53 Man Roster Decisions

kerouac9

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joeshmo said:
People should email our in town sport writters more often. They are very personable and will get back to you, it might take a little longer and they may not be able to answer everything but they will get back to you.

Indeed. Every time I dropped Kent Somers a line with an honest question, without editorial comment, he's been really good about getting back quickly and with good information that may not be "fit to print," or whatever.

What was interesting to me is that Somers seemed really disappointed to see Mac leave, but his reporting has been quite objective in regards to Denny Green and management. I think that Kent Somers does a great job.
 
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Mitch

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Sorry about forgetting to list Robert Tate. Tate showed he had some game in him last year and will make a good run at the roster, although if Reid has improved and McCareins is as good as projected, Tate may have a tough time making it this year.

As for Femi...the problem is that as the depth has grown on the roster the need for players who strictly contribute on special teams has diminished...as has the role of the FB in the Cards' offense, as the Cards are poised to employ a steady diet of 3WR/1TE/1RB and 2WR/2TE/1RB sets. In addition, the odds of Femi contributing as a 3rd down RB have waned with the addition of Edgerrin James and the receiving skills of J.J. Arrington. Yes, Femi is well liked by DG...but, when the tough roster decisions are being made and a player like Roger Robinson, who may win the KR job right out, can offer the team a more diversified role...Femi may not make it. Plus, Femi's play on special teams last year was not as consistent as in past years...that will have to change for this to even be a discussion.

As for Bronson...if he shows he can block at the FB position from a three-point stance and from motion...because he brings significant talent to the special teams and offers the team depth at TE (important considering all the 2TE packages the team wants to employ)...his versatility becomes very attractive.

Carlyle Holiday was making a splash on the scout team in practices during the second half of the season last year. I remember DG guushing about Holiday's stunning play. He is a gifted athlete and a first-rate competitor. Hence, the love.

Watkins will likely need a year on the PS to get his feet wet and to refine his skills. Same for Greg Lee and Damarius Bilbo. All three have excellent potential. DG likes to keep his draft picks on the 53 man...so Watkins will have every chance to make it.

Orlando Huff needs a very good camp, IMO. He's not the all-around WLB type that DG and CP like, because he's not a natural pass rusher from the edge and he struggles at times in coverage. Darryl Blackstock and Brandon Johnson have the edge speed the position requires. And there's no way Mark Brown is training camp fodder. He played well for the Jets last year and he excels in coverage...he returned an INT for a TD in his last game for the Jets.

It mystifies me as to why some of you don't give much slack to rookies. Lance Mitchell, for example...started slowly last year but arguably became one of the team's best tacklers on special teams toward the end of the season. One would figure that he will show added improvement this year...as should Antrel Rolle J.J. Arrington, Eric Green, Darryl Blackstock, Elton Brown and LeRon McCoy...and...Lamont Reid, Aaron Francisco, Tim Bulman, Adam Bergen, Ernest Shazor, etc.
 

joeshmo

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Mitch said:
As for Femi...the problem is that as the depth has grown on the roster the need for players who strictly contribute on special teams has diminished. Yes, Femi is well liked by DG...but, when the tough roster decisions are being made and a player like Roger Robinson, who may win the KR job right out, can offer the team a more diversified role...Femi may not make it. Plus, Femi's play on special teams last year was not as consistent as in past years.

I see it as the other way around. As depth grows you are more able to have those stricly special team specialists becuase you no longer have the need for your 3/4th RB, 5/6th WR, and so on to be contributors on the O or the D becuase the guys in front of them are good backups with no injury history.

Femi's play was just as good if not better on special teams. With more tackles on fewer special teams plays.

Also Robinson has never been a KR so giving him the job he has never done while we are not sure of his injury status is putting the cart way before the horse. And KR has already been implied by Green that it is BJ's job to loss at this point in time.

because he brings significant talent to the special teams

Versatility I will give you and IF he can show he can be a lead blocker I agree he does have a shot. But at what point in time has this special teams sigigicant talent show itself. Becuase I dont see how you can say someone is a significant special teams talent when he has only played one game.

Carlyle Holiday was making a splash on the scout team in practices during the second half of the season last year. I remember DG guushing about Holiday's stunning play. He is a gifted athlete and a first-rate competitor. Hence, the love.

How many players has Green stated this about in the past and how many are still looking for a job. I wouldnt put to much stock into it.

Orlando Huff needs a very good camp, IMO. He's not the all-around WLB type that DG and CP like, because he's not a natural pass rusher from the edge and he struggles at times in coverage. Darryl Blackstock and Brandon Johnson have the edge speed the position requires.

