Bryant salary numbers

[elindholm]

For what it's worth, I put $16 million in for a Bryant starting salary (there's guesswork involved, since we don't know the salary cap) and got

$154 million over seven years with the Lakers (including $28 million in the seventh year)
$120 million over six years with anyone else

That's a smaller difference than some have reported. Did I get my numbers wrong?

 

[slinslin]

Yes you did.

It is 6yrs/102M$ and 7yrs/136M$.

Kobe's starting salary is 14.X or so.

 

[elindholm]

Kobe's starting salary is 14.X or so.

Ah. I couldn't remember what he made last year (hoopshype has already taken it down), so I had to guess.

What did he make last year?

 

[devilalum]

Yes you did.

It is 6yrs/102M$ and 7yrs/136M$.

Kobe's starting salary is 14.X or so.

If the Suns pay Kobe $34 million for the 7th year then its the same.

Also can't he escape from his Suns contract after a couple of years and resign for a larger amount?

 

[slinslin]

Kobe's starting salary is 14.X or so.

Ah. I couldn't remember what he made last year (hoopshype has already taken it down), so I had to guess.

What did he make last year?

There is a special rule that applies to him as far as maximum salary in his first year is concerned.

According to the Larry Coon CBA FAQ a 8yr veteran like Kobe Bryant could have gotten a max contract of 13,125,000M$ in 03/04 or 30% of the salary cap before it is adjusted (12,900,000 if the cap was 43M$) whichever is higher.

*Also, free agents whose salary for the previous season was higher than the maximum can sign for 105% of their salary in the previous season

Kobe made 13,500,000 last season I believe.
105% of that is 14,175,000$.

His starting salary is the same no matter where he signs for the max. The difference is that the Lakers can offer him an additional 2.5% raise after each year and 1 extra contract year.

 

[thegrahamcrackr]

If the Suns pay Kobe $34 million for the 7th year then its the same.

Also can't he escape from his Suns contract after a couple of years and resign for a larger amount?

Yup. There would most likely be a player opt out either 1 year or 2 years before the end of the contract. Assuming he remains healthy, he will be doing this exact same thing in about 5-6 years. He will only be about 30, and will almost certainly nail down another big contract.

I continue to think that the 7th year is irrelevent. The chances of it ever being played are so small anyways.

 

[slinslin]

Kobe made 13,500,000 last season I believe.
105% of that is 14,175,000$.

His starting salary is the same no matter where he signs for the max. The difference is that the Lakers can offer him an additional 2.5% raise after each year and 1 extra contract year.

Suns contract , 10% raises 1,417,500$ per year
1st year................2nd year.............3rd year..............4th year...
14,175,000$........15,592,500$........17,010,000$..........18,427,500$

5th year..............6th year.
19,845,000$........21,262,500$

=6yrs/106.3M$


Lakers contract, 12.5% raises 1,771,875$ per year
1st year..............2nd year........3rd year..........4th year..........5th year
14,175,000$......15,946,875$....17,718,750$.....19,490,625$.....21,262,500$

6th year...............( 7th year )
23,034,375$..........(24,806,250$)

=6yrs/111.6M$ or 7yrs/136.4M$

 

[elindholm]

It is 6yrs/102M$ and 7yrs/136M$.

I get about $106 million for the six-year (non-Laker) deal?

Edit: Never mind, you corrected it.

Thanks slinslin.

 

[elindholm]

So anyway, it's only a $30 million difference, not $50 million, and the difference over the first six years is only about $5 million.

Not a big deal.

 

[slinslin]

Suns contract , 10% raises 1,417,500$ per year
1st year................2nd year.............3rd year..............4th year...
14,175,000$........15,592,500$........17,010,000$..........18,427,500$

5th year..............6th year.
19,845,000$........21,262,500$

=6yrs/106.3M$


Lakers contract, 12.5% raises 1,771,875$ per year
1st year..............2nd year........3rd year..........4th year..........5th year
14,175,000$......15,946,875$....17,718,750$.....19,490,625$.....21,262,500$

6th year...............( 7th year )
23,034,375$..........(24,806,250$)

=6yrs/111.6M$ or 7yrs/136.4M$

With respect to tax rates, la's highest bracket is 9.3%, phoenix is 5.04%.

