Can't get behind the mavs...

[dreamcastrocks]

Dude what the hell is wrong with you? Why is every freaking Mavs thread turned into a smack-like thread. Leave it alone already, even if it's them that start this crap

There is nothing wrong with him.

greensborohill is quickly turning into a troll. There is only one way to deal with trolls.

 

[Covert Rain]

There is nothing wrong with him.

greensborohill is quickly turning into a troll. There is only one way to deal with trolls.

Thank you. I am just defending our turf. Besides it's so much fun to get a rise out of these guys. It's a little to easy too.



PS He has always been a troll but was pretending not to be. Just look at some of his posts at Dallas-Mavs.com.

 

[SO91]

I know he's been a troll, but leave it alone. I think we can all agree that "defending our turf" is a bit childish. If getting a rise out of them is great, i'd say the Smack Shack is a better way to do that.

 

[Covert Rain]

I know he's been a troll, but leave it alone. I think we can all agree that "defending our turf" is a bit childish. If getting a rise out of them is great, i'd say the Smack Shack is a better way to do that.

To each his own. If this thread or topic was started there then that's where it would be. It's not like we are going over there and starting crud on their boards. Most of the points I have made are just that points countering the crud that is being posted by him. I would hardly call that childish. Bull headed? Pig headed? OK. Guilty.

 

[SO91]

Fair enough

 

[mribnik]

Here's an interesting stat...

The Suns are 3rd in the league in points given up per shot. The top five teams in this category are San Antonio, Houston, Phoenix, Chicago and Detroit.

I think the Suns initial defense is quite good (maybe even very good) but because they're often sprinting back down the court after a missed shot, they give up a ton of offensive rebounds and second chance points (more shots. they also give up more shots because of the pace obviously). However, if the game slows down, I wonder if the Suns will be able to make stops at the end of games, when they're focused on securing the rebound instead of runnning.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/stati...007&seasontype=2&avg=pg&order=false&split=999

 

[Hoopy Dunkalot]

PS He has always been a troll but was pretending not to be. Just look at some of his posts at Dallas-Mavs.com.

Dallas-Mavs.com???

PLEASE do not confuse that crappy board as the place where Mavericks fans (the knowlegable ones anyway) post. Anything you read there is 85-90% fan boy driven crap.

In fact, is this the best board for Suns talk? Anyone know of the primary one Suns fans go to??

 

[elindholm]

In fact, is this the best board for Suns talk? Anyone know of the primary one Suns fans go to??

Heh.

 

[Covert Rain]

Dallas-Mavs.com???

PLEASE do not confuse that crappy board as the place where Mavericks fans (the knowlegable ones anyway) post. Anything you read there is 85-90% fan boy driven crap.

In fact, is this the best board for Suns talk? Anyone know of the primary one Suns fans go to??

Right. Tell that to greensborohill and the rest of the Mav fans that post here. I suppose your really not IAM#1MAVSFAN from that board?

For the record, this is the premiere Suns posting board. If any other board claims otherwise.......IT'S LIES....ALL LIES.

 

[TheFallen49]

As Hollinger proves with his ranking system, stats alone cannot determine whether a team plays good defense (or good anything). I really hate that guy... I mean he has no respect for variables. I'm not sure how many of you watched our game last night but our starters didn't play the fourth quarter at all. How much does that affect the point differential? If theres a useless stat that would be it, point differential. In this specific example it didn't affect the differential at all (actually I think our super spares outplayed them) but i'm sure even you guys can see my point.

I don't want to bring up Suns choke jobs so I dont know why you people feel the need to bring up Mavericks shortcomings. What do you expect in return? You feel we are inferior despite beating you in the WCF and somehow you find a way to say your 'ahead' of Maverick accomplishments despite your current team never making it to the finals. Who cares? I don't. I care about this year, and more specifically i'm excited for Thursday so let's just foucs on what we've done as teams RECENTLY.

It's funny... you guys are the ones starting these Maverick related topics. Did you ever stop to blame yourselves for the Maverick population on these boards? Not to mention they are ALL your most popular threads based on the amounts of responses. That says something. That said, if you don't want to debate with us 'ignorant' Mavs fans then please just move on with your lives, your not obligated to post how much you don't want to respond.

