Can Someone Define the "Situation" that this Organization Found Itself In?

[kerouac9]

A lot of the apologeas for the good players that we've released (suddenly redefined from "core player" to "dead weight") has been that this organization found itself in an impossible situation with talent and salaries that couldn't be borne without taking away from the defense that had been the only successful part of the team the previous year.

I don't get it. Yes, the team had to shed some $5M to get under the league salary cap, but they could have done that by releasing one player: Stewart Bradley.

Okay, well, they wouldn't have had any money to sign any free agents or re-sign current free agents.

Well, they're going to save some $6M by releasing Kevin Kolb. Done.

So... what's the dire situation that the Cards found themselves in that required dismantling the defense? Yes, the Cards had a 5-10 record last year, but that was because of an offense that hasn't been meaningfully improved in free agency so far, and would have been able to be augmented through the draft, anyway.

If you believe that Keim has the legitimate right to destroy the roster to shape the team in his image, then say that. But don't pretend like this team was in a dire cap or talent situation that had to be dismantled. That flies in the face of all available evidence.

 

[BigRedRage]

if it needs to be done, do it. This is our organization for a minimum 3 years, if they succeed, they stay longer. Breathe.

Ill miss wilson and rhodes but it is what it is. Im excited for a new season regardless of who is on the team.

 

[WildBB]

A lot of the apologeas for the good players that we've released (suddenly redefined from "core player" to "dead weight") has been that this organization found itself in an impossible situation with talent and salaries that couldn't be borne without taking away from the defense that had been the only successful part of the team the previous year.

I don't get it. Yes, the team had to shed some $5M to get under the league salary cap, but they could have done that by releasing one player: Stewart Bradley.

Okay, well, they wouldn't have had any money to sign any free agents or re-sign current free agents.

Well, they're going to save some $6M by releasing Kevin Kolb. Done.

So... what's the dire situation that the Cards found themselves in that required dismantling the defense? Yes, the Cards had a 5-10 record last year, but that was because of an offense that hasn't been meaningfully improved in free agency so far, and would have been able to be augmented through the draft, anyway.

If you believe that Keim has the legitimate right to destroy the roster to shape the team in his image, then say that. But don't pretend like this team was in a dire cap or talent situation that had to be dismantled. That flies in the face of all available evidence.

They tried to re-up Toler. Gay pretty much sucked. Who was another starter thant was jettisoned outside of AW? I don't see all the hub-bub.

 

[Shane]

They tried to re-up Toler. Gay pretty much sucked. Who was another starter thant was jettisoned outside of AW?

Kerry Rhodes..But at 6 million per I dont blame them.

 

[WildBB]

Kerry Rhodes..But at 6 million per I dont blame them.

No saftey @ 6M and aging on a non-contending team is expendable. Did not realise he was gone. Been being hammered today.

 

[jefftheshark]

I would guess that Keim & Co. believe that defense doesn't win championships, no matter how often the old chestnut is repeated. For an example of this, imagine how painful it was for team ownership to watch the Jets game last year (at least I hope it was painful, it was for me). The defense played very well, yet we lost because of a total lack of production on the other side of the ball. The team is like an unbalanced wheel on a race car - it costs a lot of money, but it's gonna blow up like an inflatable sex doll at an all-male boarding school from the imbalance.

I think they're willing to sacrifice defensive talent to upgrade the O. Now the question is if they'll do this in a smart fashion. Well, the jury's still out on that one isn't it? But there might just be a method to the madness, we'll just have to wait and see.

JTS

Oh, and I do think Keim has the right to blow the sucker up. He's the GM and he's being paid to make this call. He is also the guy who is going to get the ax if he screws it up, so - yeah - I'll be happy to say this.

 

[BillsCarnage]

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[Cbus cardsfan]

I think Keim is "re-shaping" the defense into what Bowles wants. I wasn't sad to see William Gay leave. I would have rather kept Toler instead of Johnson. With Rhodes, if the comments are true, it sounds like he wrote his own ticket out by refusing to negotiate an extension.

It's easy to say the Cards lost 3/4 of their starting secondary, which is true, but it was not un-expected. AW knew he was gone at the end of last year. With Gay, Powers almost has to be as good or an upgrade. The key loss is Rhodes, so, to me, they really have only lost 1/4 of their planned secondary. But it's not like Rhodes was a superstar. Theyre will likely be dropoff early on but a highyly drafted rookie(Reid,Elam, etc.) should be able to offset him by mid-season.

Fleming should be improved and who really knows what we have in Bethel. Overall, other than Toler, I'm not too upset, or surprised, with the DB losses.

 

[Solar7]

Ultimately, it does boil down to what you said earlier - they're dismantling the team to build it in their own image.