Arizona 1st year...2nd year......3rd year.....4th year.....5th year.......6th year
714,420$.......... 785,862$......857,304$....928,746$....1,000,188$...1,071,630$

Total taxes over the 6 seasons = 5,358,150$

California 1st year....2nd year......3rd year......4th year.......5th year
1,318,275$............1,483,059$...1,647,844$...1,812,628$....1,977,412$

6th year
2,142,197$

Total taxes over the first 6 seasons = 10,381,415$

Saves Kobe Bryant 5.3M$ taxes. The contract difference over the first 6 seasons is 5.3M$ in favor of the Lakers.

Conclusion? The money is almost EXACTLY the same over the first 6 years.

 

[Yuma]

So anyway, it's only a $30 million difference, not $50 million, and the difference over the first six years is only about $5 million.

Not a big deal.

WRONG!!! From the Associated Press (I just looked it up):

"He can opt out of his contract, shop himself during the first two weeks of July and Buss won't be allowed to make a counteroffer until July 14. And while the Lakers can resign Bryant for more years and more money than any other club can offer — seven years for $140 million vs. six years for $90 million — chances are their roster won't be any more set than it is now. Plus, Bryant is scheduled to go on trial in late August, leaving his focus and availability in question and likely causing the distractions that plagued Los Angeles last season to spill over into the next one."

You guys making up Kobe taking a six year deal from a team is just this boards invention. Noone in the press is talking the Lakers only giving him a six year deal. You can debate it all you want, but apples to apples is max deal from Lakers vs. max deal from anyone else. It's 140 million versus 90 million.

 

[slinslin]

WRONG!!! From the Associated Press (I just looked it up):

"He can opt out of his contract, shop himself during the first two weeks of July and Buss won't be allowed to make a counteroffer until July 14. And while the Lakers can resign Bryant for more years and more money than any other club can offer — seven years for $140 million vs. six years for $90 million — chances are their roster won't be any more set than it is now. Plus, Bryant is scheduled to go on trial in late August, leaving his focus and availability in question and likely causing the distractions that plagued Los Angeles last season to spill over into the next one."

You guys making up Kobe taking a six year deal from a team is just this boards invention. Noone in the press is talking the Lakers only giving him a six year deal. You can debate it all you want, but apples to apples is max deal from Lakers vs. max deal from anyone else. It's 140 million versus 90 million.

The AP's numbers are wrong.

And the 7th year on the Lakers contract doesn't matter because Kobe will opt out or sign a new extension before he ever plays that 7th year.

 

[Yuma]

The AP's numbers are wrong.

And the 7th year on the Lakers contract doesn't matter because Kobe will opt out or sign a new extension before he ever plays that 7th year.

I don't have all day to collect all the posts i have seen with these numbers. I figured you guys would respect the AP's reporting. These numbers have been quoted on ESPN, The Arizona Republic, Kobe's agent, the Lakers Mitch Kupchak has quoted them. If everyone else in the world is wrong, and you and Elindholm are right, you NEED to call a press conference and straighten this out so Kobe doesn't get screwed!

 

[elindholm]

Earth to Yuma, come in Yuma.

If Bryant signs a six-year deal instead of a seven-year one, what do you think will happen in his seventh year? He'll become unemployed? He'll get only a minimum contract?

No. He'll just sign another deal, most likely for similar money. He'll still be only 31 or 32 (I don't feel like looking it up), so he'll still be playing at a very high level -- barring the unlikely possibility of a career-crippling injury.

Slinslin is right, by the way; the AP numbers are wrong. They do sometimes make mistakes and this is one of those times. However, it is correct that Bryant's seven-year deal with the Lakers would be for a much larger total amount than a six-year deal with another team.

But you're missing the larger point. He WILL get paid in his seventh year, no matter what contract he signs now. The only question is whether the seventh year is on this contract or the next one (or an extension).

This is at least the third time I have explained this in the past 24 hours. Please demonstrate that you have made an attempt to understand it.

 

[Yuma]

Earth to Yuma, come in Yuma.

