Cards - SD Trade?

[JeffGollin]

Lombardi floated a trade rumor that had the Chargers moving up to #13 from #18 to grab Barron ahead of Dallas at #14.

Consider the following - Quite possibly, the players still available after #14 would include DeCastro, Ingram, Coples, Glenn, Upshaw, Hightower and Brockers (I'm assuming Floyd, Cox, Gilmore, Poe and Reiff would join the 3 QB's, Richardson, Blackmon, Keuchly, Clairborne and Barron in the top 13.

Regardless of who does or doesn't go in the top 13, we'd still be guaranteed we'd get DeCastro, Ingram, Hightower, Glenn or someone else on our original wish list at #18.

Plus I'd presume we'd pick up a 2nd or another 3rd round pick to replace our missing 2nd rounder.

Unless there's someone I really really love at #13, I'd do that deal.

UPDATE - I just checked out the infamous Trade value Chart. All the exchange of picks would net us would be 250 points. A 2nd round pick is worth about 450. We'd have to settle for a 3rd & 4th. (I'm not crazy about that - the talent-level in the 3rd round is disappointing compared to what it would be in the 2nd). Question: Would the new CBA make it easier or tougher for us to make the deal worth their 2nd round pick instead a 3rd & 4th?
Whaddya think?

 

[CtCardinals78]

If there were ever a draft for the Cards to move down in this is the one. The talent level seems to be very close 10-25. I hope they can find a way to move down, get a second and still get their guy.

 

[WildBB]

Lombardi floated a trade rumor that had the Chargers moving up to #13 from #18 to grab Barron ahead of Dallas at #14.

Consider the following - Quite possibly, the players still available after #14 would include DeCastro, Ingram, Coples, Glenn, Upshaw, Hightower and Brockers (I'm assuming Floyd, Cox, Gilmore, Poe and Reiff would join the 3 QB's, Richardson, Blackmon, Keuchly and Clairborne).

Regardless of who does or doesn't go in the first 12 (& assuming SD doesn't double-cross us by not drafting Barron, we're still be guaranteed we'll get someone on our original wish list at #18.

Plus I'd presume we'd pick up a 2nd or another 3rd round pick to replace our missing 2nd rounder.

Unless there's someone I really really love at #13, I'd do that deal.

Whaddya think?

I'm of the thought that if Reiff is available he's an instant starter. Same goes with Ingram. Either of those two, and as much as I'd like a deal..I don't think it goes down IF either of those two are on the board when we're up.

 

[AzStevenCal]

I'd definitely do it. I'm sure we'd all like to return to the 2nd round and I wouldn't be against including our 6th rounder if necessary to make the deal work.

Steve

 

[WildBB]

I'd definitely do it. I'm sure we'd all like to return to the 2nd round and I wouldn't be against including our 6th rounder if necessary to make the deal work.

Steve

That would be key to any deal. Is it the 2nd?

Or would a team ahead of us move down for less? I doubt it because they already have 2nd's.

 

[SissyBoyFloyd]

That would be a great trade for S.D., but their 1st and 2nd is too much. Maybe their 1st, 3rd, and 4th.

The Chargers need a pass rusher real bad, as well as a safety. There will be some real nice pass rushers for them at 18. Not sure why they would give up another high pick. They should just save them and get the best available safety later on. But Barron is awfully tempting. I am in favor of anything that keeps the Cowboys from getting their man.

 

[Jetstream Green]

I would do that trade in a heart beat, with so many good players and lack of sure fire elite players...we would be nuts not to take it. That second round pick for the nature of the 2012 draft looms large and currently we do not have one...and I despise the Cowboys, that alone suffices

 

[Garthshort]

The Jets want Barron, also, and they have a history of draft day trades. Going from 16 to 13, would probably cost them a third. Would an 18th to 13th bring a second rounder?

