2023 Phoenix Suns Offseason

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Hmm, really?

The 2013-14 Nets roster featured Garnett (who was 37 years old to start the season), Pierce (36), and Joe Johnson (32), which probably doesn't quite line up with the Suns current big three -- but the Nets also had Deron Williams (29), Brook Lopez (25), and Kirilenko (32), for actual depth. The Heat were considered the team to beat, but the Nets were solidly in the conversation. Here are two examples I found quickly:

Predictions: Can the Heat three-peat?

SB Nation's featured writers answer several questions and offer many predictions about the 2013-14 season. How many pick the Miami Heat to win their third straight title?

www.sbnation.com

1. Who do you think is the best challenger to Miami?

...

PRADA: The Bulls and Pacers certainly match up the best, but I have questions about Chicago's depth and I'm not convinced Indiana's bench is as upgraded as many say. So I'll go with the Nets, a team many are forgetting about in this race. Kevin Garnett still has the ability to transform a team's culture, Paul Pierce still has a lot left and they have a deep bench that will help those two withstand the rigors of the NBA regular season. Also: if the Heat struggled so much to stop Roy Hibbert, just wait until they see Brook Lopez.

Eight Fearless Predictions for 2013-14

In the normal course of NBA punditry, predictions attached to the start of a season are publicly disseminated before that season actually starts.But here's the thing:Stein Line Live, as a tiny new entity in this mammoth NBA stratosphere, did not yet exist last Tuesday when the 2013-14 season...

www.espn.com

7. Your NBA champion in June is coming from the Eastern Conference.​

OK, OK. It's not the most definitive proclamation of all time, but here's the point: LeBron's Heat are either going to three-peat ... or the East team that keeps them out of the NBA Finals is going to go on and win it all. Pacers versus Clippers was my real-life Finals pick in ESPN.com's and ESPN The Magazine's respective preseason prediction collections, but what I feel even stronger about is the fact that Indy, Brooklyn and Chicago are all more title-worthy than the best of the West.

To me it’s the age differentials that just make the two scenarios so incomparable. It’s a 3 year difference and two 6 year differences. Those are REALLY big differentials. Particularly in the second half/end of career terms. Ages 26-29 is a nothing burger. Ages 34-37 is difference between all star and hanging onto a career for most players.

 

[Peter Sheldon]

That's 2 entirely different situations. The Lakers were a 7 seed who were largely written off around the All-Star break. They ended up making some savvy moves that enabled them to have the best record in the league post All-Star break and upset the defending champs and what was largely considered a legit contender in Memphis an route to finally returning to earth and getting beat by Denver.

The Suns lost to an inferior Mavericks team after finals trip the year before and setting a franchise record for wins in a season that year while cruising to the best record in the league by a half dozen games, easily. They were also up 3-1 against Dallas and Dallas came back and embarrassed the Suns in Phoenix by holding a 40+ point lead for about 3 quarters.

Those things aren't comparable. One is impressive turnaround and the other is an epic meltdown. Media bias doesn't play a role.

So impressively stated! Monty should have been frog-marched to the exit immediately after game 7. What gets lost is game 6 against the Mavs was a similar meltdown and Monty had absolutely zero adjustments after game 6. Basically two guys In Dallas beat the entire Suns squad. And one of those guys was not that great. Epic meltdown.

 

[Yuma]

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[Chaplin]

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KLAY just jumped a few spots in my book.

 

[Hoop Head]

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I think its amusing how the narrative shifts depending on the player being discussed or examined. Durant is looked at as taking the easy way out, joining super teams of sorts where as no one says a bad thing about Booker having All-Star or Hall of Fame level talent wanting to play with him. I get the difference since Booker built himself here but I think Booker might be one of the only players that comes to mind where they're not bashed for recruiting top tier talent. Like even Dwyane Wade caught hell for getting Bosh and LeBron to join him in Miami so it's not even really a homegrown star gets a pass thing. LeBron certainly didn't get a pass when he'd get guys to join him in Cleveland, in his first or second stint. I know there is a disparity in talent he attracted during the two runs there but Cleveland did spend top dollar to sign the best possible players available, Lebron just hadn't learned to win yet in the postseason and it didn't work because some of those guys were redundant.

 

[CardsSunsDbacks]

I think its amusing how the narrative shifts depending on the player being discussed or examined. Durant is looked at as taking the easy way out, joining super teams of sorts where as no one says a bad thing about Booker having All-Star or Hall of Fame level talent wanting to play with him. I get the difference since Booker built himself here but I think Booker might be one of the only players that comes to mind where they're not bashed for recruiting top tier talent. Like even Dwyane Wade caught hell for getting Bosh and LeBron to join him in Miami so it's not even really a homegrown star gets a pass thing. LeBron certainly didn't get a pass when he'd get guys to join him in Cleveland, in his first or second stint. I know there is a disparity in talent he attracted during the two runs there but Cleveland did spend top dollar to sign the best possible players available, Lebron just hadn't learned to win yet in the postseason and it didn't work because some of those guys were redundant.