But additionally, this is about fitting Bowles' scheme. Horton's defense was predicated on defensive backs that could tackle - and while William Gay was a physical player, he wasn't great in coverage. Wilson was getting old and to the point of replacement. It breaks my heart to see him go, but it was pretty much that time.

We haven't lost a ton of "impact" players, sans Kerry Rhodes - who made it clear he didn't want to be here.

As it stands, this team likely won't contend this year, barring spectacular coaching and/or a major regression from the young QBs in our division. Now's the time to commit to rebuilding the roster where they can.

 

[football karma]

how about 5-11, two offseasons away from competing for the division, and a bit hamstrung by the salary cap / pending dead money?

 

[TJ]

I'll say it 100 times if I have to: this is a transition year, and the number one goal of the franchise is to undo the mistakes from Graves, Whiz, etc. Particularly working around and with bad contracts.

This is going to be a systematic overhaul. What I like is that the FO is focusing on the strengths of each phase in the offseason. Keim knows the market for o-linemen is crap, so why try to sign more Colledges and Snyders to premium contracts when there is a bevy of top-tier talent in the draft?

The one immutable factor of the offseason is the lack of quality at the QB position, both in free agency and the draft. There is no long-term solution out there. None. Had this been last season with Luck, RGIII, Wilson etc. being available, then quite possibly we're looking at a different outcome to the season. Now, not so much, unless someone comes out of nowhere.

Again, realize that this is a rebuilding year and going for the gusto this season would be futile seeing as Seattle and SF are loading up their respective rosters with talent.

 

[MadCardDisease]

A lot of the apologeas for the good players that we've released (suddenly redefined from "core player" to "dead weight") has been that this organization found itself in an impossible situation with talent and salaries that couldn't be borne without taking away from the defense that had been the only successful part of the team the previous year.

I don't get it. Yes, the team had to shed some $5M to get under the league salary cap, but they could have done that by releasing one player: Stewart Bradley.

Okay, well, they wouldn't have had any money to sign any free agents or re-sign current free agents.

Well, they're going to save some $6M by releasing Kevin Kolb. Done.

So... what's the dire situation that the Cards found themselves in that required dismantling the defense? Yes, the Cards had a 5-10 record last year, but that was because of an offense that hasn't been meaningfully improved in free agency so far, and would have been able to be augmented through the draft, anyway.

If you believe that Keim has the legitimate right to destroy the roster to shape the team in his image, then say that. But don't pretend like this team was in a dire cap or talent situation that had to be dismantled. That flies in the face of all available evidence.

What I don't understand is why K9 of all people wants to keep together a team that went 5-11. I would have put down Big money on you being happy with changing things up.

The way I see it is that all of the core players are still on the team (PP, D Wash, CC, Fitz). Everyone that was cut was not a core player and was expendable IMO.

 

[BillsCarnage]

Because the defense was soooooo stellar last year.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Because the defense was soooooo stellar last year.

a top 12 defense that's always on the field because you have the worst offense in the league is pretty stellar IMO.

and before you throw out the one game outlier of 58-0, let me head you off at the pass there by asking you this question: Did the 38 points scored by Miami against the 1985 Bears D mean that defense wasn't the best of all time? No... because a one game outlier isn't indicative of the whole season.

and before you completely misconstrue the above and try to say I'm now comparing our defense to the 85 Bears, let me stop you there too. Just drawing parallels to the idea that one game doesn't not a season make. This Defense was stellar last year. Trying to argue otherwise is completely ridiculous. Were they great? No, but they were pretty damn solid.

 

[Doc Cardinal]

Same situation the Ravens are in.....mass exodus after super bowl appearance for us.

Only difference is Baltimore keeps their QB.

 

[MadCardDisease]

And as for "Dismantling the Defense". Our DL and LBs are still intact. Sure we lost Bradley and Lenon. However dropping Bradley was addition by subtraction. Lenon is very replacable. Losing Lenon's leadership hurts but someone else will step up.

So that leaves our secondary. Oh no, we lost a pair of sup par CBs, an aging SS and an overpaid FS. How will we ever replace them in a market flooded with FA CBs, and Safties?

 

[ARZCardinals]

Offense puts fans in the stands

 

[JeffGollin]

A lot of the apologeas for the good players that we've released (suddenly redefined from "core player" to "dead weight") has been that this organization found itself in an impossible situation with talent and salaries that couldn't be borne without taking away from the defense that had been the only successful part of the team the previous year.

I don't get it. Yes, the team had to shed some $5M to get under the league salary cap, but they could have done that by releasing one player: Stewart Bradley.