 

[myrondizzo]

troll

 

[mribnik]

As Hollinger proves with his ranking system, stats alone cannot determine whether a team plays good defense (or good anything). I really hate that guy... I mean he has no respect for variables. I'm not sure how many of you watched our game last night but our starters didn't play the fourth quarter at all. How much does that affect the point differential? If theres a useless stat that would be it, point differential. In this specific example it didn't affect the differential at all (actually I think our super spares outplayed them) but i'm sure even you guys can see my point.

I don't want to bring up Suns choke jobs so I dont know why you people feel the need to bring up Mavericks shortcomings. What do you expect in return? You feel we are inferior despite beating you in the WCF and somehow you find a way to say your 'ahead' of Maverick accomplishments despite your current team never making it to the finals.

It's funny... you guys are the ones starting these Maverick related topics. Did you ever stop to blame yourselves for the Maverick population on these boards? Not to mention they are ALL your most popular threads based on the amounts of responses. That says something. That said, if you don't want to debate with us 'ignorant' Mavs fans then please just move on with your lives, your not obligated to post how much you don't want to respond.

Not really. An average over the entire season is a pretty useful stat IMO. Sometimes you beat a team you should beat by 20, by 40. Other times you go to OT and win by 7. It averages out over a season. Perhaps I glossed over it, but I didn't see anyone saying the Mavs are inferior at all. Some posters feel they are boring to watch, but nobody has said that they aren't the best team in the league at this point. As far as Mavs threads being more popular, of course they are. There are a few threads every now and then about other teams and players of other teams. Since the rest of the threads are Suns related, those threads are more controversial and get more attention. Having a few Mavs fans come over and discuss the issues makes them only more popular. I wouldn't say it has anything to do with the Mavs specifically either, the Kobe thread got a lot of attention as well.

 

[Covert Rain]

As Hollinger proves with his ranking system, stats alone cannot determine whether a team plays good defense (or good anything). I really hate that guy... I mean he has no respect for variables. I'm not sure how many of you watched our game last night but our starters didn't play the fourth quarter at all. How much does that affect the point differential? If theres a useless stat that would be it, point differential. In this specific example it didn't affect the differential at all (actually I think our super spares outplayed them) but i'm sure even you guys can see my point.

One game shouldn't impact the differential all that much. That's why it's a season long stat.

I don't want to bring up Suns choke jobs so I dont know why you people feel the need to bring up Mavericks shortcomings. What do you expect in return? You feel we are inferior despite beating you in the WCF and somehow you find a way to say your 'ahead' of Maverick accomplishments despite your current team never making it to the finals. Who cares? I don't. I care about this year, and more specifically i'm excited for Thursday so let's just foucs on what we've done as teams RECENTLY.

First off we wouldn't bring up Mavs shortcumming if you guys were not coming in here and trolling. Your the ones talking down about the Suns. People are just responding to that. "So what do we expect in return?" No.... I think you have that backwards. This is a Suns forums. What do you expect in return?

Show me who said that the Mavs are inferior? If anything many of us have said the Mavs were the best regular season team so far and given them credit. Many people including me recognize how good the Mavs are. There is a difference between trolling and posting and that's who we are responding to.

In terms of current team? What does that mean? The Mavs have subtracted and added just like the Suns. Neither team is the same from last year. None of that matters. Mavs and Suns have combined for zero titles. The Suns have one more WCF title. So what. Both teams have zero titles. So if you want to get technical "currently" neither team has done anything consiering the the trophy has not been awarded yet.

It's funny... you guys are the ones starting these Maverick related topics. Did you ever stop to blame yourselves for the Maverick population on these boards? Not to mention they are ALL your most popular threads based on the amounts of responses. That says something. That said, if you don't want to debate with us 'ignorant' Mavs fans then please just move on with your lives, your not obligated to post how much you don't want to respond.

Yes we take full responsibility for trolls coming to our board. We should have known that posting any Mavs information would magically draw trolls to our board. There must be some internet advertisement board that draws Mavs fans to us when we do such a thing. Shame on us.

