Ayton or Doncic?

[JCSunsfan]

the pre-draft consensus was right. ayton, doncic in that order. anyone dissing doncic based on his first game stats is just being defensive. i certainly won't pull for him to have a great career with Cuban, though.

he tried a little too hard and forced some shots in game 1, and i caught a glimpse of him perhaps being a little hot-headed in like Gambo had warned about. i think he will have a Kidd-like career, including his temperament.

Doncic is exactly what I thought he would be. He is highly skilled. His footspeed is slow for an NBA guard but OK for an NBA forward. He forces shots so his 3 point efficiency is a little less than average. He is a great passer and has a good handle.

He is a bit taller, and quite a bit heavier than I thought he would be. He seems to have added some weight over the summer. It looks to me like his eventual spot will be a highly skilled stretch 4.

 

[Superbone]

Bird-lite.

 

[Covert Rain]

Doncic is exactly what I thought he would be. He is highly skilled. His footspeed is slow for an NBA guard but OK for an NBA forward. He forces shots so his 3 point efficiency is a little less than average. He is a great passer and has a good handle.

He is a bit taller, and quite a bit heavier than I thought he would be. He seems to have added some weight over the summer. It looks to me like his eventual spot will be a highly skilled stretch 4.

I can't think of the player but he reminds me of someone else who used to tuck the ball down low (almost like a football) as he drives to the bucket back in the day.

 

[Raindog]

Doncic is exactly what I thought he would be. He is highly skilled. His footspeed is slow for an NBA guard but OK for an NBA forward. He forces shots so his 3 point efficiency is a little less than average. He is a great passer and has a good handle.

He is a bit taller, and quite a bit heavier than I thought he would be. He seems to have added some weight over the summer. It looks to me like his eventual spot will be a highly skilled stretch 4.

Which again makes the Turkoglu comparisons seem appropriate.

Doncic has a reasonable chance to be a decent NBA contributor, assuming he gets his conditioning under control and doesn't end up being an attitude problem when the inevitable frustrations arise with acclimating to a higher level of competition than what he is accustomed to.

On the other hand, I am sure the absurd expectations and hyperbole about him are going to soon prove to be as ridiculous as they were outsized. I don't expect Doncic is going to develop into any sort of perennial all-star or HOF type that the alleged "experts" have been guaranteeing. I'm not saying he will never ever show up on an ASG roster, or be a frontline player for some team, at least on a limited basis. But I think the ceiling on his athleticism, an issue that is probably going to be compounded as grows, is going to limit him from ever becoming any more special than a possibly above average NBA forward with a good passing touch.

 

[Suns_fan69]

Bird-lite.

More like Bird-heavy!

 

[JCSunsfan]

Bird-lite.

He is not as good a shooter as Dirk, but he is a better ball handler and passer.
Same in his comparison with Tom Chambers.
He reminds me some of Gugliotta, especially if his shot selection improves.
Danny Manning might be his best comparison. Same type of broad talent level and athleticism.

 

[Krangodnzr]

Doncic is a tremendous player and I think 10 years from now everyone will agree.

That said Aytons presence clearly demonstrated how good he is going to be. The defense was sagging on him when he got the ball and he was smart enough to look for the open man and feed him the ball.

As others pointed out he was clearing lanes to the basket because everyone would rather give up a lower percentage finish by someone other than Ayton. I wouldn't doubt if most of Aytons teammates finish the season with higher ppg averages because of his presence.

Doncic really needs to develop a better outside shot to be more effective. He took some Josh Jackson rookie year type shots, and he's going to be closer to a net negative until he learns to pick better shots.

 

[1tinsoldier]

like Lonzo, Doncic's most valued asset is his bb IQ. whether he plays the pg position or not, he'll be the leader on the floor for Dallas. how big a star he becomes will be linked to how far he takes them.

btw, this draft was way better than last year and Doncic compared to Lonzo is an example. and how about Ayton compared to... what's his name?

 

[Krangodnzr]

like Lonzo, Doncic's most valued asset is his bb IQ. whether he plays the pg position or not, he'll be the leader on the floor for Dallas. how big a star he becomes will be linked to how far he takes them.

btw, this draft was way better than last year and Doncic compared to Lonzo is an example. and how about Ayton compared to... what's his name?

