JCSunsfan
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Did he actually make contact with him. Its hard to tell from the video.
2015-16 Around the NBA
- Thread starter Phrazbit
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Did he actually make contact with him. Its hard to tell from the video.
Adrian Wojnarowski @WojVerticalNBA
Clippers are sending cash to Houston with Josh Smith, covering the balance of his salary. Houston only sending draft rights to Clippers.
Adrian Wojnarowski @WojVerticalNBA
The Rockets are sending the draft rights to Maarty Leunen to the Clippers in the Josh Smith deal, league sources tell Yahoo Sports.
elindholm
edited for content
"Maarty"?
Chaplin
Better off silent
Cavs just fired David Blatt.
Tyronn Lue is the new coach. Not interim, new.
Tyronn Lue is the new coach. Not interim, new.
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elindholm
edited for content
Wow! It's just a no-win situation there. James left in the first place because they had second-tier talent. Then he went back because he felt guilty, but they still have second-tier talent, and James can't elevate them, because he's never been that kind of player and never will be. Meanwhile, they traded away Wiggins and a dozen draft picks in a now-or-never move, and once it becomes evident that this core can't be good enough, they're screwed for at least a decade.
In other words, James now officially has the reins. Wish him well.
Wow! I did not see that coming at all.
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Catlover
Hall of Famer
Maybe they aren't quite as deep as they need to be but I wouldn't really call that second-tier talent. They are 40 - 7 over the past year when Irving, Love and James all start. I think the problem, in addition to Kyrie's injuries, is that no one anticipated the meteoric rise of the Warriors not to mention the sudden resurgence of the Spurs.
3 year deal for Lue.
@WojVerticalNBA: Ty Lue has agreed to a three-year contract with Cavs, league source tells Yahoo Sports.
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@WojVerticalNBA: Ty Lue has agreed to a three-year contract with Cavs, league source tells Yahoo Sports.
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JCSunsfan
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I agree. Love and Irving are not second tier talent. They might not be the right talent for LeBron though.
JCSunsfan
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So much for head coaching experience as a big factor.
Steve Kerr--no coaching experience
Luke Walton--no coaching experience to speak of
Jason Kidd--no coaching experience prior to Brooklyn, 1 year prior to Milwaukee
By the way Popovich had no head coaching experience prior to taking the Spurs gig (6 years an assistant).
Pat Riley came out of the broadcast booth into the Lakers coaching job.
Oh well, all that aside. I wonder if the Cavs are eager to make a personnel move as well.
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SirStefan32
Krycek, Alex Krycek
Suns could go after Blatt now.
JCSunsfan
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Chandler, Kieff, Tucker and the Cavs pick for Love and Mozgov
Cavs need complementary players to LeBron. Defense, rebounding, players that can be effective without the ball in their hands. That is Chandler and Tucker. They also need a player that will get in LeBron's face if he has to. Chandler is one of the few players in the league that will do that.
Kieff provides a backup for Thompson.
I am not sure if Love is a star player as in a "big three" type of player. But I would be willing to gamble on him.
Could also do Knight, Chandler, and Tucker and a pick for Love, Mozgov, and Mo Williams.
Cavs need complementary players to LeBron. Defense, rebounding, players that can be effective without the ball in their hands. That is Chandler and Tucker. They also need a player that will get in LeBron's face if he has to. Chandler is one of the few players in the league that will do that.
Kieff provides a backup for Thompson.
I am not sure if Love is a star player as in a "big three" type of player. But I would be willing to gamble on him.
Could also do Knight, Chandler, and Tucker and a pick for Love, Mozgov, and Mo Williams.
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LOL... you say this all the time, but the idea that he didn't elevate second tier talent to the FINALS last year and got within 2 games of winning it makes zero sense.
Same can be said for his second title against the Spurs who were a superior team while James played with a one-legged Dwayne Wade.
the idea that James doesn't elevate everyone around him has always been and will always be one of the more ridiculous things anyone has ever said about basketball.
elindholm
edited for content
He's been the best player in the league for a decade and has two titles. Either he's been saddled with the sorriest teammates of all time, or something else is going on. His failure to consistently translate his overwhelming individual ability into championship success is without precedent, with the possible exception of Chamberlain.
