Bidwill gives Green reprieve - for now

[Russ Smith]

I think the important thing here is this shouldn't surprise any of us, and it's not permanent yet. Basically they just said we're not going to announce a firing today, and we're not giving a vote of confidence. Coaching changes are made at the bye week if possible(during the season). It made no sense to think Green would be canned this week anyways. That hasn't changed, Green basically has one week to convince the FO he's made the necessary changes, or he's likely going to get fired at the bye. I've believed that since the Bears debacle. the Raiders loss just makes it more likely, he'd have to have a complete destruction of Green Bay IMHO to save his job.

They didn't say he's here to stay or anything like that, just said nothing is happening now.

 

[football karma]

Forget the $2.5 mm-- thats the equivalent of about 8,000 season tickets

How many seats does the team lose if its announced that Green is back?

One way or another, the Cardinals are paying that money.

 

[Scott MS]

Forget the $2.5 mm-- thats the equivalent of about 8,000 season tickets

How many seats does the team lose if its announced that Green is back?

One way or another, the Cardinals are paying that money.

Wrong way to look at it. That's $2.5M out of the Bidwill family's pocket.

I'll be the Cardinals are trying to negotiate a settlement or buy out.

 

[john h]

i was trying to figure out the most accurate analogy ending with "try harder". you nailed it.

I have often doubted the basic intelligence of Green. After his two outburst before the press in our two losses I am convinced this guy is just not very smart and he is not going to get any smarter next year. Yes DG we knew what the Bears and Oarkland were before we went in! That sure makes a lot of sense.

 

[moklerman]

First of all, forget the money. That isn't the issue. DG's gonna get paid one way or another so it's not about that. I don't know what it is, but it's not that.

Second, firing Green won't hurt the team one bit, so why keep him around? If having him here means 1-6, then how does it adversely affect the team to fire him? He doesn't call plays and he doesn't motivate the players and he doesn't formulate game plans that work and he doesn't prepare the players well and he doesn't teach them mental fortitude. What else is there that a head coach should be doing that's so pivotal to the team that he should stay?

Not firing Green is a horrible message for the players that might actually still give a damn.

 

[Russ Smith]

First of all, forget the money. That isn't the issue. DG's gonna get paid one way or another so it's not about that. I don't know what it is, but it's not that.

Second, firing Green won't hurt the team one bit, so why keep him around? If having him here means 1-6, then how does it adversely affect the team to fire him? He doesn't call plays and he doesn't motivate the players and he doesn't formulate game plans that work and he doesn't prepare the players well and he doesn't teach them mental fortitude. What else is there that a head coach should be doing that's so pivotal to the team that he should stay?

Not firing Green is a horrible message for the players that might actually still give a damn.

I was going to say the same thing to Clif's question in the other thread. If it doesn't hurt the team why not do it?

Green defended his firing of Rowen as saying he doesn't like to stand still, if something doesn't work, you make changes. His coaching isn't working, make a change.

I'm still of the opinion any firing will take place at the bye week.

 

[ajcardfan]

First of all, forget the money. That isn't the issue. DG's gonna get paid one way or another so it's not about that. I don't know what it is, but it's not that.

Second, firing Green won't hurt the team one bit, so why keep him around? If having him here means 1-6, then how does it adversely affect the team to fire him? He doesn't call plays and he doesn't motivate the players and he doesn't formulate game plans that work and he doesn't prepare the players well and he doesn't teach them mental fortitude. What else is there that a head coach should be doing that's so pivotal to the team that he should stay?

Not firing Green is a horrible message for the players that might actually still give a damn.

The players quoted in the paper today seemed to not want a coaching change. But, they almost always say they want the current guy to stay. I think it's "the evil we know vs. the evil we don't" sort of thing.

 

[40yearfan]

Here's a little bit different take from the AZ. Republic:

Green's job secure - for now

Doug Haller
The Arizona Republic
Oct. 23, 2006 10:38 PM


Michael Bidwill said Monday that the Cardinals do not plan to remove Dennis Green as head coach anytime soon.

The team's vice president and general counsel flew to New Orleans for NFL owners meetings after Sunday's 22-9 loss to the winless Oakland Raiders, a performance Bidwill called "unacceptable."

Bidwill said he called Green and the Cardinals' Vice President of Football Operations Rod Graves and demanded explanations.

"What I asked them, frankly, was, 'How in the hell did we get to 1-6?' " Bidwill said. "Close losses don't count. We're 1-6, and we shouldn't be. I wanted to know what we were doing to correct it."