If Bryant signs a six-year deal instead of a seven-year one, what do you think will happen in his seventh year? He'll become unemployed? He'll get only a minimum contract?

No. He'll just sign another deal, most likely for similar money. He'll still be only 31 or 32 (I don't feel like looking it up), so he'll still be playing at a very high level -- barring the unlikely possibility of a career-crippling injury.

Slinslin is right, by the way; the AP numbers are wrong. They do sometimes make mistakes and this is one of those times. However, it is correct that Bryant's seven-year deal with the Lakers would be for a much larger total amount than a six-year deal with another team.

But you're missing the larger point. He WILL get paid in his seventh year, no matter what contract he signs now. The only question is whether the seventh year is on this contract or the next one (or an extension).

This is at least the third time I have explained this in the past 24 hours. Please demonstrate that you have made an attempt to understand it.

Again, every sports site is reporting this, not just a few mistaken ones. When I here Kupchak, who should KNOW the numbers better than us talk about resigning Kobe for $140 MILLION. When I put a direct quote from a reputable source to outline this, all you guys can say is "that's wrong." I don't see you quoting anyone else in the know about this deal other than yourselves. Who SHOULD I believe. NBA people, or guys on this board as to the correct numbers? I don't care HOW MANY times you quote suspicious numbers to me, it doesn't make it right.

Also, I had a cousin who was a sports agent, and have been lucky enough to talk to another sports agent, and when you have a guaranteed 7th year in this case, over resigning under your scenario AFTER year six, I have always heard you TAKE guaranteed money!! Also, where do you see anyone else, other than the guys on this board spouting this year six scenario you guys dreamed up? Let me see someone in authority say it's better for Kobe, then I will see you are correct. Until then, the deal being talked about is 7 years, 140 million.

 

[George O'Brien]

How valuable is that extra year? It is certainly a big paycheck and could be for an injured player. On the other hand, if the player is locked in an there is a bout of inflation, the amount may not be worth as much as we think.

In any case, the agent wants the extra year because there is no guarantee that HE will be there in six years.

 

[Yuma]

How valuable is that extra year? It is certainly a big paycheck and could be for an injured player. On the other hand, if the player is locked in an there is a bout of inflation, the amount may not be worth as much as we think.

In any case, the agent wants the extra year because there is no guarantee that HE will be there in six years.

That's true. Also true is the injury scenario, which is why you take the guarantee. Ask Grant Hill. We all saw how a team can pay for that player with insurance ala Rex Chapman.

However, equally plausible is a new CBA, that could make salaries now worth more than under a new CBA. They are already talking work stoppage. In this environment, it makes sense to lock in your money now.

 

[George O'Brien]

That's true. Also true is the injury scenario, which is why you take the guarantee. Ask Grant Hill. We all saw how a team can pay for that player with insurance ala Rex Chapman.

However, equally plausible is a new CBA, that could make salaries now worth more than under a new CBA. They are already talking work stoppage. In this environment, it makes sense to lock in your money now.

If I was on the owners side of the negotiations, I would put getting a limit of four years guaranteed as the first goal (more than even the age limit). It would totally change the economics of the game and be a huge boost to teams under the cap since over cap teams could not offer six year MLE deals any more.

 

[Joe Mama]

That's true. Also true is the injury scenario, which is why you take the guarantee. Ask Grant Hill. We all saw how a team can pay for that player with insurance ala Rex Chapman.

However, equally plausible is a new CBA, that could make salaries now worth more than under a new CBA. They are already talking work stoppage. In this environment, it makes sense to lock in your money now.

I agree. I'm not sure how much the seventh year will play into all of this, but it is nearly as trivial as some of you are making it out to be. It's nowhere near a certainty... far from it really... that Kobe Bryant is going to get $30 million at age 32. Now if you figure that the guy probably already has a net worth of over $100 million ($2.50 after his lawyer's bills ) I'm sure that he will go wherever he wants to go regardless of the money.

Joe Mama

 

[thegrahamcrackr]

I agree. I'm not sure how much the seventh year will play into all of this, but it is nearly as trivial as some of you are making it out to be. It's nowhere near a certainty... far from it really... that Kobe Bryant is going to get $30 million at age 32. Now if you figure that the guy probably already has a net worth of over $100 million ($2.50 after his lawyer's bills ) I'm sure that he will go wherever he wants to go regardless of the money.