It was known that this draft was better. I think Fultz/Tatum/Ball/ Jackson fall to later in the lottery. Ayton/Bagley/Doncic/Bamba/Young/etc are much better prospects.

 

[SactownSunsFan]

also, he could grab more rebounds if he jumped more. it seems like he's conserving energy sometimes. unlike bulky big men, he's got a body type that should allow him to be more active. maybe he needs better conditioning.

He looked a bit slow and stiff after the first few minutes of the tip-off, much more than any time during the preaseason. My guess would be adrenaline playing in his first real NBA game got the better of him. Even the most well-conditioned athletes can get unnaturally fatigued because of adrenaline dump.

 

[Mainstreet]

I can't think of the player but he reminds me of someone else who used to tuck the ball down low (almost like a football) as he drives to the bucket back in the day.

Perhaps you are thinking about Marbury. He used to tuck the ball away like a football on drives to the basket.

 

[GatorAZ]

Perhaps you are thinking about Marbury. He used to tuck the ball away like a football on drives to the basket.

Barbosa too

 

[sunsfan88]

Barbosa too

That's who I had in mind as I was reading that post.

 

[Mainstreet]

Barbosa too

That's who I had in mind as I was reading that post.

I guess I remember Barbosa more for extending his long arms for layups and flip shots rather than tucking the ball away a lot. I'm sure he did it some but I do not remember it as a trademark.

 

[95pro]

Yep Barbs used to do that a lot.

 

[GatorAZ]

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[1tinsoldier]

3 assists and 6 turnovers. but a great game for doncic

regarding Ayton, we've got a problem. i noticed the same problem in the one game i watched him in the NCAA
watch the suns' first 30 seconds of the 3rd quarter
the suns were rested, but Ayton barely moved for their whole first possession

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

So, role reversal for two rooks. I think we will see this all season.

 

[SirStefan32]

3 assists and 6 turnovers. but a great game for doncic

regarding Ayton, we've got a problem. i noticed the same problem in the one game i watched him in the NCAA
watch the suns' first 30 seconds of the 3rd quarter
the suns were rested, but Ayton barely moved for their whole first possession

He's a rookie. He was playing against the second best Center in the league, and got rookie treatment with fouls. He's gonna have bad possessions, bad quarters, bad games.

 

[AzStevenCal]

He's a rookie. He was playing against the second best Center in the league, and got rookie treatment with fouls. He's gonna have bad possessions, bad quarters, bad games.

Not to mention bad ankle, bad air (altitude).

 

[BC867]

3 assists and 6 turnovers. but a great game for doncic

regarding Ayton, we've got a problem. i noticed the same problem in the one game i watched him in the NCAA
watch the suns' first 30 seconds of the 3rd quarter
the suns were rested, but Ayton barely moved for their whole first possession

He played the game with an ankle sprain. When they said he was good to go before the game, I couldn't help but wonder, "Does good to go mean that the can put weight on it ... or that he can play equal with his competing Center?" We saw the answer. He should have sat out the game.

The Suns knew that it would be an uphill fight in our first road game and in the thin Colorado air.

Building his confidence should be a priority at this time.

Edit: I just saw your post, Steve, which hit before I completed mine.

That makes it unanimous.

 

[1tinsoldier]

he didn't have a sprained ankle in the ncaa game
look, i'm still delighted to have him, even over doncic
but his movement without the ball IS a problem that needs to be addressed
sooner rather than later

 

[slinslin]

We were +5 with ayton in the game

 

[1tinsoldier]

in case you're wondering how Jokic had the energy for 35/12/11 in mile-high Denver:

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this is a video clip of the first 2 suns' possessions of the second half
it just looks like a still photo because Ayton never moved from that area on both possessions

he did sprint up the court on defense between plays, so it wasn't his ankle

 

[Mainstreet]

My primary concern about Ayton entering the game was getting into foul trouble. This proved to be the case. It took away from a lot of his aggressiveness.

And Jokic is huge and a very fine center. It's no surprise to me that Ayton had trouble with him in his second start. Ayton will develop into an excellent center but will take time for his body to fully mature.

Also I think there was a bit of a shock factor playing in Denver where they got rolling early in the high altitude. It's a bit intimating for any team. It didn't help Jokic couldn't miss with his shots.