Alex Len...LET HIM GO!

[AzStevenCal]

I want to like him but I feel he just teases us with what he can do. He hasn't established his brand of basketball yet. Hey maybe he'll be starter caliber but not consistent enough for my tastes. I guess some want to keep him because our options are limited but overall we can't depend on him. He don't seem like a natural baller...It seems forced.

I can't argue real forcefully in favor of keeping him, I just disagree with the idea that he doesn't have on court value. We might have to let him walk but it will be money that drives that decision more than his performance.

IMO he's clearly shown he's capable of starting in this league and as I mentioned, he has played better in that role. But I'm concerned that someone out there is going to offer him a deal around 100M and that puts us in a bind. He's too good to just lose for nothing but at that kind of money we may have to let him go. And despite what the anti-Len crowd think, that's a loss for us.

 

[pokerface]

I can't argue real forcefully in favor of keeping him, I just disagree with the idea that he doesn't have on court value. We might have to let him walk but it will be money that drives that decision more than his performance.

IMO he's clearly shown he's capable of starting in this league and as I mentioned, he has played better in that role. But I'm concerned that someone out there is going to offer him a deal around 100M and that puts us in a bind. He's too good to just lose for nothing but at that kind of money we may have to let him go. And despite what the anti-Len crowd think, that's a loss for us.

I agree with that totally...Its a money driven decision to whether he stays or not. He hasn't made himself indespencible but he has some value...Some of it still based on potential. It just bugs me that he hasn't totally broken out and we are still guessing on this guy. He's not a clear cut anything... Including a bust. I agree too about the fear that we are going to be locked in a stupid contact. I'd rather he just walk...

 

[Phrazbit]

A lot of you want to ship out Brandon Knight and I get it but truthfully Brandon has more desire and natural talent then Len will ever possess.

I'd agree with this, except I don't think Knight knows how to play team basketball. There are a lot of dudes who would be good 1 on 1 players but suck as NBA players, and I think Knight is in that category. He has good handles a solid shooter (not this year but relative to off-the-dribble shooters, yes) and is athletic, but he is a terrible team defender and has horrific shot selection.

Good basketball player, bad NBA player.

 

[sr7706]

Anyone saying Len is worth 15 million a year needs to have their head examined...

 

[AzStevenCal]

Anyone saying Len is worth 15 million a year needs to have their head examined...

Look at the salaries of other recent signings, his market value is pretty well set. If we keep Chandler all season we might be able to re-sign Len at 15 but if he starts for half a season that price could well go up. If you define worth based on what someone will give him on his upcoming contract, he's going to be worth 15 at least IMO.

 

[sunsfan88]

Anyone saying Len is worth 15 million a year needs to have their head examined...

I think Steve was saying that Len will command that type of salary from some dumb teams out there.

Honestly, if Len isn't willing to resign here on a Festus Ezeli or Meyers Leonard type contract, I would let him walk.

Many teams have regretted signing bigs to overpaid extensions (Plumlee, Mozgov, Noah, Mahimi, Henson etc) so why should the Suns try and add to that list? Giving Len $15M/yr would put Len on that list with those players as the worst contracts in the NBA even under the new salary cap.

 

[JCSunsfan]

Anyone saying Len is worth 15 million a year needs to have their head examined...

Its the market. Very few in the NBA are worth what they are getting paid.

 

[Mainstreet]

Anyone saying Len is worth 15 million a year needs to have their head examined...

The market sets the the value of a player.

There are a lot of NBA players earning huge salaries that may not be worth it in your eyes. I thought I was being conservative when I estimated that Len could command a salary offer of 15 million a year in free agency.

The Suns are paying Dudley approximately 10 million per season.

 

[JCSunsfan]

The market sets the the value of a player.

There are a lot of NBA players earning huge salaries that may not be worth it in your eyes. I thought I was being conservative when I estimated that Len could command a salary offer of 15 million a year in free agency.

The Suns are paying Dudley approximately 10 million per season.

Dudley is a good example. Older player, not nearly as productive as Len, and destined to decline. He got $10 million.

 

[Hoop Head]

Who do you suppose we bring in as a backup center if we let Len go now?

This is the first time in my 25+ years of following the Suns that they have 2 legit centers on the roster that are healthy, for the most part. It's amazing how just before we signed Chandler a lot of people complained about the Suns not having anyone but Len at Center and now that we have 2 good, above average, centers some fans seem to forget the times that we trotted out guys Joe Klein, Luc Longley, Big Jake.

 

[Mainstreet]

Who do you suppose we bring in as a backup center if we let Len go now?

This is the first time in my 25+ years of following the Suns that they have 2 legit centers on the roster that are healthy, for the most part. It's amazing how just before we signed Chandler a lot of people complained about the Suns not having anyone but Len at Center and now that we have 2 good, above average, centers some fans seem to forget the times that we trotted out guys Joe Klein, Luc Longley, Big Jake.

The Suns not having a center was a common complaint before the Suns drafted Len and signed Chandler as you note. My, how time passes.

I think the Suns intend to match Len in free agency but the Nuggets are wanting to trade Jusuf Nurkic. Also Willie Cauley-Stein might be included in a trade with the Kings. I'm sure there are many more. I think the main thing the Suns want from a center is defense and rebounding.

Also if the Suns are patient, Bender might prove to be a skilled high post center with the whole package, offense, defense and hopefully rebounding.

 

[sunsfan88]

Alan Williams has done well this season when given minutes so I think he could be a decent backup C in the case Len leaves.

 

[Mainstreet]

Dudley is a good example. Older player, not nearly as productive as Len, and destined to decline. He got $10 million.