In a phone interview, Bidwill said he did not deliver ultimatums or votes of confidence. He pointed out that the Arizona locker room has enough talent to win and that a failure to do so has frustrated nearly everyone in the organization.

He would not commit to saying Green's job was safe for the rest of the season or even past the next game, Sunday against the Green Bay Packers. Asked if he would hesitate to make a coaching change during the season, Bidwill said, "I'm not going to speculate. My hope is that we get this (season) turned around."

At his weekly news conference Monday, Green said he is still the right man to lead a Cardinals reversal.

"I don't question it," Green said. "As I've said quite a bit, we've got a lot of people working together. I've tried to play a role in helping us acquire some talent. I think we have pretty good talent; I just think we haven't had as good of fortune as we'd like to have."

Green admitted in a postgame news conference that he hasn't found success with the "team that we have" and suggested that anyone would love to coach such a talented outfit.

As a result, the Cardinals, 1-6 for the first time since 1997, have a coaching controversy that likely won't vanish anytime soon. Although it is unusual for ownership to dismiss coaches during the season, it's not without precedent.

The Cardinals fired Vince Tobin and replaced him with then-defensive coordinator Dave McGinnis after a 2-5 start in 2000. Three years later, the Atlanta Falcons canned Dan Reeves after a 3-10 start.

Green has one year remaining on his contract, with a team option for a fifth year. Management would have to pay Green $2.5 million to get rid of him. Asked if the job speculation adds more pressure, Green simply answered, "No."

He acknowledged that this is the worst stretch he has had in 13 years as an NFL head coach. In 10 seasons in Minnesota, Green took the Vikings to the playoffs eight times. In his first two years here, Green failed to win more than six games a season, a trend that likely will continue.

After the Packers game and an off week, the Cardinals face Dallas, Detroit, Minnesota, St. Louis, Seattle, Denver, San Francisco and San Diego in the season's second half.

A humbling experience?

"I was raised in a humbling experience," Green said. "My background says I've never rode the easy horse. I've always rode the bucking horse."

After Monday's workout, receiver Anquan Boldin didn't question Cardinals management. Coaches don't play football games, he said. Asked if he still has confidence in the system, Boldin replied, "Yeah, why not? We're professionals. This is what we do for a living."

 

[conraddobler]

After Monday's workout, receiver Anquan Boldin didn't question Cardinals management. Coaches don't play football games, he said. Asked if he still has confidence in the system, Boldin replied, "Yeah, why not? We're professionals. This is what we do for a living."

I think the players are going to say the right things, it amounts to blah blah blah.

They vote with their play on the field, that Radiers game was pretty bad, it looked like they already voted on DG.

 

[Russ Smith]

FWIW late yesterday Pro Football Talk had a story up saying Green might be out in the next 48 hours and they were speculating he was probably finagling his own way out like he did in Minnesota. But I still say if he's gone, it'll happen at the bye week.

 

[Sandan]

Come on Nidan... we all know it has something to do with the money and that's ok. I wouldn't want to be on the hook for two head coaches either. Sure there aren't any viable options at this time, but even if there were they wouldn't pull the plug just yet anyways.

Come on yourself.

It's my understanding that they have to pay him theis year and next regardless. So whether he stays or goes is not going to affect the cash postition.

Time to get real and stop falling back on the Bidwill's are cheap mantra. That has nothing to do with this. It certainly has nothing to do with the disaster last week.

 

[Team G]

My dad is a television repairman! He has a sweet set of tools!- Spicolli

 

[Russ Smith]

Come on yourself.

It's my understanding that they have to pay him theis year and next regardless. So whether he stays or goes is not going to affect the cash postition.

Time to get real and stop falling back on the Bidwill's are cheap mantra. That has nothing to do with this. It certainly has nothing to do with the disaster last week.

This year and 2.5 for the next. So if he's fired next week, the team owes him 2.5 for next year.

PFT made a good point, in Minnesota, Green quit, but he negotiated it so it was as if he was fired, so he still got the buyout money. He simply couldn't take another NFL coaching job without forfeiting the salary. So for 2 years he worked for ESPN, everyone interviewed him (Rooney Rule) and then the Cards finally hired him after his 2 years of salary from the Vikings was up.

So he's probably going to want a similar situation as will the Cards. That is, we'll pay you to go away, but if you take another coaching job, you forfeit the rest of your salary.

 

[Sandan]

DS2 Moff: We'll redouble our efforts.
Vader: I hope so, for your sake, Commander. The Emperor isn't as forgiving as I am.

