BA = Toxic

[Dback Jon]

A few different players but same coach that has won 2 coach of the year awards & has had a winning season every year but this one. I think he is doing a fine job.

So if he gets the credit for great seasons, shouldn't he get the blame for seasons like this one?

Arians wants to get all the credit when things go well, but blames the players when things go wrong.

He's lost the locker room.

 

[TJ]

So if he gets the credit for great seasons, shouldn't he get the blame for seasons like this one?

Arians wants to get all the credit when things go well, but blames the players when things go wrong.

He's lost the locker room.

I haven't heard anything to suggest that he's lost the locker room.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[BigRedRage]

Well not THAT perfect. LOL Guy has more gates associated to his team then a horse farm.

and on his way to a possible 5th title.

 

[RugbyMuffin]

and on his way to a possible 5th title.

Yeah, I agreed with that part in the original response.

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

So if he gets the credit for great seasons, shouldn't he get the blame for seasons like this one?

Arians wants to get all the credit when things go well, but blames the players when things go wrong.

He's lost the locker room.

Show us some proof, even remotely, of that.

 

[cardncubfan]

So if he gets the credit for great seasons, shouldn't he get the blame for seasons like this one?

Arians wants to get all the credit when things go well, but blames the players when things go wrong.

He's lost the locker room.

Not really. They've had a lot of injuries though.

 

[StreetTruckinTitan]

Not really. They've had a lot of injuries though.

exactly. Injuries and plain bad luck plaqued this team all season.

 

[RugbyMuffin]

FYI, just heard on the radio Arians was asked about how he thinks Floyd will do with the Patriots, he said two things.

- "I do not know" (how he will do)

- "I hope he does well"

There is a difference between business and personal.

 

[AZ Native]

FYI, just heard on the radio Arians was asked about how he thinks Floyd will do with the Patriots, he said two things.

- "I do not know" (how he will do)

- "I hope he does well"

There is a difference between business and personal.

So Arians is capable of saying the "right" thing.
So now, build on that.

 

[chickenhead]

A quick response to the millennial subtopic: criticizing a younger generation is the same mindset as ascribing negative characteristics to any group (race, immigrant, economic status, age) in order to make withholding sympathy and help more comfortable.

 

[JeffGollin]

Ironic: Find a kicker who can kick, a snapper who can snap, a holder who can spot, coverage guys who can tackle (and a ST coach who can coach) and we're not having this conversation.

My point: a HC can be terriific in many aspects of the game only to be brought down by a "small detail" that blows up an entire season.

 

[Harry]

This is a great deal to respond to, I'll just hit a couple of highlights. Mitch your tracing of Keim's off season is quite accurate. I think you were a little hard on the decliners. Some were sick/hurt; Fells, Bethel, TM, Brown, and Rucker, etc.

I don't agree that BA is toxic. Sports' history is filled with successful managers/coaches who threw players under the bus. The Fitz deal about playing the slot is old news and I believe his recent statements indicate that. He no longer has the speed to play outside. BA is frustrated and so are most of the players. Players tend to put far less stock in these BA type comments than fans. If you ever heard what many coaches called players in practice you'd be shocked. Thin skinned players need to pick a different game.

 

[Mitch]

This is a great deal to respond to, I'll just hit a couple of highlights. Mitch your tracing of Keim's off season is quite accurate. I think you were a little hard on the decliners. Some were sick/hurt; Fells, Bethel, TM, Brown, and Rucker, etc.

I don't agree that BA is toxic. Sports' history is filled with successful managers/coaches who threw players under the bus. The Fitz deal about playing the slot is old news and I believe his recent statements indicate that. He no longer has the speed to play outside. BA is frustrated and so are most of the players. Players tend to put far less stock in these BA type comments than fans. If you ever heard what many coaches called players in practice you'd be shocked. Thin skinned players need to pick a different game.

I wasn't trying to be hard on the guys with injuries...just pointing out the numbers of players who for one reason or another have not played up to par this year...I think it is an inordinate number.

I have been trying to think back to find an NFL head coach who was so openly negative about individual players and the last one I can think of is Bill Parcells. There was a time and place for Bill Parcells and he loved to mix it up with the media the way BA does---and Parcells was openly candid to a fault---like calling Terry Glenn "she."

But, there's a reason why Parcells bottomed out as a head coach. And for the same reasons, if BA doesn't amend his ways, then I fear he is going to bottom out the same way Parcells did.

Just to be clear---I am not naive about the kinds of things that are said in practice---but my point is, that's where it belongs and where it should stay.