Huff is easily a good coverage LB. There is a reason we held TE's to the least amount of catches, Yards, TD's over the last 10 years in the NFL. That is becuase all 3 of the LB's last year Dansby, Huff, and Darling are all good to great coverage LB's. And to say that Huff doesnt have the edge speed playing behind shattered DL core is one of the craziest things I have seen yet in the paswt month. He was ranked 6th in the whole NFL for TFL's, #1 on our team and he doesnt have edge speed. The guy is fast any way you slice it. Its his strength that is questionable not his speed not one bit.

Huff is the #1 WLB even after all the OTA's, yet he will need a very good camp to stay on the team. Going against a 5th round slim jim rookie and another LB that the coaches were dissapionted in his progression last year in Blackstock? Dont see where you are coming from on this one at all.

It mystifies me as to why some of you don't give much slack to rookies. Lance Mitchell, for example...started slowly last year but arguably became one of the team's best tacklers on special teams toward the end of the season.

Mitchell had 9 Tackles the first 8 games of the season and 5 the last 8 games. He was far more consitent the first 8 games not his last 8 becuase he was injured multiple times his last 8 games. But I do like his special teams potential based off of last year.

As for the first sentence you are probably correct but at the same time you give far far to much credit to rookies, especially the UDFA's of the world. You are the complete opposite of what you are complaining about us. You are the ultimate underdog cheer leader, and there is nothing wrong with that.
 

perivolaki

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I think 6'4" is about two inches too tall for Dockett. Ya I know thats what they list him at but I've stood next to him and hes just slightly taller than me and I'm 6'.
 

LoyaltyisaCurse

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Bronson does not beat Femi... When has Green ever employed a strictly blocking FB?? He likes his FBs to be versatile and Femi is as versatile as any FB in the NFL...
 

BigDavis75

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spanky1 said:
Aaron Francisco is going to push Griffith for the FS position. Shazor is becoming a Green favorite and will make the roster as back up to Wilson and on ST's.

I disagree on Francisco. People don't give Griffith enough credit, he has lost some speed and doesn't make very many big plays but he plays inside the scheme and Wilson works off of him well. Francisco is only a bit faster than Griffith and hasn't shown anything on an NFL level, save breaking up a few wedges at the end of last year.

spanky1 said:
I can't see Lance Mitchell losing out on a roster spot....sure he struggled last year but he is now a full two years removed from his knee injury and it's too early to write him off.

It might turn into a numbers game with Mitchell, sure he has potential but players such as Brandon Johnson and Blackstock have a better chance to realize their potential. I would like to see him stick around, but right now there are 7 or 8 LBs that I would say are better.

spanky1 said:
Kenny King, IMO backs up Berry on the roster.
No way, King is coming off 2 season ending injuries and wouldn't he be planting on his injured wrist? Also, Smith was very very good in relief of Berry last year.

spanky1 said:
I'll be surprised if Huff beats out Blackstock at WILL. Mark Brown is TC fodder IMO.

Joe already took care of this multiple times but I'll state it again, Huff was very solid and Blackstock wasn't good enough to beat him out. Blackstock showed flashes against the Rams and has been given a year to transition from Grol's 3-4, but he really needs to improve his ST play.

spanky1 said:
The battle for the 5th WR is Carlyle's to lose.
I can't see him coming close to making the roster, I would put Spurlock, Watkins, and Greg Lee all ahead of him. Even Walters as a possible returner

spanky1 said:
Troy Walters is headed for a battle for the KR/PR position.
I would prefer if Walters didn't win this job, if BJ gets it then it saves another roster spot for a 9th DB or DL or a ST guy, which would be very helpful considering the amount of talent at those positions. Walters has very little as far as receiving skills and has gotten worse and worse as a returner.
 
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Totally_Red

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Mitch said:
Sorry about forgetting to list Robert Tate. Tate showed he had some game in him last year and will make a good run at the roster, although if Reid has improved and McCareins is as good as projected, Tate may have a tough time making it this year.

As for Femi...the problem is that as the depth has grown on the roster the need for players who strictly contribute on special teams has diminished...as has the role of the FB in the Cards' offense, as the Cards are poised to employ a steady diet of 3WR/1TE/1RB and 2WR/2TE/1RB sets. In addition, the odds of Femi contributing as a 3rd down RB have waned with the addition of Edgerrin James and the receiving skills of J.J. Arrington. Yes, Femi is well liked by DG...but, when the tough roster decisions are being made and a player like Roger Robinson, who may win the KR job right out, can offer the team a more diversified role...Femi may not make it. Plus, Femi's play on special teams last year was not as consistent as in past years...that will have to change for this to even be a discussion.

As for Bronson...if he shows he can block at the FB position from a three-point stance and from motion...because he brings significant talent to the special teams and offers the team depth at TE (important considering all the 2TE packages the team wants to employ)...his versatility becomes very attractive.

