Bartell should get the start if fall to 1-5..

[Cards_Campos]

Gets my vote for dumbest thread so far this season! Kolb is NEW hello give the freaking guy a chance if it were for terrible playcalling and some questionable officiating this team could be 4-0 as easy as they are 1-3. We lost these games IMO by terrible coaching that's fairly obvious. Coach whiz is always trying to be cute or out think people when it's the exact opposite of what we should be doing it's ridiculous and infuriating to watch!

Well its because you dont think outside the box.

Our schedule is brutal coming up. Say we lose 6 of the next 7...and are 2-10....Kolb could be destroyed confidence wise...he was suppose to save us and yet we could be worse!!!! 2nd....We benched Warner a few times and it took those benchings (I guess) To bring his career around again. Kolb maybe can see what is going on from the sidelines and get a breather.

3rd What if we do end up witht he 1st or 2nd pick of the draft? You better not pass on Luck if we do!

 

[Unsterblich856]

If Richard Bartel was a worthy starter, he wouldn't be the career 3rd stringer who bounced around four NFL teams and a UFL team. I don't care if he played well against 2nd/3rd/PS players in the preseason. Kevin Kolb is easily the best QB we have on the roster, I shouldn't even have to type that.

 

[D-Dogg]

Sure and Adrian Peterson would have been a failure in Arizona playing with Warner, Fitz and Boldin behind our offensive line.

I think he would have. Truly. Warner SUCKED at handing the ball off.

Seriously though, I would love a mulligan on that one.

 

[Duckjake]

If Richard Bartel was a worthy starter, he wouldn't be the career 3rd stringer who bounced around four NFL teams and a UFL team. I don't care if he played well against 2nd/3rd/PS players in the preseason. Kevin Kolb is easily the best QB we have on the roster, I shouldn't even have to type that.

If Kevin Kolb were a worthy starter he wouldn't have sat on the bench in Philly for years and then been shipped out of town.

If Kurt Warner were a worthy starter he wouldn't have been playing in the Arena League. If Tom Brady were a worthy starter he wouldn't have been a 6th round draft pick. If Matt Schaub were a worthy starter he wouldn't have warmed the bench in Atlanta for 3 years and then been shipped out of town.

That argument is hogwash.

Now let's talk about a realistic reason that Bartel has been nothing more than a career 3rd stringer. 1. Was never given a chance? Warner and Brady only became starters when the guy ahead of them was injured. 2. Has a tendency to throw stupid interceptions. Could be the real reason. 3. Is not a good practice player. Have no idea. 4. Is inaccurate. 70% completion rate would say otherwise. 5. Panics in the pocket. No, he looks as cool as they come.
6. Has trouble with the faster and better prepared 1st team guys? How would we know he's only had half a start. But that could be happening in practice.

Those are real reasons. That a guy is passed over by other teams is just not a reason to write him off. But sadly it happens far too often for a lot of NFL hopefuls.

 

[WarnerHOF]

My question is why was Andy Reid so quick to run Kolb out of town after giving the keys to franchise to him after trading McNabb? Kolb looks like Rob Johnson and AJ Feeley to me so far.

 

[Diamondback Jay]

My question is why was Andy Reid so quick to run Kolb out of town after giving the keys to franchise to him after trading McNabb? Kolb looks like Rob Johnson and AJ Feeley to me so far.

Some guy named Vick might have played a factor in that?

 

[Sunburn]

Another vote for stupidest thread of the year

 

[conraddobler]

It's really not a stupid thread.

People just think it's stupid because we paid 60 million dollars, a player and a draft pick for Kolb.

Turn this around and just have two relatively equal draft picks on the team and people would already be talking about Bartel getting a chance.

What you gave up for Kolb is meaningless the moment he walks in the facility doors.

There's absolutely no reason to chose him over Bartel because of what they are paid, other than the CHEAPER one all else being equal should get the nod, they are two available players on your team, what you paid for each one means NOTHING in reality.

The idea is to put the best player on the field, I don't know at this point who that is between the two but the coaches should have a good idea, the trouble is if they had a big hand in getting Kolb then they will never ever ever do this even if it's the right move, which is a theme on our team.

 

[Crazy Canuck]

Well its because you dont think outside the box.Our schedule is brutal coming up. Say we lose 6 of the next 7...and are 2-10....Kolb could be destroyed confidence wise...he was suppose to save us and yet we could be worse!!!! 2nd....We benched Warner a few times and it took those benchings (I guess) To bring his career around again. Kolb maybe can see what is going on from the sidelines and get a breather.

3rd What if we do end up witht he 1st or 2nd pick of the draft? You better not pass on Luck if we do!

Most people who say that they are "thinking outside the box" are simply confused.

 

[Mulli]

If you were going to start someone besides Kolb, wouldn't you start Skelton instead?

