Are the Suns done for the summer (player moves) ?

Amare32

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Seems like It with Jackson, Harpring off the board along with Tim Thomas.

signing Pike was a pointless move to be honest, no point in signing another shooter when we still need more inside and in the back-up point department.
 

carey

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I think it's possible they panic and offer Mike James the full MLE. If that doesn't happen then I believe they are finished with the possibility of being a 3rd team facilitator in a trade with the TE.
 

Joe Mama

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Really? Does it seem that way?

I think they'll wait to see what falls through the cracks, and they'll also try hard to get involved in some trades.

Joe
 

JCSunsfan

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They missed their primary targets. The worst thing they could do is pay alot of money for someone they don't really want.

Judging from the draft, they won't do that. They would rather sit out of free agency than over pay or get someone they don't want.

Not that I am happy about it.
 

ShuHanGuanYu

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Amare32 said:
Seems like It with Jackson, Harpring off the board along with Tim Thomas.

signing Pike was a pointless move to be honest, no point in signing another shooter when we still need more inside and in the back-up point department.

It's better than not getting anything, which certainly could have been the case based on how much players are getting overpaid this offseason. They get a vet in which the NBA will pay a good portion of his salary. Not bad in my opinion.
 

NastyOne

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carey said:
I think it's possible they panic and offer Mike James the full MLE. If that doesn't happen then I believe they are finished with the possibility of being a 3rd team facilitator in a trade with the TE.

How would that be a panic move? Mike James for the MLE would be a steal for a guy that averaged 20/6 playing PG.

I would love to have him sign for the full MLE for 3 years, But it would probably take a 4 year deal and he is already like 31years old.
 

carey

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NastyOne said:
How would that be a panic move? Mike James for the MLE would be a steal for a guy that averaged 20/6 playing PG.

I would love to have him sign for the full MLE for 3 years, But it would probably take a 4 year deal and he is already like 31years old.

I guess I was thinking it would be a panic move because they don't really want to spend that on one guy. I also agree that the MLE likely wouldn't get it done.
 

Mainstreet

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Joe Mama said:
Really? Does it seem that way?

I think they'll wait to see what falls through the cracks, and they'll also try hard to get involved in some trades.

Joe

I see things much the same way.

This is essentially my take. I think the Suns will try to invest the most money they are willing to pay to the BPA that can fulfill a need. I have a gut feeling that the Suns want Jumaine Jones but are also trying to budget for a PG.

Ultimately, I think they will choose the BPA. I think if the Suns sign Jumaine Jones, the Suns will trade James Jones for a PG. I think a three team trade is a real possibility as well with the Suns as a participant to make it work (as they still have the TE).

I also would not mind seeing Eddie House back in a Suns uniform. He's probably as good or better than Pargo, although I have not seen Pargo play that I remember.

There are so many ways it can workout. I do think the Suns are targeting at least one player and then the dominoes will fall afterwards.
 
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Gaddabout

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NastyOne said:
How would that be a panic move? Mike James for the MLE would be a steal for a guy that averaged 20/6 playing PG.

Why Mike James? Give Barbs 37 MPG and I'd be willing to bet he could match those numbers ... and possibly exceed them. James is no better on defense and presents the same kind of size/matchup problems at the position.

They are the same player, but Barbs is younger and even more athletic, while James is older and has a horrible attitude.
 

nowagimp

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NastyOne said:
How would that be a panic move? Mike James for the MLE would be a steal for a guy that averaged 20/6 playing PG.

I would love to have him sign for the full MLE for 3 years, But it would probably take a 4 year deal and he is already like 31years old.

No kidding Nasty One, I'd also take James in a heartbeat for the full MLE! This would address the suns greatest weakness, backup point along with a guy who can create his own shot inside or out at the '2'. He is a very versatile player who will probably get more than the MLE from someone else.
 

JCSunsfan

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Mainstreet said:
I see things much the same way.