But hey, just stick with name-calling, it works well for you.
GatorAZ
feed hopkins
Of the four finals series Lebron lost I don't think anyone would have expected his team won other than 2011. They probably shouldn't have beaten San Antonio in 2013 either. Spurs were the better team IMO.
They mostly say Lebron is more Magic than Michael. Magic had 8 or 9 finals and 4-5 rings? I forget. Lebron has 2 rings and I think 5 appearances? Magic and Lebron are great and have had Allstars around them, they just don't have the killer instinct like Jordan and Kobe did.
Catlover
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I would have never thought to say that Magic lacked killer instinct nor that he was in any way inferior to Kobe. Unlike today there were several great teams playing during Magic's run and yet he still led them to 5 championships. If you really think he falls short the killer instinct watch that series against Philadelphia where Kareem was out. Magic matched up against their center, the supposedly soon-to-be-superstar Darrell Dawkins and dominated him. Dawkins was never quite the same again.
JCSunsfan
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Phrazbit
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His original run with the Cavs, for sure, apart from LeBron that team was one of the worst rosters in the NBA, and they proved it the next season. Larry Hughes and Mo Williams were two of the best guys who played with his first go in Cleveland, most teams he went against in the playoffs wouldn't have even started those 2.
He leaves Miami last year and they couldn't even make the playoffs... in the East.
So far in his return to Cleveland they've made the finals and got beaten by a monster, right now they're atop what is the best Eastern Conference in over a decade.
I don't see how he isn't lifting these teams. I suppose if the only measure of carrying a team is to drag them to the title, then yeah. But he has averaged 55-60+ wins a year for like 8 or 9 seasons now, he will probably make his 6th straight trip to the finals this year.
The only season I think he really should have done better than he did was his first year in Miami. He let himself be the 3rd fiddle vs Dallas. They should have won that series easily.
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Phrazbit
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I also think Kobe's "killer instinct" is the most misplaced trait ever assigned to a player, and him getting put along side Michael is a real disservice to a guy who actually knew how to tear a team's heart out. It was virtually always the Lakers who would die when Kobe went into the clutch and decided he needed to start chucking. And when the Lakers backs were against the wall and they needed a win to keep a series going he was almost always at his worst.
When I think of MJ's killer instinct I think of him stripping Malone, strolling down the court and winning the finals, or drawing in the defense and hitting an open Paxson or Kerr to win a series. When I think of Kobe the memory that stands out the most is Ron Artest tipping in his airball.
When I think of MJ's killer instinct I think of him stripping Malone, strolling down the court and winning the finals, or drawing in the defense and hitting an open Paxson or Kerr to win a series. When I think of Kobe the memory that stands out the most is Ron Artest tipping in his airball.
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did you watch his teams on Cleveland the first time? Those were the SORRIEST teammates of all time. When he got to Miami, he went to the Finals 4 straight times and won 2. And when he got back to Cleveland and they lost one-all star in the first round, he still put that team on his back and got them back to the finals and then when they lost their second all-star, he STILL won 2 games with again, the sorriest team of all time.
I mean, what happened to the Cavs last year when LeBron left? They still had Bosh and Wade... and pretty much the ENTIRE team that LeBron dragged to the finals the year before. What happened to them in the Eastern conference? Oh yeah... they didn't even make the playoffs. But LeBron didn't elevate that team previously?
You realize that he's been to the Finals 6 times. And that's he's won 2, right? That's championship success. You realize he's only lost ONCE as a title favorite, right? He's got one less title then Larry Bird. And the same amount as Wilt. Do you believe those guys also didn't elevate their teammates?
You say something patently ridiculous like LeBron doesn't make teammates better and I'm going to call it ridiculous. Guys like Dellavadova, Shumpert, J.R. Smith... he makes ALL those guys better. And again, the Heat didn't even make the PLAYOFFS last year, in the horrendous East, without LeBron, who one year earlier put them in the Finals.
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Magic was incredible, no doubt. But Magic also played with one of the most talented rosters in NBA history. Kareem is one of the best players of all time. Worthy is a HOFer. Byron Scott was a great player. Jamaal Wilkes, Norm Nixon, etc. etc. Not to mention, Magic played for one of the most genius minds in basketball history with Riley coaching him.
