Bynum demanding max deal

[Covert Rain]

I wish the Suns had fallen into the Joe Johnson trap... for real.

Not even comparable. First off the Suns and Joe were only off in contract talks by 5 million dollars. The Sun decided they didn't want to pony up the extra 5 million according to Joe in an KTAR interview. Sarver says they would have paid him whatever he wanted if he said he wanted to stay. Joe disputed that in the radio interview.

Also, Joe's scenario wasn't about a player who demanded max contract dollars and was coming of an injury you were not sure he could recover from. He also wasn't coming of a scenario where you still didn't know what you have in him. We knew what we had in Joe. The Suns just decided he wasn't worth the extra 5 Million.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

i think many of you aren't paying attention to what's happening in sports these days. do you not recognize that a player that shows promise at a position of greater importance at a young age can demand ridiculous salaries? have you not paid attention to where the NFL draft has gone? to the signing bonuses of baseball's top ten first round picks? no one has to prove themselves anymore b/c there are always other teams willing to take a chance on a young with UPSIDE! (had to sneak the word in there). if someone else is willing to pony up, you have to look good and hard and determine the likelihood of the player reaching their potential, then gulp hard, and swallow the damn contract. 'cuz if you let that player walk . . . and they reach that potential . . . you'll spend years trying to recover, both on the court and in public opinion.

bynum will get his. and none of us should be surprised. unhappy with the state of sports? sure, but not surprised.

 

[Mainstreet]

Not even comparable. First off the Suns and Joe were only off in contract talks by 5 million dollars. The Sun decided they didn't want to pony up the extra 5 million according to Joe in an KTAR interview. Sarver says they would have paid him whatever he wanted if he said he wanted to stay. Joe disputed that in the radio interview.

Also, Joe's scenario wasn't about a player who demanded max contract dollars and was coming of an injury you were not sure he could recover from. He also wasn't coming of a scenario where you still didn't know what you have in him. We knew what we had in Joe. The Suns just decided he wasn't worth the extra 5 Million.

There are some similarities. JJ ended up getting 75 million as a RFA where Bynum will probably get close to 80 million if he becomes a RFA. Sure the Suns could have extended JJ for about 55 milion but they chose not to do it. Bynum wanting more now is a major difference, but both could play out the same in RFA. Also I believe JJ was coming off an eye socket injury in the year he was eligible for an extension year. The situations are not exactly the same but close enough to make me think of the JJ situation... again.

 

[Covert Rain]

There are some similarities. JJ ended up getting 75 million as a RFA where Bynum will probably get close to 80 million if he becomes a RFA. Sure the Suns could have extended JJ for about 55 milion but they chose not to do it. Bynum wanting more now is a major difference, but both could play out the same in RFA. Also I believe JJ was coming off an eye socket injury in the year he was eligible for the extension year. The situations are not exactly the same but close enough to make me think of the JJ situation... again.

Yeah but Bynum was demanding max. Joe just wanted a fair contract. That's not similar to me. Also, Joe's eye socket injury was already known not to cause any long term effects. Knees are different.

I admit I like Bynum here if he were a guy demanding max. If I could figure out a way to trade the guy while duming Diaw's dead weight...I would do it.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Yeah but Bynum was demanding max. Joe just wanted a fair contract. That's not similar to me. Also, Joe's eye socket injury was already known not to cause any long term effects. Knees are different.

i agree, but what would you have said if we had changed the facts and it was amare coming off the micro demanding the max? would you be ready to let him go? again, not EXACTLY the same scenario (amare was a more established star than is bynum at present, but amare's injury was considered MUCH worse than is bynum's, so i think they equal out the equation).

 

[Mainstreet]

Yeah but Bynum was demanding max. Joe just wanted a fair contract. That's not similar to me. Also, Joe's eye socket injury was already known not to cause any long term effects. Knees are different.

I'm just comparing the two if Bynum goes into RFA like JJ. I'm not trying to draw an exact comparison. If you don't see any similarities so be it.

 

[Covert Rain]

i agree, but what would you have said if we had changed the facts and it was amare coming off the micro demanding the max? would you be ready to let him go? again, not EXACTLY the same scenario (amare was a more established star than is bynum at present, but amare's injury was considered MUCH worse than is bynum's, so i think they equal out the equation).

That's not a fair question because knowing what I know now and how he rebounded I would have said give him the MAX.
However, at that time had the scenarios been the same with the magnitude of that procedure...I probably would have said don't pay him the MAX. Then again, Amare by his injury had already shown me way more then Bynum had up to the point of his injury.

 

[Irish]

In an odd way, this situation is more like Diaw than JJ. The decision to low ball JJ was based on a distorted market in 2003-04 when wings were not that highly paid. As it was, in 2004 Manu only got $53 million and he was a much bigger star than JJ.

BC has successfully put all the blame on Sarver, but IMHO he did not fight hard enough for the $50 million. I don't think he'd admit it now, but my read on it is that he thought JJ and Q were about equal in talent and they had to pay extra for Q due him being an RFA. It seemed improbable that JJ would become hugely better than Q.

But with Bynaum, what is gained by giving him a max contract now or a year from now? If he gets hugely better, they still end up paying the same amount. If he regresses, the Lakers save a bundle.

Two years ago I failed to voice my reservations strongly enough against signing Diaw to the $9 million for 5 years. Mostly I was saying it was not necessary to sign him to an extension at all, because he was (is) not the type of player to get a max contract offer from a team trying to force the Suns not to match.

Teams can only get RFA's when the original team is no longer interested (Salmons or James Jones) or else th;y have to pay a big premium to keep the former team from matching. I looked at what Boris does (biggest strength is ball handling) and concluded he was worth more to the Suns than anyone else. Nobody was going to get into a bidding war for an undersized, pass first power forward. So why extend?