This is essentially my take. I think the Suns will try to invest the most money they are willing to pay to the BPA that can fulfill a need. I have a gut feeling that the Suns want Jumaine Jones but are also trying to budget for a PG.

Ultimately, I think they will choose the BPA. I think if the Suns sign Jumaine Jones, the Suns will trade James Jones for a PG. I think a three team trade is a real possibility as well with the Suns as a participant to make it work (as they still have the TE).

I also would not mind seeing Eddie House back in a Suns uniform. He's probably as good or better than Pargo, although I have not seen Pargo play that I remember.

There are so many ways it can workout. I do think the Suns are targeting at least one player and then the dominoes will fall afterwards.

Would Jumaine Jones be an upgrade at sf over James Jones? I think he may be. He is certainly not a downgrade. And he fills our team's mandatory "JJ" quota.

I have a feeling we might see House back. I know he is talking with Miami. I think he was frosted some that he got so little burn in the playoffs. Still, he likes it here.

Not sure Mike James is the answer but, he's a good shooter from the 3, distributes reasonably well, and plays solid D. That's better than any pg fa we have looked at so far.

It would have to be for the MLE though. A sign and trade would be difficult. We, have to send out another 2.5 million in salary to make it even out for us. I don't think the TE helps us unless we would be allowed to do a 3 team deal in which we take a 2.5 million player from another team with the TE, and then we immediately trade that player with Jones for James. I'm not sure you are allowed to use the TE that way in combo deals. Technically its not combining a player with the TE, but there is probably some other rule against it.
 
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nowagimp

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Gaddabout said:
Why Mike James? Give Barbs 37 MPG and I'd be willing to bet he could match those numbers ... and possibly exceed them. James is no better on defense and presents the same kind of size/matchup problems at the position.

They are the same player, but Barbs is younger and even more athletic, while James is older and has a horrible attitude.

What James can do that Barbs cant (yet) do is create his outside shot off the dribble. With the clock winding down, this can be an important talent for a (backup) point guard when the offense is forced into a half court game, like in the playoffs. Barbs is younger, faster, and a better open court player, but his shot release (position/quickness) is too easy to defend off the dribble. I sure hope Barbs can develop a more effective release so he can get his shot off in the crunch, but that might require a change in shooting mechanics. As for James reported bad attitude, that could be a big problem for the suns. james is 31 and hasnt sniffed success, so maybe he's in for an attitude change.
 

Treesquid PhD

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nowagimp said:
What James can do that Barbs cant (yet) do is create his outside shot off the dribble. With the clock winding down, this can be an important talent for a (backup) point guard when the offense is forced into a half court game, like in the playoffs. Barbs is younger, faster, and a better open court player, but his shot release (position/quickness) is too easy to defend off the dribble. I sure hope Barbs can develop a more effective release so he can get his shot off in the crunch, but that might require a change in shooting mechanics. As for James reported bad attitude, that could be a big problem for the suns. james is 31 and hasnt sniffed success, so maybe he's in for an attitude change.

I don't agree, James is a bad attitude guy, he would be ok for cheap but I certainly wouldn't jeapordize keeping any of the core for this guy. Creating a shot off the dribble sounds an awful lot like how the Suns don't want to play.
 

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ShuHanGuanYu said:
It's better than not getting anything, which certainly could have been the case based on how much players are getting overpaid this offseason. They get a vet in which the NBA will pay a good portion of his salary. Not bad in my opinion.
thats what they did to get googs when dice bailed on them. and it was waaaaaaaaay worse than if they had sat out. but they way over paid googs and they could have only slightly over paid TT. so my guess is they should have paid him 21mil but i'll wait and see who they land through trade.
 

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JCSunsfan said:
Would Jumaine Jones be an upgrade at sf over James Jones? I think he may be. He is certainly not a downgrade. And he fills our team's mandatory "JJ" quota.

The way I look at Jumaine Jones, he appears to be a more rugged player that can shoot adequately and is big enough that he could back-up both forward positions. He is listed by ESPN at about 6'8" and 242 pounds. James Jones does not appear to have these physical attributes.

