80% of the NBA cities...thus Phoenix as a whole SHOULD be a very attractive city for free agents. As mentioned though, the Cardinals haven't been able to take advantage of this. Poor ownership can negate a lot of the attractiveness of a city.

I never even suggested that Scottsdale should have it's own NBA team. Please follow along with the conversation as a whole.

 

[JCSunsfan]

Sigh...

I know Scottsdale is a suburb of Phoenix. That's the point. 1 suburb of Phoenix is better than 80% of the NBA cities...thus Phoenix as a whole SHOULD be a very attractive city for free agents. As mentioned though, the Cardinals haven't been able to take advantage of this. Poor ownership can negate a lot of the attractiveness of a city.

I never even suggested that Scottsdale should have it's own NBA team. Please follow along with the conversation as a whole.

If it makes you feel better,Igot your point.

 

[Bigdez22]

Sigh...

I know Scottsdale is a suburb of Phoenix. That's the point. 1 suburb of Phoenix is better than 80% of the NBA cities...thus Phoenix as a whole SHOULD be a very attractive city for free agents. As mentioned though, the Cardinals haven't been able to take advantage of this. Poor ownership can negate a lot of the attractiveness of a city.

I never even suggested that Scottsdale should have it's own NBA team. Please follow along with the conversation as a whole.

we are now comparing the Suns front office to the Cards front office?

 

[Chris_Sanders]

we are now comparing the Suns front office to the Cards front office?

The Cardinals have never sold players for money like the Suns have.

 

[Chris_Sanders]

Oh and Bigdezz, I didn't compare the Suns office to the Cardinals office. I said that Bidwill has been unable to take advantage of what should be a large asset in his city of residence. They are a case in point of why good city doesn't equal big free agents.

You need to either:

A) Actually read what people are saying.

B) Stop trying to twist their words to get a reaction.

 

[Bigdez22]

Oh and Bigdezz, I didn't compare the Suns office to the Cardinals office. I said that Bidwill has been unable to take advantage of what should be a large asset in his city of residence. They are a case in point of why good city doesn't equal big free agents.

You need to either:

A) Actually read what people are saying.

B) Stop trying to twist their words to get a reaction.

ok.

Then why use the cards analogy to compare to the Suns situation? The cards dont get free agents because they have not been in contention for 50 years. So by you saying this, you think free agents do not want to come here because the front office is no good, You are comparing the cards front office to the suns front office.If You think the destination is great, then there has to be another reason why you think the Suns would not be a place where people would not want to play. could it be the........front office?????????? So, when you used the Cards analogy, you were saying the Suns are no better then the cards and that's why players, according to you, would not find Phoenix a good destination.

so..... chill out and stop telling people what they need to do, and spend a little more time thinking about what you are saying before you post.

 

[Splinters81]

Oh and Bigdezz, I didn't compare the Suns office to the Cardinals office. I said that Bidwill has been unable to take advantage of what should be a large asset in his city of residence. They are a case in point of why good city doesn't equal big free agents.

You need to either:

A) Actually read what people are saying.

B) Stop trying to twist their words to get a reaction.

I really do not think that Phoenix is the reason they can't bring talent to the team. I think the problem is the team has a reputation of doing horrible even though they dont look bad on paper.

I dont see how you can compare the Suns to the Cards.

 

[msdundee]

so..... chill out and stop telling people what they need to do, and spend a little more time thinking about what you are saying before you post.

 

[mojorizen7]

You must be registered for see images

so..... chill out and stop telling people what they need to do, and spend a little more time thinking about what you are saying before you post.

 

[Irish]

I really do not think that Phoenix is the reason they can't bring talent to the team. I think the problem is the team has a reputation of doing horrible even though they dont look bad on paper.

Horrible? Two trips to the WCF, one to the second round, and only this past playoffs did they fail to get out of the first round. T-Mac has never once been out of the first round in his entire career.