 

[THESMEL]

Bartell is a scrub QB, borderline emergency QB on any other team. get a grip.

Mike Miller is new at OC, Kolb has 4 games without an offseason- He is ahead of the curve and better than I expected at this point. My God Chris Miller is his QB coach. OUCH we can't find any better? I mean from local High Schools?

It was a team effort to lose these last 3- ripp defeat from the jaws of victory like our legacy demands. Vikings are not as diagnostic as I thought before the season. We found out alot in te Giants game- most of it good! IMO

After the bye in the weak NFCW we'll see, We have 2 left against the Niners- we still control or own destiny! And we are better than them...,. alot better if we don't beat our self and feed the bean.

 

[kerouac9]

If you were going to start someone besides Kolb, wouldn't you start Skelton instead?

Skelton's toast. The Coaching staff apparently had immediate buyers' remorse on the draft pick, and he's sitting third string now even though he has like a 9 month headstart on Bartell on learning the offense. He has work to do to get back to 2nd string after being deactivated the first quarter of the season.

It's stunning that the Cards gave up on a high-priced free agent and starting cornerback and shipped him out in order to pick up a quarterback who is maybe 50/50 to make the team next year.

 

[chickenhead]

In this discussion, 1-5 as a team is not as relevant as Kolb's actual performance. We're playing Minnesota on the road and then Pittsburgh at home. 2 losses are VERY possible. What if we lose both but Kolb is solid? What if we win both but he is mediocre at best? Let's keep watching...

In any case, the prospect of starting Bartel doesn't excite me all that much, because it's based on "seeing what we have" or worse, a punitive benching of Kolb. I don't think the "best chance to win" argument is as strong here.

 

[Russ Smith]

I don't know what to make of Bartel to be honest. He's 28 and hasn't really played much. He looked very good against SD and then terrific in the final exhibition game, but then most of the guys he played against were cut the next day.

in the Green Bay game he made one of the most brain dead mistakes I've seen since Plummer left, panicking under pressure he literally threw the ball right to a defender. Just a total hot potato play where he was willing to risk a turnover just to not get hit. I commented at the time it really concerned me that he didn't appear to be anything close to NFL capable and by that time I think Hall was already hurt and clearly gone so you knew Bartel would be the #3 QB. he played quite well the last 2 weeks of preseason and actually became the #2.

I just think the main problem Kolb has is reacting to the pass rush, and with our OL there is going to be a pass rush. Then I look back at that one play from Bartel againt GB and I wonder, if he actually plays in games are we going to see the calm guy from the last 2 games or the one that threw that pass against GB?

Skelton seems very relaxed, the problem I have with Skelton is for all his size and arm etc, so far he shows almost no ability to make plays downfield.
He had one long TD play last year 74 yards and for the rest of the plays he averaged under 5 yards per attempt and seemed completely disinterested in throwing downfield. He was a rookie of course but he seemed about the same in the preseason in limited play, for a guy with a big arm he seems not all that effective downfield.

I will say this, if we do bench Kolb, I personally would play Bartel before I would play Skelton.

 

[Russ Smith]

Skelton's toast. The Coaching staff apparently had immediate buyers' remorse on the draft pick, and he's sitting third string now even though he has like a 9 month headstart on Bartell on learning the offense. He has work to do to get back to 2nd string after being deactivated the first quarter of the season.

It's stunning that the Cards gave up on a high-priced free agent and starting cornerback and shipped him out in order to pick up a quarterback who is maybe 50/50 to make the team next year.

I'm confused are you saying Kolb is 50-50 for next year or Skelton?

 

[Cheesebeef]

Most people who say that they are "thinking outside the box" are simply confused.

says the man who called AJ Jefferson a "real steal" in the pre-season and was thought Acho/Schofield were going to really help the pass rush... and consitently defended the FO's decision not to address the OT position... and was really confident in Roberts for our #2 WR... and basically thinks the overwhelming majority of any decision the Cardinals make is the right one. yeah... he's the confused one Canuck.

 

[oaken1]

Play Bartel if ya want, he has the head for it....unfortunately he hangs the ball in the air far too long......

wasted thread at this point in the season IMO

 

[TJ]

Came out of Cardinals' posting retirement just to say this is one of the most absurd, ridiculous ideas I have ever read on this board.

I swear, many fans here are complete hypocrites. On one hand, they insist they will be patient with Kolb's growth in the system due to the lockout and give him a season get acclimated. On the other, they get upset and ask for the guillotine after 4 games.

Furthermore, Kolb hasn't been horrible by any stretch of the imagination. Sunday's game was the first where he didn't pass for more than 250 yards (he was at 240 +/-). Additionally, he is completing 62% of his passes at over 8 yards per attempt. Not too shabby for a QB learning a new system on the fly.