IMO, James Jones plays more like a SG. I do like him and wish the Suns could keep him. Piatkowski may be able help here a little.

The Suns just need more size and strength upfront. It appears Jumaine Jones at least has the build to play there. He could be a poor man's TT. :)
 

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Gaddabout said:
Why Mike James? Give Barbs 37 MPG and I'd be willing to bet he could match those numbers ... and possibly exceed them. James is no better on defense and presents the same kind of size/matchup problems at the position.

They are the same player, but Barbs is younger and even more athletic, while James is older and has a horrible attitude.

You underrate Mike James defense

He gives you the entire package at backup PG

He sets up his teammates, Can score by driving or knocking down outside shots, and hes a above average defender.

We would finally have a PG that can contain (Not shutdown) the likes of Jason Terry,Mike Bibby and Same Cassell.Well atleast for 20+ minutes of the game coming off our bench.
 

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NastyOne said:
You underrate Mike James defense

He gives you the entire package at backup PG

He sets up his teammates, Can score by driving or knocking down outside shots, and hes a above average defender.

We would finally have a PG that can contain (Not shutdown) the likes of Jason Terry,Mike Bibby and Same Cassell.Well atleast for 20+ minutes of the game coming off our bench.

He sounds like a veteran player that could help a team going for a Championship. Ultimately, it may come down to which player(s) that are affordable and fulfill the greatest need as perceived by D'Antoni.
 

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Treesquid said:
Creating a shot off the dribble sounds an awful lot like how the Suns don't want to play.

EXACTLY its how the suns DON'T want to play, its how the opposing teams want to MAKE the suns play. And did you notice, they want Barbs to dribble the ball on the perimeter with the clock winding down. They cover his passing lanes, cheat over with some bigs to cover the drive to the hoop, and try to guard him one-on-one and make him shoot the perimeter shot over a defender. Leandro's defender can often go under the pick and still bother the shot, its so slow and launched so low. This is how the suns offense fails when Nash goes to the bench, because Nash CAN burn you off the dribble, you have to respect him by getting up on him. With Barbs, they play off him more, since he's quick off the dribble, and his slow shot mechanic allows the defender to play off and still bother the shot.

Its all a balance treesquid, and its the defensive strategy against the suns that works in the playoffs when Nash goes to the bench. If the backup point can make his perimeter shot over a defender, that strategy fails. Making that shot over a defender will improve spacing, open up the penetrate and dish/pullup shot options.

As for James attitude, if its bad its bad and he's probably of no use.
 

Gaddabout

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NastyOne said:
You underrate Mike James defense

He gives you the entire package at backup PG

He sets up his teammates, Can score by driving or knocking down outside shots, and hes a above average defender.

We would finally have a PG that can contain (Not shutdown) the likes of Jason Terry,Mike Bibby and Same Cassell.Well atleast for 20+ minutes of the game coming off our bench.

Mike James used to be a guy that worked hard on defense, but he has never, ever been a shut-down defender. Now he's an aging small PG with a surprising sense of entitlement. Cassell would post him up all day long, not to mention Livingston.

If James was a point guard that legitimately set up his teammates, he'd still be in Toronto, where they are holding open auditions for the position. What he has been for Toronto is a legitimate first-scoring option on some really bad and/or young teams. Now Toronto wants to win, and James has been shown the door.

All of this is pointless, of course, because James feels he is entitled the money and the minutes. I'm quite certain he would balk at what the Suns would have to offer.
 

Errntknght

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I don't recall James from this year but he was a solid defender playing for Houston. My guess is that Toronto wants to play uptempo and thats why they overpaid for TJ, more than James not doing his job in the half court. Still, that means that he lacks one quality we'd prefer to have in a PG.
 

mjb21aztd

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Seriously I hope we do something maybe sign Tony Delk like someone mentioned earlier he would be a good back up for nash and plays alright defense. I just dont want Eric Pitowaski to be our big summer signing lol that would be pretty sad...
 

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