It was all traded to him. That is certainly a factor in that.

 

[AzStevenCal]

It was all traded to him. That is certainly a factor in that.

True, plus it's the new normal now so even if it had been through free agency it probably would have created less of a stir.

 

[Yuma]

Also, the Lebron circus act in Miami didn't help. How many rings? Not 1, not 2, not 3....

 

[Dr. Jones]

Book is about as real as it gets for home grown drafted talent in the NBA. Tatum hasn't had to struggle. Our guy struggled. Hard.

Much respect for our dude. He's the truth. Best Sun Ever.

 

[Cheesebeef]

To me it’s the age differentials that just make the two scenarios so incomparable. It’s a 3 year difference and two 6 year differences. Those are REALLY big differentials. Particularly in the second half/end of career terms. Ages 26-29 is a nothing burger. Ages 34-37 is difference between all star and hanging onto a career for most players.

Yup. And KG was toast years earlier, not anywhere CLOSE to his prime as opposed to KD who just last midseason was in talks for MVP.

Not to mention Beal is 5 years younger than Paul Pierce who was in major decline, Kirilenko was trash by that point of his career, Lopez hadn’t come close to figuring out his game and Joe Johnson was old news as well.

Oh… and Deron Williams was wayyyyy past his prime as well.

Oh… AND WE HAVE BOOKER. No one on that team was comparable to him in any way shape or form.

Is there a chance that the absolute worst happens and we are just an injury riddled mess all season? That is a possibility but just from a game standpoint, our stars are so vastly superior compared to where their stars were so I see the comparison as a pretty sizable stretch.

 

[Hoop Head]

It was all traded to him. That is certainly a factor in that.

Lebron's running mates in Cleveland like Love were traded there. Same goes for most of their role players. Happened again in LA with trading for Anthony Davis.

Booker is kind of like a modern day Paul Pierce. Drafted here, endured some awful seasons, and finally got some help. The help is top tier as well. He went from TJ Warren and Isiah Canaan to Durant and Beal. That's quite an upgrade.

 

[Phrazbit]

Yup. And KG was toast years earlier, not anywhere CLOSE to his prime as opposed to KD who just last midseason was in talks for MVP.

Not to mention Beal is 5 years younger than Paul Pierce who was in major decline, Kirilenko was trash by that point of his career, Lopez hadn’t come close to figuring out his game and Joe Johnson was old news as well.

Oh… and Deron Williams was wayyyyy past his prime as well.

Oh… AND WE HAVE BOOKER. No one on that team was comparable to him in any way shape or form.

Is there a chance that the absolute worst happens and we are just an injury riddled mess all season? That is a possibility but just from a game standpoint, our stars are so vastly superior compared to where their stars were so I see the comparison as a pretty sizable stretch.

Deron was only 28 years old and an all-star the year before.

Our guys have an age advantage on those post-Celtics stars but the age question is countered by the injury concerns. I would not call the Suns having serious injury problems next year a "worst" scenario... it is a likely scenario that we will just have to deal with and hope they the injury bug doesn't hit in the post season.

 

[Hoop Head]

Deron was only 28 years old and an all-star the year before.

Our guys have an age advantage on those post-Celtics stars but the age question is countered by the injury concerns. I would not call the Suns having serious injury problems next year a "worst" scenario... it is a likely scenario that we will just have to deal with and hope they the injury bug doesn't hit in the post season.

Just to add, KG was an All-Star in his last year in Boston before the trade and Brook Lopez was an All-Star that same year. Joe Johnson ended up being an All-Star the year that Brooklyn team acquired KG and Pierce so they were very much a super team with plenty of weapons. It didn't pan out, partly because Lopez got hurt and missed almost the entire season, but the talent was definitely there. I can see them as a precursor to this Suns team. While neither KG or Pierce were at their peak, together they were equal to KD and Joe Johnson - Bradley Beal isn't a bad comparison either. I'd take Book over Deron easily but the collection of players in Brooklyn formed a more cohesive team than the trio here. We still have questions on who the fifth starter is, although that isn't as dire as it was last season.

 

[Phrazbit]

Just to add, KG was an All-Star in his last year in Boston before the trade and Brook Lopez was an All-Star that same year. Joe Johnson ended up being an All-Star the year that Brooklyn team acquired KG and Pierce so they were very much a super team with plenty of weapons. It didn't pan out, partly because Lopez got hurt and missed almost the entire season, but the talent was definitely there. I can see them as a precursor to this Suns team. While neither KG or Pierce were at their peak, together they were equal to KD and Joe Johnson - Bradley Beal isn't a bad comparison either. I'd take Book over Deron easily but the collection of players in Brooklyn formed a more cohesive team than the trio here. We still have questions on who the fifth starter is, although that isn't as dire as it was last season.

I think, on talent, KD is obviously above where Garnett and Pierce were, but they were still really good going into that trade. Their gap is made up in durability. It doesn’t matter if KD puts up MVP stats if he is missing half the games.