Carlyle Holiday was making a splash on the scout team in practices during the second half of the season last year. I remember DG guushing about Holiday's stunning play. He is a gifted athlete and a first-rate competitor. Hence, the love.

Watkins will likely need a year on the PS to get his feet wet and to refine his skills. Same for Greg Lee and Damarius Bilbo. All three have excellent potential. DG likes to keep his draft picks on the 53 man...so Watkins will have every chance to make it.

Orlando Huff needs a very good camp, IMO. He's not the all-around WLB type that DG and CP like, because he's not a natural pass rusher from the edge and he struggles at times in coverage. Darryl Blackstock and Brandon Johnson have the edge speed the position requires. And there's no way Mark Brown is training camp fodder. He played well for the Jets last year and he excels in coverage...he returned an INT for a TD in his last game for the Jets.

It mystifies me as to why some of you don't give much slack to rookies. Lance Mitchell, for example...started slowly last year but arguably became one of the team's best tacklers on special teams toward the end of the season. One would figure that he will show added improvement this year...as should Antrel Rolle J.J. Arrington, Eric Green, Darryl Blackstock, Elton Brown and LeRon McCoy...and...Lamont Reid, Aaron Francisco, Tim Bulman, Adam Bergen, Ernest Shazor, etc.

Holiday has an outside shot IMO. He's a hard worker who's relatively new to the WR position and it showed last preseason. Given an opportunity he may be the sixth receiver. As I recall, he also returned punts at Notre Dame.
 
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Mitch

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joeshmo said:
I see it as the other way around. As depth grows you are more able to have those stricly special team specialists becuase you no longer have the need for your 3/4th RB, 5/6th WR, and so on to be contributors on the O or the D becuase the guys in front of them are good backups with no injury history.

The problem is that the Cardinals still have no idea who the KR and PR men will be. Based on previous performances, Bryant Johnson does not look like the answer as a kickoff returner or punt returner. He runs far too upright and hesitates the way Reggie Swinton did.

Roger Robinson seems ideal for the KR role. He's built low to the ground and he has ideal burst to find daylight.

Michael Spurlock is the Randal Antwan-El type athlete that DG has been looking for. He's shifty and quick.

Troy Walters brings veteran savvy and ability to the role and will likely win the job if Spurlock struggles.

I predict that Spurlock will impress and win the job...and may even win the KR job as well. If so, that might save a roster spot for someone like Femi.

Femi's play was just as good if not better on special teams. With more tackles on fewer special teams plays.

I was watching different games, I guess. I saw Femi whiff repeatedly on tackles last year...yeah, he had 17...as did Harold Morrow...and Quentin Harris led the team with 24. But, Femi looked tentative to me, as did Morrow, who was supposed to be a special teams dynamo.

Also Robinson has never been a KR so giving him the job he has never done while we are not sure of his injury status is putting the cart way before the horse. And KR has already been implied by Green that it is BJ's job to loss at this point in time.

Answered above.



Versatility I will give you and IF he can show he can be a lead blocker I agree he does have a shot. But at what point in time has this special teams sigigicant talent show itself. Becuase I dont see how you can say someone is a significant special teams talent when he has only played one game.

Did you watch Bronson in pre-season and in the first game (he had 2 ST tackles versus the Giants...1 unassisted and 1 assisted)? The guy made the team because he is such a physical specimen...really stood out as a big framed athlete with above average speed and tackling ability for a player his size. I would be shocked if he doesn't make the team, assuming he stays healthy.



How many players has Green stated this about in the past and how many are still looking for a job. I wouldnt put to much stock into it.

I agree. Good point. There's no telling what anything means with DG.



Huff is easily a good coverage LB. There is a reason we held TE's to the least amount of catches, Yards, TD's over the last 10 years in the NFL. That is becuase all 3 of the LB's last year Dansby, Huff, and Darling are all good to great coverage LB's. And to say that Huff doesnt have the edge speed playing behind shattered DL core is one of the craziest things I have seen yet in the paswt month. He was ranked 6th in the whole NFL for TFL's, #1 on our team and he doesnt have edge speed. The guy is fast any way you slice it. Its his strength that is questionable not his speed not one bit.

Orlando Huff played more with his mouth last year than anything else. He's a sturdy, reasonably quick (not fast) LB who's very much hit or miss. Yes, he had 7 TFL last year...which was good...but, he was not a blitzing threat at WLB...in fact he had only one QB pressure and one QB hit. CP wants a WLB who can blitz from the edge so that teams will be reluctant to double team Bertrand Berry.

Orlando Huff's overall play last year was not impressive...plain and simple. He missed far too many tackles and wasn't the athlete on the edge that CP wants. The Sporting News' comment on Huff: "Orlando Huff has some decent skills, but the coaches are looking for a playmaker on the weak side. They didn't think Huff delivered last year." Lindy's comment on Huff: "Disappointed on weak side after coming over from Seattle last year."