 

[82CardsGrad]

I wasn't trying to be hard on the guys with injuries...just pointing out the numbers of players who for one reason or another have not played up to par this year...I think it is an inordinate number.

I have been trying to think back to find an NFL head coach who was so openly negative about individual players and the last one I can think of is Bill Parcells. There was a time and place for Bill Parcells and he loved to mix it up with the media the way BA does---and Parcells was openly candid to a fault---like calling Terry Glenn "she."

But, there's a reason why Parcells bottomed out as a head coach. And for the same reasons, if BA doesn't amend his ways, then I fear he is going to bottom out the same way Parcells did.

Just to be clear---I am not naive about the kinds of things that are said in practice---but my point is, that's where it belongs and where it should stay.

Parcells is in Canton with his 2 Super Bowls... Man would I love to see BA "bottom out" a la Parcells... [emoji106]

 

[Buckybird]

Parcells is in Canton with his 2 Super Bowls... Man would I love to see BA "bottom out" a la Parcells... [emoji106]

While your right, Parcells never again reached a Super Bowl in his last 11 seasons & in that span was like 3-5 (2 came in 1 year) in those playoff years.

I'm not saying a HC can't be tough in certain ways these days, but IMO most players of today respond differently than the players of those early Parcell days to criticism & verbal abuse. I don't agree with all of Mitch's thoughts on the topic but I think there's some validity to what he's saying. Do any of the top coaches today repeatedly rip players like BA does? I can't think of any. I guess since 2016 is basically over we won't find out until next season.

If BA doesn't fire Amos Jones after the season how does that set in the locker room with the players & team on accountability? I think it sends a terrible message. I personally hope BA is either full of it or Michael or Keim step on his toes.

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

Maybe I'm not remembering correctly, but it's not like BA is always throwing players under the bus. I remember the knee deep comment which was a rookie in camp and Arians said it kind of jokingly. There's the Bethel thing, which was being honest, but other than saying the WR's need to make a catch, the players aren't executing, or the kick needs to be made, etc., I don't remember him criticizing individuals by name.

If he asked whether Palmer was to blame for an INT, he'll say something like, yeah, he threw it. But let's not act like every week he's naming players and ripping them in the press. Also, not mentioned, is he praises players quite often too.

 

[82CardsGrad]

While your right, Parcells never again reached a Super Bowl in his last 11 seasons & in that span was like 3-5 (2 came in 1 year) in those playoff years.

I'm not saying a HC can't be tough in certain ways these days, but IMO most players of today respond differently than the players of those early Parcell days to criticism & verbal abuse. I don't agree with all of Mitch's thoughts on the topic but I think there's some validity to what he's saying. Do any of the top coaches today repeatedly rip players like BA does? I can't think of any. I guess since 2016 is basically over we won't find out until next season.

If BA doesn't fire Amos Jones after the season how does that set in the locker room with the players & team on accountability? I think it sends a terrible message. I personally hope BA is either full of it or Michael or Keim step on his toes.

I've said I'm not in favor of BA talking down about specific players to the media. And his blind loyalty to Jones is worsened because of his rants to the media about players while leaving Jones untouched. It smells really bad...
However, Parcells has two championships. BA has never been to one as a head coach.
Are players different today? Yes and no... The money is the biggest thing. However, what makes great leaders and great teams is essentially the same as it was 40 years ago. The Cards just don't have true leaders on this team. Even Fitz, for as much as I love him, is more of a reluctant leader - it doesn't come natural to him at all. Palmer as well... we don't have a Lawrence Taylor, Harry Carson, Phil Simms, Mark Bavaro, Jim Burt on this team. The Badger could be the most natural leader we have, but it doesn't matter because he's never on the field...
BA's tactics would be fine if we actually had leaders within the locker room...

 

[slanidrac16]

Arians has called out Fitz, Campbell, Peterson and more over the years. He is who he is. Someone said there are players would take less money to play somewhere else? Then good riddance. Don't want to play in sunny Arizona with top notch facilities and sold out crowds because your feelings are hurt?

Bye Bye. Try submitting your resume' in Cleveland.

Remember coach them hard and hug them later.

 

[RON_IN_OC]

Arians has called out Fitz, Campbell, Peterson and more over the years. He is who he is. Someone said there are players would take less money to play somewhere else? Then good riddance. Don't want to play in sunny Arizona with top notch facilities and sold out crowds because your feelings are hurt?

Bye Bye. Try submitting your resume' in Cleveland.

Remember coach them hard and hug them later.

Hahahaha...yup...just ask Dansby about Cleveland.

Sent from my SM-N920V using Tapatalk