KD needs to stay healthy, and it’s very rare for injury plagued guys his age to change the narrative.

I’d take Booker over Deron too, obviously, but he was still considered a mega star at the time. His career did have a shocking decline, but it hadn’t happened yet.

If we are healthy, we are clearly better, but if Beal and Durant have injury problems like they have the last several years then… yeah… the comparison will be very real.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

I think, on talent, KD is obviously above where Garnett and Pierce were, but they were still really good going into that trade. Their gap is made up in durability. It doesn’t matter if KD puts up MVP stats if he is missing half the games.

KD needs to stay healthy, and it’s very rare for injury plagued guys his age to change the narrative.

I’d take Booker over Deron too, obviously, but he was still considered a mega star at the time. His career did have a shocking decline, but it hadn’t happened yet.

If we are healthy, we are clearly better, but if Beal and Durant have injury problems like they have the last several years then… yeah… the comparison will be very real.

Hmm the outcome might be the same, but again I think the comp is flawed. Yeah those guys were coming off okay seasons but then fell off a cliff. Our guys may be injury concerns but their respective ages don’t indicate the same cliff looming. So if both teams had entered the playoffs healthy ours would be a considerable favorite talentwise. Also, if that nets team didn’t get it done immediately they were cooked. 38, 37, 37 and suddenly (and inextricably) ineffective deron (I can’t recall any player experiencing a drop off of the proportions of his sudden weird deterioration) compared to 35, 31, and 27 suns stars going into season 2 of the crews.

And KG’s all star nod the season before was all timing and rep. He averaged under 15th and under 8 Rebs per game. First season in Brooklyn he averaged 6.5 and 6.6 respectively. Pierce averaged 13.5pys/game in first year in Brooklyn.
And JJ’s all star season was averaging 14,3, and 3. The East was just talent deficient. As mentioned, Lopez only played 17 games and deron was at 14, 6.5. They just all came together a year or two too late. That age doesn’t factor for beal or Booker.

 

[Phrazbit]

Hmm the outcome might be the same, but again I think the comp is flawed. Yeah those guys were coming off okay seasons but then fell off a cliff. Our guys may be injury concerns but their respective ages don’t indicate the same cliff looming. So if both teams had entered the playoffs healthy ours would be a considerable favorite talentwise. Also, if that nets team didn’t get it done immediately they were cooked. 38, 37, 37 and suddenly (and inextricably) ineffective deron (I can’t recall any player experiencing a drop off of the proportions of his sudden weird deterioration) compared to 35, 31, and 27 suns stars going into season 2 of the crews.

Exactly, that is the rub. We're better... but health is the X factor. The Nets were hoping their aged stars would not suffer a decline... we our hoping our oft injured stars (especially KD)... stop being injury prone.

 

[CardsSunsDbacks]

Lebron's running mates in Cleveland like Love were traded there. Same goes for most of their role players. Happened again in LA with trading for Anthony Davis.

Booker is kind of like a modern day Paul Pierce. Drafted here, endured some awful seasons, and finally got some help. The help is top tier as well. He went from TJ Warren and Isiah Canaan to Durant and Beal. That's quite an upgrade.

LeBron also went back there in free agency after they already had an established stud in Kyrie. That made that situation much more like the Miami situation than Booker's curren situation.

 

[Peter Sheldon]

I kind of expect between KD, Book, Beal & Ayton, at any given time this coming regular season, 1 or 2 will be out with injury. Just look at history. But the beauty of bringing someone like Beal (an all-star) in to the fold, now suddenly you can maybe still win possibly half your games while weathering an injury or two. That's going to be huge. And maybe now the Suns have the luxury of load-managing some of the stars prior to playoffs. And also test and see how deep our bench is this time around. This couild be a really interesting season. Only shoot for 55+ wins maybe.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Exactly, that is the rub. We're better... but health is the X factor. The Nets were hoping their aged stars would not suffer a decline... we our hoping our oft injured stars (especially KD)... stop being injury prone.

Agreed. The reason I put more faith in our crew is that injuries are generally time limited (with of course the chance for residual impact or it being career ending - but those are still chances, not certainties). Once age hits, it’s pure decline. If an injury occurs early in the season you have a likelihood/chance of return by the playoffs. If you turn a year older early in the season you’re just older than that by playoffs.

 

[Germz249]

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Respect Klay.. much respect.. you got another fan today.. not because it was Booker.. you rarely will hear players say this..

 

[Mainstreet]

I'm hoping Kevin Durant comes into the season looking like this.

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[Mainstreet]

So proud...

Klay Thompson is finally getting around to apologizing for the "four rings" comment.

How magnanimous of him.

 

[leclerc]

I like what Klay was saying on that podcast -- and -- I hope Booker shuts him down and drops 40+ on him the next time we play them.

 

[Mainstreet]

Udoka Azubuike is officially signed to a two-way contract.

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[Mainstreet]

It still doesn't feel right to me for the Suns to trade Cam Payne in what amounted to a salary dump.

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