Funny how when we post things about the Heat or Spurs or host of other teams we don't get the same response from those fans. Mmmmm.

 

[msdundee]

All Suns fans on this board should be suspended.

 

[Covert Rain]

All Suns fans on this board should be suspended.

I wouldn't mind seeing this thread locked though.

long ago.

 

[TheFallen49]

One game shouldn't impact the differential all that much. That's why it's a season long stat.

One game won't, but you know for a fact it won't be entirely accurate. As of late we have been resting our starters a lot, thats the benefit of a deep team and once again i'm confused as to why Phoenix doesn't play it's bench when they have a game well under control. If it comes back to haunt you with injuries then you won't have anyone to blame but D'Antoni. That makes these stats useless, you guys NEVER rest your starters it seems, check our starters MPG and you will see significant enough differences that you can throw the comparison of our two teams out the window.


First off we wouldn't bring up Mavs shortcumming if you guys were not coming in here and trolling. Your the ones talking down about the Suns. People are just responding to that. So what do we expect in return? No I think you have that backwards. This is a Suns forums. What do you expect in return?

Sorry if I feel that your constant references to the finals can be defined as jabs towards us Mavs fans. I can see why some people might get a little touchy. I don't care anymore, I expect it but I can definitely see where the hostility is coming from. I'm sure a lot of what I say pisses Suns fans off as well but hey it's not intentional.

Show me who said that the Mavs are inferior? If anything many of us have said the Mavs were the best regular season team so far and given them credit. In terms of current team? What does that mean? The Mavs have subtracted and added just like the Suns. Neither team is the same from last year. None of that matters. Mav and Suns have combined for zero titles. The Suns have one more WCF title. So what. Both teams have zero titles. So if you want to get technical "currenlty" neither team has done anything sense the playoffs have not started yet.

Word for word? No one. But when you take into account the excuses made for the Mavericks beating your team last year I feel you really are diminshing what little success we did have last year. How can you sit there and judge us for our meltdown when you did the same thing to our team no less in the WCF? I know you want to measure success with titles and that seems to be the general consensus, which makes sense. But personally I just feel that having such a great shot at a historical season record and even making it to the finals for the first time last year are major acocmplishments and stepping stones towards the title. Every bit helps, it's definitely something to be proud of and still should be defined as success.


Yes we take full responsibility for trolls coming to our board. We should have known that posting any Mavs information would magically draw people to our board. There must be some internet advertisement board that draws Mavs fans to us when we do such a thing. Shame on us.

I'm just surprised you have so many Maverick related topics. I lurked these boards just to check whats up with the Suns before I made an account, but when I see something about my team I feel like commenting on it. It's only natural.

 

[msdundee]

I wouldn't mind seeing this thread locked though.

long ago.

ASFN is a lot better than most, but trolls are a fact of life on any message board and it will only get worse as we get closer to the end of the season. Once we're into the playoffs I usually stop even looking at the boards.

 

[msdundee]

"I'm just surprised you have so many Maverick related topics."

There are two topics talking about the MVP so they automatically include Dirk. There is one topic on the upcoming Phx-Dallas game (understandable). Other than those, there is only one topic about the Mavs on the current front page. Kobe's predicament got a lot more attention than the Mavs.

 

[Covert Rain]

That makes these stats useless, you guys NEVER rest your starters it seems, check our starters MPG and you will see significant enough differences that you can throw the comparison of our two teams out the window.

Overall with the starters still logging most of the minutes for both teams, the numbers of minutes given to bench have a much smaller impact on that number. I would be interested to see someone do an analysis of point differential just from the starters. I doubt it would look much different. I would like to see the differential with Dallas starter versus Suns in minutes as well.

Sorry if I feel that your constant references to the finals can be defined as jabs towards us Mavs fans. I can see why some people might get a little touchy. I don't care anymore, I expect it but I can definitely see where the hostility is coming from. I'm sure a lot of what I say pisses Suns fans off as well but hey it's not intentional.

Ofcourse it's a jab towards Mav fans. Maybe it's not you but your trolling brothers have been taking jabs. If you listen to them the Mavs are a lock for a title this year. You don't think that is going to draw a response? Then we should feel bad for them because their "touchy" now?