LeBron's never had that insurmountable collection of talent around him save the first three years with Miami. He definitely crapped the bed the first year against Dallas, but after that they won 2 straight... with Spoelstra as their leader.
elindholm
edited for content
Look, I'm not the only one with this point of view. Snoop around NBA sites and you'll see all sorts of chatter about James's leadership failures. That doesn't mean that the chatter is correct, but it seems pretty haughty to dismiss it out of hand as "one of the more ridiculous things ever said."
In addition, getting to the Finals and losing isn't the standard that the greatest players measure themselves by. Jason Kidd's Nets got to two straight Finals, and those teams sucked. A lot of people think that Stockton and Malone's 0-2 Finals record tarnishes their legacies. Imbalance between the conferences can make it a lot easier to get there through one side than through the other.
Since I mentioned Chamberlain specifically, I have to wonder whether you read my post. As for Bird, he was at full strength for only his first 9 seasons, so 3 titles isn't a bad percentage, especially since he was up against legitimate all-time greats in Abdul-Jabbar and Magic.
Pick your favorite candidates for top-5 all time and ask yourself if they would ever lose to the 2011 Mavericks in a Finals. That's just one glaring example.
In addition, getting to the Finals and losing isn't the standard that the greatest players measure themselves by. Jason Kidd's Nets got to two straight Finals, and those teams sucked. A lot of people think that Stockton and Malone's 0-2 Finals record tarnishes their legacies. Imbalance between the conferences can make it a lot easier to get there through one side than through the other.
Since I mentioned Chamberlain specifically, I have to wonder whether you read my post. As for Bird, he was at full strength for only his first 9 seasons, so 3 titles isn't a bad percentage, especially since he was up against legitimate all-time greats in Abdul-Jabbar and Magic.
Pick your favorite candidates for top-5 all time and ask yourself if they would ever lose to the 2011 Mavericks in a Finals. That's just one glaring example.
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I don't care what people write on the internet to drive traffic. I think it's beyond ridiculous to say he doesn't make his teammates better and since you just refused to acknowledge literally ANY point made about his previous teams, it's pretty obvious to me that either a) you don't watch many of his games or b) just can't admit that you're wrong.
There's no doubt that it's easier to get to the Finals from the East... but the fact that LeBron, and LeBron alone can seemingly get ANY team he plays on to the Finals has to say at least A LITTLE about his ability to make the players around him better, IMO.
And I don't know what Kidd, Malone and Stockton have to do with anything. Are you in any way shape or form actually comparing them to LeBron and linking his failures to them? Because i'm pretty sure 6 finals appearances (on a lot of BAD teams) and two titles wins have nothing to do with guys who NEVER won a title (except kidd in his twilight).
I read your post... just starting piling on other guys who should fit your bill as players with overwhelming talent that apparently don't make players around them better. As for your caveat with Bird... he had HOF talent surrounding him his entire career. Can you say the same for LeBron? And LeBron didn't have All-Time greats he was going up against, mostly single-handedly? Tim Duncan, Manu, Parker and their cadre of titles AREN'T all-time greats? Come on.
And should we put Hakeem in the category of not making players around him better? I mean, he only won two titles and was overwhelming more talented than any big man in the game. I mean, what a loser that guy was!
it's one glaring example... because it's the exception to the rule. Can you give me other glaring examples?
Catlover
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You can't really compare rosters from Magic's era (or earlier) to that of today. When Magic played there were several teams during that era that were just as loaded. Expansion and other changes diluted the talent level throughout the league.
Boston for example, in their first 80's championship had Bird, McHale, ML Carr, Cornbread Maxwell, Tiny Archibald, Robert Parish and they only improved that roster over the next few years. Philadelphia when they won the championship a couple years later had Dr J, Moses Malone, Andrew Toney, Mo Cheeks, Bobby Jones and their version of Rambis (Marc Iavaroni). And during that same decade the Pistons put together their best team followed by the Jordan-led Bulls. And they weren't the only teams loaded with talent.
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