We agree about this.

What I need about now is a trade to get the adrenaline flowing.

 

[Mainstreet]

Alan Williams has done well this season when given minutes so I think he could be a decent backup C in the case Len leaves.

There is such a disparity in talent between Williams and Len. I don't think Williams could ever be a rim protector. I view him as a third center.

 

[sunsfan88]

There is such a disparity in talent between Williams and Len. I don't think Williams could ever be a rim protector. I view him as a third center.

Well yeah ideally we would want someone better than Williams but my point was that if we were to trade Len, then Alan Williams can hold down spot duty as the backup C for the remainder of the 40 or so games left and then we can find someone else cheaper in the off season via draft or free agency.

 

[leclerc]

Len (23) to me is our starting center of the future. Alan Williams is a sub. Bender is too thin to be a starting center. I see more of a Dirk kind of player there but with better defence and not that much of a scorer. Len is good enough to be a very decent starter. Not a star, but a solid rotation player. Sign him!

 

[Mainstreet]

Well yeah ideally we would want someone better than Williams but my point was that if we were to trade Len, then Alan Williams can hold down spot duty as the backup C for the remainder of the 40 or so games left and then we can find someone else cheaper in the off season via draft or free agency.

I think Williams would be an end of the bench player even if the Suns were to trade Chandler or Len. If the Suns traded either of these two players they would likely get a backup center in return. If not, I would not mind letting Bender getting his feet wet playing some backup center.

 

[Mainstreet]

Len (23) to me is our starting center of the future. Alan Williams is a sub. Bender is too thin to be a starting center. I see more of a Dirk kind of player there but with better defence and not that much of a scorer. Len is good enough to be a very decent starter. Not a star, but a solid rotation player. Sign him!

I think the Suns will match any offer for Len unless it is off the wall.

 

[BC867]

It is interesting that not one word in this thread refers to the leg problems he has had when given the chance to be starting Center.

Keeping Alex Len as a backup to Tyson Chandler is fine as our youngsters develop. But keeping him to be a full-time starter for years to come is chancy considering his health history.

 

[AzStevenCal]

It is interesting that not one word in this thread refers to the leg problems he has had when given the chance to be starting Center.

Keeping Alex Len as a backup to Tyson Chandler is fine as our youngsters develop. But keeping him to be a full-time starter for years to come is chancy considering his health history.

Len came into the league with problems related to his college injury/surgery but that's about it. Offhand I can remember a couple of different hand injuries that he mostly played through and a sprained ankle. Compared to Chandler, Len has been Cal Ripken. I think he's missed 13, 4 and now 2 games over the past three seasons.

 

[Phrazbit]

Yeah, as much as I bag on Len, I think he has largely put the health questions to bed. If he gets hurt again I suspect it will be something new and not some condition that we worry is chronic.

My opinion overall is; the guy is barely replacement level right now. Yes, some similar players got big paydays last summer but those were given out by some franchises that wretched, IMO not a behavior to emulate.

If someone offers him 15 million, let him walk.

 

[ASUCHRIS]

Yeah, as much as I bag on Len, I think he has largely put the health questions to bed. If he gets hurt again I suspect it will be something new and not some condition that we worry is chronic.

My opinion overall is; the guy is barely replacement level right now. Yes, some similar players got big paydays last summer but those were given out by some franchises that wretched, IMO not a behavior to emulate.

If someone offers him 15 million, let him walk.

I'd pay him 15. We'll have tons of room, and he's young enough to take the risk. What's the alternative? All our talent is young and cheap, what else will we do with the money?

 

[Phrazbit]

I'd pay him 15. We'll have tons of room, and he's young enough to take the risk. What's the alternative? All our talent is young and cheap, what else will we do with the money?

That we commit ourselves to giving regular playing time to a player who makes us worse when he is on the court...

Len is a bad player right now. We're worse when he is in the game, not as bad as Knight but he is not helping us and not helping us on a regular basis. Even with how big the cap will be, 15 mil a year is the kind of salary where they guy is going to get PT regardless of how bad they're playing.

Len may improve, he isn't as bad as he was last year, but he's lousy and if this is what he is then I wouldn't keep him for 5 mil a year. He is replacement level. I feel very confident in saying that if we gave all his PT to Williams, Bender and more minutes for Chandler that we'd be better.

 

[ASUCHRIS]

That we commit ourselves to giving regular playing time to a player who makes us worse when he is on the court...

Len is a bad player right now. We're worse when he is in the game, not as bad as Knight but he is not helping us and not helping us on a regular basis. Even with how big the cap will be, 15 mil a year is the kind of salary where they guy is going to get PT regardless of how bad they're playing.

Len may improve, he isn't as bad as he was last year, but he's lousy and if this is what he is then I wouldn't keep him for 5 mil a year. He is replacement level. I feel very confident in saying that if we gave all his PT to Williams, Bender and more minutes for Chandler that we'd be better.

You're not paying Len for what he is - you're paying him for what you think he may be. Although his play on a whole is underwhelming, he does show improvement and is only 23.

It's a gamble, but there is a reason other teams will be willing to roll the dice. Maybe we will too.

 

[pokerface]

You're not paying Len for what he is - you're paying him for what you think he may be. Although his play on a whole is underwhelming, he does show improvement and is only 23.

It's a gamble, but there is a reason other teams will be willing to roll the dice. Maybe we will too.

I don't believe in giving out high paid long term contracts to players based on what they "could" be...thats what the draft is for. They get paid on their history and more importantly what they're doing right now. That is why it's called a "contract year" because that's what the contract is based on...the current year. He shouldn't be rewarded for underperforming.