 

[Stout]

Put it this way: If there are enough players that we like in between our current pick and theirs, you tell them you will trade, but only for the second rounder. If they start to hem and haw, take the hard line. Do you want the player? If so, take our deal. If not, ****. If they want him that bad, they'll do the trade. If not? Fine, you get your pick of the players you like. Nice and simple.

 

[Totally_Red]

Put it this way: If there are enough players that we like in between our current pick and theirs, you tell them you will trade, but only for the second rounder. If they start to hem and haw, take the hard line. Do you want the player? If so, take our deal. If not, ****. If they want him that bad, they'll do the trade. If not? Fine, you get your pick of the players you like. Nice and simple.

I'd be a 'little' more flexible, e.g. swap our 3rd for your 2nd and pick up another 5th rounder. Objective: get a 2nd round pick;

 

[Stout]

I'd be a 'little' more flexible, e.g. swap our 3rd for your 2nd and pick up another 5th rounder. Objective: get a 2nd round pick;

Yeah, I'd be down for that too. I just wouldn't want us to settle for a 3rd. Why should we have to?

 

[JeffGollin]

The Jets want Barron, also, and they have a history of draft day trades. Going from 16 to 13, would probably cost them a third. Would an 18th to 13th bring a second rounder?

Not according to the traditional Draft Value Chart. (It would be worth their 3rd plus their 4th). But the new CBA is said to render the traditional value chart moot because of the lower cost of high 1st round picks. I'd assume this would make the Cardinal #13 pick more valuable vis a vis San Diego's #18 but I'm not sure. (JoeSchmo - what say you)?

I like Stout's hard-bargaining stance, but I agree with Totally Red regarding the need to pick up of a 2nd rounder. I think this has to be our priority - I don't know how the Cardinal board rates players likely to go in the 3rd round vs. those slated to go in the 2nd, but my own accessment is that things start to dry up talent-wise midway through the 2nd, and by the time we get to #80, I'm already somewhat underwhelmed.

So I'd make Stout's position Plan A with Totally Red's position a good Plan B to fall back on. No doubt some kind of point value assessment would enter into negotiations in any case.

 

[earthsci]

Yeah, I'd be down for that too. I just wouldn't want us to settle for a 3rd. Why should we have to?

Yeah...I like your first post better. If they are calling us before our pick that means we are their last chance to get who they really want. IMO Melvin Ingram is going to be a star and if we are essentially passing up our chance to get him, they need to pay.

 

[earthsci]

And screw the value chart. Is a potential QBOF really worth three first rounders?

 

[bg7brd]

If a bunch of teams are wanting to trade down this year then it will drive the compensation down (supply and demand). I wouldn't be surprised if Jax, Carolina, Buffalo, K.C., and Seattle were all looking to trade down.

 

[earthsci]

I won't lie. I like Melvin Ingram. I like DeCastro. If we are drafting for need (which I don't like) I think that Reiff is a good choice. If we move down we could lose all three.

 

[juza76]

I won't lie. I like Melvin Ingram. I like DeCastro. If we are drafting for need (which I don't like) I think that Reiff is a good choice. If we move down we could lose all three.

i prefer to lose those 3 players and get a second round pick

 

[earthsci]

i prefer to lose those 3 players and get a second round pick

Re-read the thread. That is what I am saying. Don't settle for a 3rd rounder.

 

[CardsFan88]

While there are charts, there's what can be done. Good gm's taking advantage of average, maybe just crappy Gm's can make that trade and get a 2nd this year and a 1st next year. Happens almost every year.

You see one team get a 3rd and 4th or a 2nd and a 3rd, and then like three or so spots later someone gives up a whole lot more that includes their 1st round pick and next years 1st, and more.

I agree that higher picks are worth more now, because the cap implications aren't significantly there anymore.

Good gm's don't look for equitable trades. They look for one sided ones, try for one sided ones, and then eventually back down to equitable, if they really want to. For some reason I peg (as a guess) Graves as a guy that starts at equitable.