Joe Mama

Joe, I am not saying he will get 30 million at 32. However, I do think he will opt out before the 7th year to reup on one last long term deal. Unless he has a career ending injury, I think most people would agree that the chances of that happening would be extremely likely.

Yuma, if a work stoppage happens, Kobe doesn't get paid, regardless of what his contract is. The league is pushing for a shorter number of guaranteed years, not diminishing the pay scale. It will not sway the balance in either direction.


Lastly, for someone who "works with a lot of math" check Slin's numbers. They look pretty good to me. He did the raises by the CBA. Often times news papers dont state the correct numbers, do to a lack of understanding. The CBA is an extremely confusing document. That is why you often see trade rumors that are not possible printed in papers.

As for Kupchak stating the numbers, I haven't seen him give exact numbers. He just states they can pay him more, which they can.

 

[elindholm]

As for Kupchak stating the numbers, I haven't seen him give exact numbers. He just states they can pay him more, which they can.

Thank you.

 

[playstation]

slinslin - you stole my research!

yuma - holy crap, do some research yourself:

http://members.cox.net/lmcoon/salarycap.htm#49

this is a lawyer who helped come up with the cap, he is a cap god.

armed with the information provided, you do the math, don't be so lazy that you trust a fool armed with a typewriter and a publishing company.

if you still think everyone says the most any other team can offer is 90, check this out:
http://msnbc.msn.com/id/4282507/
its also wrong, but because it overshoots.


at the end of the day, SlinSlin is correct, over the 1st 6 years, the value of the deal is EXACTLY the same (give or take a few thousand). you can't extend a 6 year deal until AT LEAST the fourth year, which means kobe can get an extension at 30, which he will assuming no jail time and good health. the more i get into this, the more i realize the money issue shouldn't really be a factor. when i get home i'll have to double check with the math i did back in february, but i'm pretty sure its right.

 

[playstation]

in fact, monetarily, the suns can offer kobe the BETTER deal if you think about it.

in the first few years the actual pay is quite similar but phoenix taxes him less, while in later years la makes up for more tax by getting him more boosts in pay. HOWEVER, for the first couple years, he'll have more money in his hand with phoenix than with LA, and for a rich person who probably invests, having money in your hand NOW is more quite important.

if anyone has trouble understanding this, add up how much kobe will get in year 1,2,3, etc from the suns, then from the lakers, then subtract the taxes. you'll find that after year 1,2,3, etc, he'll have more net income from the suns than the lakers. the amount only evens out after the 6th year. so while the suns can't offer that 7th year right off the bat, they do have what i just mentioned working for them

 

[Yuma]

As for Kupchak stating the numbers, I haven't seen him give exact numbers. He just states they can pay him more, which they can.

Thank you.

"Bryant has said he'll opt out, and Kupchak said that makes the best business sense since the Lakers could then sign him for seven years for over $140 million. That's one year longer than any other team could sign him and for substantially more money."

Not hard to find. He told this reporter the numbers straight up!

 

[Yuma]

slinslin - you stole my research!

yuma - holy crap, do some research yourself:

http://members.cox.net/lmcoon/salarycap.htm#49

this is a lawyer who helped come up with the cap, he is a cap god.

armed with the information provided, you do the math, don't be so lazy that you trust a fool armed with a typewriter and a publishing company.

if you still think everyone says the most any other team can offer is 90, check this out:
http://msnbc.msn.com/id/4282507/
its also wrong, but because it overshoots.


at the end of the day, SlinSlin is correct, over the 1st 6 years, the value of the deal is EXACTLY the same (give or take a few thousand). you can't extend a 6 year deal until AT LEAST the fourth year, which means kobe can get an extension at 30, which he will assuming no jail time and good health. the more i get into this, the more i realize the money issue shouldn't really be a factor. when i get home i'll have to double check with the math i did back in february, but i'm pretty sure its right.

At least you have an article to show this. It's just good fact checking to at least have two sources for something. You have my props. I have seen so many guys spout stuff on these boards and seen it totally wrong! I have learned, you need to see someone in print backing it up.