Huff is the #1 WLB even after all the OTA's, yet he will need a very good camp to stay on the team. Going against a 5th round slim jim rookie and another LB that the coaches were dissapionted in his progression last year in Blackstock? Dont see where you are coming from on this one at all.

Blackstock fits the mold physically if he can improve the mental aspects of the position. If Gerald Hayes is healthy and winds the MLB job...look for James Darling to garner some time at WLB...and the sleeper here, IMO, is Mark Brown. This guy is under-rated. As for your reference to Brandon Johnson, he will need to get stronger...but his role this year will likely be on STs and in the nickel packages where he can use his speed to his and the team's advantage in coverage.



Mitchell had 9 Tackles the first 8 games of the season and 5 the last 8 games. He was far more consitent the first 8 games not his last 8 becuase he was injured multiple times his last 8 games. But I do like his special teams potential based off of last year.

I did not realize that...probably because Mitchell had a real good game late in the season and I remember thinking how much he had improved over the course of the year. He was being criticized for not playing physically tough enough...yet, I remember him pasting a return man twice in one game on the far sidelines.

As for the first sentence you are probably correct but at the same time you give far far to much credit to rookies, especially the UDFA's of the world. You are the complete opposite of what you are complaining about us. You are the ultimate underdog cheer leader, and there is nothing wrong with that.

The funny thing is...the surprises will be there...they almost always are...the challenging part is predicting them...this year my money's on Robinson, Spurlock, Holiday, Bulman, Mark Brown, McCareins and Francisco.
 

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Also Robinson has never been a KR so giving him the job he has never done while we are not sure of his injury status is putting the cart way before the horse. And KR has already been implied by Green that it is BJ's job to loss at this point in time.

Robinson was used at KR while he played for Utah State, he was a freshman and set the season record for Utah State..... he also had over 200 return yrds in one game against BYU. If I remember correctly he returned a punt to the house that year. You are incorrect to say he has never been a KR.
 

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Duetto said:
Robinson was used at KR while he played for Utah State, he was a freshman and set the season record for Utah State..... he also had over 200 return yrds in one game against BYU. If I remember correctly he returned a punt to the house that year. You are incorrect to say he has never been a KR.

I am talking about a real NFL game. Which is all that matters, becuase his college return career wasnt much to talk about which is why I didnt bring it up.

As for the record he had a pedestrian 22.8 yard average(not even in the top 50 in the nation) and all the record tells me is that they had a really bad D that couldnt stop teams from scoring on them hence a butt load of kickoff attempts or their return game really sucked before that. The same way that Martay Jenkins Broke the same record here in AZ.
 

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I looked and your wrong again..... he did have a lot of returns, but he did have less then the guy who had the previous record at Utah State. It is not as if he set the record with more returns..... and lets not forget he was a freshman. Relax bro.....

I think you will see him in the mix for returning kicks. Thats all I am saying....

You said "Robinson has never returned kicks"...... I was answering that post, not what you imagined yourself writting.

For now on I will look very closley at your post and try to figure out what you ment to write before I make a fool of myself and answer what you wrote.
 

joeshmo

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Duetto said:
I looked and your wrong again..... he did have a lot of returns, but he did have less then the guy who had the previous record at Utah State. It is not as if he set the record with more returns.....

???

joeshmo said:
As for the record he had a pedestrian 22.8 yard average(not even in the top 50 in the nation) and all the record tells me is that they had a really bad D that couldnt stop teams from scoring on them hence a butt load of kickoff attempts or their return game really sucked before that.

Sorry if I came off a little hostile in my earlier post. Its just that a little pet peeve of mine is using obscure college production and pedestrian stats from 2,3,4 years ago as an arguement for a players worth today in the NFL. Which is why I dont even bring it up. Not that you tried to prove Robinsons worth, my post was more of a roll over from the earlier debates.
 
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Duckjake

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#2 RB: Marcel Shipp (diligent, hard-nosed veteran sticks)

To do what though? I don't see what role he could play other than being the John Navarre of the RB's. Unless of course Arrington is far worse than I thought.
 

Duetto

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Sorry if I came off a little hostile in my earlier post. Its just that a little pet peeve of mine is using obscure college production and pedestrian stats from 2,3,4 years ago as an arguement for a players worth today in the NFL. Which is why I dont even bring it up. Not that you tried to prove Robinsons worth, my post was more of a roll over from the earlier debates.

We are all Cards fans hoping to field a winning team. No hard feelings....

I missed the portion of your post that mentioned "or their return game really sucked before that" That may have been the case. Still can't take that from the kid, Utah State has been playing football for over 80yrs!! They used to win back in the old days.
 

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