Okay, well, they wouldn't have had any money to sign any free agents or re-sign current free agents.

Well, they're going to save some $6M by releasing Kevin Kolb. Done.

So... what's the dire situation that the Cards found themselves in that required dismantling the defense? Yes, the Cards had a 5-10 record last year, but that was because of an offense that hasn't been meaningfully improved in free agency so far, and would have been able to be augmented through the draft, anyway.

If you believe that Keim has the legitimate right to destroy the roster to shape the team in his image, then say that. But don't pretend like this team was in a dire cap or talent situation that had to be dismantled. That flies in the face of all available evidence.

Was that a question?

 

[PJ1]

The defense was very good last year. The 5-11 record is a testament to just how bad our offense was. It was as bad as I can remember. I haven't seen one thing done to improve it. Possibly a slightly better RB and adding a career backup at QB to add to our current collection.

Oh I know the draft is coming.......

 

[MadCardDisease]

The defense was very good last year. The 5-11 record is a testament to just how bad our offense was. It was as bad as I can remember. I haven't seen one thing done to improve it. Possibly a slightly better RB and adding a career backup at QB to add to our current collection.

Oh I know the draft is coming.......

Grimm gone is a huge improvement.

Then factor in that the new coaching staff has multiple OL coaches and that is an improvement as well IMO.

Maybe now we will be able to better develop our young OLinemen instead of hoping they pick it up by osmosis.

 

[Cheesebeef]

So that leaves our secondary. Oh no, we lost a pair of sup par CBs, an aging SS and an overpaid FS. How will we ever replace them in a market flooded with FA CBs, and Safties?

apparently we're replacing them with the cheapest people we can find... you know... an aging S who's bounced around the league for years making no impact anywhere who's making league minimum and Rashad Johnson who I'm sure you would have listed as supbar had he left the team.

Powers was a solid signing... but our safeties are a joke. you get what you paid for.

and I love that everyone know is completely banging on Rhodes being "overpaid". The guy's done nothing but make plays on this team. You know who's overpaid? Colledge, Snyder, Kolb... all guys who did NOTHING and cost just as much but for some odd reason are still on the team.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Offense puts fans in the stands

that's great... but considering we've done nothing to improve that side of the ball, why did the defense have to get so much worse?

 

[kerouac9]

I'll say it 100 times if I have to: this is a transition year, and the number one goal of the franchise is to undo the mistakes from Graves, Whiz, etc. Particularly working around and with bad contracts.

This is going to be a systematic overhaul. What I like is that the FO is focusing on the strengths of each phase in the offseason. Keim knows the market for o-linemen is crap, so why try to sign more Colledges and Snyders to premium contracts when there is a bevy of top-tier talent in the draft?

The one immutable factor of the offseason is the lack of quality at the QB position, both in free agency and the draft. There is no long-term solution out there. None. Had this been last season with Luck, RGIII, Wilson etc. being available, then quite possibly we're looking at a different outcome to the season. Now, not so much, unless someone comes out of nowhere.

Again, realize that this is a rebuilding year and going for the gusto this season would be futile seeing as Seattle and SF are loading up their respective rosters with talent.

So... what are those mistakes? My opinion on the offense was that it was a bad idea to rely on unreliable running backs, and it's impossible to evaluate more or less any other part of the offense because the quarterback situation was so awful.

We fixed the quarterback situation and running back situation with $7M. Done.

Was Kerry Rhodes' one-year contract an albatross on this organization? How so? What deal has been done that Rhodes' presence on the roster would have prevented?

Same thing with Adrian Wilson. Wilson may have been in decline from being a perrennial Pro Bowler, but he's better than Yeremiah Bell and was better last year than Rashad Johnson (yes, even at the end of the year he was getting more PT). Wilson could have been released in 2014 as easily as in 2013.

Besides saying "these losses on the defense are not that bad" doesn't answer my question:

What was so awful about our cap situation or defensive talent situation that the secondary had to be completely dismantled?

 

[MadCardDisease]

You know who's overpaid? Colledge, Snyder, Kolb... all guys who did NOTHING and cost just as much but for some odd reason are still on the team.

No arguement there on the Guards. Unfortunetly Graves screwed us over with their contracts.

Oh and Kolb will be gone soon enough.

 

[MadCardDisease]

apparently we're replacing them with the cheapest people we can find... you know... an aging S who's bounced around the league for years making no impact anywhere who's making league minimum and Rashad Johnson who I'm sure you would have listed as supbar had he left the team.

Wrong. I had Johnson as a player that I wanted to bring back in my offseason plan.

I also wanted to bring Toler back but at the right price. $5M a year was no where near that price and I think Powers can be just as good at half the cost.