Big money goes to centers, point guards, and guys who score a lot of points. Bynum will get the max if he plays well because centers are so highly valued. But extending him doesn't save them anything.

 

[Mainstreet]

But with Bynaum, what is gained by giving him a max contract now or a year from now? If he gets hugely better, they still end up paying the same amount. If he regresses, the Lakers save a bundle.

Maybe another team offers Bynum 50 million upfront if he becomes a RFA. It seems Sarver told JJ the same thing... go prove yourself worthy. He did, the Suns got slammed by the upfront money. I think like 25 million.

 

[pokerface]

The question is are the Lakers crazy enough to sign him to max deal? They made it to the Finals WITHOUT him, anybody think he was the difference in the pounding they took in the finals? If they are smart they offer him a fair deal and if he wants to be stupid let him walk.

Sarver offered the "fair deal" for JJ and look how well that turned out.

 

[sunsallday]

That's not a fair question because knowing what I know now and how he rebounded I would have said give him the MAX.
However, at that time had the scenarios been the same with the magnitude of that procedure...I probably would have said don't pay him the MAX. Then again, Amare by his injury had already shown me way more then Bynum had up to the point of his injury.

We're lucky that Amare Stoudemire didn't become the next Chris Webber after three knee surgeries. Thank god.cough*suns medical staff*cough

 

[Kel Varnsen]

http://www.nba.com/games/20071225/PHXLAL/recap.html

LOL. Well done.

 

[pokerface]

In an odd way, this situation is more like Diaw than JJ. The decision to low ball JJ was based on a distorted market in 2003-04 when wings were not that highly paid.

JJ in no way shape or form was he lowballed by Sarver. Johnson was given an offer IMO of exactly what he was worth at the time. JJ had a lot of ups and downs and was inconsistant up until that offer. Only in the final year of his Suns tenure was JJ showing more consistancy and worth more money but by that time JJ had hurt feelings and wanted out regardless of what Sarver was willing to pay (or match).

 

[tobiazz]

http://www.nba.com/games/20071225/PHXLAL/recap.html

If you gave a max contract to every center that went off against the Suns . . .

 

[cobbler]

The Lakers have until Oct 31 to wait and see how he comes back before offering to extend him. If he comes back at 100% and continues to show the promise he did this year before the injury then they will most definetly extend him for the max or close to it. You just don't find 20 yr old centers with that potential around every corner. If he shows that his injury will continue to impact his growth then they will offer to extend him for less or let him become a RFA. You will NOT see the Lakers rush into anything. All the talk from the agent expecting a max extension was just that. An agent talking in response the Bynums' comments that getting max money isn't as much a priority as playing for the team he wishes to and being a contender.

 

[TucsonDevil]

http://www.nba.com/games/20071225/PHXLAL/recap.html

That is about the best reply I have seen in years on any forum, at any time. Kudos.

 

[formerphoenix suns]

Offering Bynum a max deal at this point is ludicrous. Give him $8-10 million a year and see if he earns it. If so, then he can start dreaming about $15-20 million paydays.

Giving Bynum the max amount would be like the Sonics signing Jerome James to an extension. Sure, he showed some promise for a short time, but to make the big bucks, you've gotta do it on a regular basis.

 

[abomb]

Giving Bynum the max amount would be like the Sonics signing Jerome James to an extension.

 

[elindholm]

http://www.nba.com/games/20071225/PHXLAL/recap.html

I distinctly remember Tsakalidis having at least one huge game against the Lakers, when they had O'Neal.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

I distinctly remember Tsakalidis having at least one huge game against the Lakers, when they had O'Neal.

Big Jake for the MAX!

 

[abomb]

I distinctly remember Tsakalidis having at least one huge game against the Lakers, when they had O'Neal.

OK.

I dont recall numerous GMs requesting Big Jake in trade deals since his rookie season.

 

[LakeShowMan]

Guys, the Lakers don't have to make any decision on this until the regular season. His agent can ask for whatever he wants.

The fact is, the Lakers have his rights for the next two seasons. If he comes back healthy this year, shows the ability that he showed last year, and stays healthy, he'll get his money.

Andrew is a rare commodity in the NBA. A guy with his size and wingspan, athletic ability, great hands and touch around the basket, and that has shown the ability to be a double digit rebounder and shot blocker is going to get paid. Especially if said player is only 20 years old.

Comparing this guy to Jerome James or Big Jake is ridiculous.

 

[Mainstreet]

I think it all boils down to how one projects Bynum's career will play out. I certainly see him being better than the average role playing center. On the upside he might may even develop into an elite player. He is also very athletic and has plenty of ability at the early age of 20. He also has an NBA body. I certainly would not bet against him having an outstanding NBA career especially since he has already shown a glimpse of what he can already do. Thus I'm sure at least one or more NBA teams would give him a max deal. Bynum is not a player like Dampier who already had limited ability when he signed his large contract.

Talking about Big Jake is fun in retrospect but comparing these two players ability... well it's not even close.

 

[TucsonDevil]

Personally, I would love to see the Lakers' give him max money. Then, big Andrew comes back healthy - but his progress is halted due to his timidness on his knee/legs. Three years later, they beg to trade him for a bag of peanuts. That would make me happy.

What? I don't like the Lakers, get over it.

 

[elindholm]

Comparing this guy to Jerome James or Big Jake is ridiculous.

Of course it is. But establishing his value by pointing to one big game against a team known for terrible interior defense is equally ridiculous. I was rebutting the evidence, not the conclusion.