Ok the first one was funny but this is better

 

[Sandan]

So you are agreeing with me Russ that this isn't a money issue ? Either way the Cards pay Green for this year and next.

The only possible confusion is the potential to hire a new haed coach immediatly which in my opinion is unlikely. To make any difference he would need to implement his own system and that ain't happening until the offseason.

Also the incremental cost of such a coach for the remainder of the season is peanuts in NFL terms. So this isn't a money issue.

I'd expecting a firing after GB is we have another collapse with an existing assistant picking up the slack.

 

[vince56]

Come on yourself

Anyone notice the porn references with the commentators on this week's game?

"Warren Sapp just came in Matt Leinart's face!!"

I heard something like that at least twice on sunday and can't believe they let it through on air.

 

[Russ Smith]

So you are agreeing with me Russ that this isn't a money issue ? Either way the Cards pay Green for this year and next.

The only possible confusion is the potential to hire a new haed coach immediatly which in my opinion is unlikely. To make any difference he would need to implement his own system and that ain't happening until the offseason.

Also the incremental cost of such a coach for the remainder of the season is peanuts in NFL terms. So this isn't a money issue.

I'd expecting a firing after GB is we have another collapse with an existing assistant picking up the slack.

At this point I don't think the Cards are keeping Green to save money. I don't think we're keeping him I still say he's fired after Green Bay barring a huge turnaround.

But no I don't think at this time the Cards are going to keep Green just to avoid double paying. If they keep him through 2007, then yeah that would be my suspicion, it was to save money.

 

[jefftheshark]

Anyone notice the porn references with the commentators on this week's game?

"Warren Sapp just came in Matt Leinart's face!!"

I heard something like that at least twice on sunday and can't believe they let it through on air.

Kind of makes you miss the days of the mid-70's Vikings when they had Fred Cox and Jeff Siemon.

The Shark

 

[RonF]

I would think that the Bidwills would want to wait until the Super Bowl is over before addressing the head coach position. No sense in overreacting and let Green off the hook by replacing him with an interim coach. I say challenge the guy and hold him accountable both on and off the field. Let the crowd boo him if they must and let the sports writers criticize him if he fails. We're not going anywhere this year anyway, except, to develop some of the players. Let the new head coach come in next year with his staff and go from there.

Although, I'm not sure that I can hold up to a new five-year plan, we've had enough of those already.

 

[jenna2891]

This got me to thinking about something....which no one will ever know and is a worthless exercise..but I will do it anyway....what is the protocol for the Cardinals? Who talks to who? Does Michael communicate with Denny...or Rod? I guess both...Does Michael talk to Denny on a daily basis..or is it a hands off operation?

nobody in the organization sneezes without bidwill approval.

 

[Sandan]

I know RG talks [or more accurately talked] with Dg a lot.

I used to see them watching practices together every time I was there.

 

[clif]

Come on yourself.

It's my understanding that they have to pay him theis year and next regardless. So whether he stays or goes is not going to affect the cash postition.

Time to get real and stop falling back on the Bidwill's are cheap mantra. That has nothing to do with this. It certainly has nothing to do with the disaster last week.

Didn't say it did. In fact it has nothing to do with the Bidwills being cheap. Simple fact that most teams don't fire coaches in mid season (as the article above suggests) It is not a slam as it is reality. No team wants to pay a fired coach AND a new guy the rest of the way. Simple as that.

 

[BigRedArk]

Imagine if Bill had sold his share of the team to Stormy back in 1972 instead of the other way around. Stormy's side of the family couldn't have done any worse than Bill's has. When Stormy was calling the shots back in the St Louis 60's the Cards were at least competitive every year.

 

[moklerman]

I think it would be best to give the interim coach his shot with the rest of the year(after the bye?). That way, it could be seen whether or not hiring from within(unlikely, I know) would be a viable option. There will be some high profile coordinators up for head coaching opportunities next year as well as ex-head coaches who are now coordinators biding their time and/or paying dues.

Ron Rivera, Mike Martz and Jim Haslett come to mind at this point. Fassel's out there too. Edit: I forgot about Al Saunders. Now HE would be a good choice in my opinion. Not much of a resume' when it comes to head coaching success but I think his time in St. Louis, KC and now Washington has been well spent under some really good organizational coaches (Vermeil, Gibbs). He would at least address the o-line and special teams and he really knows how to get an offense clicking with the right tools.

 

[vinnymac]

i thought that green had a fifth year option. the option being he has gotten the cardinals to the playoffs. if green has lost the team, then he will be shown the door at the end of the year.