There is NO logical reason you even consider making a change at QB. There are other contributing factors to our 1-3 start. The most perplexing thing is we haven't been blown out yet. In our three losses, we lost by a combined 8 points. This tells me we are closer to success than fans want to admit.

I'm as disappointed as anyone, but unlike last season (even though we were 2-2 at this time), I have more confidence in our potential for success.

That is all. Back to posting retirement. I'll be in the D-Backs forum if you need me.

 

[kerouac9]

I'm confused are you saying Kolb is 50-50 for next year or Skelton?

LOL. Didn't think about that. Skelton is 50/50 to make the roster next year. No reason not to think that he could be fighting for his job with Max Hall, who mysteriously still is collecting an NFL paycheck on injured reserve.

Two years in a row we cast off starting cornerbacks + draft picks for quarterbacks. Obviously we have a plan to be successful.

To the OP, I think it's ridiculous to even consider putting Bartel in the lineup. Kolb is the guy we've hitched our wagon to, and Coach clearly believes that Kolb's problem is a lack of reps in the offense. Kolb isn't going to get those reps riding the bench, and there's no reason to believe that Bartel gives us a better chance to win.

This is not like last season when the Cards were clearly outclassed in every game that wasn't against a similarly miserable team. This team is competitive in every game thus far. Even though it's frustrating, until we look like we don't belong on an NFL field, I don't see need to make sweeping changes.

TJ's kind of got his head in the sand when it comes to Kolb. Kolb's completion % is nothing to write home about, and his YPA dropped his first three games. His yardage has declined more or less through four games, while his passer rating has declined every single game. Kolb's not playing well, but the losses aren't purely on him. Film is out on him and the offense, and Whis has done a miserable job preparing for the shortened offseason. He's making excuses about it every time he gets in front of a microphone.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Whis has done a miserable job preparing for the shortened offseason. He's making excuses about it every time he gets in front of a microphone.

man, if this doesn't hit the nail on the head. i've heard him complain about this NUMEROUS times and it bothers the hell out of me. Every coach has had to deal with the same damn thing. get over it Coach and take a look in the freaking mirror for once instead of blaming a lock-out, or lamenting the loss or Warner or whatever other excuse you're gonna come up with next as to why teams like Washington and Tennessee who were horrible last year have been able to start stronger... or even the freaking Bengals or Browns, who had wholesale coaching changes/or personnel changes.

 

[Catfish]

Baloney !!!!!

 

[Duckjake]

I don't know what to make of Bartel to be honest. He's 28 and hasn't really played much

This is why I also don't know what to make of Kolb. He's 27 and hasn't really played much. I just hope Brown,Keith and Grimm haven't ruined him as a QB.

But that is no reason to simply start Bartel because the Cards are losing. Bartel to me is a great insurance policy in case he HAS to start. I don't see him as our QBOF though stranger things have happened with QBs in the NFL. Kolb isn't losing games for us like DA did. He just isn't winning them for us. As much as I hate 2011 being yet another 5-11 rebuilding year I think we have to stick with Kolb into next season.

 

[Russ Smith]

This is why I also don't know what to make of Kolb. He's 27 and hasn't really played much. I just hope Brown,Keith and Grimm haven't ruined him as a QB.

But that is no reason to simply start Bartel because the Cards are losing. Bartel to me is a great insurance policy in case he HAS to start. I don't see him as our QBOF though stranger things have happened with QBs in the NFL. Kolb isn't losing games for us like DA did. He just isn't winning them for us. As much as I hate 2011 being yet another 5-11 rebuilding year I think we have to stick with Kolb into next season.

Kolb has thrown about 450 passes in his NFL career, Bartel has thrown 28.

Kolb was a 4 year starter in college that threw for about 13,000 yards, Bartel played some at SMU, 2 years 299 attempts and then went to Tarleton State for another 263 attempts. Threw combined for under 4000 yards. Bartel is inexperienced he threw about half the passes in college Kolb did and at a lower level. He's had almost no playing experience in the NFL.

I'm not saying that means he can't play it wasn't that long ago Warner took us to the Super Bowl with a college career about as impressive as Bartel, I'm just saying I literally have no idea how good Bartel might be.

I do think he's better than Skelton though. The thing is the biggest concern I had about Bartel when I did see him play was how he handled the pass rush, so given that's Kolb's biggest issue I'm not sure that would get any better if Bartel was playing.

 

[crisper57]

Kolb isn't melting down and giving up our leads. Sure, he hasn't finished out a game-winning drive, but he's put us in the position to win every week and the defense has been the weaker link.

Kolb isn't the problem.

Ugh.

 

[Duckjake]

So what if he's thrown more passes we still don't know what we have in Kolb anymore than we know what we have in Bartel. That we are being asked to be patient and wait and see with a guy who has been in the NFL for 4+ years like he's some rookie speaks specifically to that.