 

[crisper57]

If the Cowboys are truly coveting a player that a lot of other teams want, then we are their cheapest option to leapfrog.

 

[Totally_Red]

If the Cowboys are truly coveting a player that a lot of other teams want, then we are their cheapest option to leapfrog.

The closer the draft gets, the more I suspect we'll have offers. And with Ingram, DeCastro, Reiff, and Floyd as viable options, I suspect the Cardinals will seriously consider moving down a little if they still can get one of those four and pick up another pick. If it is 'just a third' they can package that with one of their sixes and move back up into the second.

Somers and Jurecki both seem to think Riley Reiff would be the pick if we stay at #13, but I suspect he'd still be there a couple of picks later if we trade down.

 

[Jetstream Green]

Maybe Reiff really is the pick we should be rooting for. It is hard to get excited about a OL pick but without them we cannot expect our offense to do anything exciting on a positive note

 

[THESMEL]

I value #13 much more than most- Look how much we had to suck to get it! We puke for Luke! we are the worse 8-8 team in the draft- and i'm ok with that!

Very lucky if Luke is still there like I hope, You take the BPA- Dwash and Luke gives Horton's 3-4 specifically great flexibility, They both may struggle as a Clancy or Bill Davis 3-4 style SIL- but both are elite WIL 3-4 MLB's. Dwash elite safety style coverage WIL- while Luke is a tougher tackling defensive QB style WIL.

Horton's defense is stingy on yards and scores, Davis and Clancy sold out for turnovers- big difference. Horton will not ask Luke to play Haye's role and be solid every down - so that others can do the superstar thingy. Turnovers will be a result of a stingy defense not the primary focus of a bend don't break defense.

Will Dan Williams please stand up(he is the key), With Dwill, CC and DD We can do this. cause with these 2 ILB's on the field it will look like the opposing offense is surrounded! They will cry out for mercy,( mercy - william - mercy) but Longshanks will not fold his tent!

 

[slanidrac16]

Lombardi floated a trade rumor that had the Chargers moving up to #13 from #18 to grab Barron ahead of Dallas at #14.

Consider the following - Quite possibly, the players still available after #14 would include DeCastro, Ingram, Coples, Glenn, Upshaw, Hightower and Brockers (I'm assuming Floyd, Cox, Gilmore, Poe and Reiff would join the 3 QB's, Richardson, Blackmon, Keuchly, Clairborne and Barron in the top 13.

Regardless of who does or doesn't go in the top 13, we'd still be guaranteed we'd get DeCastro, Ingram, Hightower, Glenn or someone else on our original wish list at #18.

Plus I'd presume we'd pick up a 2nd or another 3rd round pick to replace our missing 2nd rounder.

Unless there's someone I really really love at #13, I'd do that deal.

UPDATE - I just checked out the infamous Trade value Chart. All the exchange of picks would net us would be 250 points. A 2nd round pick is worth about 450. We'd have to settle for a 3rd & 4th. (I'm not crazy about that - the talent-level in the 3rd round is disappointing compared to what it would be in the 2nd). Question: Would the new CBA make it easier or tougher for us to make the deal worth their 2nd round pick instead a 3rd & 4th?
Whaddya think?

What is the Value Chart say if we swapped our 1st and 3rd for their 1st and 2nd?

 

[JeffGollin]

What is the Value Chart say if we swapped our 1st and 3rd for their 1st and 2nd?

Cards #1 = 1150

SD #1 = 900

SD #2 = 450

I'm not sure what our #3 would be - probably about 175.

Using that math, we'd be swapping 1325 points in exchange for their 1350, but wouldn't gain back our lost "Kolb" pick. We'd be losing 5 slots in the 1st round in order to upgrade from a 3rd to a 2nd round pick. Not earth-shattering but it could help us a bit depending on what our board looks like thru 3 rounds.

Caution - It's still the obsolete value board.