Word for word? No one. But when you take into account the excuses made for the Mavericks beating your team last year I feel you really are diminshing what little success we did have last year. How can you sit there and judge us for our meltdown when you did the same thing to our team no less in the WCF? I know you want to measure success with titles and that seems to be the general consensus, which makes sense. But personally I just feel that having such a great shot at a historical season record and even making it to the finals for the first time last year are major acocmplishments and stepping stones towards the title. Every bit helps, it's definitely something to be proud of and still should be defined as success.

How is pointing out that we did'nt have Amare or a healthy team diminishing Dallas's success? Was it not a fact we were not healthy? Dallas beat us regardless. That is also a fact. However, that does give Suns fans a reason to be confident.

Also, the Suns were never on the verge of locking down the NBA finals like the Mavs. You can't even begin to compare any or our performances to the Mavs last year. That is considered one of the biggest choke jobs in NBA history. Last time I checked nobody has associated the Suns that way in any of their appearances.

I'm just surprised you have so many Maverick related topics. I lurked these boards just to check whats up with the Suns before I made an account, but when I see something about my team I feel like commenting on it. It's only natural.

Fair enough but I only see 2 and the trolls have been posting everywhere. Just don't expect Suns fans to bow down to the trolling and negative comments without a response of some sort. Just for the record I don't mind having Mav fans here. We have some really cool ones on this board. It's the trolls that stand out and I think you know who I am referring too.

 

[mribnik]

One game shouldn't impact the differential all that much. That's why it's a season long stat.

One game won't, but you know for a fact it won't be entirely accurate. As of late we have been resting our starters a lot, thats the benefit of a deep team and once again i'm confused as to why Phoenix doesn't play it's bench when they have a game well under control. If it comes back to haunt you with injuries then you won't have anyone to blame but D'Antoni. That makes these stats useless, you guys NEVER rest your starters it seems, check our starters MPG and you will see significant enough differences that you can throw the comparison of our two teams out the window.

Sorry if I feel that your constant references to the finals can be defined as jabs towards us Mavs fans. I can see why some people might get a little touchy. I don't care anymore, I expect it but I can definitely see where the hostility is coming from. I'm sure a lot of what I say pisses Suns fans off as well but hey it's not intentional.

Word for word? No one. But when you take into account the excuses made for the Mavericks beating your team last year I feel you really are diminshing what little success we did have last year. How can you sit there and judge us for our meltdown when you did the same thing to our team no less in the WCF? I know you want to measure success with titles and that seems to be the general consensus, which makes sense. But personally I just feel that having such a great shot at a historical season record and even making it to the finals for the first time last year are major acocmplishments and stepping stones towards the title. Every bit helps, it's definitely something to be proud of and still should be defined as success.

I'm just surprised you have so many Maverick related topics. I lurked these boards just to check whats up with the Suns before I made an account, but when I see something about my team I feel like commenting on it. It's only natural.

Accurate in terms of what? Every year every team has plenty of games where they get to rest their starters and plenty of games where they play there starters more minutes than they are used to. I don't think you understand the idea of an average. The Suns big 3 (Nash, Amare, Marion) average .1 more minutes than the Dallas big 3. Big whoop. If Dallas had Barbosa coming off the bench he'd play 30+ minutes for them as well.

I'm sorry but I just don't see the hostility. Many Suns fans think the Mavs are boring, big deal. Pretty much everybody on this board respects the Mavs for what they've been able to accomplish. How about you focus on that instead of whining about a few random posters?

 

[Covert Rain]

Accurate in terms of what? Every year every team has plenty of games where they get to rest their starters and plenty of games where they play there starters more minutes than they are used to. I don't think you understand the idea of an average. The Suns big 3 (Nash, Amare, Marion) average .1 more minutes than the Dallas big 3. Big whoop. If Dallas had Barbosa coming off the bench he'd play 30+ minutes for them as well.

I'm sorry but I just don't see the hostility. Many Suns fans think the Mavs are boring, big deal. Pretty much everybody on this board respects the Mavs for what they've been able to accomplish. How about you focus on that instead of whining about a few random posters?

