Braves vs. D-backs series thread

BC867

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...see how many NL teams you can find that have had as consistent of a batting order over the last five or six games than the Diamondbacks. I count one that is definitely more consistent over that period, and just a couple that are close one way or another.
97 different batting orders as of August 3rd, and you're using the article to show consisency?

Citing the 6 and 7 positions (the two least important in the lineup) . . . over the last five or six games?

Wow!

Melvin was Brenly's bench coach when they used 135 different batting orders in a season. He's on his way.

97 different batting orders as of August 3rd. Consistency? Wow, again.
 

Nasser22

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DBacks, 97 different line-ups
Angels: 100
A's: 91
Blue Jays: 92
Cardinals: 99
Dodgers: 96
Giants: 92
Indians: 92
Nationals: 98
Rangers: 97
Red Sox: 92
Rockies: 97
Royals: 93
Tigers: 96
Yankees: 92

That's 15 teams who have used over 90 different line-ups. The way you guys talk about these changes, it makes it seem like it's an uncommon thing to do. The DBacks really struggled for two months so of course he was going to chance the line-ups to see what works. You can't just stick with something that's bringing you no runs. Some say he's incompetent because he doesn't know where his players belong...Are all those 14 other managers, some of pretty good teams, also as incompetent?
 

coyoteshockeyfan

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97 different batting orders as of August 3rd, and you're using the article to show consisency?

Citing the 6 and 7 positions (the two least important in the lineup) . . . over the last five or six games?

Wow!

Melvin was Brenly's bench coach when they used 135 different batting orders in a season. He's on his way.

97 different batting orders as of August 3rd. Consistency? Wow, again.
First off, thanks to injuries and whatnot, using number of batting orders as the sole barometer for offensive consistency is totally bunk. Want proof? Look at St. Louis. 99 total lineups (more than Arizona), most frequent lineup used in 5 games (same as Arizona). Yet, St. Louis is third in the NL in runs scored.

But once again, you've used a straw man to avoid the question that was asked. Multiple people have complained that the lineups this week have been constantly shifted, so my question was, how many NL lineups have been more consistent over that same time period? Go ahead, count them out for me.
 

BC867

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... so my question was, how many NL lineups have been more consistent over that same time period? Go ahead, count them out for me.
When you present the details you're referring to, I wonder how many of the teams that change batting orders regularly have a preponderance of young position players, as the D'backs have had -- Quentin, Upton, Young, Drew.

One of the reasons Mike D'Antoni was encouraged to leave the Suns, despite winning Coach of the Year, was his quote that it's not his job to develop young players.

Bob Melvin has failed in that area, too. He just doesn't have the guts to acknowledge it.
 

coyoteshockeyfan

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Evade, evade, evade. So, how many NL lineups have been more consistent over the last five games? I guess if the facts don't fit the story, all one can do is ignore them.

I checked each NL team's lineups over the last five games. Know how many times I found that a team had used the same batting order for two games in a row (ignoring the pitcher, of course)? Two. Out of 64 chances, it had been done twice.

As for the number of young starters, couple of teams that popped into my head was Colorado and Pittsburgh. I didn't calculate their average ages but they both should qualify as "young." Have either had as consistent of a batting order as the Diamondbacks recently?

http://www.sportsline.com/mlb/teams/depth-chart/COL
http://www.sportsline.com/mlb/teams/depth-chart/PIT

Regarding Drew/Young/Upton/Quentin/etc, pretty convenient to leave Jackson out of the group. Now I don't think Jackson's performance is to Melvin's credit (just like I don't think anybody's poor performances are his fault), but if you're going to play this game you have to call it both ways and acknowledge the successes as well. Drew has made great strides this season, Tracy continues to be a productive player, Snyder has played at his ability, and Upton has outperformed what his brother did at the same age (if there's a more appropriate gauge for Justin's career progress than what his brother has done, I'm all ears). Young has been pretty disappointing this season for the most part, but time is still on his side. Regarding Quentin, people seem to be forgetting that he hit .253/.342/.530 for an OPS+ of 115 in his only healthy season here, which isn't exactly something to scoff at for a rookie season. We must have had a different manager that year.

I would have thought that for all of the recent complaining over the batting order that guys would be able to rattle off teams all over the place as to who has had a more consistent order over that time. Yet, the silence speaks volumes.
 

BC867

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I would have thought that for all of the recent complaining over the batting order that guys would be able to rattle off teams all over the place as to who has had a more consistent order over that time. Yet, the silence speaks volumes.
I don't care what teams "all over the place" do. We have a very young team of position players who need consistency while adjusting to the Majors.

I don't believe that's being handled well.

Chris Young breaks a long ofer with three hits in a game, and immediately gets moved up to 2nd in the batting order. The next day, back down. How the hell is that building confidence?

You and I disagree in our opinions, coyoteshockeyfan. That's cool.

P.S.: An effective manager (in any business) is one who makes it as easy as possible for his people to do the job well. I spent 30 years in Management. I'm telling you, Bob Melvin is not making it easy for his young guys to do well. Regardless of what teams "all over the place" do.
 
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coyoteshockeyfan

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On a topic like consistency, what happens around the league is critical, you can't just avoid what other teams are doing. In order for a team's batting order to be "consistent" or "inconsistent," it has to be in comparison to something. If the standard of reference for consistency is a fictional team who almost never changes their lineup, then there are 30 "inconsistent" teams in the league because I've already proven that that team simply doesn't exist. Thus, in order to come up with a label of "consistent" or "inconsistent," then you have to compare them to what the rest of the league is doing because there is nothing else to compare them to.
 

coyoteshockeyfan

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An uncharacteristic start tonight for Haren, 4 runs given up so far in the 6th and now out of the game after throwing over 100 pitches. The Diamondbacks are still in it though, 4-3.
 

coyoteshockeyfan

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...and now a completely embarrassing display by Cruz. Walk, bases loaded plunk, double, then gets Hudson AND Reynolds injured with two awful throws.
 

Shzm13

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Hudson out... aaaaaand we're probably done.

Reynolds gets taken out right after Hudson. His doesn't look as worse though.
 

TJ

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four game losing streak....gotta love these D-Backs......
 
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DBacks, 97 different line-ups
Angels: 100
A's: 91
Blue Jays: 92
Cardinals: 99
Dodgers: 96
Giants: 92
Indians: 92
Nationals: 98
Rangers: 97
Red Sox: 92
Rockies: 97
Royals: 93
Tigers: 96
Yankees: 92
I love this, of the clubs on this list, the team with the best record in baseball has made the most lineup changes.

It's quality, not quantity, I don't buy this lineup-switching argument anymore.
 

Skkorpion

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The season is not over!

Not sure if you are being sarcastic or not. If not, I agree. We are still in first place and Webb pitches today. I will watch the game and hope we win.
 

Lefty

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Not sure if you are being sarcastic or not. If not, I agree. We are still in first place and Webb pitches today. I will watch the game and hope we win.

Why would I be sarcastic? This is a weak division and this team has not had a long winning streak, so they are due.
 

Dback Jon

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Another lineup...

D'Antona at first
Ojeda at second
Burke in Right
 

Dback Jon

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Good start - Webb shuts down the braves in top of 1st.

Dbacks start off with singles by Drew and Ojeda, double by Reynolds
 

Dback Jon

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Reynolds steals third, scores on ground out by Young.

3-0 end of one.


Why do the Dbacks only play small ball once a week?
 

Lefty

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They have their hitting shoes on early except Chris Burke.
 

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