Not really sure how accurate this statement is considering all the successful 31 to 40-year-old coaches in the league as of late and the amount of success they’re having... hmmm
Cardinals' HC Search Thoughts Part III
- Thread starter Mitch
- Start date
Not really sure how accurate this statement is considering all the successful 31 to 40-year-old coaches in the league as of late and the amount of success they’re having... hmmm
Hopefully not Mike McCoy. He runs the same offense we had under Whisenhunt which is not too different from Arians to a degree. Much more suited for veteran QB behind a solid OL. I'd much rather have DeFilippo or Shurmur with their quick rhythm WCO which is loaded with RPOs and a huge variety of screens. Perfect offense to groom a young QB and control the clock when you have a good defense.
wa52lz
Hall of Famer
- Joined
- Jan 25, 2009
- Posts
- 2,272
- Reaction score
- 1,461
I knew about the rankings, but had never noticed that differential was that great, let alone positive. Only 2x since 1960 have the Cards had a losing record w/ a positive point differential 2016 and 1993. Quite the historic accomplishment for BA!
kerouac9
Klowned by Keim
Well, I mean those numbers are a little skewed by the 40-7 hurting we put on the Bucs in Week 2 and the 44-6 beatdown we put on the Rams in Week 17. Take those games out--or even one of those games out--and it looks a little different.
Hypothesis
Draft Junkie
- Joined
- Feb 9, 2009
- Posts
- 1,036
- Reaction score
- 179
I can't find anywhere, outside of Revenge of the Birds, that states Mike McCoy is Wilks choice of OC. The names I hear him most tied to are Norv Turner, Mike Shula and John DeFilippo.
SoCal Cardfan
ASFN Addict
- Joined
- Apr 11, 2004
- Posts
- 6,056
- Reaction score
- 1,296
I don't even want Bettcher as a DC.... Having him as HC? 
- Joined
- May 13, 2002
- Posts
- 38,580
- Reaction score
- 25,605
I feel like we are just getting a small glimpse at your thoughts Mitch. Can you please put some more time into writing your posts?
OP
OP
Mitch
Crawled Through 5 FB Fields
2018 NFL Head Coaching search rumors, whispers and innuendos ...
www.1580thefanatic.com/2018-nfl-head-coaching-search-rumors-whispers-and-innu...
5 days ago - Mike McCoy is being tagged as the OC for not only James Bettcher, but also Steve Wilks, the DC of the Carolina Panthers who will interview when the Panthers are out. McCoy is alleged to be wanting to bring a veteran quarterback in and that veteran quarterback is… Brock Osweiler; Why is Mike Munchak ...
In addition, an article this morning in New York (I read several early this am and can't remember which one it was) stated that the Giants were not happy with Wilks' choice of Mike McCoy. So, if that's true, McCoy is Wilkes' choice, at least as of yesterday.
AsUpRoDiGy
Magnanimous
Mccoy wasn't even the OC while in Denver...Peyton Manning was. He's done nothing remotely spectacular without Manning calling his plays.
Jetstream Green
Kool Aid with a touch of vodka
Bettcher's ability to adjust at halftime irritated me to no end but he has gotten better simply because he has learned on the job and he is better now than when he started. I have no problem at all with him as the DC, expecting his ability to progress and keeping the defense intact is a big plus in my opinion. The offense, meaning the OL and the QB are the issue along with special teams. I do not feel Bettcher would be the best hire as a head coach when he is only now mastering the DC position. We need a coach which can identify and mold our QB and OL, but keeping Bettcher would be on less thing for the new coach to worry about with the defense already in stride and put his efforts towards the offense and success 
dude....coffee on the keyboard.....
kerouac9
Klowned by Keim
Bettcher's ability to adjust at halftime irritated me to no end but he has gotten better simply because he has learned on the job and he is better now than when he started. I have no problem at all with him as the DC, expecting his ability to progress and keeping the defense intact is a big plus in my opinion. The offense, meaning the OL and the QB are the issue along with special teams. I do not feel Bettcher would be the best hire as a head coach when he is only now mastering the DC position. We need a coach which can identify and mold our QB and OL, but keeping Bettcher would be on less thing for the new coach to worry about with the defense already in stride and put his efforts towards the offense and success
Yeah. I dunno. I think that the best head coaches are great administrators and motivators. There's no question that Rex Ryan was a hell of a defensive coach, but he couldn't maintain discipline in a coaching staff. No one is going to accuse John or Jim Harbaugh of being strategic geniuses, but they're both great leaders and people who bring out the best in those around them.
IMO, Whisenhunt is a good position coach and coordinator, but a terrible administrator and leader. Couldn't figure out how to empower his staff. I think that Norv Turner was the same way. Marvin Lewis, Marty Schottenheimer are great leaders (in a football world).
CFLredzoned
Hall of Famer
I heard Wolfley say he researched past successful QBs and found that there were actually more with defensive minded HCs than offensive HCs. If that's true, it's basically saying that there's no relationship and it can go either way.
So it's easy to get enamored with offensive HCs due to the recent success of McVay and Shanahan. But they're different because they work directly with the QB and call their own plays. So that begs the question: Has Shurmur revealed who will be running the offense on gameday? Him or an OC?
So it's easy to get enamored with offensive HCs due to the recent success of McVay and Shanahan. But they're different because they work directly with the QB and call their own plays. So that begs the question: Has Shurmur revealed who will be running the offense on gameday? Him or an OC?