All that keeps the Suns from being a strong destination is that they don't have cap space and aren't prepared to go deep in the LT. Remember back in 2004 the Suns were a major target and they had missed the playoffs two of the previous three years.

 

[Joe Mama]

Horrible? Two trips to the WCF, one to the second round, and only this past playoffs did they fail to get out of the first round. T-Mac has never once been out of the first round in his entire career.

All that keeps the Suns from being a strong destination is that they don't have cap space and aren't prepared to go deep in the LT. Remember back in 2004 the Suns were a major target and they had missed the playoffs two of the previous three years.

I think he was talking about the Arizona Cardinals.

Joe

 

[nowagimp]

Why shouldn't he be? He's arguably one of the top 3 Power Forwards in the game, and could reasonably develop into the games premier PF. As a general rule, I'm all for having the best player of his position on my team, call me crazy.

Amare stoudemire is the best offensive big man in the NBA, one of the 5 worst defensive PF's in the league and he plays on a reconstructed, almost experimental, knee. Some of you "defense, defense" wizards should ask where defense begins. It begins with a KG or a TD down low, so you CAN play an eddie house or ray allen on the perimeter without getting beat continuously. TD covers for oberto, KG covers for allen, no one covers for amare. Maybe lopexz will be that guy, but it seems a bit of a long shot for a guy projected to have a max upside of varajao. A big man that dominates the middle defensively is one of the most valuable assets in the NBA, because he changes the way you play defense, pressure the perimeter more because you have an intimidator in the lane area. I think the question is can ANY team afford to pay amare stoudemire 17M and still have enough money to hire the big man defenders and offensive swings and stay under the cap. If amares defense was even passing it'd be alot easier.

 

[nowagimp]

I really do not think that Phoenix is the reason they can't bring talent to the team. I think the problem is the team has a reputation of doing horrible even though they dont look bad on paper.

I dont see how you can compare the Suns to the Cards.

It seemed obvious to me that the comparison was only that the destination must not have been the dominant factor, for the cards, and for the suns. Most players will listen to their agents, if the agent says sarver is a jerk, he goes somewhere else. Suns fans should realize that after the JJ fiasco that agents manipulate players. Many players wont react well to the negotiating tactics that owners will use with agents and visa versa, and the agent can just say, he's being difficult and not giving you what you deserve, "it doesnt look like a good deal". So if sarver is "on the outs" with agents or perhaps is too difficult with them, that FA may go elsewhere and it likely has nothing to do with what phoenix has to offer.

Old guys like PJ Brown and Cassel probably didnt want to run the ball.

Tyron Lue thought he wouldnt get the PT, or perhaps he's another greg anthony or avery johnson(both think they were better PG's than nash).

Finley, probably picked the spurs as a better organization, hard to debate that one.

The ownerships of boston, LA, SA, Detroit, Portland, Dallas, Houston, are pretty stiff competition for a real estate businessman who is relatively new to the business of basketball. Ditching the colangelos too quickly may have had a cost, perhaps the present ownership didnt learn the basketball business savy, smarts, before dumping them.

 

[Mainstreet]

Ditching the colangelos too quickly may have had a cost, perhaps the present ownership didnt learn the basketball business savy, smarts, before dumping them.

The truth rings loud and clear. I think there are still a number of fans still so busy kicking D'Antoni to realize this.

 

[HooverDam]

Amare stoudemire is...one of the 5 worst defensive PF's

This statement is monumentally stupid. Amare may be one of the worse star Power Forwards on defense (i.e. he's not as good as TD, KG, Boozer, etc), but one of the top 5 worst defending power forwards in the league? Thats ridiculous.

 

[LV-Suns]

This statement is monumentally stupid. Amare may be one of the worse star Power Forwards on defense (i.e. he's not as good as TD, KG, Boozer, etc), but one of the top 5 worst defending power forwards in the league? Thats ridiculous.

Boozer? Much worse defender than Amare. A lot.