Thanks mribnik. I didn't think it was that different in terms of minutes. So the time our starters have is about the same meaning that the difference in differential cannot be written off because of that.

Also, nobody is whining last time I checked. He made a statement and I responded. I think for the most part people are just making diggs to have fun. If they get defensive. Oh well.

 

[mribnik]

Thanks mribnik. I didn't think it was that different in terms of minutes. So the time our starters have is about the same meaning that the difference in differential cannot be written off because of that.

Also, nobody is whining last time I checked. He made a statement and I responded. I think for the most part people are just making diggs to have fun. If they get defensive. Oh well.

I was only talking about the big 3. However, if he's going to talk about how the Mavs resting players ruins the differential, perhaps he should also accept that the Mavs have been much healthier than other teams this season and that matters as well. In the end, it evens out.

 

[Lorenzo]

the refs beat the mavs last year? I can't tell you how mad i was after wade got to the line to end the game... i think it was game 5. He drove to the paint. He was triple teamed. and he threw up a wild shot. he got bailed out. but it was a close game and the heat won. anytime you play in a close game....the calls will be magnified. If i remember correctly most spurs fans whined that the mavs only won because mark cuban bought out the refs. then mavs fans started doing the same thing after miami. Dallas had a 2-0 lead, they had a chance to win games 3, 5, and 6. but they didn't get it done. Miami was the better team. They played better defense and i think they were the first team in the playoffs to out-rebound the mavs. Shaq and wade were just too much for the mavs. then those other guys started earning their paychecks for once. Miami may have had a shot to win the title in the previous year as well if wade didn't get injured in the EC finals. I can understand blaming the refs right after the game while you are still emotional. But there just has to come a time when you look at reality for what it truly is. but fans will be fans and they will justify a loss anyway that they can.

 

[msdundee]

the refs beat the mavs last year? I can't tell you how mad i was after wade got to the line to end the game... i think it was game 5. He drove to the paint. He was triple teamed. and he threw up a wild shot. he got bailed out. but it was a close game and the heat won. anytime you play in a close game....the calls will be magnified. If i remember correctly most spurs fans whined that the mavs only won because mark cuban bought out the refs. then mavs fans started doing the same thing after miami. Dallas had a 2-0 lead, they had a chance to win games 3, 5, and 6. but they didn't get it done. Miami was the better team. They played better defense and i think they were the first team in the playoffs to out-rebound the mavs. Shaq and wade were just too much for the mavs. then those other guys started earning their paychecks for once. Miami may have had a shot to win the title in the previous year as well if wade didn't get injured in the EC finals. I can understand blaming the refs right after the game while you are still emotional. But there just has to come a time when you look at reality for what it truly is. but fans will be fans and they will justify a loss anyway that they can.

I hope you won't mind a compliment: You're a great Mavs fan -- and obviously a great basketball fan as well. Discussions with you have covered topics ranging from the Mavs to the Suns to the merits of the State of Texas, and you've always stayed rational and reasonable and your comments make sense. Your posts are a pleasure to read.

 

[azirish]

Every year is different. What happened last year, or the year before, or the year before, etc. means little. Everybody starts with the same record.

As for the Suns and key injuries... It is sad but true. Not simply the last two years, but in early 90's as well. It's a fact of life and with the differences between the top teams being so small, even small injuries can be enough to change the balance.

Two years ago the Spurs were better than the Suns, but losing JJ made it much harder for the Suns to have even a chance. The final outcome would not likely have been changed, but it was disappointing that the Suns couldn't really compete (although Amare did have a great series).

Last year the Suns were without Amare and KT plus Bell was banged up to the point of not being a factor. Would the Suns have won if healthy? Who knows, but certainly their chances would have been a lot better.

This year we get a lot of Mavs fans that insist that the Mavs are vastly superior to the Suns based on a couple of squeeker victories and the Suns losing streak when Nash was out.

Maybe the Mavs are the better team. If both teams are healthy in the playoffs, then we'll know for sure. But if the Mavs get all beat up and lose in the first round, it won't mean they are a bad team. Just unhealthy.