Hypothesis
Draft Junkie
- Joined
- Feb 9, 2009
- Posts
- 1,036
- Reaction score
- 179
New York and Chicago radio said Shula, Turner and DeFelippo. It's all speculative at this point.
clif
ASFN Addict
Also. On McVay, dude didn’t even have to coach his team. He was the OC. He even said he didn’t even watch the defense when they were on the field. IMO depending on how the roles and defined and delegated, the staff is critical. Some coaches like to be hands on in all aspects and others are great at allowing their coaches to do their thing.
I said all that to say, we have no real idea how any of these guys will do because unless we are apart of the interview and know their management styles we are just spitballing.
I would be afraid of a Bettcher hire because I don’t know anything about his coaching connections aside from Pagano being mentioned. I can only assume it’s not too deep being he is only 3 years in this role.
I said all that to say, we have no real idea how any of these guys will do because unless we are apart of the interview and know their management styles we are just spitballing.
I would be afraid of a Bettcher hire because I don’t know anything about his coaching connections aside from Pagano being mentioned. I can only assume it’s not too deep being he is only 3 years in this role.
Arz101
ASFN Lifer
- Joined
- Apr 23, 2014
- Posts
- 4,906
- Reaction score
- 5,600
I heard it too. Wolfley repeating about defensive coaches and QB performances makes me wonder if a defensive guy Wilks and Bettcher are front runner. Wolfely knows a lot more than he lets out.
possib
Great QB's can keep an offense productive without a great OC or an offensive minded HC...
so when an owner thinks he has a great QB he then hires an defensive minded HC to try and complete a more balanced team.
when you look at guys like Favre, Elway, rodgers,..even Plummer... you get the feeling they could just draw up plays in the dirt while in the huddle and still put up 30 points in a game... Manning or Brady could just look a guy in the eye and say "Get open"...and the play is going to succeed 9 times out of 10.
If I were a GM and had the second coming of the greatest show on turf on my roster...I would hire a fair OC, because it wont take a genius to get lots of points out of them... then hire a defensive minded HC and young teachable DC to get my defense just strong enough to not allow 25 points a game.
ility.
Great QB's can keep an offense productive without a great OC or an offensive minded HC...
so when an owner thinks he has a great QB he then hires an defensive minded HC to try and complete a more balanced team.
when you look at guys like Favre, Elway, rodgers,..even Plummer... you get the feeling they could just draw up plays in the dirt while in the huddle and still put up 30 points in a game... Manning or Brady could just look a guy in the eye and say "Get open"...and the play is going to succeed 9 times out of 10.
If I were a GM and had the second coming of the greatest show on turf on my roster...I would hire a fair OC, because it wont take a genius to get lots of points out of them... then hire a defensive minded HC and young teachable DC to get my defense just strong enough to not allow 25 points a game.
TRW
ASFN Addict
If McCoy is bringing Brock with him...OH HECK NO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Capital Card
The Kobayashi of Kool-Aid
I think QB's and most players, young and vet alike, spend the majority of their time with their position coaches. I think the direct impact HC have on developing players is minimal. Sure, they will have some impact, but BA doesn't spend hours studying film of second string TE's. He reviews the analysis provided to him with the TE coach and players.
HC's impact is primarily in keeping their staff dialed in to their players and maintaining the overall climate of the organization.
BA called plays throughout his term with us, because as he said, being a HC on game day would be boring. I'm surprised more coaches don't continue in this role, but perhaps the general consensus around the league is that is the coordinators job.
Go Cards.
kerouac9
Klowned by Keim
Yeah. I don't know how hard he worked and what his data set was like. I mean, yes, Brady had Belicheck and Rivers and Brees were the products (mostly) of Marty Schottenheimer. But Mike Sherman and Mike McCarthy were Aaron Rodgers' head coaches. Jim Mora was a defensive coordinator for one year with the Pats and a head coach for a decade before Peyton Manning came along. Dan Reeves was an offensive coach who shepherded John Elway into the NFL, and everyone knows about Bill Walsh.
All along in this process of finding a new head coach I have been very interested in Steve Wilks. He has never been my first choice, and he still isn’t, but I think that he seems to have a great connection with his players as well as being a very good motivator, and when I read the rumor that he might bring John DeFilippo as an offensive coordinator I became even more intrigued. However, as I have thought more about it I have become a bit skeptic, and the reason is that the rumor has it that Matt Patricia is the primary target for the Giants.
Dave Gettleman is the new general manager of the Giants, and so obviously he has a huge saying in the hiring of their new head coach. Gettleman worked closely with Steve Wilks for four seasons while they were both employed by the Panthers. In other words, Gettleman know Wilks very well, and reportedly likes him a lot. Now, one of the co-owners of the Giants - John Mara – said just two weeks ago that he much preferred their new head coach to have prior experience as a head coach or at least have extensive experience as a coordinator.
Steve Wilks does not have that kind of experience either as a head coach or a coordinator but neither does Matt Patricia. In fact, you could argue that their resumes are more or less the same, maybe with a slight advantage to Wilks because he has been an assistant head coach for two years.
Now, all of those rumors could obviously be false, but if the Giants hire Patricia over Wilks, even though neither of them fits the description John Mara gave, it almost has to signal that Gettleman did not want to speak that highly of Wilks in order to convince the other decision makers. That would instantly make me think twice about hiring Wilks.
Of course, Wilks could be hired by someone sooner than Patricia, and if so we will never know for sure if the Giants actually preferred Patricia to Wilks.
It was McCoy that guided the Broncos to a playoff victory over the Steelers with Tim Tebow as their quarterback. That nearly has to be one of the best single game coaching jobs ever in the history of the league. I might agree with you that he is not the best coordinator out there, but it is not really fair to him to completely dismiss all of his work as a coach.
clif
ASFN Addict
I always wondered how people can get so hooked on soaps and reality tv. I can’t quit the NFL. This is the drug of choice!!
